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Thread: RT issues

  1. #1

    RT issues

    on my Rt with a level x is short stroking a lot, that turned in to the bolt not returning back all the way...tried a new spring

    here is a video and this is with a new spring


    http://imageshack.us/clip/my-videos/...xccbijqoa.mp4/

  2. #2
    Join Date
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    Bolt stick can cause short stroking. Have you ensured that the carrier size is correct for the white carrier oring you are using?
    Except for the Automag in front, its usually the man behind the equipment that counts.

  3. #3
    dont know what u mean.... years ago i had it tuned but it had sat for a long time

  4. #4
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    Sounds like it needs to be retuned.

  5. #5
    well crap... it was tuned at one time... o well i found some shims where is the how to on the level x? thanks all!

  6. #6
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    Level 10 tuning guide:

    The carriers are sized using lines and dots. Each line represents a 1 and a series of dots represents 0.5. Eg; 2 lines and dots equals size 2.5. Carriers range from size 0 to 3.5 but most people only have from 0 to 2.5 and most new kits have even less.

    When tuning your level 10, remove all the shims from the powertube before starting. They don't affect the operation but they can cause false leaks which cause you to use a carrier size that is too tight. Don't put them back when you are done. You shouldn't ever need them.

    For carrier sizing:

    Find the carrier size that causes the installed oring to fit freely over the bolt stem. The carrier should sit on the bolt stem without moving if the bolt is held in a vertical position. If you tap the valve on a hard surface, the carrier should be loose enough to allow the bolt to move. If you have to force the carrier onto the bolt stem with any force at all, then it is too tight. Install the bolt and valve into the gun. When aired up there should be no leaking. If it leaks, take the carrier out and replace it with the next smaller size. Always use the same white carrier oring in each carrier that you use. It is the oring that you are adjusting. Try it again. You want to use the largest carrier size that does not produce a leak.

    Any time that the gun fires and does not reset or short strokes and does not reset, or just chuffs and does not reset, the problem is most likely a carrier that is too tight. Installing shims will not help. Shims only help if the bolt moves, hits an object but does not vent any air, and then cannot reset because the chamber is still fully charged. Most of the time the bolt always moves far enough to expose the vent hole, get rid of excess air, and then reset.

    For spring adjustment:

    You want to use the bolt spring that allows you to shoot about 20fps above the lowest velocity that the gun will cycle at. So, if you want to use the gun at 280fps, then your desired lower limit of operation is 260fps. Insert your long bolt spring. Turn the velocity adjuster down before you air up the valve. Then gradually turn up the velocity until the gun will cycle. This is your lower velocity. Measure it. If it is above 265fps, then you will need a shorter spring or you will need to clip the one you have (unless you have red one. They are usually in the correct range). If you clip a spring, only clip half a coil at a time and then try it using the same procedure of starting with a low velocity setting. Make sure you put the cut end of the spring towards the bolt. If you have the short spring installed, and the lower range is 30fps below the desired shooting velocity, I wouldn't worry about using a stiffer spring and would just go with the short bolt spring. If it was much lower than that, I would definitely clip a long spring to get closer to the desired range.

    Hopefully this helps.

  7. #7
    well the level x is tuned i think, i went through it, it has 2 shims.... i cantdo the spring test no chrono but i tried different springs. now it wont shoot. the trigger has pressure and moves back with force but wont fire... i did put oil through and made sure the on off got lubed...

  8. #8
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    Depending on the spring, you'll need to adj your velocity up a bit to get it firing.

    NEVER USE THE SILVER SPRING AS IS

    How tight your frame and thumb screws are can also cause what your experiencing.

    Lastly, your air. You need at least 800psi. Don't care if it shot with less, you need at least 800psi for the marker to properly work.

  9. #9
    yea i took caution with the screws, and i tried the big spring then a gold rt spring, im confused it was working somewhat now its all messed up...should i just rebuilt the valve? I never rebuilt one i always had the local shop or AGD do it.

  10. #10
    k i turned in the velocity and it was working okish, sometimes i could hear a leak in the barrel. put it just doesnt rip like it should. i remember this marker shooting massive strings. and it had the level ten in last when i played it year ago.... could it be the y grip? i always ran a 45 single trigger frame...but that still doesnt tell me why it leaks from time to time now while cycling? it has oil in it i made sure but its just not where it should be. i was always told under 1k i lose the rt effect and played many times like this( long games)andit never short stroked like this before!?
    Last edited by RT Lover; 12-29-2012 at 07:58 PM.

  11. #11
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    When changing frames, you may have to readjust the sear rod length. Should sit about a credit cards width from the back of the trigger when aired up. Is it clicking when it airs up? You should hear it set itself.

  12. #12
    yes it clicks! whats the magic to adjusting it? just take it apart....move a little at a time?

  13. #13
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    When checking the trigger rod length, turn on the safety. Hold the trigger against the safety with the gun aired up. With the bolt in the reset position and the sear fully forward, there should be a credit card thickness of space between the back of the trigger and the front of the trigger rod. Adjust the trigger rod to achieve this distance and you should be fine.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by RT Lover View Post
    k i turned in the velocity and it was working okish, sometimes i could hear a leak in the barrel.
    This is usually an indication that there are too many shims in the powertube. Take them all out when tuning your level 10. They may move the carrier oring too close to the bolt stem vent hole and can cause a periodic leak. Also it can make you use a carrier size that is too tight for your setup.

  15. #15
    should i keep the shims out? im sure that i have the right carrier.. i should be able to put my 45* back on and it should work just fine? then do u think that if the sear is miss alined can this cause a leak in the barrel? after all is ok it shouldnt short stroke but rarely? i never had issues like this before with sort stroking. the trigger doesnt feel right it should rip with no issues and it seems like i just cant get it to go fast at all? maybe get rid of this y grip and go back to a 45*

  16. #16
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    Yes, keep the shims out.

    A sear out of alignment shouldn't cause a leak. It could cause reset issues though. Leaks down the powertube are always associated with the sealing orings in the powertube. In a level 10 setup, the sear can have an affect on leaking, but only if the sear is worn or is sitting in a rail that is out of spec where the sear is farther forward than normal causing the bolt to sit farther ahead than it should and exposing the vent hole while at rest.

    The short stroking by definition is not releasing the trigger all the way before pulling it again to fire the gun. This short stroke reduces the amount of time that the on-off is open to recharge the front chamber. When the gun fires, the reduced pressure in the front chamber causes a cough of sputter. Other factors can also cause the same effect such as a slow bolt reset. The bolt/powertube carrier size needs to be properly tuned to reduce friction so that there is no delay in the reset. Until the bolt is reset, the sear cannot tip forward to open the on-off and charge the front chamber. This is where the level 10 tuning comes into play and why it is so critical to get it right.

    Until you get your level 10 tuned properly, it will also impede the ability to achieve a good reactive trigger.

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