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Thread: New ULE Bodies? How'd we all miss this?

  1. #31
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    Unless these are super cheap I don't get it. Some real odd aspects as mentioned above. Wondering who they got feedback/input from considering they never posted anything ahead of time. Seems like you would poll your target audience before investing in something like this.

  2. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by OPBN View Post
    Unless these are super cheap I don't get it. Some real odd aspects as mentioned above. Wondering who they got feedback/input from considering they never posted anything ahead of time. Seems like you would poll your target audience before investing in something like this.
    Yes and no. As a general rule consumers want what they get rather than getting what they want. Probably not the case with niche markets like automags. The price point is really important here. If this thing isn't markedly cheaper than a ULE body then it's kind of pointless. If it's considerably cheaper than it has the potential to expand the Mag market a bit by offering lower cost access to features people want.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patron God of Pirates View Post
    Yes and no. As a general rule consumers want what they get rather than getting what they want. Probably not the case with niche markets like automags. The price point is really important here. If this thing isn't markedly cheaper than a ULE body then it's kind of pointless. If it's considerably cheaper than it has the potential to expand the Mag market a bit by offering lower cost access to features people want.
    I disagree. Knowing your market is very important. Some would argue that AGD most of all learned this lesson a few times. Producing something that people don't want is pointless. I can't imagine bringing something to market that I wasn't fairly certain was actually needed/wanted. More info is definitely needed.!

  4. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by OPBN View Post
    I disagree. Knowing your market is very important. Some would argue that AGD most of all learned this lesson a few times. Producing something that people don't want is pointless. I can't imagine bringing something to market that I wasn't fairly certain was actually needed/wanted. More info is definitely needed.!
    I agree but I could argue AGDs shortfall was failing to tell people what they wanted. lol.

  5. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Frizzle Fry View Post
    And I have to add, CCM threads, really?

    If you're screwing in to something, Angel seems to be the most common thread pattern in the industry. Anything other than a clamp-on feedneck seems a step backwards.
    Both these companies are near one another, if I was to guess I bet they have some type of working relationship. It seems that all these companies cross mingle a lot in Oregon.

  6. #36
    I agree, someone coming out with something new or alternate for a mag is usually a plus. Really I don't think it's that ugly, need better pictures of the body itself.

    My only concern is price and how can they be anodized.

    Who's to say they don't have an automag, just happens that their friend had a better one that can rip.
    Quote Originally Posted by Patron God of Pirates View Post
    Props to Gearhead for making these. Not a fan of the feed necks or the plastic covers for them, but the way I see it any company deciding there is enough of a market place to do this is a good thing. Very curious about the price point.

  7. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by GoatBoy View Post
    I kind of wish anyone designing a new body would like... do it right, from scratch... and not inherit all the legacy design flaws.
    Sorry if I just missed it, or am forgetting something, but what specifically do you mean by legacy design flaws? Not trying to be argumentative; I really want to know. Given a completely clean slate, please clarify if you have time. Thank you!

  8. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Chrome View Post
    Sorry if I just missed it, or am forgetting something, but what specifically do you mean by legacy design flaws? Not trying to be argumentative; I really want to know. Given a completely clean slate, please clarify if you have time. Thank you!
    I didn't post it in this thread; it's kind of scattered in various other threads. Some of it is in the other "time for a new automag body" thread.

    I hate feednecks (doubly true for threaded ones), prefer dual detents, don't see the need to actually cut barrel threads into the body, and I like bodies which are both warp compatible and vert/right feed at the same time.

    I mean, Hell, if you're going to do something ugly, with plastic bits, you might as well go for max functionality.
    "Accuracy by aiming."


    Definitely not on the A-Team.

  9. #39
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    So not so much flaws, but failures to live up to your warped idea of the perfect body?

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by OPBN View Post
    So not so much flaws, but failures to live up to your warped idea of the perfect body?
    My sydarm weighs less than yours!!!

  11. #41
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    From what I can see the design approach based on the lowest material costs possible and perhaps limited by machining equipment, however this is purely speculation.
    Form follows function, materials and production approach.

  12. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by OPBN View Post
    So not so much flaws, but failures to live up to your warped idea of the perfect body?
    Not perfect; just actually functional.

    Functionality is all I care about (well, that and cost); everything else is your domain.




    Quote Originally Posted by luke View Post
    From what I can see the design approach based on the lowest material costs possible and perhaps limited by machining equipment, however this is purely speculation.
    Form follows function, materials and production approach.
    And that's where the rubber meets the road.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoatBoy View Post
    Not perfect; just actually functional.

    Functionality is all I care about (well, that and cost); everything else is your domain.
    .
    But you said flaws. They are not inherent legacy flaws, just things that you don't like. You think threads in the body are not needed, so it's a flaw. You don't like feednecks, especially threaded feednecks so it's a flaw. Both items that I consider positives, as do most people. Just because something doesn't live up to your unique criteria doesn't make it flawed. AC threaded bodies are very functional. Threaded feednecks are very functional. Aluminum is lightweight and sturdy, functional. For that matter, with a simple adapter, you can even make CF ULE body warp ready. About the only item I agree with is that dual detents could and probably should be standard.

    I personally think warpfeeds are pointless, therefore they must have legacy flaws. Did I do it right?
    Last edited by OPBN; 12-14-2013 at 06:10 PM.

  14. #44
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    Thanks XMT, for making bodies that don't below goat (no offense goatboy) like this one.

  15. #45
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    But in all seriousness...Goat and OPBN, hug it out. I remember Goat at least from tunaball 7 and you didn't seem like a bad dude...can't we all agree that this body just plain does not make sense?

  16. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by debruynda View Post
    But in all seriousness...Goat and OPBN, hug it out. I remember Goat at least from tunaball 7 and you didn't seem like a bad dude...can't we all agree that this body just plain does not make sense?
    nope, I don't agree. I like that both sides are round smooth lines all the way down. looking at the video, body does not look all that bad on there. if the price is lower than the AGD ule or any other body out there, and you were wanting to give people options id say mission accomplished. yeah the plastic sleeve is not looking the best and dual detents would be better, but would doing that add to the price?

  17. #47
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    Anyone have a center feed Phantom? There's your body design. Plastic sleeve and all. But if I were premiering a new body for Mags, I'd show off the body. Not someones paint sprayer. Highlight the features, smooth body lines,cocker detent(I agree with the dual dentents idea) and for the love of Mags. Say something about price point so even if you hate the feedneck you could see ,if cheap enough, doing your own feedneck mod.Compare yours to AGD's. Show customers why they would want to buy this.I've seen the ULE's since day one so I'm used to their appearance and I've even done my own dual detent mods. I've put a phantom stock class feed on a ULE Mag pistol. Unless these will be uber-cheap why mess with it. If the price is right You could hack one up trying mod.s and not loose to bad if it goes wrong.
    Last edited by Runamok; 12-15-2013 at 04:15 AM.
    I took the road least traveled...now where the hell am I ?

  18. #48
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    Hello all - this is Crystal from Gearheadz Paintball. Glad to see our video & limited information (I know, we've been releasing small info in batches as we near release - more info will be coming in the next few days) have made it over here!

    Unfortunately, we are a small shop and I head much of the forum stuff (as well as the billing, running the showroom, keeping the guys working, etc.) and haven't had much time to push the information to all of the forums out there - we are most active on MCB because that is the place we have gotten the most feedback from the widest portion of our customers over the years so that tends to be the place we drop info first. I apologize if you all were disappointed it wasn't dropped here first, but as I haven't been active on this forum, I didn't want to just sign up and spam information here - as a long time forum user, I hate it when companies do that myself.

    A little information on the bodies: They are aluminum, they are similarly weighted to the ULE bodies (I believe it is a 0.1 oz difference, ours being the heavier of the two), the feedneck is CCM threaded and will be available in the less expensive press-in feedneck OR CCM clamping feedneck. The body takes a single Cocker detent, and takes cocker barrels. The price point will be released shortly, but it will be a more affordable option for people looking for something lightweight.

    We have been developing these bodies under-wraps for over a year. And as was speculated, yes, we do have a shop-Mag that we've played around with these on, but one of our sponsored players had a much prettier marker and was kind enough to loan it to us for the video.

    Thank you all for your input and feedback. We appreciate all of it.
    Last edited by GHPBwoman; 12-15-2013 at 09:38 AM. Reason: 5am brain put the wrong weight difference.

  19. #49
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    bout time you people came here...

  20. #50
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    Thanks for taking your time to come here and post.

    I asked a question over on MCB regarding if these bodies have the steel ring and c clip inside to protect them from the spring and bolt that all of the agd aluminum bodies have.


    Quote Originally Posted by GHPBwoman View Post
    Hello all - this is Crystal from Gearheadz Paintball. Glad to see our video & limited information (I know, we've been releasing small info in batches as we near release - more info will be coming in the next few days) have made it over here!

    Unfortunately, we are a small shop and I head much of the forum stuff (as well as the billing, running the showroom, keeping the guys working, etc.) and haven't had much time to push the information to all of the forums out there - we are most active on MCB because that is the place we have gotten the most feedback from the widest portion of our customers over the years so that tends to be the place we drop info first. I apologize if you all were disappointed it wasn't dropped here first, but as I haven't been active on this forum, I didn't want to just sign up and spam information here - as a long time forum user, I hate it when companies do that myself.

    A little information on the bodies: They are aluminum, they are similarly weighted to the ULE bodies (I believe it is a 0.1 oz difference, ours being the heavier of the two), the feedneck is CCM threaded and will be available in the less expensive press-in feedneck OR CCM clamping feedneck. The body takes a single Cocker detent, and takes cocker barrels. The price point will be released shortly, but it will be a more affordable option for people looking for something lightweight.

    We have been developing these bodies under-wraps for over a year. And as was speculated, yes, we do have a shop-Mag that we've played around with these on, but one of our sponsored players had a much prettier marker and was kind enough to loan it to us for the video.

    Thank you all for your input and feedback. We appreciate all of it.

  21. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by GHPBwoman View Post
    The price point will be released shortly, but it will be a more affordable option for people looking for something lightweight.
    Can you say that it will be under $100 for the more expensive of the two models?

  22. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigEvil View Post
    Thanks for taking your time to come here and post.

    I asked a question over on MCB regarding if these bodies have the steel ring and c clip inside to protect them from the spring and bolt that all of the agd aluminum bodies have.
    Post 21 on MCB facepalm

    Quote Originally Posted by GHPBwoman View Post
    The bodies include a stainless steel spring buffer and stainless steel front frame screw lug.

  23. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beemer View Post
    Post 21 on MCB facepalm
    That was posted after the question was ask twice.

  24. #54
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    I'm semi interested but price will have to be low enough for me to forget buying ule.I think new ule is 140$ so for me to bite I'm thinking 85 to 95$ on a new body .I would need more input from folks like Luke or Xmt for their final thoughts on this product if they say good price and quality I would help support the product.:-) we all know that those 2 know their stuff :-)

  25. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beemer View Post
    Post 21 on MCB facepalm
    Thanks. I did not see it

  26. #56
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    All in all we have to say this is kind of exciting for the AO community. What other marker that is 20+ years old has new products being developed for it like an automag? Any addition to the longevity of this amazing marker that we have created this community around is an asset in my books. If you get down to the brass tax of things then yes the price, quality and design all play a huge part in the success of this product. Just want to be the cheerleader for GearHeadz for going out on a limb and creating something that will eventually add to our community in one way or another. Just like Luke, Rogue, XMT, Doc, Rainman, and so many other great machinist and fabricators have done for us over the years.

    So good on you GearHeadz for making a new automag body. Can't wait to see it available for purchase.

    Crystal thank you for joining our forum of automag enthusiast. We can be a rough crowd sometimes, but we appreciate what you guys are doing. Also you were very helpful when I bought some of your Empire Spring Feed adapters a few months ago. So thank you.
    Last edited by Sk8ermog; 12-16-2013 at 08:20 AM.

  27. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigEvil View Post
    Thanks for taking your time to come here and post.

    I asked a question over on MCB regarding if these bodies have the steel ring and c clip inside to protect them from the spring and bolt that all of the agd aluminum bodies have.
    As noted above, yes. Sorry that I haven't been on to answer your question directly, but glad you got the answer anyway.

    Quote Originally Posted by Frizzle Fry View Post
    Can you say that it will be under $100 for the more expensive of the two models?
    I can't say exactly until it is officially announced since as in all things the pricing isn't set in stone until it's posted for sale. But, we are keeping that general region of amounts of monies in mind, while still being able to pay production costs and keep the lights on.

    And thank you for the warm note, Sk8ermog. We are players, not just business owners, and I don't play around when I tell people that Keith and I will not produce & put our name on a product that we wouldn't play with ourselves. Most of our product development comes out of demand in our local scene where pump, classic Cockers and Mags are seeing a huge revival. I'd have to count, but I'm pretty sure we have more classics hanging on the sale wall in our showroom than we have new out of the box markers right now. We love seeing the old markers coming back onto the field, and are happy to be among a growing community of players and companies who are active in supporting those platforms.

    I know our products aren't going to be a perfect fit for everyone, and that's ok. I only ask anyone who doesn't support us to find a company whose products, services and staff you can get behind - and give them your money. We work with and are constantly inspired by companies and players all over the paintball industry, and all those other little mom 'n pop shops need to keep afloat as well so that we can continue to be challenged and encouraged by them.

  28. #58
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    Any chance you will be at Living Legends this year?

  29. #59
    Will there be pricing with or without feedneck? Can we get more pictures of the body, around the weld on the neck?

    I am excited to see new products and I can see myself picking one up. Any hints on other mag products you guys are coming out with?

  30. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by OPBN View Post
    But you said flaws. They are not inherent legacy flaws, just things that you don't like. You think threads in the body are not needed, so it's a flaw. You don't like feednecks, especially threaded feednecks so it's a flaw. Both items that I consider positives, as do most people. Just because something doesn't live up to your unique criteria doesn't make it flawed. AC threaded bodies are very functional. Threaded feednecks are very functional. Aluminum is lightweight and sturdy, functional. For that matter, with a simple adapter, you can even make CF ULE body warp ready. About the only item I agree with is that dual detents could and probably should be standard.
    You're sort of missing/confusing multiple points. For example, removable feednecks are useful. But they don't need to be threaded to be useful -- look at BT markers. You're confusing "removable" and "threaded". Threaded feednecks are a legacy design problem. We can't get away from it because that's how everybody does it.

    Cocker threaded barrels are useful. But you don't literally need to carve the threads into the body. So you're confusing the utility of cocker threads with the need to actually carve them into the body. We can't seem to get away from it because that's how everybody does it.

    Warp feed... you can only get AGD or PTP (yikes) bodies with real warp feed. Nobody else makes those bodies, I'm not sure anybody else ever really did... not sure if I could call that a legacy issue...

    Quote Originally Posted by debruynda View Post
    But in all seriousness...Goat and OPBN, hug it out. I remember Goat at least from tunaball 7 and you didn't seem like a bad dude...can't we all agree that this body just plain does not make sense?
    That's fine, I'm just pointing out that there's not a lot of functional advantage I'm seeing here.

    So what will remain to see is cost -- if they decide to make it (more) affordable, which I do agree with. You'll have to pardon my distrust as most aftermarket mag parts of this scale have anything *but* affordability in mind.


    Thought just popped into my mind after getting caught up on other threads... Given what I think are the construction methods for this body, I wonder if it would be possible to offer the un-welded, un-cut (no feed hole, or at least the option to specify feed hole) body blanks for tinkerers. Depends on how the steel ring and front grip frame screw are implemented.

    Oh, and are these going to be pump milled?
    Last edited by GoatBoy; 12-16-2013 at 11:52 AM.

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