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Thread: Trigger job tips for a Mag with a ReTro?

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
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    123

    Trigger job tips for a Mag with a ReTro?

    I'm currently running a mag with a ReTro valve and a Benchmark .45 frame (NEED TO BUY AN INTELLIFRAME!!! the Benchy sucks). See below:



    I really want to (A) improve the responsiveness of the trigger (right now it's almost none), and (B) make it lighter so I can "bounce" on it and get my ROF up. I know that an AGD frame would help a ton (or at least a DYE), but is there anything else I can do at this point in time to help it? I've heard of some sear tweaking tips (taking a Dremel to it and smoothing it in some areas), and I've already adjusted the rod length so that there is virtually no play front-to-back (but, due to the fact it's a Benchmark, there's at LEAST 2mm of side-to-side play). Anyone have any ideas? I'm about to take on two friends of mine, and I need to prove that my gun owns them (one has an Impulse, the other an Angel LED, not LCD). Thanks!
    -Campbell "aNtHrAx323" Krueger
    http://www.h2overclocking.com
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    "If you are distressed by anything external, the pain is not due to the thing itself, but to your estimate of it; and this you have the power to revoke at any moment." -(dunno)

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Location
    Mobile Al, USA
    Posts
    823

    ok, here we go.

    Yes, there is somthing you can do. However, before i get into that, let me go ahead and say that there is a very GOOD posibillity that you gun will not be working at peak performance (at least not for long). this is because of what youve already done. there are 2 rules that have been repeated over and over and over and over again here: 1. dont mess with the trigger rod legnth. 2. dont polish your sear.

    youve already done the rod, so i wont berate on that too much. . . sufice to say that, by increasing the legnth of the rod, you are minutely changing the angle at which the sear releases and on-off opens. just think about it for a sec, and youll see where im going with this. Basiclly, it kinda changes the timing of the firing sequence. thats why all the rods are factory set to a specific legnth (down to the thoucandths of an inch, i believe.) Anyway, my recomendation is to find out that legnth, and put the rod back immediatly- - - additionally, the benchy trig mod wont do anything if yove already moved the rod up to meet the trigger.

    now, as far as polishing the sear. the sear has a special coating on it to minimize wear and tear on it. remember, it's catching on that stainless steel bolt. . . If you polish it, it WILL wear out faster (ive seen a couple of mags that had this done -- --fired AWESOME for like a couple of months--depending on how much play they got-- then the things went full auto b/c the sear wore out. had to replace the sear, and they were back to square one, w/ a whole differnt trigger pull. ) your best bet is to learn the trigger w/ no mods to the pin and sear. (ALso, dont "shave your bolt" either- same reason) Once you get used to it, you will be able to rock and roll and do muchy damage to the competition. The key to rulling w/ a mag (or any gun) is learning how the thing fires, and maximizing that potential w/ your trigger finger. You can fire a stock mag at somthing like 9 bps, once you learn how to pull it right.

    ok. ANYWAY lol (sorry about going off like that.)

    here's how to take the pull on the benchy and cut in in half - - at least. What we're doing here is simply turning the saftey into a trigger stop. Please note that, afer this mod., your gun WILL NOT HAVE A SAFTEY.

    step 1. find out the factory legnth for your triger rod and reset it. (locktite it back into place)

    step 2. well, i was just gonna refer you to where i learned this from. . . complete w/ pics. . .but the page is gone now. well have to do this the old fashioned way.
    after the trig rod is back in place, gas up the gun and fire it very slowly. . . youre trying to determine exactly where in the looooong trigger pull the gun actually fires.
    it should be about half way or so. . .

    step 3. find somthing that is the same thickness as the distance between the back of the trigger and the frame- - - when the gun fires. They guy that had the detailed page had an old on/off top lying around, and he said it happened to be pretty much perfect. When it was held behind the trigger, the gun would fire, but the trigger would not go all the way back. . it would stop on the peice of metal which was held between it and the frame.
    Now you know how long to make your trigger pull. (note: i did say "how LONG" to make it. . . were kinda orking backwards. . were not shortening the pull, where legnthing the pull with the saftey engaged.

    Step 4. de gas the gun and remove the trigger frame.
    hold the frame in your hand, and look down on the part that connects to the body rail. Notice the saftey. play around with it, and discover how it works. the trigger has a peice that extends up into the frame. Its kinda like a plate. when the saftey is off, pulling the trigger will cause this plate to move up some. now, put the saftey on. . notice that the internal part of the saftey moves over this plate, and when the trigger is pulled, the pin prevents the plate from moving up. . . therefor preventing the trigger from moving hardly at all. You may also notice that the trigger will move just a hair w/ the saftey on. were just gonna make it move a little more.

    STEP 5. disengage the saftey. the trigger should pull freely now. take your spacer (on off top or whatever) and place it behind the trigger. pull the trigger so the spacer is inned beween the back of the trig and the frame. Remember, this is where the gun actually fires at in the Benchy trigger pull. of course, when this is held in place, that plate (called the SAFTEY PLATE or TRIGGER PLATE) hase moved up, blocking the saftey pin from being pushed in.
    what your gonna do is shave down some of the saftey plate, so the saftey pin will engage w/ the trigger held like this.

    Step 6. Whip out the ol' dremmel.
    I recomend using some type of grinding disk, that is width of the trigger plate. slowly, start grinding away the part of the trigger plate thats in-line w/ the saftey pin. Try to keep it steady, and not grind on the actual frame (its really not gonna hurt if you mess up a little and nick the frame, though.)

    Step 7. take off a little bit, and then release the trigger and put on the saftey. . it will pull a little more now. . . go back and take off a little more metal. when you start getting close to the point that your spacer indicated the gun fired, stop and put it back together, gas it up, and pull the trigger w/ the saftey on. If it dosent fire, take it apart and grind off a little more.
    once you get it to the point where ther trigger pulls and fires the gun EXACTLY where the saftey stops the trig, i reccomend going back and taking off JUST A LITTLE MORE>> this is to ensure that the trigger pull is both releasing the sear AND hitting the on off top. . if you dont give it just a little more than you think it needs, you will wind up with an automatic short stroke like every pull.

    step 8. Wow. youre pretty much done. Reassemble and put your saftey on. the gun will fire, but the trigger will only pull about half as far as it did before, maybe less.

    Step 9. Now, as far as the side to side wobble and front slack (that distance where the trig dont touch the pin, as well as the top front of the trigger dosent touch the top of the frame. . .
    This is kinda tricky-- i havent had too much luck w/ it, and i dont curently have this on MY benchy- - - but It can work, if you take enough time.
    What you want to do is create a shim to wedge under the TOP FRONT of the trigger. . in that little space between the trig. and the frame. If done correctly, it will not let the trigger come forward so far that it wobbles-- it will kinda pin the trigger just barely up against the pin.

    step 10. try using a VERY thin peice of plastic, or a folder over peice of a coke can. no wider than the width of the underside of the trigger frame, but wide enough for a hole for your frame screw to go through. this little shim will be long enough to reach to the Front side of the frame screw. . . punch a hole in it to feed the screw through. . . this part needs to be EXTREMELY thin. the thickness of a single peice of aluminum from a coke can should be thin enough. the part that will wedge up under the front of the trigger needs to be a little thicker. (try cutting a thin LONG rectangular peice of a coke can, and folgind one end of it over on itself 2 or 3 times. . . this might be about thick enough. . . the unfolded portion is where you will run the frame screw through.

    When installed and measured properly, this will eliminate side to side play, and Front slack. however, if the shim is too thick (pinning the trigger againdt the pin a little too hard, ) the gun will short stroke really easy . . so its pretty tricky to get it right.


    There ya go. . . . if you need any help let me know, same if i need to clarify anything.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2001
    Location
    naples, florida USA
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    1,990
    ummm....how about no.

    1)reset your trigger rod back to its normal length.

    2)use washers to fill in the gaps on the sides of the trigger in between the trigger and the side of the frame. this will eliminate side to side slop

    3)drill a hole behind your trigger and install a screw that sticks out enough to stop the trigger after it fires. this will eliminate the huge trigger pull.

    as for the reactivness of the trigger, you need to increase the pressure going into your gun. that is why an adjustable tank is recommended with the retro valve. the higher the pressure, the higher the reactiveness.

  4. #4
    Join Date
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    I'm with chaotic. Trigger stops (the screw in the trigger or in the frame) works great. Look at Bushies, they got an adjustable trigger stop in those triggers. Did the same thing with my Z-grip, trigger stop is the way to go.

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