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Thread: Level 10 degassing issue?

  1. #31
    Join Date
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    LVL 10 Users,

    I have read all the posts for residual pressure and the results make sense.

    The bolt acts like a cork holding back pressure in a bottle. When you fire the marker the air pressure pushes out the "cork" BUT the mainspring is now holding the cork in with more force than before. This results in more residual pressure in the system.

    In other words the fact that the LVL10 mod causes your gun to stop shooting abruptly at the end of the tank and the gun holds more residual pressure is the result of the same thing. This is all caused by the stronger mainspring.

    My personal opinion is that removing a macro line from a fitting is a poor choice to degass a gun. I would recomend everyone use some type of degassing fitting to loose all the pressure before dissasembly. Most people with screw in tanks will not have a problem. The others will just have to get a degassing fitting because this effect is a normal part of the LVL 10 operation.

    We didn't see it here because we use degassers on our lines. Overall I see this as the only hiccup so far in the LVL 10 testing.

    I should warn everyone that the Retro Valve and RT Valve will hold residual pressure even with the air source removed. You should NEVER remove your valve and mainbody together and then pull out the valve. This can cause the on/off assembly to shoot out at high speed. By removing the valve while the mainbody is still attached to the rail the system will degass properly. This is the best reason to NOT ADJUST YOUR TRIGGER ROD!!

    Besides this I don't have any other solutions to the residual pressure problem. You just can't shoot it down to nothing with this new setup.

    AGD

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
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    Thanks Tom
    The level 10 kit works flawlessly in all other aspects. I think we all just wanted to be sure we werent missing something, and at the same time, make others aware of the proper way to release the residual pressure.

    Once again, thanks for a great product and your continued support of your users.

    AGD Pride Emag With 4.0 For Sale Here
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  3. #33
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
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    Delmar, NY
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    Originally posted by AGD
    This is all caused by the stronger mainspring.
    Am I the only one who is successfully running level 10 with the original mainspring? Mine has been running beautifully... bouncing off of paint, squeegees, fingers, etc.

    I haven't noticed this problem because so far I've only used it with my PMI screw in tank. But I use a proconnect with my Armageddon anyways so I'm not really concerned.

  4. #34
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    No Arno your not...in fact I think all of us STARTED our set up with the stock and moved on. But for most I should think the stock would be a nice conservative way to go. But many of us because this is a beta test wanted to run through the full range of settings for the reports back to Tom.

    Those of you talking about pushing on the bolt to release all of the gas...not going to get it. I tried. Many times with my wood dowel. Could not get it to do this. How its working for you I just do not knows. Gas is only releases when the bolt is moving partialy forward not when its fully retracted. Perhaps your managin to get it to move forward somehow. But I think this is a poor choice when better solutions exist.

    As we all have discovered those of us with hard line setups are going to need to degas with some kind of device. We got by for a long time "cheating" (if you will) by using macro and regular quick connects. But should not continue with this practice much longer with Lvl 10. Cheating on 50-100 psi was alright. Cheating with 200-400 is not. So now we know.

    Good stuff realy I think. Remember this is a Beta test! We are discovering new things. Fun too I might add.
    Last edited by cphilip; 07-06-2002 at 08:50 AM.

  5. #35
    FreshmanBob Guest
    any recommended devices?

  6. #36
    Join Date
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    "The SC" (South Carolina)
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    Look back up in the thread Freshman. I put one in for the Skanline ones. Click on the degasing slide check one. Only like $15 for the nickel. Proconnects are good but pricey. remember some slide checks are not degasing slide checks. Get one that degases

  7. #37
    FreshmanBob Guest
    o ok thanks phil

  8. #38
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Alberta, Canada
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    2
    I dont have the level 10 mod but...
    i use a remote line to run my retro and yes there is a problem with pressure. To fix this i have a slide check built into the remote line and a small flick release all pressure quick and easy..no problems.
    That's another fine mess you got me into!!!

  9. #39
    Ok, I just want to double check, (I haven't gotten my lvl 10 kit yet) but this is only an issue for non-screw in Nitro Tanks.
    If you run CO2 you should be fine b/c in order to remove the pressure you have to "break the circuit" by removing the CO2 bottle.
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  10. #40
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    Here's a link to the De-gas valve metioned..
    http://www.skanline.com/productspb/c...ck_Dis_PB.html It's 14.95 and it's ONLY A DEGAS VALVE....not Degas+quick disconnect. That one 20$ and you can see it from that link. I gotta order one and some other stuff.. oh well All in the name of AFTERMARKET PERFORMANCE...at least thats what ricers say

  11. #41
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    I'm a dumb grunt here and pictures speak louder than words. Could someone who has a bleed with macroline pleaase take a pic of the attachment and post it. I have macro coming from a Nitro-duck minireg. I appreciate any help.

    The gun is 1/8" of a game that is a FOOT long!
    (...but a 'mag helps)
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  12. #42
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Thompson, Ct
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    Smile

    Well, this is how it's working for me...

    Long silver spring
    #2 carrier
    2 shims

    When I shut the air off (68/4500 Flatline) I fire a few dry-fire shots to release pressure. Then the gun just "bleeds out" any residual pressure. The hissing sometimes starts right away, and lasts only a second or 2. Sometimes it retains pressure for quite a while. I do have a Q/D, to release pressure in the line (and mke disassembly easier).

  13. #43
    Join Date
    May 2001
    Location
    Snellville, GA
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    463
    Hey Phil,
    After checking it out, I found that I have 350-400psi left in my lines. That's on a ReTro Valve with the original spring (the one that came with the ReTro) coming out of a 68/3000 Flatline.

    Hope this helps ~ Dave
    David M. Jones
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  14. #44
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    "The SC" (South Carolina)
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    Originally posted by drx975
    Well this isnt good news at all....

    So with this setup am I going to experience this problem of high pressure left in the gun?

    Thanx

    ps: Tom fix this plz I realllllllllllllllllllyyyyyyyyyyyyy want this mod
    What in the world are you going on about! Did you not read any of the thread at all? You have a screw in tank. Just unscrew it and you will have removed all the residual pressure! There is nothing to fix! It works!!!! just that some of us will have to do a better job with our set ups to degas is all. Please read the entire thread before you go running around like a chicken with your head cut off. All this thread was supposed to accomplish was to make people aware of the higher pressures left in the marker. Go ahead and get the darn thing. It works. Just unscrew your tank!

  15. #45
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    Alright man sorry, jeez im sorry. I haven't ever used a non-screw in tank so I didnt realize it. Now that I think about it I guess that was a really stupid question.
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  16. #46
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    No...it realy wasn't a stupid question...but it was one that was answered already if you had read this thread!

  17. #47
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    I am unsticking this thread ad a link to it is now in the "Classic: All LVL 10 Info Here" thread.

  18. #48
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    I have found a simple...no cost solution to the degassing issue for fixed tanks...using macro or microline. If you have a <a href=http://www.tecratools.com/pages/service/graphics/35108l.gif target=crimper>butt connector crimper</a> like the one shown. (yes there are things called butt connectors) If you notice... you can loosely grip the macro/micro line with the crimper while using it as leverage to bleed the line. I used it to setup my level 10 as I don't have fittings for my degas valve I bought for fie dolla! (make you holla!). Anyway...its a temporary solution to a permanent product of the low impact bolt system. Anyway figured it'd save you some fittings... just remember... don't squeeze the crimper too hard, let slide along the gas line and depress the fitting seat. Works wonderfully.

    BTW.. MY LEVEL 10 ROX!!

  19. #49
    could someone please tell me if this www.paintballgear.net/039-5500-3.html slide check bleeds the airout of the gun? thx

  20. #50
    i would really like it if some one would answer my above question thx

  21. #51
    Yes, that will bleed the air out. I recommend Pro-Connects. Mine has worked fantastic. Another idea, on my Conquest tank that I use with my cocker setup, by shutting off the tank, it bleeds out all the air in the gun and line. Just a feature that I liked about it. For other air tanks(that can actually power the Lvl 10, just get a pro-connect or slidecheck.
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  22. #52
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    How do other tanks connect then? I thought all tanks screwed in. Sorry if this is a dumb question
    Superbolt

  23. #53
    Join Date
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    proconnect! It's the best thing I have added to my guns since level 10! thanks a huge bunch to Tunaman who got them for me (he can get them for anyone). You can't get them over here easily (I've certainly never seen them often here) but they are worth every penny.

    here's a pic on my gun...





    in fact they are so good I may go start another thread on them

    manike

  24. #54
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
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    Originally posted by Shirow
    How do other tanks connect then? I thought all tanks screwed in. Sorry if this is a dumb question
    Adjustable tanks usually do not screw in. They connect via a hose. You can see most of it in the link to my marker in my signature.


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  25. #55
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    Oh, I see.. thanks!

  26. #56
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    The guys at Planet were able to get there hands on a old but un-used Venom hardline Deluxe for me. It has a bleed built into it and the pipe looks very clean running from my vert adapter to my vavle. Gets rid of that "hose everywhere" look that mags are notorious for.

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