Ebay Scammers & Negative Feedback

So, like an idiot I sold an item on ebay rather than the forums.

I posted multiple pictures, mentioned and pictured damage to the finish, and sold it as "for parts".

So this idiot (with, may I say, the WORST username ever) sends me a handful of messages offering to buy it outside Ebay for under my starting-bid price. Then he bids on it and wins. I mailed it out, and it arrived within 3 days. At this point, he leaves me neutral feedback based on the issue that was pictured/described, and sends me an email stating that he will change it to a positive if I give a full refund, and a negative if I don't. Then (after feedback and email) he sent me an Ebay message saying "Before I leave feedback, I wanted to discuss this issue with you..." to which I responded that he ought to send me a picture of what he feels is a problem, which he won't.

What's the deal here? And why can't I leave him negative feedback?

It more or less sounds like he is trying to extort you, if all of this stuff is documented, I would take it all to Ebay and let them deal with the buyer. I am assuming they have some sort of policy that prohibits this kind of behavior.

I had an issue where it wouldn't let me leave neutral feedback. Said the seller was ranked to high. Wtf. The new part had to be modified to fit the bike that was in its specs that it fit. To me that isn't positive. Some things are just jacked. Good luck with your ordeal. Hope it works out for you.

Long ago, Ebay bowed down to the complaints of the buyer and made their selling platform completely one-sided. Buyers started complaining that they would buy an item and then would be fearful of leaving negative feedback for the seller if there was a problem, because then the seller could also retaliate and leave negative feedback for the buyer. It was reasoned that once a buyer pays, timely, for a won auction, then that's all they have to do to receive positive feedback. Ebay now prohibits sellers from leaving negative feedback for buyers that simply pay for the auction. They refuse to give any credence to the argument that a buyer's obligation isn't fulfilled simply by paying, but also by working to a complete resolution where both sides are satisfied.

So now buyers have caught on, and have been doing things like what you describe. There's no retribution. If you open a dispute through Ebay, you're very likely to lose as a seller. This, combined with Ebay's high fees, is why that site is full of high-volume sellers only - people and companies that, through their size, can absorb the aggravation and expenses of the bad apples as simply a "cost of doing business." What started off as a place for anyone to post up and sell all kinds of items, mostly useful and lightly used, has turned into a cheap flea market where volumes upon volumes of things are sold, even "new" (read: refurbished and not disclosed) at retail prices.

I will buy things from the Ebay site from time to time, if I can't find them elsewhere or find a good deal. But I don't think I would ever sell things there again. It's too risky, with no seller protection at all.

EDIT: So you might be asking, "how does Ebay still get people to use the site, then?" Because it caters to the buyer in all instances, Ebay remains extremely buyer friendly. They own the auction site (dispute resolution), they bought PayPal (dispute resolution) and their policies favor the buyer to provide all kinds of assurances and protections - basically protecting the buyer from themselves, throwing caveat emptor out the window, at the expense of the seller.

And it's easy to promote yourself as a great marketplace for sellers when you can show so much buyer activity. If only high-volume sellers can afford to do business in the marketplace due to the buyer protection policies, then so be it. High volume sellers make more money for Ebay anyway, with all the listing fees, PayPal fees, etc. They simply don't care about a person who goes and tries to sell 20 things a year.

Well I called him and they can't do anything because he emailed me and messaged me, and all I can do is provide screencaps of the messages which they deem inconclusive to prove extortion. I pointed out that he offered to buy outside ebay, they said it was irrelevant since he won the auction. I pointed out that his feedback complained about an issue, and that the issue was pictured and described in the auction, they said that didn't matter. Screw ebay.

Also, who calls themselves "Boom 911" that's just sick, especially since the auction ended on 9/11.

I have sold on the bay for years, and I sold an Angel with out a charger. It stated in the listing that there was no charger. After he received it the buyer stated in a message that there was no charger, and wanted to know what "we" were going to do about. I kindly replied that "we" were going to re-read the listing stating that there was no charger and that "we" weren't doing anything about it.

You listed as damaged goods, and clearly showed it in pictures and black and white in writing. There shouldn't be an issue... This is ludicrous if there is...

I have been hearing more and more instances of this. My brother in law sold a T9 a couple of months ago that was not only complete but included a bag of extras. I know the marker was complete because I had just used it with him the month before and he made no changes. Guy got it and started complaining that is was missing parts and it was going to cost him X number of dollars to fix and said the same thing.. "What was he going to do to make it right". ITT you're right, some people have caught on and are bidding on stuff without caring if it goes too high and then are complaining when they get it to negotiate a more favorable price. Seriously, how many times have we seen markers that have sold for stupid prices? Now what I don't get is that if people repeatedly do this, wouldn't Ebay notice a pattern?

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Originally Posted by OPBN

wouldn't Ebay notice a pattern?

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They know there is a pattern. They just don't care. As long as the buyers keep showing up people will post things for sale. As long as both keep showing up Ebay makes $. As long as ebay makes $ they don't care if anyone is happy.

well then all this being said no more of my markers for sale.
lol
like they were on anyone's radar :D :D

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Originally Posted by wetwrks

They know there is a pattern. They just don't care. As long as the buyers keep showing up people will post things for sale. As long as both keep showing up Ebay makes $. As long as ebay makes $ they don't care if anyone is happy.

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While in general I agree, I still would like to think if the same buyer tries such shenanigans more than once or twice EBay would have to have something in place. But then again I believe in rainbows and unicorns.

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Originally Posted by OPBN

While in general I agree, I still would like to think if the same buyer tries such shenanigans more than once or twice EBay would have to have something in place. But then again I believe in rainbows and unicorns.

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I can understand the rainbows....

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Originally Posted by Justus

I can understand the rainbows....

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It was early. Hadn't had any coffee yet. Cut me some slack..lol!

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Originally Posted by XtraKargo

You listed as damaged goods, and clearly showed it in pictures and black and white in writing. There shouldn't be an issue... This is ludicrous if there is...

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Apparently if he had filed a dispute through PayPal they would have sided with me, in which case the feedback would be removed by ebay. He hasn't filed through PayPal so the only way to get rid of it is to prove his scam, which according to them I can't, or to somehow convince him to retract it, which obviously he won't.

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Originally Posted by Frizzle Fry

Apparently if he had filed a dispute through PayPal they would have sided with me, in which case the feedback would be removed by ebay. He hasn't filed through PayPal so the only way to get rid of it is to prove his scam, which according to them I can't, or to somehow convince him to retract it, which obviously he won't.

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Why dont you just put a reply to his feedback and move on with life ?

Click on this :

http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/BayISAPI...dFeedbackLogin

Then log in and click reply.

Your reply will show up in your feedback directly under his feedback.

(or log in, go to feedback, then feedback forum, then reply to feedback received)

http://pages.ebay.com/services/forum...eName=comm:f:f

;)

I did, I just... I dunno, I have 150+ positive feedback and now there's a big glaring neutral there - soon to be a negative.

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Originally Posted by Frizzle Fry

I did, I just... I dunno, I have 150+ positive feedback and now there's a big glaring neutral there - soon to be a negative.

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Is that new? I don't remember being able to change ratings once they are given.

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Originally Posted by OPBN

Is that new? I don't remember being able to change ratings once they are given.

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I dunno I looked at all the "ebay articles" and apparently within X number of days you can change it.

Sorry for the informality, but that **** is wack. Take the neg, reply with your post, and move on. If he files a claim, they WILL have to contact you either way. I am 99% sure the claim will have to go through ebay dispute resolution. Outside of the extremely inconvenient process, its not worth it. This guy is literally trying to screw you over. I'd have to imagine that as mentioned above ebay is VERY buyer friendly. But at the same time this guy cant get his money back, and keep your ****. I'd suggest a full refund, he pays shipping, although if he is as much of a prick as he sounds.... he won't want to pay for shipping. If he doesn't that helps you even more. Look, the feedback may be a lost cause, so I would't fret over it. It leaves your account in a year anyway. Your reply to his feedback (Whether its neutral or negative) should kindly be worded like this: Buyer didn't read description, clearly listing the condition of all items within auction. Refused to return items for a refund.

The auction is a binding contract, and it sounds like he got a hold of his mothers ebay account after a long night of drinking...so outside of the feedback, your not going to get screwed here. I don't know how much feedback you have, but the reply you give to his neg/neutral will make this guy look like an idiot. Not reading the description? HAH. Welcome to 90% of ebay transaction issues (Seller related)
Sorry, but I hope things work out man
Thanks,
Jason

I left a followup to the neutral; if it becomes a negative, at least there'll be a response...

I suggested a full return and he didn't bite; I'm certainly not paying shipping and auction fees because he's illiterate, so I asked if he would return it at which point I'd give a refund and we'd mutually cancel the transaction, but he wanted a full refund AND the item. I'll take solace in the fact that he has the item and I have the money, and if he tries to file with PayPal they'll side with me and delete the bogus feedback.

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Originally Posted by Frizzle Fry

I left a followup to the neutral; if it becomes a negative, at least there'll be a response...

I suggested a full return and he didn't bite; I'm certainly not paying shipping and auction fees because he's illiterate, so I asked if he would return it at which point I'd give a refund and we'd mutually cancel the transaction, but he wanted a full refund AND the item. I'll take solace in the fact that he has the item and I have the money, and if he tries to file with PayPal they'll side with me and delete the bogus feedback.

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Uhh, IIRC, if you did issue a refund, and he bit heh.... you could put in a case for a final auction value fee credit. I don't know if it works on refunds or not, though. But since hes not, it isn't an issue. You're fine. ^_^


^B/I/U: LMAO, what a joke. That's hilarious.

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Originally Posted by Stealthpanda

Uhh, IIRC, if you did issue a refund, and he bit heh.... you could put in a case for a final auction value fee credit. I don't know if it works on refunds or not, though. But since hes not, it isn't an issue. You're fine. ^_^


^B/I/U: LMAO, what a joke. That's hilarious.

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Yeah that's what I figured, but then I'm out the item and the money but I get the fees back, or I get the item and fees back but pay the shipping again. I dunno.

Yeah, I wouldn't do it. If it was something expensive, a few hundred dollars, not worth it. Moving on!

Another thing to keep in mind is whether you want it back or not after this guy has had it. Considering he is an idiot, not telling what he might do to it. Saw a case in MCB where some kid in Ft Wayne bought a members Sniper and after getting EBay to side with him it did not return in the condition it left in.

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Originally Posted by OPBN

Another thing to keep in mind is whether you want it back or not after this guy has had it. Considering he is an idiot, not telling what he might do to it. Saw a case in MCB where some kid in Ft Wayne bought a members Sniper and after getting EBay to side with him it did not return in the condition it left in.

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LOL I'm one of the people who dug into that one, and contacted several of the proshops where he tried to "have it fixed" after screwing up the A/T and scratching it all to hell. I guess I get a bug up my butt about outright scams... Miscommunications and bad descriptions and ignorance of the item are excusable on some level, even if no agreement is met, but outright scams really piss me off. It's such a small community compared to other sports and hobbies; we can't afford to have that crap go on.

Regardless, I'm not about to pay for return shipping, and he won't ship it back either way.

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Originally Posted by Frizzle Fry

LOL I'm one of the people who dug into that one, and contacted several of the proshops where he tried to "have it fixed" after screwing up the A/T and scratching it all to hell. I guess I get a bug up my butt about outright scams... Miscommunications and bad descriptions and ignorance of the item are excusable on some level, even if no agreement is met, but outright scams really piss me off. It's such a small community compared to other sports and hobbies; we can't afford to have that crap go on.

Regardless, I'm not about to pay for return shipping, and he won't ship it back either way.

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:headbang: Rock on man.

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Originally Posted by Frizzle Fry

LOL I'm one of the people who dug into that one, and contacted several of the proshops where he tried to "have it fixed" after screwing up the A/T and scratching it all to hell. I guess I get a bug up my butt about outright scams... Miscommunications and bad descriptions and ignorance of the item are excusable on some level, even if no agreement is met, but outright scams really piss me off. It's such a small community compared to other sports and hobbies; we can't afford to have that crap go on.

Regardless, I'm not about to pay for return shipping, and he won't ship it back either way.

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Yeah I think I might have tossed the name of the main shop in that area. It's one I frequent actually. Anyway, if the guy doesn't ship it back he is SOL anyways. Take the rating hit and move on.