Results 1 to 23 of 23

Thread: Apologies to donggie, mag_doc, rexel16, and www.modifiedpaintball.com - EVERYONE READ

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2000
    Location
    Kansas City, MO USA
    Posts
    1,765

    Apolgies to donggie, mag_doc, rexel16, and www.modifiedpaintball.com - EVERYONE READ

    A little bit of history for you all... Shortly after Mussolini (you know, Hitler's buddy who was ruler of Italy) was executed - along with his mistress - their bodies where hung up in the town square. Shortly after the towns’ people beat, shot, and stabbed these bodies until they were just mangled corpses.

    Well - history repeats its self on automags.org. You see, I thought that a person was guilty of something and banned him. And I named a couple people who I thought were involved too. By putting up these targets, these people unfairly got a lot of flack they didn't deserve. I am here to apologize and set the record straight.

    On Friday, the AO user mykroft emailed me upset that someone was spamming using his name. Basically he received a bounced email to a third person that used HIS user name in the email message and had his PERSONAL email address as the return email (which is why it bounced to him).

    Mykroft was rather upset about this, as anyone would be. He presented the email and evidence, and I compared it to donggies IP address from posting on AO. He has a static internet IP address and there is no doubt he sent the email.

    So - with this knowledge - it looked like that donggie was spamming people, using a false endorsement. It’s kind of stupid, but not unheard of. Well, seeing what I saw, I was rather upset he did this too, so I just banned him and explained it on the forum as to why. At the same time I suggested that Mag_doc and or rexel16 may or may not be donggie as another alias (the Internet is big, and this wouldn’t be the first time someone has taken two or more identities on a forum).

    So - because of the knowledge I had, I acted swift and hard. I am used to taking one swing of the sword and being done with it. Well - in this case I was a bit premature.

    Here is what really happened:

    Donggie DOES have a website, www.modifiedpaintball.com. He did send out some emails to people who had previously contacted him about other paintball related things. The problem is, he was using a form based email program and he inadvertently made it look like mykroft was SENDING the recommendation to check out the site, when donggie really meant to send the message TO mykroft.

    To make matters work - he is doing this paintball thing on the side to make a bit of extra money because he was laid off from a nice paying IT job due to the economy down turn.

    Mag_doc is a guy in California who likes to tinker with mags. He hooked up with donggie to do some gun work and repairs for him and worked with him on the site and the forums. He sells guns he builds up for fun and to make a bit of cash.

    And to make matters worse, mag_doc is recovering from a bad car crash and is on disability. (this is sounding like a Charles Dickens book, isn’t it?)

    Rexel16 is a 16-yr. old kid who was helping mag_doc sell some guns online. You see, mag_doc wasn’t real web savvy and rexel16 was helping mag_doc out. In exchange, mag_doc was going to build him a stock mag from some parts he had for helping him out.

    Now - I had no idea of all of the crap my post would stir up. Granted - a bit of anger is understandable when members feel that another member has betrayed their trust by doing something like sending out false endorsements. But a couple indeed did go over the line. In fact some of the posts should have been deleted. But, like Mussolini hanging in the square, he was the "bad guy", and everyone want a chance to get a kick in.

    But now I see that I did not have all the information. I made a mistake and acted without all the information. In hindsight I should have contacted donggie BEFORE I publicly hung him out to be flogged. I HONESTLY did NOT mean to drag mag_doc and rexel16 into all of this. But they were obviously pulled down into it by the "angry mob". Like I said, I NEVER had any reason to ban or be upset at either rexel16 or mag_doc, but I thought they COULD be aliases of donggie.

    So I whole heatedly apologize for my mistake. I feel bad because a) you lost face with people on the forum, b) you lost business because of this, and c) a lot of un-nice things were said to these people that they didn’t deserve.

    Some people may want to point at mykroft. Yes he called this to my attention, and he presented the evidence. But *I* am still the "keeper of the castle". I should have gotten both sides of the story before acting. I know that mykroft no longer thinks donggie is to blame - nor that he did anything wrong intentionally.

    I want to stress that any bad will towards these people should immediately be shed. I spent about an hour on the phone with mag_doc and donggie. They are both stand up people, and while they are upset, they also understand that I acted with certain assumptions and was trying to do my job, even if it wasn’t the right move.

    I just want to clear up that www.modifiedpaintball.com is a reputable dealer - and does not engage in unethical business practices. Indeed, if you read some of their customer’s posts, they do a good job at what they do.

    And Mag_doc is just a great guy who tinkers with guns and makes a buck or two off of it. He does not practice unethical business practices either - and he would be a great person to turn to if you are looking to build up a custom mag.

    Rexel16 is a kid who is helping mag_doc sell some guns. Both are private people and should be allowed to post on the classifieds.

    Again - I feel bad about this confusion. I am unbanning donggie after I post this. I know that many of you said what you said, under the assumption that he was being unethical. But I think that many of us owe these people an apology, and knowing the users on this forum, they will do the right thing.

    Again - I am truly sorry for this mistake and hope that they will continue to visit and use automags.org.
    Last edited by Webmaster; 10-29-2001 at 08:12 PM.

    Problems or questions with the site or your account? Email me: webmaster@automags.org I collect old guns and paintball gear. Email me if you have stuff to sell!

    Paintball Never Dies - www.vintagerex.com

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2001
    Location
    Central Florida
    Posts
    21
    Act in haste repent in leisure. Thumbs up to you Webby

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2000
    Location
    Don't make me pull over!!
    Posts
    5,771
    I am truly, unabashedly, ashamed at my personal reaction to this situation.

    I live in a black and white world where what is said goes. The way what is said also is important, as it is your inflection that gets the message across. Sometimes the inflection can be taken to mean something else entirely and bad things happen.

    I am still learning that I cannot possibly have you understand my vocal inflection from reading what I have typed. This has, again, has caused undo heartache and consternation among you AO members.

    I saw Webby's post about a thief and a liar. Nothing gets my dander up more than a thief, and a liar is a close second. I posted what I thought was obviously a parody of a Hollywood movie, but that inflection thing reared it's ugly head and smacked me right between the eyes.

    Donggie, I give you my head on a platter. I over reacted and smeared your name. I am sorry.

    Mag_doc, you were inadvertantly in the line of fire and my brashness sullied you too. I am sorry

    Rexel16, as you were standing by to your friends, you too were soiled by my harsh rhetoric. I am sorry.

    To all that were appalled at my post, I am sorry to have upset you, forcing you to waste your time responding to me.

    It seems I was the one not being too honorable after all.

    I am going to ban myself from Automags.org for a while, so as to serve my pennance the same as any other member would be for such a screw up.

    Dave

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Oct 2000
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    5,956
    Donggie, Mag_doc and Rexel16,

    You have my sincerest appologies from myself and my company. I hope you can find some way to forgive us and continue to be active on this forum. We all know now that we made a mistake and I hope this helps in some way make up for it.

    Very sorry,

    Tom Kaye and AGD

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Stalker Paintball
    Posts
    822
    Good call Army, I know I still have respect for you and everyone else affected by this mishap.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2000
    Location
    California
    Posts
    721
    Ok, lemme call nike town, what size shoe would you ALL like for your mouths? jk
    ~Chaos
    chaos@cazorp.com
    NutBuster.net
    Team AO, SoCal

    Wanna talk to a REAL skanline guntech? Email smackmyass@cazorp.com

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    Toronto,Ontario,Canada
    Posts
    2,007
    My apologies to mag doc, Rexel16 and Donggie. This is a classic example of how evidence can lie. I have something that looks hands down like a deliberate attempt to use my name without my permission, and it turns out that as best we can tell, Donggie merely screwed up a cut&paste.

    I took the steps I felt were necessary to protect my professional reputation, and am very sorry that what was a simple mistake turned into this fiasco. Next time I will definitely contact the person involved offline to try and resolve it before taking it to the authorities.

    Mea Culpa
    2k2 VF Cocker, STO Ram, Hollowpoint, Eclipse Blade, Old-Style 14" Boomstick, 45/45 'Geddon
    68AutoMag Classic Feed CF11023, Ring trigger.
    http://www.blackstarusa.com - Best gear on the market
    LP = Marketing Drivel

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    offshore
    Posts
    7,227

    I am also VERY sorry

    I also have followed the crowd on this one, and my deepest apologies to anyone that may have been affected. I live and learn, only to learn more everyday. My sincere regrets, Bob
    Email me for low prices on ALL AGD Products and more. tunaman5@verizon.net
    Tunamart

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    CA.
    Posts
    11

    Arrow things happen

    They say it takes more of a man to say he is wrong than admit he's right . I hope we all kind learned to get look at all sides of the fence before we burn it down . No hard feeling's here . Hope to be up playing by the new year . Later The Doc

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2001
    Location
    Rock Hill, SC, USA
    Posts
    505

    This is why I stay out of these things...

    There is always more to a situation that meets the eye. Be slow to wrath :-)


    "I am your father."
    --Darth Vader

  11. #11
    Join Date
    May 2001
    Location
    Wayne, PA
    Posts
    1,000
    At least you were man enough to admit it...

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Location
    "The SC" (South Carolina)
    Posts
    16,205
    I guess it would be a bit small of me to say "I told you so"? So I won't... It was an honest mistake on everyones part.

    Good job everyone for doing the right thing. I am proud to be a member of AO.

  13. #13
    Cphilip.....It might be small of you to say it, but I'll sure say it "Told you so". And so did a few other people.

    I do like the way that everyone apologizes so quickly after being proven wrong. Instead of getting all the facts, people just jump to conclusions based on the preponderance of evidence that Mykroft had. Now if we all jumped on the same band wagon OJ would be in jail right now (ok...so that's a bad example, he actually did it). While i was not very vocal in this, i wholeheartedly supported donggie as this accusation was totally out of his character. I just hope Don and the others will feel comfortable coming back to AO.

  14. #14
    I'm really glad this is over and we have our great friend donggie back Thanks for the post Webby, I really appreciate it, and thanks for everyone else who helped out.

    (Webby is still, by far, the coolest [] webmaster I know of )

    "We were, we were wasting time
    Let the hours roll by
    Doing nothing for the fun
    A little taste of the good life
    Whether right or wrong
    Makes us wanna stay, stay, stay, stay for awhile"

    -Dave Matthews
    Last edited by Tbone; 10-30-2001 at 10:08 AM.
    me

    "You can only hide your lack of game with your Rate of Fire for so long." - RobAGD


  15. #15
    Join Date
    May 2001
    Location
    Willington, CT, USA
    Posts
    461

    Told ya

    Originally posted by paintball8869
    Cphilip.....It might be small of you to say it, but I'll sure say it "Told you so". And so did a few other people.
    I like to be one of those few other ppl.
    Not every possible outcome was considered with the given "evidence", or like I said, "clues".
    And of course, the good'ol Army response, there was no right given for that post to be made.
    I hope that conclusions are not reached so quickly next time.

    NOTE: That incident reminds me of something as well...hmm, maybe HighSchool gossip almost? You get the point.
    No more of that, it was made to0 public, too many uniformed ppl speaking out, etc...

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    Denver,CO,USA
    Posts
    277
    You learn little about a company from looking at it's mistakes, and alot from how it takes responsibility for them.

    Now is as good a time as any to voice in public what has been clear to me for a long time, and that is that AGD is an exceptional company.

    Companies spend insane amounts of money to try and create a corporate identity and image that you guys get just for being you. I find ( this is part of my business ) that most of them don't realize that it's not about anything that they can buy, create, or sell as their image, it's about their commitment to their customers and their desire to be really great at what they do.

    Good job on clearing things up, and I bet that in the long run donggie ( now known to many as donggie the exhonerated ) might find an increase in business if anything thanks to the good nature of the folks here in the community.

    On a completely different note, donggie, if you have a formmail application running locally that allowed this to happen by mistake then take a good look at it. Since most hosting companies made email servers more secure the easiest way to send Spam now is to find such a formmail application and relay through it. Because it is on a known IP the mail server will happily allow it to send whatever anyone wants. I reguralarily see entries in my server error logs where web-spiders trying random IP addresses fail to find something like /cgi-bin/formail.pl? and the code to send this IP address to a hotmail account so that a spammer knows you have an opening that can be abused!


    Keith


    Mi-f33t-R-Wet.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Wasilla, Alaska
    Posts
    48

    Red face add me

    I apoligize also for anything I said. I figured he was guilty with what I was reading without looking further.

    Army, I hope you don't stop posting. I could see what you were doing. My world is black or white also. I am in the AF and I think we judge the same. One mistake is all it takes for me to loose trust in someone but have to have a different level of trust with or co-workers than most. It seems as though Donngie was innocent. I can accept that also and I am going to check his site to see if there is something he has to offer even though I had never heard of it before.
    DAVYBOY

  18. #18
    Join Date
    May 2001
    Location
    OH
    Posts
    2,230
    sometimes its really good to stay at a slight distance from the soap opera that is internet message boards. i have absolutly no idea who any of these people involved are, and barely even glanced at the original "whateverhisname has been banned" post.

    but thanks for the update nonetheless

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Oct 2001
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    909
    you where wrong and you admitted it. you are a better person because you admitted this. 'nough said.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    May 2001
    Location
    Hicksville, NY, USA
    Posts
    790

    Thank You.

    To Everyone:

    I was more disappointed than angry with what had happened. It had become a daily routine for me to at least check to see some of the things that were going on with mods or mag stuff for sale. Thank you for resolving this whole thing. I am so glad that I was not wrong in thinking that the people here are all stand up people, that they are all ok and would make the best of friends.

    I would like to thank all of those who believed in me before, and throughout this incident, especially to those that came to my defense. For those that actually called me, long distance, just to keep me up to speed, I hope you all know how much your faith in me has meant. They say it is during times like these you really know who your truest friends are. After receiving a cut and past of the thread as it progressed, I was feeling quite poorly, it was the second set of messages that was sent to me by a good friend, that made me cry (not being a *** or anything) But just to see people speak of me as I could only wish all would, I was truly touched. My sincerest thanks goes out to you.

    For those of you who may have said some things or might have thought bad things about me, I understand. I do not believe anyone should have to suffer in addition to the suffering that has already taken place. Banning yourselves or putting yourselves in a negative light in any way would serve no purpose. I am just glad that all is well again. I do not need to "get even" or throw around negative thoughts. Aside from my disappointment of being branded such an idiot by people who may not really know me, I was not really "angry". It may be in our best interests to forget this ever happened.

    Webby, I thank you for your understanding and sincerity. I appreciate the efforts you made even though you did not have to. I thank you for apologizing even though you were only doing your job and doing it well as usual. Thanks for being concerned enough to do all that you did. Oh, and I took off the midi and the tail script on the homepage.

    AGD, thank you so much for your personal involvement in this whole unfortunate misunderstanding. Again as true to form as can be, you and your staff have come to the rescue, above and beyond the call of duty... AGAIN! I am proud to be an Emag owner and am honored to have spoken and interacted with you and your staff. I have always sang the praises of your products and your company, I will have to try even harder to sing more fervently.

    Marcia, Joanne, Jon, and whomever else I may have forgotten to mention, thank you from the bottom of my heart. When something like this happens, some stand by you while others just stand. Thanks for being there when it counted most.

    Finally, granted that the prices on my website are not as low as I'd like, I am at the mercy of my supplier of these things. For all AO members, if anyone wants anything that I have on the site, please contact me directly and I will give you all a discount depending on how much I can... if it's still too high, at least I tried and you may opt to purchase at another place, no bad blood, no bad feelings. As much as I would love to cut everyone a bang up deal on everything, I have to do it without losing my shirt.

    Thanks to all... I'M BACK!!!

    Sincerely,

    Don
    This is DEFINITELY the BEST way
    to SEND AND RECEIVE Money
    via the internet. Check it Out.
    NO FEES FOR RECEIVING PAYMENTS!!!
    AND IT'S FREE!!!
    Get $5 for signing up and $10 for sending your first payment.
    LINK TO C2IT and AOL Quick Cash


    Donggie@ModifiedPaintball.com
    516-520-6668
    www.ModifiedPaintball.com
    Modifiedpaintbal - AIM

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Location
    "The SC" (South Carolina)
    Posts
    16,205
    Welcome back Don. Your a gracious fellow.

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Oct 2001
    Location
    Central Florida
    Posts
    21
    Stop your Blubbering and get your postings started again Every one involved learned a hard lesson. On your part I hope you start computer classes. Mykroft buy new glasses. Webby and Army Have another beer Your both only human (I think)

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Oct 2000
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    5,956
    Glad to have you back Don!!

    AGD

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •