Finished ULE Automag build having some small issues

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08-09-2014, 10:41 PM
nooq

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Finished ULE Automag build having some small issues

Just finished building a x-valved ULE automag. Started from the ground up on this one. Always wanted one so i am pretty stoked to have this finished, but i am trying to get it to shoot tits and having a few issues. Heres some specs and pics...questions will be below. thanks in advance for any help.

-Gloss black ULE centerfeed main body
-NDZ detent
-polished stock am rail
-classic sear
-kapp angel non gas through 15* asa
-gutted maxflo reg = foregrip
-intelli-frame
-ccm feedneck
-hybrid rail with dp rapps asa
-dw freaked barrel
-x-valve, rt on/off, level 10
-ninja preset tank runing at around 800psi

Attachment 89990
Attachment 89991

Heres my issue. the gun fires, but it looks like iam getting some bolt stick. i can get a few shots off, sometimes rt the trigger but the bolt sticks back sometimes (most of the time), leaksdown the barrel and doesnt re-cock itself, this is also causing my sear to get stuck back and not re-pressurizing itself back up against the trigger. i am guessing it is the carrier. bought the xvalve and level 10 used, so it didnt come with any extra carriers, only a 1.5. i just ordered a 1 so i am hoping this may fix it. i will use the same carrier oring. i am also running 2 shims in their as well. plenty of planet eclipse oil in the gun, so thats not a problem. also...i am running the shortest spring in it. i cant seem to get the gun to fire using the red or grey spring?? dont know what is up with that. the sear pressurizes up against the trigger with the red/grey spring in it, but when the trigger is pulled, all i have is tension and no shooting. any idea?
08-09-2014, 11:45 PM
Cyco-Dude

Quote:

Originally Posted by nooq

i just ordered a 1 so i am hoping this may fix it. i will use the same carrier oring. i am also running 2 shims in their as well.

probably should've grabbed a 2.0, a couple of extra carrier o-rings and some bolt foamies just for good measure. take the shims out.

Quote:

also...i am running the shortest spring in it. i cant seem to get the gun to fire using the red or grey spring?? dont know what is up with that. the sear pressurizes up against the trigger with the red/grey spring in it, but when the trigger is pulled, all i have is tension and no shooting. any idea?

well, the stiffer spring resists the forward movement of the bolt. you need higher regulator pressure to overcome this force to get the bolt to move. so, the stiffer the spring you use, the more you need to turn the velocity up. do note that a stiffer spring will result is a softer hitting bolt, but you may be firing at too high of a velocity. the gray spring especially, is not really meant to be used as-is, but you have to trim it to get it to work right. ideally, you want the stiffest spring rate possible while maintaining a normal operating velocity.
08-10-2014, 12:01 AM
nooq

thanks for the reply. why do you say get the 2.0? i did the bolt test with holding the valve, and the bolt slides right off, actually cant get the bolt to stay on while upside down. wouldnt that mean i need to drop the carrier in size a little?
08-10-2014, 02:37 AM
Cyco-Dude

Quote:

Originally Posted by nooq

thanks for the reply. why do you say get the 2.0? i did the bolt test with holding the valve, and the bolt slides right off, actually cant get the bolt to stay on while upside down. wouldnt that mean i need to drop the carrier in size a little?

that carrier o-ring will wear out eventually man lol. gotta think long-term. ;)

i see you are using a ule body on a classic rail. is that a newer rail that can accommodate classic bodies as well as the emag / ule bodies? if it only has the rectangular hole, i would guess your bolt stick is due to misalignment between the body and valve, which causes excess friction on the bolt when it fires. the round lug on the ule body is just a hair taller than the square lug on the classic bodies, so the body won't sit flush with the rail.

i would try putting a classic body on and see what it does.
08-10-2014, 07:33 AM
OPBN

It's only the SS Emag bodies that had the longer pims. ULE bodies should fit fine on classic rails. At least I've never had a problem.

And to the OP if you are getting bolt stick you want to go to a bigger carrier not smaller. If you are getting bolt stick with a 1.5 you need to try moving to a 2. Going down to a 1 will exacerbate the stick. Another thing to make sure if is that your détents aren't too far in.
08-10-2014, 11:54 AM
athomas

It does sound like you are getting basic bolt stick due to a carrier size that is too tight. Install the next larger carrier size. You want to use the largest carrier that does not produce a leak using the same white carrier oring. The smaller carrier sizes cause bolt stick and a leak because they don't allow the bolt stem to slide in properly and they push the carrier assembly farther back in the powertube while keeping the bolt stem vent hole exposed so that it weeps air. It stops the bolt short of being far enough back to reset the sear.

You should keep a range of carrier sizes. You never know when you might damage a carrier oring and need a new one. You need to adjust the tension of the new oring using the carriers.

Also, remove all the shims from the powertube. They can cause you to experience false leaks which result in you using a carrier size that is too tight for your setup.

If you use a longer or stiffer bolt spring, you need to increase the pressure/velocity setting to offset the increase in spring tension.
08-10-2014, 01:17 PM
nooq

thanks for the help guys, very informative.
08-10-2014, 08:37 PM
Cyco-Dude

Quote:

Originally Posted by OPBN

It's only the SS Emag bodies that had the longer pims. ULE bodies should fit fine on classic rails.

this is incorrect. the ule bodies' lug, while not as tall as the ss emag / rtp lugs, are still taller than the classic bodies lug by a very small amount. this can be verified by measuring with some calipers, but you should be able to see it if you hold a ule body next to a classic body, lugs facing eachother. the ule body will not sit flush with the classic body due to the taller lug.
08-10-2014, 08:52 PM
OPBN

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cyco-Dude

this is incorrect. the ule bodies' lug, while not as tall as the ss emag / rtp lugs, are still taller than the classic bodies lug by a very small amount. this can be verified by measuring with some calipers, but you should be able to see it if you hold a ule body next to a classic body, lugs facing eachother. the ule body will not sit flush with the classic body due to the taller lug.

They may be slightly taller, but not enough to cause issues. I have had dozens of ULE bodies as well as AM/MM rails and never had a single issue. Only bodies that have ever had clearance issues are the SS Emag length bodies with the round pims.
08-14-2014, 08:03 PM
ElecTROkiLLer

Just to cover another possible bolt stick problem, have you checked the detent? If it's to far in it will give you bolt stick and miss fires.
08-14-2014, 08:32 PM
athomas

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElecTROkiLLer

Just to cover another possible bolt stick problem, have you checked the detent? If it's to far in it will give you bolt stick and miss fires.

That one usually causes the bolt to stick forward. If the bolt goes back but just won't fully reset, then it most likely isn't a detent.
08-14-2014, 10:18 PM
Flatliner333

Also after you get the bolt issue fixed, if you want it to shoot "tits" as you say remember the more pressure and air flow your reg puts out the more "reactive" your trigger will be. 1100 psi or more will have it shooting ropes.