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Thread: E/X-Mag Microcontroller Programming (Atmel AT90S2313)

  1. #691
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    e-MAg varying on the chrono

    Hey guys, how are you doing? Long time no see (talk).

    As some of you know, Iīm training to the Brazilian National Paintball Cup, which will be held at Ibirapuera Park here in Sao Paulo (think of Central Park in New York) on December 2nd and 3rd.

    I sold my SFT Shocker and now Iīm using only my e-Mag. People here canīt believe that I use this gun at a tourney like that but Iīm absolutelly confident with it. In fact, Iīm buyin another e-Mag to have a spare, just in case something goes wrong with the first one. Of course itīll sport X-Mod software as well.

    What brings me here this time is about drop-off and chrono variations. I donīt kow if itīs normal but my Mag shoots between 270 and 298 fps without touching it.

    My current set-up is:

    ROF: 17
    DWEL: 15
    FIX: 11
    Firing Modes: all - actually, Iīm shooting almost Semi only because of the tournament.
    Air Pressure into the gun: 950 to 980 psi

    Should I raise the DWEL? Would it help fixing this variation?

    How does your e-Mag behave, regarding to this? Do you chrono them with one shot per time or do you give rapid bursts over the chrono?

    Thanks again and best regards,

    Mendel.

    PS: Paul, as you could see, I was the third one to place a review on PBReview.

  2. #692
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    Quote Originally Posted by mpsd
    Hey guys, how are you doing? Long time no see (talk).

    As some of you know, Iīm training to the Brazilian National Paintball Cup, which will be held at Ibirapuera Park here in Sao Paulo (think of Central Park in New York) on December 2nd and 3rd.

    I sold my SFT Shocker and now Iīm using only my e-Mag. People here canīt believe that I use this gun at a tourney like that but Iīm absolutelly confident with it. In fact, Iīm buyin another e-Mag to have a spare, just in case something goes wrong with the first one. Of course itīll sport X-Mod software as well.

    What brings me here this time is about drop-off and chrono variations. I donīt kow if itīs normal but my Mag shoots between 270 and 298 fps without touching it.

    My current set-up is:

    ROF: 17
    DWEL: 15
    FIX: 11
    Firing Modes: all - actually, Iīm shooting almost Semi only because of the tournament.
    Air Pressure into the gun: 950 to 980 psi

    Should I raise the DWEL? Would it help fixing this variation?

    How does your e-Mag behave, regarding to this? Do you chrono them with one shot per time or do you give rapid bursts over the chrono?

    Thanks again and best regards,

    Mendel.

    PS: Paul, as you could see, I was the third one to place a review on PBReview.
    I'm not sure on the chrono thing that sounds normal to me. Changing the dwell shouldn't have any affect at all. Try the tech thread. And yes I did see your review, thank you.

  3. #693
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    sounds more of a mechanical issue with the valve. It shouldnt be affected by the software. Try to chrono it in Mech mode just to make sure. It probably wouldnt hust to overhaul the reg portion of the valve.

  4. #694
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigEvil
    sounds more of a mechanical issue with the valve. It shouldnt be affected by the software. Try to chrono it in Mech mode just to make sure. It probably wouldnt hust to overhaul the reg portion of the valve.
    Yeah, I did overhauled the reg. I had to change the piston assembly a couple of weeks ago but itīs still varying. Iīll have to do the mech mode test. I thought of changing the DWEL ajustment because Iīve read it on an Ion thread at a local forum. The guy was having the same problem with hisīs Ion and another guy suggested that he should raise the Dwel.

    Yesterday I did a complete cleanup of my maker (after sunday games), oiled it thoroughly and checked the o-rings. All of them seem to be OK.

    Let me see what happens next sunday and Iīll let you know.

    Thanks and best regards,

    Mendel.

    PS: Iīve posted a thread on BEO about drilling a ULE body to make it lighter and how to do a ULE trigger frame for the e-Mag. Did you see it? Thanks!

  5. #695
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    Quote Originally Posted by mpsd
    Yeah, I did overhauled the reg. I had to change the piston assembly a couple of weeks ago but itīs still varying. Iīll have to do the mech mode test. I thought of changing the DWEL ajustment because Iīve read it on an Ion thread at a local forum. The guy was having the same problem with hisīs Ion and another guy suggested that he should raise the Dwel.

    Yesterday I did a complete cleanup of my maker (after sunday games), oiled it thoroughly and checked the o-rings. All of them seem to be OK.

    Let me see what happens next sunday and Iīll let you know.

    Thanks and best regards,

    Mendel.

    PS: Iīve posted a thread on BEO about drilling a ULE body to make it lighter and how to do a ULE trigger frame for the e-Mag. Did you see it? Thanks!

    FYI - the way the dwell effects the ion and most other guns is different than the way it does mags. The dwell on a mag is how long the noid pull the sear, and should have very little to do with velocity.

    When you overhauled the gun, did you change the reg springs and vavle pin? Also make sure you lube the living crap out of everything. Keep you input pressure over 800psi.

    Yes, I saw on BEO about the weight reduction. I think I left a brief response, but I cannot access the site from work anymore. Its getting blocked by the content filiter. Maybe I need to filter the cursing?

  6. #696
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigEvil
    FYI - the way the dwell effects the ion and most other guns is different than the way it does mags. The dwell on a mag is how long the noid pull the sear, and should have very little to do with velocity.

    When you overhauled the gun, did you change the reg springs and vavle pin? Also make sure you lube the living crap out of everything. Keep you input pressure over 800psi.

    Yes, I saw on BEO about the weight reduction. I think I left a brief response, but I cannot access the site from work anymore. Its getting blocked by the content filiter. Maybe I need to filter the cursing?
    Filter the cursing could be a good idea LOL Iīll check BEO īcause I did not receive an e-mail saying the thread got answered so I didnīt came back there.

    Thanks for your help. I didnīt know about the Dwel ajustments on other guns but I got your point. I also didnīt change the valve springs nor the pin because I donīt have spares so I just cleaned and lubed it. How should I know when these springs have to be changed?

    I think Iīll place an order on two other pistons and some valve springs.

    Thanks,

    Mendel.

  7. #697
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    Quote Originally Posted by mpsd
    How should I know when these springs have to be changed?
    When you start having inexplicable velocity problems (Dont forget the pin, it's often overlooked.)

  8. #698
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigEvil
    When you start having inexplicable velocity problems (Dont forget the pin, it's often overlooked.)
    Yeah, I guess Iīll have to get some f these springs and the pin. The pin costs over US$ 20,00... I thought it would be cheaper. Iīll see if Tuna can send those parts to me here in Brazil. Anyway, thanks again.

    Best regards,

    Mendel.

  9. #699
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    Quote Originally Posted by mpsd
    Yeah, I guess Iīll have to get some f these springs and the pin. The pin costs over US$ 20,00... I thought it would be cheaper. Iīll see if Tuna can send those parts to me here in Brazil. Anyway, thanks again.

    Best regards,

    Mendel.
    If there was another e-mag board made with the same chip footprint what processor should be used. Also with extra memory how many more features would be available ???

    Yes this is a loaded question....
    "It's my buddies gun"
    "I just bought it"
    "It came that way"
    "I borrowed it "
    I HAVE HEARD THEM ALL, SO BE ORIGINAL !!!

    My gun says I'm holding it back from doing great things ...


  10. #700
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    Quote Originally Posted by KayleAGD
    If there was another e-mag board made with the same chip footprint what processor should be used. Also with extra memory how many more features would be available ???

    Yes this is a loaded question....
    Lornecash told me the only thing limiting the feature list is the space on the board :-)

    (Keep us posted on this one Kyle)

  11. #701
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    Talking

    Quote Originally Posted by BigEvil
    Lornecash told me the only thing limiting the feature list is the space on the board :-)

    (Keep us posted on this one Kyle)

    i still want a gps anti theft locator, mp3 player..and a web browser..or maye finger print recognition, with a electric shock theft deterent..

  12. #702
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    Quote Originally Posted by rudz
    i still want a gps anti theft locator, mp3 player..and a web browser..or maye finger print recognition, with a electric shock theft deterent..
    Today if I was to design that board I would use an ATmega48/88/168 (all the same chip with either 4k, 8k or 16k of memory) since they all have the same footprints and many more on chip features than the AT90S2313/ATtiny2313.

  13. #703
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    Quote Originally Posted by LorneCash
    Today if I was to design that board I would use an ATmega48/88/168 (all the same chip with either 4k, 8k or 16k of memory) since they all have the same footprints and many more on chip features than the AT90S2313/ATtiny2313.
    Will this chip directly replace the current chip and will the 1.37 software work on this chip ?

    Kayle

  14. #704
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    No, only the ATmega48, ATmega88, and ATmega168 have the same footprint. They have more pins than the current AT90S2313 IC so are not compatible with our present board.
    Except for the Automag in front, its usually the man behind the equipment that counts.

  15. #705
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    Show My Thread

    I don't know why but my thread keeps disappearing if no one posts in it. I think the mods should sticky it but since it's not an official AGD thing that's not gonna happen... My only choice is to post every so often to make it stay visible
    Last edited by LorneCash; 04-09-2007 at 11:28 AM.

  16. #706
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    it's OK, we like to hear frome you every now and then to knwo all is well.


    Styg
    Sometimes It's Good to be EVIL

  17. #707
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    Sticky my thread please.

  18. #708
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    micro-

    how about one of these ? digikey it had the same footprint but only one counter/ timer..

  19. #709
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    Quote Originally Posted by KayleAGD
    how about one of these ? digikey it had the same footprint but only one counter/ timer..
    link is broken, but if I were to make to choose a new processor now it would be an Atmel ATmega48

    summary datasheet for Atmega48
    http://www.atmel.com/dyn/resources/p...ents/2545S.pdf

    check out pages 18-21 for the different sizes available I'd stick to the 20Mhz chips since that's what the current chip is. the only thing left is to check digikey and see what the availability is because they only stock the common options... which is what we would want anyways.

    These chips have several advantages first if I would ever run out of memory I can get the same chip with up to 16k of memory (8 times the current chip although 4k should be pleanty)

    second they can be really tiny 5x5x1mm... much smaller than the current chip

    and that's just to name a few physical details... there's a few programming advantages too.

  20. #710
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    try this digikey pdf


    Attiny861v-10pu-nd

    this processor has the same footprint for the boards it would make it easy ..

  21. #711
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    Quote Originally Posted by KayleAGD
    try this digikey pdf


    Attiny861v-10pu-nd

    this processor has the same footprint for the boards it would make it easy ..
    It looks like a good chip there are 2 things that concern me... the pinnout is different enough so that it could never be a drop in chip, and also it doesn't have as many IO pins. It has 16 instead of 18. That isn't really a problem though because currently only 13 of them are actually used.

    This chip does have some of the advantages of the Mega48 too... the main one is that every IO pin is an interrupt. This means the gun could be put in sleep mode whenever you're not shooting and not kill yout battery... I actually wrote the code to do this before I realized that it would never work because the only interrupt is the trigger.

  22. #712
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    Quote Originally Posted by LorneCash

    Here is a list of what i found when doing a pinnout of the Board. If anyone wants a full pinnout of the Microcontroller or a reverse engineered schematic on the board let me know and i'll either email it to you or post it if i get enough requests.

    Port B
    PB7 - N/C
    PB6 - ACE
    PB5 - Tournament Lock
    PB4 - Display RS
    PB3 - Display DATA IN
    PB2 - Display CLOCK
    PB1 - Low Voltage
    PB0 - N/C

    Port D
    PD7 - N/C
    PD6 - Display CE
    PD5 - Bottom Button
    PD4 - Top Button
    PD3 - Solenoid/Warp Feed (at the same time)
    PD2 - Trigger (HES)
    PD1 - N/C
    PD0 - N/C

    Can someone double check these? I haven't gotten far enough in the code to use all of them yet and it would be extreemly frustrating if i had this part wrong. Send Me a PM and i'll edit my post so as not to confuse anyone who reads this later.
    Paul ;
    I cannot find a reference to pd7 on the chip diagram. Any thoughts ? Could you e-mail me the schematic of the board ?

    Kayle

  23. #713
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    Quote Originally Posted by KayleAGD
    Paul ;
    I cannot find a reference to pd7 on the chip diagram. Any thoughts ? Could you e-mail me the schematic of the board ?

    Kayle
    Yea guess I put that in there just to make things symmetric... In actuality you're right PD7 does not exist. The other one had 7 so I just made that one have 7 and left is as N/C. sorry for the confusion

  24. #714
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    are there any pins that cannot be moved by programming ? other than VCC and GND

    old AT90S2313 ...... new ATtiny861

    PB7 - N/C
    PB6 - ACE ...... PA2-PIN 18
    PB5 - Tournament Lock ...... PA3- PIN 17
    PB4 - Display RS ...... PB0- PIN 1
    PB3 - Display DATA IN ...... PB1- PIN 2
    PB2 - Display CLOCK ...... PA4- PIN 14
    PB1 - Low Voltage ...... PA5- PIN 13
    PB0 - N/C

    Port D

    PD6 - Display CE ...... PA6- PIN 12
    PD5 - Bottom Button ...... PB6- PIN 9
    PD4 - Top Button ...... PB5- PIN 8
    PD3 - Solenoid/Warp Feed ...... PB4- PIN 7
    PD2 - Trigger (HES) ...... PB4- PIN 4
    PD1 - N/C
    PD0 - N/C

    I can make a crossover to move connections but the fewer the better. Better get youre programming fingers warmed up I think we can do this. Can you send me the diagram of the board ? That would save me alot of time ..

    Kayle

  25. #715
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    Quote Originally Posted by KayleAGD
    are there any pins that cannot be moved by programming ? other than VCC and GND

    I can make a crossover to move connections but the fewer the better. Better get youre programming fingers warmed up I think we can do this. Can you send me the diagram of the board ? That would save me alot of time ..

    Kayle
    I'll send you what I got, but pm me your email again, can't seem to find it.

  26. #716
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    up

  27. #717
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    it's a clasic... I gotta bring it up

  28. #718
    figured i'll try to help out the up post

  29. #719
    Anyone know why Lorne's website is down and if the files are mirrored/archived anywhere? I bought the programmer more than a year ago, but never got around to flashing my gun. Also, any chance the programmer works with Vista?

    Thanks,

    -Calvin
    From a poster at PB Nation:

    ""Jim, back to your cave. Bob Long is on the batphone..."

    MY FEEDBACK

  30. #720
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    Quote Originally Posted by cledford
    Anyone know why Lorne's website is down and if the files are mirrored/archived anywhere? I bought the programmer more than a year ago, but never got around to flashing my gun. Also, any chance the programmer works with Vista?

    Thanks,

    -Calvin
    Mine is an old serial programmer and it works perfectly with Vista. Don't know about the site but if Lorne doesn't mind I can get you a copy of 1.8. PM him first to make sure, ok?

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