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Thread: Really Old Classic Mag - Discovering History

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  1. #1

    Really Old Classic Mag - Discovering History

    I acquired a few markers for some extra parts I needed and am looking to send off the rest. As I was cleaning everything and oiling them down, I came across this:





    A couple of things make me think this is really old.

    First, it's on a WGP frame.



    Next, the valve is marked 00186 and appears to be from back in the day when they soldered on the powertube



    Also, the sear is huge, the sear pin in pressed into the rail, and the twist lock assembly is threaded instead of pressed.



    Finally, the rail is stamped 186 to match the valve



    It had a lvl 7 bolt, so I know it's not all original, but seems pretty close.

    So I'm wondering if I have something special or just another old mag.

    Thanks, everyone.
    Last edited by bowcycle; 07-12-2014 at 05:12 PM.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    southern IL
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    1,884
    The aluminum pot metal WGP trigger frames stopped sometime around 94. My 94-95 automag had a carbon fiber frame on it.

    Didn't the soldered on tips come after the clip on? I could have sworn they still soldered them on? Could be wrong there.

    As for the stamp on the rail. I've never seen that before. But pretty much everything you show pre dates 94. And a level 7 hardnose was on my 94-95 classic 68automag.

    Not sure any of that helped. But I tried.

  3. #3
    Thanks, bd1k.

    I know I'm 3rd owner on this. First owner was manufacture to '99, 2nd was '99 until this year, and I'm 3rd as of this year.
    That's really all the history I have for it.

    So again, do I have something special or just another old mag?

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    southern IL
    Posts
    1,884
    Quote Originally Posted by bowcycle View Post
    Thanks, bd1k.

    I know I'm 3rd owner on this. First owner was manufacture to '99, 2nd was '99 until this year, and I'm 3rd as of this year.
    That's really all the history I have for it.

    So again, do I have something special or just another old mag?
    I'm no collector. But I'm guessing its just another old mag. Other than the number stamp. Everything else just looks like early level 7 automag to me.

    Nothing wrong with that. Set of orings and she will most likely fire like new.

  5. #5
    according to these archives:
    the sear should not be pressed in after mid-91 (lvl5), but the power tube started getting soldered on in '92 with the intro of the lvl7. Knowing the WGP frames ended in '94, that gets us in a 3 year window.

    I'd still like to know if anyone else has a mag with the rail stamped to match the valve.

  6. #6
    So, with some more digging:
    Apparently Rod Demaris has the oldest "CF" engraved valves that anyone's ever seen (with the exception of TK himself). He has some in the 20's. Pyrate Jim had #44 upgraded to a lvl7, which requires milling the rail a bit for the twist-lock. So I think these originally had older valves than we were thinking. And SGTKennedy had #147 and there's at least one ~130 around here somewhere.

    Serials up through the 200's were still on lvl5 bolts. At lvl 5, they started laser welding the powertube tips into the body (still using the thick bumpers). But when lvl 7 came out and they switched to twist-loc barrels, you could get the lvl7 powertube tip welded onto the front of the valve body (which is what was done to my valve the same as Pyrate Jim's valve).

    So, it is obviously upgraded, but not outside of what the factory was doing for its customers. And one, final thing: this is supposed to be one of the markers used by Team Swarm, the team who won the international classic back in the early 90's using our beloved mags.

    Links to helpful info are here, here, here, and here.
    Last edited by bowcycle; 06-08-2014 at 09:38 AM.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    triple mag shop.
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    3,192
    open up one side of the grip panel and pack a whole bunch of mud in there.
    that would help with some "classic" aspect.
    My sydarm weighs less than yours!!!

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