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Thread: ** Official Level 10 Problems Thread **

  1. #1291
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Littleton CO
    Posts
    7

    Constant leak from valve body

    X-valve RT-Pro

    I've noticed a few times while changing carriers, movement and a gap between the powertube end piece and the middle section of the valve body. I've noticed a small leak I believe is coming from there, as well.

    Second (and possibly related), I've been seeing very wild problems with consistency. At the last few tournaments, I've had to make big adjustments to the velocity over the course of a day. I'll adjust it to ~290 then when I come back for the next game, it'll be shooting around 340, (adjust back down to 290) then come back again and be down around 250 (if it even fires) What could be happening here? My input reg is a Centerflag Dynaflow, set to about 900psi (but even it varies 200-300psi) I oil the marker regularly with KC-Troublefree blue. Come to think of it, will TOO MUCH oil give problems with the X-valve/lvl10?

  2. #1292
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    3,235
    Quote Originally Posted by Flyboy771
    X-valve RT-Pro

    I've noticed a few times while changing carriers, movement and a gap between the powertube end piece and the middle section of the valve body. I've noticed a small leak I believe is coming from there, as well.

    Second (and possibly related), I've been seeing very wild problems with consistency. At the last few tournaments, I've had to make big adjustments to the velocity over the course of a day. I'll adjust it to ~290 then when I come back for the next game, it'll be shooting around 340, (adjust back down to 290) then come back again and be down around 250 (if it even fires) What could be happening here? My input reg is a Centerflag Dynaflow, set to about 900psi (but even it varies 200-300psi) I oil the marker regularly with KC-Troublefree blue. Come to think of it, will TOO MUCH oil give problems with the X-valve/lvl10?
    never over oil your valve.

    i only oil it when it sticks or when i replace a o-ring

    you dont need to re oil the valve after each game or day of playing

    soo that really could be the problem

    mabey you are using a old or messed up oring

    your bolt is a older style and is be used alot

    or useing wong size carrior

    you want it to be loose as possibal without to leak

    now with the volocity if the first shoot drops than the rest go back up to normal you need to get a smaller carrior.

    or it may be a o-ring in the valve like the regulator seat oring's

    ~my e-mag~

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  3. #1293
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Houston, Tx
    Posts
    1

    classic mag with xvalve and ule trigger

    I had my classic mag valve replaced with an xvalve at a local shop (an authorized mag dealer). The trouble i am having seems to be the bolt sticking and the only way to relieve that is by pressing it back with my finger (through the breech). I Just took it back to the shop today and watched them dry-fire the gun in store with no problem (no bolt stickage) and they said it was a problem with my remote/tank because it apparently did not stick with their tank.
    I took it straight to the field and tried it again with no remote and it is still sticking, plus i am struggling to get the velocity under control. With the ball velocity high (350ish) i can get out more shots before it sticks but trying to get down to 300 fps is nearly impossible without cutting off the air and the trigger going limp, closely followed by air hissing out the barrel.
    If i fire slowly it works ok but if i try and let loose on it then that is when the bolt gets stuck.

    I have no idea what inlet pressure my tank is set at or how to change it.

    As i said it is a classic mag with a ULE top feed body, black xvalve, intelliframe blade trigger, gas through foregrip and running on HPA.

    if you can help at all i'll buy ya a beer(coke as in 'cocacola' for kids)!

  4. #1294
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Halifax, N.S., Canada
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    7,391
    It sounds like a basic bolt stick. Try tuning the level 10. Remove all the shims and put in the shortest bolt spring first. Then increase carrier sizes until you get leaking down the barrel. Use the largest carrier that doesn't leak. Make sure you use the same carrier o-ring in each instance. If the carrier is tight on the bolt stem but still leaks, then replace the carrier oring and start over.

    Once the bolt is cycling without sticking, you can change back to the middle red bolt spring for better antichop capability.
    Except for the Automag in front, its usually the man behind the equipment that counts.

  5. #1295

    X-mag won't fire when breach is placed >

    Hello people,

    hopefully someone can help me out here, I'm beyond frustration now and thinking of buying a new marker...
    And then to think I went looking for an X-mag because they were supposed to be easy maintaining and such. I have it for more than 6 months now and just played like one tourney and three trainings with, halve of the time leaking at one end or the other...

    At a point I had a leak from the back and front of the x-valve on my X-mag. Had a new reg piston come over and a spare parts kit.

    Changed the piston and set-up the power-tube. It seems to be the right carrier. It leaked slightly barrelside but after dry-firing it settled in.

    On the field it was totally messed up, barrel breaks, balls just going a couple of yards etc.

    Immediatelly set the ball-detent different and even changed it. But that didn't turn out to be the problem.

    As soon as I place on of the two breaches I have, the superbolt gets stuck on them. With the vertical breach it won't even come forward and with the side-feed one it comes out for like 6mm and then gets stuck. With the next triggerpull it returns. It looks like it left marks on the vertical breach from the couple of times it did fire well in between chops/breaks.

    I don't want to turn the velocity up to much because I can't test the speed it's at now and I'm afraid I will wreck the x-valve, or at least part of it.

    The superbolt seems to be just fine, not offset in any direction as seems the powertube. With dry-firing everything seems dandy en speedy to, no air-dropoffs, leaks or anything (that is without a barrel and breach).

    There is a thing worth mentioning. When I installed the piston and put the valve back together and shot it, it felt way over 300fps but it fired. Ofcourse I turned the speed down. Next thing I bought myself a handchrono and messured like 240fps and I turned it up to 280. It was a little inconsistent but I figured that would settle after a box of paint.
    At that time I shot like a dozen balls or so and all seemed fine untill I went to the field the next day and the above mentioned problem occured.

    I've taken the mag apart numerous times and steam is coming out of my ears by now.
    Changed about evrything that can be on the X but nothing does the trick, I'm absolutely clueless...

    Can someone please help me out here.

    PS. one more thing. the top of the sear-assembly seems to have a mark from the superbolt over the length of it, is this normal?

    If pictures are needed please let me know.

  6. #1296

    follow-up X-mag breach problem >

    Ok I finally got a step ahead...


    It seems the springs I used are messed up! I got an 'old' spring from a friend and I'm shooting again. That is, dry-firing with barrel.

    Can't wait for the weekend to take it to the field and put some paint through it.

    Don't understand it though. Can't remember standing on the springs or something like it, it's very weird indeed...

    The wear-marks on the breaches and sear are normal probably. Could not remember how they were whe I got the marker.

    Hope it works now and hope it rips again this weekend.

    One thing possitive from all this, I know the X inside-out and can take it apart and assemble it blindfolded

    Thanks for the attention and will keep things posted.

    out.

  7. #1297
    dont know if this has already been posted but, i put the lvl 10 togther and there are absolutley not leaks, the on/off pin preassurizes but it will not fire, i pull the trigger and nothing, no chuffing noise or anything
    For all the kids that want to shoot 20+bps...


    It only takes one paintball to get someone out and its a hell of alot cheaper



    Good traders: Mighty Mike, firebanex, and me

  8. #1298
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Halifax, N.S., Canada
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    7,391
    Increase the velocity setting until the gun fires. If it still won't fire, increase the carrier size until you are using the largest one that doesn't leak.

  9. #1299

    Which carrier to use?

    I have a classic 68 automag.

    1.5 carrier slips on with gravity.
    1.0 needs my help.

    which one?

    (2.0 was way too big)

    if anyone can tell me the exact set up:....what size and number of everything. i would appreciate it.

    (if it helps. i got the expansion chamber...so i'm running it on C02 until my Nitro comes. It ran fine with the Venturi bolt that i had in it but i wanted to upgrade to lvl 10. any tips or help would be great. (i'm kinda paintball gun-retarded) dunno alot abou the mechanics. but i'm workin' on it! :]

  10. #1300
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Halifax, N.S., Canada
    Posts
    7,391
    It appears that the 1.0 carrier is probably the one you should be using. Don't use any shims unless you have problems with the bolt not resetting after a "chuff".

  11. #1301

    Bolt Stick And Air Leak

    I have a RT Pro with ULE body, Intelliframe, X Valve, Level 10 and ULE Trigger Kit.
    What I am experiencing is either bolt srick or air leaking down the barrel.
    I have the Level 10 tuned so that it will reset when it encounters my finger tip.
    I get plently of reactivity from my trigger.
    I am using a .5 carrier. I am having a problem with the bolt sticking and I have to either push it back to reset the trigger or remove the air supply to correct the problem.
    I went to a .0 carrier and the same problem was present.
    I went to a 1.0 and the bolt stick was reduced although there was air leak down the barrel. The bolt would still stick at times, it would reset it self if I waited a second or two. The air leak down the barrel seemed to be intermittant, stopping after a few shots only to start again after afew more shots.
    I have tried less shims and more shims in both the Level 10 and the ULT. It does not seem to change the problem either way.
    I have also tried a nigger spring to no avail.
    I have tried to loosen the field strip bolt some and well as the grip frame bolt.
    I have tried more oil.
    I am using an Armagedden reg at 900 psi.
    HELP PLEASE.

  12. #1302
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Grayslake, IL
    Posts
    43
    Quote Originally Posted by mic49
    I have a RT Pro with ULE body, Intelliframe, X Valve, Level 10 and ULE Trigger Kit.
    What I am experiencing is either bolt srick or air leaking down the barrel.
    I have the Level 10 tuned so that it will reset when it encounters my finger tip.
    I get plently of reactivity from my trigger.
    I am using a .5 carrier. I am having a problem with the bolt sticking and I have to either push it back to reset the trigger or remove the air supply to correct the problem.
    I went to a .0 carrier and the same problem was present.
    I went to a 1.0 and the bolt stick was reduced although there was air leak down the barrel. The bolt would still stick at times, it would reset it self if I waited a second or two. The air leak down the barrel seemed to be intermittant, stopping after a few shots only to start again after afew more shots.
    I have tried less shims and more shims in both the Level 10 and the ULT. It does not seem to change the problem either way.
    I have also tried a nigger spring to no avail.
    I have tried to loosen the field strip bolt some and well as the grip frame bolt.
    I have tried more oil.
    I am using an Armagedden reg at 900 psi.
    HELP PLEASE.
    Which spring are you using? If it is the middle spring, the one with the end already cut, try cutting 1/4 turn off that end of the spring. This worked for me becasue I had a similar problem. Shoot it for a bit and it should start to leak again, maybe after a case because of break in, then move to the next smallest carrier, you should be good after that, this is what worked for me.... let us know.
    I'm the old guy with the old school gun
    that gets the guys with the Angels first.

    68 Classic TKO - Lvl10
    14" All American 2002
    System X drop
    Air America Reg 68/4500
    Soon to be ULE with X-Valve

  13. #1303
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Halifax, N.S., Canada
    Posts
    7,391
    Trista: Use the 1.0 carrier. The 1.5 will cause intermittent leaking, especially after it gets broken in.

    mic49: Use just enough shims in your ULT to shoot consistently. Don't overtune the ULT. Remove all shims when setting the level 10 up. Use the biggest carrier that doesn't leak. If you are getting bolt stick with the largest carrier that doesn't leak, then try a different o-ring. You may have a bad one. How old is your gun? Check the sear for wear. Any wear at the tip could create leaking that may cause you to use a carrier that is too tight.

  14. #1304
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    mon calamari
    Posts
    718
    last night i ordered an xvavle. got it today. i put it in my emag, gas up and all it does is leak down the barrel. i looked at what it says to do in the cd that came with it. i took the bolt off, carefully unscrewed the powertube tip, took out the shims, and put in a new spacer, one size up, put the oring in the spacer, made sure the backup oring was there, put it back together the same way, and it still leaks. i've tried every spacer but it doesn't work. now i also did this whole thing with each bolt spring. am i doing something wrong? i've had problems sometimes where the bolt would stick forward on my emag valve but all i have to do is push the bolt until it clicks and it works again. i tried this with the xvlave and it didn't do anything. when it was leaking, i noticed it would stop leaking if i pushed the trigger down and held it in mech mode. also, when i was comparing my emag to xvalve, i noticed the all gold on/off assembly has a small oring on the top surrounding the pin. but my gold/sliver on/off assembly in the emag valve doesn't have the oring. are these different on/off's or are they the same just different colors? also, i tried switching on/offs to see if that did anything, but to no avail. currently i'm out of air but once i get some more, are there any tips i should try out? thanks.
    e-mag 226
    flashed with 1.31

  15. #1305
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Halifax, N.S., Canada
    Posts
    7,391
    tribalman: Keep the new xvavle on-off assembly in the xvalve but make sure you put your original emag pin in it. The new valves use a larger oring to hold the smaller oring in place. The older valves had an indentation that the small oring fit into. Other than that, the assemblies are the same.

    As for the carrier sizing, take you carrier out and test fit it on you bolt. With the bolt sitting stem up, it should slide on gently with a bit of resistence. If you have to force it on, it is too tight. If it slides down the bolt stem on its own, its too loose. Adjust the carrier size until you find the correct fit. Install it without any shims. Make sure you put it in facing the correct direction. The bolt springs only change the impact pressure on the ball and the range of velocity operation. They won't have much affect on the leaking.

  16. #1306
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Naples, FL
    Posts
    57

    Missing Back Up washer!

    I just got the level 10 kit, and it doesn't have a backup washer on it. Looking at the list of what it has, I don't see any washers either. Where do I get the flippin delrin back up washer?!

  17. #1307
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    I want food... Can you email me a cookie?
    Posts
    707
    I have a question, when i gas up my mag, it does this full auto shot sequence untill i cut off the gas. Any clues??

  18. #1308
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Halifax, N.S., Canada
    Posts
    7,391
    Quote Originally Posted by NeoApollo
    I just got the level 10 kit, and it doesn't have a backup washer on it. Looking at the list of what it has, I don't see any washers either. Where do I get the flippin delrin back up washer?!
    Call AGD if the kit came without a backup washer.

  19. #1309
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Halifax, N.S., Canada
    Posts
    7,391
    Quote Originally Posted by senghing27
    I have a question, when i gas up my mag, it does this full auto shot sequence untill i cut off the gas. Any clues??
    What is the configuration of your mag and how old is it.?

    Check to see if there is an oring missing in your on-off top.

  20. #1310
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    758
    Quote Originally Posted by athomas
    What is the configuration of your mag and how old is it.?

    Check to see if there is an oring missing in your on-off top.

    The mag has a level 10 bolt running on a 68 valve in a ULE body

  21. #1311
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    Aug 2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toll
    The mag has a level 10 bolt running on a 68 valve in a ULE body
    Yeah, i got it from tolls.. but now, when i gas it up, it has resistance on the trigger, but now, doesn't shoot, and when i do get it to shoot, its more of a leak not a full shot..

  22. #1312
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by senghing27
    Yeah, i got it from tolls.. but now, when i gas it up, it has resistance on the trigger, but now, doesn't shoot, and when i do get it to shoot, its more of a leak not a full shot..
    nevermid guys we got it taken care of, apparently theres no bottom brass thinininmajig in the on/off assmbly, and theres no orings i there, i went and ordered a parts kit...

  23. #1313

    bolt stick

    i got my level 10 installed on my emag.. and it worked wonders over the weekend..no breaks for the first time.... now when i gas it up, i get bolt stick after 1 shot,

    How do i fix this??.. and do i have to keep constatly fine tuning the level 10?

    thanks

  24. #1314
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Halifax, N.S., Canada
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    You need to go up one carrier size. That should allow the bolt to fully reset after each shot. Once the carrier oring is broken in you shouldn't need any further tuning.

  25. #1315
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Temple, TX
    Posts
    2

    Help for Tac-One

    My buddie shot my Tac-One, fell in love and bought one a few weeks ago. Outta the box with the air fittings on it it shot great. This last weekend at practice however, it started to double feed from time to time and would start losing velocity and pressure on the RT. Sometimes the RT would stick into the actual grip itself. Should he just send it back or can I easly fix the problem for him. I need to know soon if possible, we have a scenario this weekend. He has an A-5 that has everything you could possibly imagine on it but the Tac-One still outshoots it hands down.
    JEDI OUT!!!!

  26. #1316
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Halifax, N.S., Canada
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    Quote Originally Posted by JediJenax13
    My buddie shot my Tac-One, fell in love and bought one a few weeks ago. Outta the box with the air fittings on it it shot great. This last weekend at practice however, it started to double feed from time to time and would start losing velocity and pressure on the RT. Sometimes the RT would stick into the actual grip itself. Should he just send it back or can I easly fix the problem for him. I need to know soon if possible, we have a scenario this weekend. He has an A-5 that has everything you could possibly imagine on it but the Tac-One still outshoots it hands down.
    JEDI OUT!!!!
    Most problems like this are due to bolt stick. Try going to the next larger carrier and see if that helps.

  27. #1317
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    1,254
    My velocity jumps around 10 or 15 fps when I use the middle spring. I cant use the longest spring (wont fire). When I use the stock spring the velicity stays within 1. 280,279, and so on. Is it normal for the velocity to jump around with the red spring?
    Last edited by 11 Bravo; 10-12-2005 at 02:30 PM.

  28. #1318
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
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    Halifax, N.S., Canada
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    7,391
    Using the middle spring, you are probably setting the velocity too close to the lower end of the operating range. This would cause the inconsistency you are seeing. Once the carrier oring is properly broken in, these fluctuations will go away. Until then, you may want to use the short bolt spring. The other option is to cut the long spring down to act as a shorter version of the middle spring. The proper spring allows the ideal velocity setting to make the gun shoot 20fps above the lowest velocity at which the gun stops shooting.

  29. #1319
    hey guys, just picked up a nice classic with intelliframe and lvl 10 yesterday. few things. first, any chance of AGD sending me 2 foamie bumpers for the bolt? mine is kinda...well, use your imagination. and a new wire detent would be appreciated as well

    second i am completely new to mags. i got the valve all cleaned out, replaced a few old looking o-rings, got it greased, etc. and i am currently setting up the level 10. what i was wondering is what are the pros and cons of the heavy spring as opposed to the medium spring, and what would be the ideal carrier to use? from what i've gathered the heavier the spring the better, assuming you can still reach the desired velocity. and for the carriers, would you want the largest one you can use without a leak, or would you want the smallest you could use without bolt stick?

    right now i don't have air, but i am gonna try for the heavy spring and single bar carrier. the double bar carrier seemed a bit loose to hold the pressure very well.

    and i know most of this has probably been answered many times before, but i occasionally find mixed ideas and i don't have the time to sort through 44 pages.

    thanks guys

  30. #1320
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    1,254
    You want the largest carrier that does not leak. As for the springs I dont know. The heavier the spring the more air you use to move the bolt. When I put my finger in the breach and fire I cant tell the difference between the medium spring and the short spring. I get better consistancy from the short spring, but that was explained by athomas in the post above yours.

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