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Thread: ATTN: Tom Kaye! No more Xmags?!?!

  1. #61
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    Now THAT is what I was expecting to hear. Thank you Tom for posting.

    I am sorry that the E and X Mag are going away, but I am sure they will be replaced with an even better products that will allow AGD the chance to compete at an even higher level. All my best, and good luck. I can’t wait to see what you folks have cooking.

  2. #62
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    Awwwww damn, I was going to buy an X Mag with my re-enlistment bonus. Well, I guess I'll just buy one used...

    or!

    just wait to see what AGD rolls out next!
    I'm sure that it will blow the X out of the water.

    P.S. We need to come up with a working title for this thing. How about call it the Thing or The Gizmo? Just for continuity's sake. I think the AGD Thing or the AGD Gizmo could be a good working title for this as-of-yet undeveloped markler...
    Giant flying dogs are gonna give you a flame-thrower enema!!!

    SUPPORT YOUR TROOPS!!!!!!!!

    Chuff!!! Chuff!!!

    ABQHC

  3. #63
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    WOW! I don't know what to say. I an on the list for an xmag this time. I sure hope I get one.

  4. #64
    So what exactly is AGD's current marker product line, RTP custom?

    The classic, mini, E and X are all going? The Classic and the Mini have been missing from AGD's online store for a while now, PBGear has them on clearance but almost no stock. Then Tom says the E and the X are going.

    Stopping production of the older models and using the remaining parts for tac-ones?

  5. #65
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    SP should still be boycotted. Screw them.

  6. #66
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    Wow, defintely a surprise but it makes sense when you look at the greater picture... Obviously, the E-Mag has served everyone well but being 4 years now the need for a new product is definitely out there... With the whole SP thing, why bother taking all of those resources towards developing a new e-marker (along with spending a boatload of cash in the process) if 6 months down the line you find it will infringe on the patent... From what I've seen, AGD always has something up their sleeve and with the ULT among other things, the mechanical marker I am sure will still be the best on the market.

    Besides, there are plenty of e-mags out there and with the quality that goes into them buying one used is probably just as safe a bet as buying one new -- with the proper maintenence.....

    Good luck guys!

  7. #67
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    How will the warranties by affected? What if my X breaks down in a couple of years?

    They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.
    Benjamin Franklin

  8. #68
    am I the only one who LIKES the emag's looks?

    Jacob
    My AIM Intimidator is better than your Automag. Get over it.
    Hobart Paintball AIM Paintball

  9. #69
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    Originally posted by Vendetta
    How will the warranties by affected? What if my X breaks down in a couple of years?
    Bro,
    AGD gots yo' back. Anything happens they will be more than happy to service the products they sold you. AGD is not like WDP that just leaves you haning in the wind when they build a new product...

    jb

  10. #70
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    Thumbs up

    Originally posted by Gadget
    Whoa, didn't see that announcement coming

    If a new 'E' isn't a viable proposition - why not get hold of nicad and develop his ram-powered non-electro grip frame?

    Locate a 3 way in the FBM, ram in the frame to trip the sear and have all the mount points and milling in place for users to retro fit a morlock, solenoid and eyes as aftermarket parts.
    amen to dat brudah...

  11. #71
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    Originally posted by Jack & Coke


    amen to dat brudah...
    you mean like this?

    http://www.automags.org/forums/showt...hreadid=125891

  12. #72
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  13. #73
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    It's the resources like here on AO that really impresses me. There are alot of really SMART people working on these things.. IF a 2nd generation emag comes out, I wonder if designs like this will ever influence it.. going by the electro i posted from the workshop forum, imagine having an emag grade gun in the space of your intelliframe.. MAYBE having to use some small pneumatics up front....

    I can't wait to see what's in store -- its worth the wait

  14. #74
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    wow...I didn't see this coming *gasp*...yeah...as if...you people should have seen this coming a mile away...but you were too busy staring at your little X-Mag's through rose colored goggles..


    -dB

  15. #75
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    Originally posted by DiRTyBuNNy
    wow...I didn't see this coming *gasp*...yeah...as if...you people should have seen this coming a mile away...but you were too busy staring at your little X-Mag's through rose colored goggles..


    -dB

    Anyway,


    I totally understand what AGD has to do. It would be great if people start realizing how nice the ULT mechanical mags are.

    For those not on the list just keep checking Ebay, they pop up all the time for around $1,200.

  16. #76
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    Originally posted by DiRTyBuNNy
    wow...I didn't see this coming *gasp*...yeah...as if...you people should have seen this coming a mile away...but you were too busy staring at your little X-Mag's through rose colored goggles..


    -dB
    Yeah, cos we all have the power of clairvoyance and could see the AGD-E/NPS deal coming

    ...and besides I've got an E, not a X.

  17. #77
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    Originally posted by SprayingMango



    Anyway,


    I totally understand what AGD has to do. It would be great if people start realizing how nice the ULT mechanical mags are.

    For those not on the list just keep checking Ebay, they pop up all the time for around $1,200.
    I don't know if it's just ignorancy or idiocy but why can't people realize that this was going to happen not matter what went on with the SP suit...it was inevitable...AGD cannot compete on the world stage of what is now the Industry machine of paintball.

    Paintball is not going to go back to the dark ages of Pumps and Mechanical markers...no matter what you think of your blessed AGD it's just not going to happen...Companies like NPS, Dye and SP aren't stupid enough to ignore their bottom line and let it happen...and you may get Mechanical only tournaments...but they'll be a fad just like pump tournaments are..

    and you can roll your eyes at me all day Mango...it still doesn't change the fact that people outside of the Cult of AO have been taking side bets on how long AGD was going to last for years now...just because they were wrong up to this point didn't automatically mean you were right either...

  18. #78
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    You all be nice to DB. If it wasn't for him, I wouldn't have gotten my X-Mag.



    AGD gots yo' back. Anything happens they will be more than happy to service the products they sold you. AGD is not like WDP that just leaves you haning in the wind when they build a new product...
    Oh, I have no doubt about that.

  19. #79
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    I've got Dirty Bunny's old Magma Xmag. Played 3 days on it, so I think it has 5 days total played on it. I think I'm going to support AKA and buy a viking if anyone is interested in the Xmag. I'm sure there are pictures of it around. Let me know if you're interested. I've added a blade trigger to it which is nice, but I just can't get any local support for it in Socal. I will tell you that if you don't align the breech correctly, it will reset the level 10. I'm assuming I won't be able to get this fixed based on the information in this post.

  20. #80
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    I must say I thought this might happen. I am just dissapointed because I finally found a marker that works great. I am still going to shoot my e-mag till it is completely worn out. The thing I love best about the AGD is that they have always put out a superior product. When I got my current e-mag it had been sitting on a wall for two years. They went through it and got everything work great, without charging me anything. In the tournament seen our markers must be reliable, light, and accurate. I have shot many markers and this is the only one that has had all three qualities. Thanks you Tom for making the best marker I have owned.
    David

  21. #81
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    Originally posted by orpheos
    I've got Dirty Bunny's old Magma Xmag. Played 3 days on it, so I think it has 5 days total played on it. I think I'm going to support AKA and buy a viking if anyone is interested in the Xmag. I'm sure there are pictures of it around. Let me know if you're interested. I've added a blade trigger to it which is nice, but I just can't get any local support for it in Socal. I will tell you that if you don't align the breech correctly, it will reset the level 10. I'm assuming I won't be able to get this fixed based on the information in this post.
    One person is more local then others and that man is RogueFactor (SoCal all the way). He isn't in the emag realm but I have a feeling that he'll be joining that side quickly. Anyways. You should be able to get it fixed through AGD but they'd probably have to get another one anno'ed for ya. Give AGD a call and have them take a look at it as it is a manufacturing defect with that breech.
    BUY great quality gear, parts from RogueFactor, SoCal PRIDE!!feedback
    Remember if it doesn't say RPG... it's not the real deal and probably voids the warranty

  22. #82
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    Originally posted by DiRTyBuNNy


    I don't know if it's just ignorancy or idiocy but why can't people realize that this was going to happen not matter what went on with the SP suit...it was inevitable...AGD cannot compete on the world stage of what is now the Industry machine of paintball.

    Paintball is not going to go back to the dark ages of Pumps and Mechanical markers...no matter what you think of your blessed AGD it's just not going to happen...Companies like NPS, Dye and SP aren't stupid enough to ignore their bottom line and let it happen...and you may get Mechanical only tournaments...but they'll be a fad just like pump tournaments are..

    and you can roll your eyes at me all day Mango...it still doesn't change the fact that people outside of the Cult of AO have been taking side bets on how long AGD was going to last for years now...just because they were wrong up to this point didn't automatically mean you were right either...
    I will roll my eyes at you all I want, it makes me feel good to do so. Also, most of us knew this was going to happen anyway. It surely does not spell the end of AGD. The thing is, many of us on here believe in AGD and feel proud to own AGD Markers. A few of us have gone to many meets and done many things with the people who work there. So I know a lot of us feel some sort of connection to the company that goes deeper than just owning a product. I know I personally have many GREAT friendships that I cherrish just because of it. So when something like this happens, it effects some of us differently. You wouldnt know anything about this and can't relate, which is understandable and its a shame.

    In a way I guess some of us didn't want to accept it. At the same time we are loyal to something that is much more than just a company that sells Paintball markers to the masses. Again you can't relate. Because to some of us AGD and AO are something far greater than what they seem to be on the surface. We will ride it out along with Tom and everyone at AGD and are confident that everything will pan out in the end. If you call the frienships I've built and the great people I've met here a "Cult" then so be it. Oh and for good measure:





  23. #83
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    tom were all sure u have something hidden up your sleve well we hope so good luck for know and lets not be ket waiting tooo long

  24. #84
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    Originally posted by Gadget
    Locate a 3 way in the FBM, ram in the frame to trip the sear and have all the mount points and milling in place for users to retro fit a morlock, solenoid and eyes as aftermarket parts.
    Word to that!

    Ok, here's the new SP gameplan, call Dubya and Osama, tell them that the other one's going to be at the SP factory on the same day. With any luck, the whole situation will just work itself out from there!
    I'm nothing more than text to you...

    Attention
    Getting
    Device

  25. #85
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    Originally posted by AGD


    Now the bad news, with the current legal situations going on in paintball it is not strategicaly smart for us to invest in a new e-marker at this time. We are going to wait until the dust settles and see who comes out on top before we proceed with a new design.

    We will work slowly on a new concept that will eliminate the large battery and charger, incorporate the ULT trigger system and completely new electronics. We don't expect to introduce this marker until 2005 if it makes sense to do so.


    AGD
    FINALLY!!!!!! A NEW GUN!!! This is not bad news for me they are good so im gonna be back with a mag in 2 years.

  26. #86
    Damn, crossed feelings! Happy on one side, a tad sad on the other. I've had many markers but the X-Mag is the one I'll be burried with.

    I'm totally confident that this is for good, and even if it will be a harsh wait, it's a guaratee that what ever lies beyond the mountains will Rock 'n Roll.

    Shine on AGD!
    My "twins":

    Ironmen Matrix
    Red/Black DM4

  27. #87
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    FINALLY!!!!!! A NEW GUN!!! This is not bad news for me they are good so im gonna be back with a mag in 2 years.
    2005 is next year.

  28. #88
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    Clearance sale! Everything must go!

    I saw this coming, months ago.
    The problem was simple, really...

    1) X-mags were too much of a headache to produce, and could not be produced in sufficient numbers to meet demand. Various patents required to make them were owned by AGDE, not AGD proper, preventing outsourcing.
    Overall profit on each was small, and the "average" paintballer would never buy one, even if they were the only marker in existance. Just too expensive. A big white elephant, in business terms.

    2) The E-mag is an old design, as far as electronic guns go. As Tom says, 4 years old, and quite ready for revision. Who buys a 1999 Intimidator anymore? Dated design, big and clunky.

    3) The Smart Parts litigation, or more correctly, the climate it has created, is indeed already stiffling innovation and the development of new products. Just as predicted. Mr. Kaye has now provided us with a graphic illustration, and his own testimony to this effect.

    4) The classic and minimag were already being phased out, as was the classic and retro valves. One valve line is smart, 3 is not. Consolidation is good business sense.

    5) The new ULE and tac-one body effectly made the stainless parts obsolete. Time to clean out the old, as Tom has posted in several threads over the last few months. I expect to see warp feeds discontinued in the forseeable future, due to slumping demand. Price has already fallen precipitously.

    Tom is correct...business decisions are made based on industry trends, not customer desire. Every one of these decisions is sound, from a company perspective.

    My concern is that this leaves AGD in a uneviable position, with but 2 primary products: The ULE mag, and the tac-one. Neither are exacly top of the line, and neither are entry-level markers.
    Time will tell what this means for AGD in the long run, but I'm beginning to fear that those naysayers who predicted they would not even be around in 4 more years might be right.
    I sure hope they are wrong.


    "From the mouths of babes....incoherent gibberish."

  29. #89
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    Originally posted by SprayingMango


    I will roll my eyes at you all I want, it makes me feel good to do so. Also, most of us knew this was going to happen anyway. It surely does not spell the end of AGD. The thing is, many of us on here believe in AGD and feel proud to own AGD Markers. A few of us have gone to many meets and done many things with the people who work there. So I know a lot of us feel some sort of connection to the company that goes deeper than just owning a product. I know I personally have many GREAT friendships that I cherrish just because of it. So when something like this happens, it effects some of us differently. You wouldnt know anything about this and can't relate, which is understandable and its a shame.

    In a way I guess some of us didn't want to accept it. At the same time we are loyal to something that is much more than just a company that sells Paintball markers to the masses. Again you can't relate. Because to some of us AGD and AO are something far greater than what they seem to be on the surface. We will ride it out along with Tom and everyone at AGD and are confident that everything will pan out in the end. If you call the frienships I've built and the great people I've met here a "Cult" then so be it. Oh and for good measure:
    Amen to that!

  30. #90
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    Here is the short explanation. AGDE has taken a job to run the National Paintball Europe distribution center. They will still distribute our products but making bodies is not high on the list. They are machining the last of the extrusions so there will only be one more batch of about 50 xmags. Some people on the list will not get them, sorry I dont know what to say.
    I am sure this will hurt AGD's business in the short term. Why can't AGD take up other Xmag body design continue the Xmag production? We can name it Xmag '04 or something unique.


    We will work slowly on a new concept that will eliminate the large battery and charger, incorporate the ULT trigger system and completely new electronics. We don't expect to introduce this marker until 2005 if it makes sense to do so.
    On the other hand, I am really excited to see a completely new design electornic marker from AGD. I think my Emag will hold out for at least another year.

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