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Thread: Weak Rt function, where to start?

  1. #1

    Weak Rt function, where to start?

    I just bought my first Mag in 18 years, had a 68 classic in high school. I bought an RT online and the guy selling it said it airs up and shoots fine but, "the RT function is weak."

    Where should I start in diagnosing something like this? Thanks for any and all help, I just want this thing running perfect so I can get it in the field.

  2. #2
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    MOTM14
    The rt effect is a result of 3 things. How broken in the orings are, rt on/off pin length, tank out put pressure.

    I suggest pulling it all apart and checking to make sure it is clean and oiled. Then put your tank on it and see if it is setup the way you want. If it is not then you can adjust 1 of the 3 above. I don't recommend going shorter than a .740 rt on/off pin.

  3. #3
    Thank you for the quick reply, very much appreciated.

  4. #4
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    Each RT reacts differently with each tank. So you can put on your 800psi tank and nothing but your friend's 800psi tank and it does something. Since this is going off what the seller is saying, it will react quite differently when it is in your hands.

    With that, look at the length of your on/off, if the RT effect is not where yiu want it. All of the RT effect is from the on/off pin. You can shorten it to get a change to the trigger. Filing it down(go in small increments) and constantly see what is doing in the gun aired up, basically tunes the gun to the tank you are using.

  5. #5
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    An Emag on/off pin and a reg that puts out any pressure above 850 will work well. I'd change the orings as well.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by longi View Post
    An Emag on/off pin and a reg that puts out any pressure above 850 will work well. I'd change the orings as well.
    emag pin will be too short in any stock mag.
    Email me for low prices on ALL AGD Products and more. tunaman5@verizon.net
    Tunamart

  7. #7
    When you say ďRT effectĒ, are you referring to trigger bounce?

    To clarify, RT just means that the trigger, immediately after firing, actively pushes back against your finger with greater force than what was required to pull it. Basically, it assists in speeding up the trigger reset process, but itís still purely a semi-automatic function. On the other hand, trigger bounce is basically full auto ó the bump stock of paintball, if you will ó and is not what the manufacturer intended the gun to do. Trigger bounce is kind of an abuse of the RT function and is achieved by shortening the on/off pin and/or increasing your tankís output pressure. The shorter the pin and/or the higher the tank output pressure, the easier it is to trigger bounce and the higher the rate of fire you can produce. I went down this road a few years back just to see how far I could take it; I used a Dye Rotor, a very short RT on/off pin, and an Armageddon adjustable HPA tank jacked up to about 1250 psi output. Here is the result:
    https://youtu.be/saIsaOj11K0

    Shooting ~25 balls per second at a tree stump in your backyard is fun and all, but thatís all you will ever do with it. Itís totally impractical and completely unethical for actual paintball play, and Iíd never use this level of firepower against another human being. But itís cool to explore. Just donít shave down the on/off pin too much because if you do, full auto is ALL the gun will be able to do. That might sound like an attractive feature at first, but I assure you that itís super annoying to not be able to control your rate of fire. These days, I much prefer a full length RT on/off pin (or a ULT) when Iím not playing pump. In my opinion, trigger bounce is wack and it just makes the gun feel like itís broken to me.
    Last edited by ghost flanker; 08-05-2018 at 01:37 AM.

  8. #8
    I don't know what to say ghost flanker... trigger bounce is the whole point of an RT after all. Sounds like you are making more of an argument against RT and X-Valves all together (or any other high ROF marker). In that case, don't buy RT/E/X-Mags in the first place? Stick to cockers, lol. I don't know why you say that 'trigger bounce' (like a bumpstock) isn't what the manufacturer intended the gun to do... it is pretty much exactly what AGD intended the marker to do if its a ReTro, RT, X, or E-Mag valve and exactly why people put SHP (1100-1500psi) tank regulators on these mags.

    That being said, I think it is important to point out that there is the 'RT effect' and also 'run-away'; these may overlap and I'm sure many tune their mags to achieve a bit of both but they are two different things. Cutting the ON/OFF is more about causing run-away and can be done on ULT's even; this isn't so much about actually actively returning the trigger 'like a bumpstock' so much as narrowing the position window on a trigger to create a run-away automatic firing window. An RT trigger, if pulled slowly and firmly, should still only result in one firing, but a trigger set up to run away often pops off more than one shot when it hits that 'sweet spot' in the trigger pull. RT'ing is amplified by boosting supply pressure, and run-away is amplified by shortening the ON/OFF pin. To 'cash in' on the RT effect is more about finding the right force to hold your finger at and letting the trigger move it, while 'run away' is more about finding that right constant position in the trigger pull where it keeps firing without moving or barely moving.
    Last edited by JimBobFett; 08-06-2018 at 01:56 PM.

  9. #9
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    Cause & effect.

    Please remember what the intention was when TK found this and what the intention was for, to help eliminate the possibility of short stroking the trigger thus causing problems with trying to fire too fast. The byproduct of that is that if you are good, or take steps to accentuate the effect is that you can fire faster and faster by the design of the valve.

    By modifying and implementing the 3 methods(shortening the on/off, ULT and higher than normal pressures) you are moving the range to which this 'Reactive Trigger' come into play. Thus you can tap into the potential of the valve to be able to shoot at the speed that it can. There is a reason why the gun can shoot in the 30bps range without shootdown.

    Now, the effect of this, as it is only governed by the end user, is to use all the options, mods and parts in a responsible way. No one needs to pump out fire that fast, but it surely is fun. Whether it is in a game or at a static target, it is fun to unload a hopper as fast as possible(which then is another test in seeing which hoppers can meet their own claims of feed rates).

    But the effect of every RT is to reset the trigger positively so that it will return faster than you could possibly pull the trigger is and will always be more viable than a non-reactive trigger. It can be abused, but it shouldn't be avoided just because many don't understand why the trigger is the way it is.

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