finally finished my homemade e-mag conversion...

[the electrician]

you could route the air differently, use an inline reg , spring it down to get a steady 50 psi out of it, put a tee on the side and take the tank pressure to the back of the mag and to the inline, then come out of the vertical with aa lpr line incognito, inside the rail.

OR, you can do it however you want.

but that rock reg under the barrel doesn't really bother me too much.

not any different than a matrix, cocker, bushmaster,freestyle etc.

[noahyay]

mags need like 700+ psi to operate so you would need a seperate air source

[noahyay]

i am in the process of talking with the electrician and clippard.com about making a system that uses a

9v
microswitch
ram
reg
electronic 3 way

that can fire 16bps. the trigger pull would be a microswitch. it would be simple and fast.

problems:

battery usage and dwell time

the eblade seliniod would be perfect but it is like 90 bucks plus 100 for a reg and plus more for pnematics and fittings. you might as well get a hAir

[nicad]

Dont bother with clippard.. they wont do it.

[shatter_storm]

This project is really interesting, you wouldn't mind if I imitated it would you?

My plan:
LPR for regulated air source
solenoid 3-way or solenoid valve to drive a ram or actuator
a ram (2 inputs for forward/reverse travel) or actuator (one input for forward travel)
9v or other power source
controlling board

I'm a CS major leaning towards embedded systems and building a custom board would be a great project for me. My custom board would have an option for eyes, 3 pushbuttons or a 5-way stick input to program the board, a piezo for alarms and user response, and maybe a LCD.

I've got industry contacts to get "samples" of some things, so I'm not worried too much about getting my hands on some of the parts. I've been looking around on a few different manufacturer's sites and there seems to be a lot of choices for 3-way solenoids or 2-way valves.
I can't really pretend to be a mechanical engineer though, so I've got no clue what to use as a ram. I have an x-valve with original on/off and the ULE on/off, so I figure I've got some leeway when it comes to the pressure needed. As best as I can tell, using the normal on/off would eliminate the need for a ram that can travel forwards *and* back since the return force on the on/off is high enough. I'm kinda skeptical about if that same method would work with the ULE, since if the return force is cut down it may not reset the sear consistantly.
electrican - do you have any suggestions as far as rams go? I don't think I'd be able to machine the clippard actuator into a ram w/piston the same way you did, especially since I can't figure out how you made the manifold and attached the air source.

The most expensive thing about the whole project is going to be the gripframe to put everything in. As best as I can figure, even if I blow a 'noid up testing the whole thing the parts should only cost about $80. A gripframe will be at least another $100, maybe more if I go with a logic or rogue grip to stuff things into. If anyone has a used or spare gripframe, let me know and I can make an offer on it - I'm a poor college student though, gotta spend money on books before I can build toys.

[MonsterMag]

how do i change the setttings? like sps and the game timer?

[the electrician]

shatter_storm-

basically, I wouldn't attempt the project if you don't have access to a mill.
you're not going to find "drop in" parts for the project.

All I can do is recommend what I have used. or you can make your own ram.
if you're not up on your pneumatics, I'd suggest going to a manufacturer's website and look for informational links or downloads.

the manifold is just a simple block of aluminum, that you drill ports in to route the air.


emagballa-

huh? it's a morlock board. did you read any other parts of the thread?

[trains are bad]

mags need like 700+ psi to operate so you would need a seperate air source

Wow. better put a no smoking sign on you marker if you're running O2.

[gunselman]

Well guys i have been working on this mod for awhile... this is what i am using. I have a customized ProTeam Products MicroMag body that i am redoing to my likings. And i am converting a Benchy 45 over to 2 finger with a custom made blade trigger with stops.

My origional design was an all mechanical/pneumatic trigger system. Consisting of a clippard 3 way (MAV-3R) and a tiny clippard ram the SM-2 actually. Well the trigger pull i feel is to heavy in the stock form of this so it is going over to full electro.

I have come up with some interesting facts for you guys... First off if you try and use a regular 45 frame there is NO way that an emag sear will fit. I made the unforntunate msitake of buying one and it didn't work.The emag sear has a longer protruding rear portion that will not travel fully in a regular 45 grip frame. I guess thats one reason why the Emag has a special grip frame. I imagine that there is some way around this but i think that i will use a regular retro sear. Another problem all be it very tiny (but i have realized that some of you don't have machining skills is that the bushing in the emag sear is to small and needs to be drilled out. And problem 3 with the emag sear is that it it about a 1/16 wider and will not fit in a regular mag rail or my micro body. So to use it you need to mill out that groove to make it work. Basically all of this still gets you no where because it won't travel fully in a regualr 45 frame. It might work in some tyoe of vertical but not a 45.

So i am going to the morlock set up.

[Cryer]

anyone tried messing with TAG's predatorII? Its tiny...

[10261]

awesome job man, you get mad props

[Phyrex]

Ok, if you dont mind me asking, couldnt you take out the electro 3-way and put a regular solenoid going directly to the sear?
im gonna try it this weekend, ill let yall kno my results.

[the electrician]

you mean like a....e-mag solenoid? and a giant battery? or perhaps like a centerflag frame with about the same reliability and wear problems?

yeah you could do that.

[Phyrex]

Yea, just an idea. And i give u mad props for your stup. Nice
Like my shiney gun?

[noahyay]

heres an anim or electritions trigger

[the electrician]

phyrex-
yeah it can be done for sure. I'm just not interested in it. AGD already makes the e-mag, no reason for me to make one. it wouldn't be a bad project for someone to have fun and learn something about solenoids, batterys and electronics.

you do have a couple of nice shiney guns there, and thanks for the compliment.

[the electrician]

oh yeah
noahyay-
your animation happy aren't you?
I don't even know how to make those damn things.

couple things though, the eblade uses a 4-way solenoid valve, not a 3-way. just like every other electrococker.

and you misspelled solenoid

now I'm just busting your chops


cryer- I've been wanting to try that new predator board. I am also interested in the new mini-morlock. they are both very small and might open up a bit of room to help with the tight squeezes I always find myself in.

[noahyay]

while i know that i am not entirly competent at designing triggers or spelling i do know that i can use flash.

[noahyay]

i ordered all of the parts for the smav 3 3 way version trigger. after i get that done then i will order the pnemadyne solenoid and the manifold. clippard is out of stock on some of the parts s i have to wait "5-7 business days" for manufacture. does the 3 way come with fittings? if not then 3x 11752-5 brass fittings for me. i also have every part but the lpr for that lpr foregrip design i made.

the lpr is already shipping along with the 450 i got from my cocker. now i can get my rt pro w/o ult. got a 15* asa for it even. ill let you know how it goes. ill get a picture of the gun its self and one with the trigger.

[noahyay]

so i got my clippard parts/micro rock and screwed them all together with no sealing implements of any kind. the smav3 3way trigger works!!!. I am sooooo happy. Course it leask but that i can fix. my new mag comes wednesday so i can screw it all together and have some pictures of it this weekend. im gonna go to the local field with a ton of people cause i started a paintball club at my school. ill put pics up this weekend.

also gonna order the pnemadyne 3 way and the single base manifold this weekend

[noahyay]

so i got my mag finnaly and spent a lot of money on part to make this thing.
a week later i relized it was too much time and effort-and i saw the inside of the y grip
now that the hAir will never come out at this rate im gonna start working on it again.

my mag is like the picture except i cut an inch off the rail and contersunk a new screw hole for the 15 degree. the 15 degree is RPG and i made it fit by cutting off that top. this is me buying acceories before the gun and them not fitting.

the micro rock is attached to a C/A to 1/8 adapter. I win for having 3 QD's on one gun.

i am gonna make a pnematic version with smav3 that i have and the smv-2 ram i think.
then ill get the pnemadyne soleniod

hose setup goes behind gun now and will be like the paint picture i made earlier

[nippinout]

what's the solenoid's part number?

cv value? open and close times?

[the electrician]

are your questions directed to me nippinout?

you can see the specs on it on the Numatics website I believe. it's the TM model. normally closed, 10mm wide, 50 Hz, 1.2 watts. I ordered a 6 volt model.

I think the Cv was .008, not much, but I don't need much for this application.

they show 3 msec open time, and 5 msec to close, but it'll do a little better than that when you give it 9 volts.

that help?

[Scott Hudnall]

I know this is an older thread, but I just came across it.

Elec - very very very impressive. Words cannot express.......

[the electrician]

thank you very much.

it's all black now.

I took it out last week and played a few games. man it's fun to shoot. I've pretty much got the trigger set-up just like I like it. no bounce, but it walks real easy.

the next thing is making a high efficiency mag. I believe it will also yield a higher rof.
I'm still doing tests, but so far I've got a pneumatic bolt return design that operates should get about 1800 shots off a 68/4500, and operate at 250 psi.

it all experimental for now.

[Conqueror]

~E~:

What specific distributor did you buy the noid from? Cause I just got this back from Numatics:

That may be the case, but I’ve been the Sales Manager for 5 years and we’ve never sold a 6vdc TM valve in that time frame. I spoke with the President and he seemed to remember about 7 years ago doing a special valve for a company named Allied that may have been 6vdc. However, we no stock or longer manufacture that 6vdc valve, and to special order it minimum quantity is 2500ea. If your interested in ordering a minimum order quantity the lead-time is 6 – 8 weeks. If you have any questions or require additional information please feel free to contact me.

Sincerely,

Steve Brancheau
Sales & Marketing Manager


CQ

[trains are bad]

I got a similar response. I'm running a 12v one on a 9.6v rechargeable and it works just fine, thousonds of shots on a charge, no problems noted.

[the electrician]

pneumadyne is distributing the exact same valve.

I don't know if pneumadyne has the specs on thier website anymore, but they were identical to the Numatics TM model.

it helps to have you're own little pnuematics business, to get special order stuff without ordering a mountain of them

really, if you can get the 12v model to work they should be pretty damn efficient, being that they will not draw hardly any current if you run them at about 10 volts. the response time might not be as good, but you're talking a very small difference. it might have problems working properly at higher operating pressure, being that it is a direct acting poppet type, but I believe that it is fairly balanced.

1.3 watts @ 12volts draws 108 milliamps and has a 110 ohm coil. run it at 10volts and it draws 91 miiliamps and generates .91 watts


1.3 watts @ 6 volts draws 216 miiliamps and has a 27.7 ohm coil. run it at 9 volts and it draws 325 milliamps and generates 1.95 watts.


so it is definitely more efficient to use the 12v model if you can. I used the 6 volt model for the extremely fast response time I would get by giving it 9 volts.

[noahyay]

i have the penumadyne soleniod catolog with specs and whatnot so if nebody needs it ill put it on my website

http://www.noahkool.com/catalog.pdf

so my new plan is to start my job in february and buy a 550 devil mag upgrade
then sell my lvl 10 and buy a soleniod valve and then use the predator board to make this thingy, while trying not to break the board

[M.Don]

kudos to electrician, nicad and noahkool, great anim noahkool, looks so simple like that, could you do one showing a mechanical version? . amazing peice of work electrician and nicad, well your just a genious and im sorry about your problems with a certain product which im sure your sick of people asking you about, you are obviously very passionate about what you do it must be a real kick in the teeth not being able to offer your ideas to the world... for now. feel any better? ive got an rt ule which id love to put the karta body and rail on, with a 15degree asa and one of your guys designs, i like the idea of no batteries but its way beyond my comprihention, and spelling! If anyone is interested i think a mechanical trigger like the one refered to above or any of the above designs, and a low operation pressure, 250-300 psi would realy bring the mag back to life. it would mine anyway. what do you guys think or know about the mq valve (i know the mq valve has little or nothing to do with a mag) or the devilmag? would be interesting to compare how they all work. and finaly cant any of you guys offer a service or perhaps a kit form for you great ideas? or would one be just as open to legal issues?



p.s. or would i be better of just buying a shocker?