Page 63 of 76 FirstFirst ... 135359606162636465666773 ... LastLast
Results 1,861 to 1,890 of 2264

Thread: ** Official Level 10 Problems Thread **

  1. #1861
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Halifax, N.S., Canada
    Posts
    7,371
    Quote Originally Posted by ghost flanker
    I have a classic automag with a level 10 bolt that leaks no matter what I do. Leak stops when trigger is held down. I've changed all o-rings, used plenty of lube, removed all shims, and installed the smallest carrier with little effect. The leak persists, ranging from moderate to floodgate. What the hell is wrong with this thing?

    The level 10 carriers (all of them) fit very tightly into the power tube and must be pushed down to the bottom with considerable force (even when soaking in lube), as if it's hanging up on the powertube's threading. However, the carrier o-rings show no visible signs of damage when removed, but who knows.

    Any tips?
    The carrier does fit tightly into the powertube. Your leaking sounds like it might be sear related. If your sear is worn, the bolt will sit too far forward. The vent hole will always be past the carrier oring. Make sure you have the rail bushing as well. This could also lead to continuous leaking.
    Except for the Automag in front, its usually the man behind the equipment that counts.

  2. #1862
    Quote Originally Posted by athomas
    The carrier does fit tightly into the powertube. Your leaking sounds like it might be sear related. If your sear is worn, the bolt will sit too far forward. The vent hole will always be past the carrier oring. Make sure you have the rail bushing as well. This could also lead to continuous leaking.
    I'm having this exact same issue with one LX bolt but not another... I have tried all the standard stuff and even tried removing the bolt and holding the trigger while airing it up. No leak, reassemble with bolt and SNAP, the leak is back. Then I looked at the non function bolt and the working one and WOW the stem is longer...

    Here is a photo for the record...


    I'm guessing I've got my self an early LX Bolt here because of the seam at the front of the bolt. The strange thing is it was working fine until the other day while playing in freezing weather the thing just started leaking and would not stop. I have swapped bolts off another valve and leak goes away so that would rule out the sear... and now that I look at the bypass hole in the shaft it is back further than the working LX bolt... but the foamy looks to be in the right place up front...

    Approximate distance to bypass hole from back edge of bolt
    .2020 Leaky Lx
    .3415 Working LX

    Looks like I have a failed Level X Bolt
    Any suggestions?

  3. #1863
    Think I found my answer at post 176 in this thread...

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackVCG
    DarkPhoenix- If you're handy with tools and Loctite, take off the foamie, take a drift pin and tap out the bolt pin from the hole exposed when you take off the foamie. This will remove the bolt pin so you can put a dab of RED Loctite on it and press fit it back in. Be sure to fully clean off any dirt from the tip of the pin surface that is press fitted into the bolt with rubbing alochol. Use a q-tip to wipe off any Loctite that comes out from pressing it in. I suggest using a flat faced hammer on the end of the bolt pin with short, but firm taps. The end of the bolt pin that you'll be hitting with the hammer doesn't contact anything so it's not an issue to hit it with a hammer, so long as you tap it in straight and don't slip. Use calipers to measure from the tip of the bolt to the tip of the pin. It should go in to 2.010".

  4. #1864
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Oakville, On, Canada
    Posts
    1,018
    Quote Originally Posted by athomas
    The carrier does fit tightly into the powertube. Your leaking sounds like it might be sear related. If your sear is worn, the bolt will sit too far forward. The vent hole will always be past the carrier oring. Make sure you have the rail bushing as well. This could also lead to continuous leaking.
    What do you mean by rail bushing?

    I have a continuous leak, I have checked my sear and it works fine, changed all oring and such. Have done the carrier/oil/shims drill but still leaking.

    Have not measured the bolt but pretty sure it is the correct size since I have tried several.

  5. #1865
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Halifax, N.S., Canada
    Posts
    7,371
    Quote Originally Posted by ezcreation
    What do you mean by rail bushing?

    I have a continuous leak, I have checked my sear and it works fine, changed all oring and such. Have done the carrier/oil/shims drill but still leaking.

    Have not measured the bolt but pretty sure it is the correct size since I have tried several.
    The sear may work fine but if there is any wear on the tip where it catches the bolt, it could alter where the bolt is held in place. If the bolt sits too far forward, then it will leak. It doesn't take much.

    The rail bushing fits in the rail where the field strip screw holds the valve in place. Without this bushing, the valve will have a tendency to sit too far back when aired up. This effect is the same as having the bolt too far forward and it will leak continuously.

  6. #1866
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Oakville, On, Canada
    Posts
    1,018
    Quote Originally Posted by athomas
    The sear may work fine but if there is any wear on the tip where it catches the bolt, it could alter where the bolt is held in place. If the bolt sits too far forward, then it will leak. It doesn't take much.

    The rail bushing fits in the rail where the field strip screw holds the valve in place. Without this bushing, the valve will have a tendency to sit too far back when aired up. This effect is the same as having the bolt too far forward and it will leak continuously.
    The rail bushing is in place. I have tried another valve in and it shoots no problem, no leak. I do believe now that my valve is defective to be honest.

  7. #1867
    hey guys i would like to request some spring help.

    my mag shoots fine and at velocity but the force of the bolt seems a bit high and it seems very very thirsty.

    i've been told two things. one switching to the red or silver spring will alleviate this problem but i'm not sure which. i was thinking the red would reset the bolt faster and would require the valve to be turned up which would make the mag thirstier, but the silver spring would return the bolt slower but use less air. and the second i was told that i would probably have to cut the spring, which i'm not sure how to do.

  8. #1868
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Summerfield, FL
    Posts
    1,131
    Quote Originally Posted by gunangel
    hey guys i would like to request some spring help.

    my mag shoots fine and at velocity but the force of the bolt seems a bit high and it seems very very thirsty.

    i've been told two things. one switching to the red or silver spring will alleviate this problem but i'm not sure which. i was thinking the red would reset the bolt faster and would require the valve to be turned up which would make the mag thirstier, but the silver spring would return the bolt slower but use less air. and the second i was told that i would probably have to cut the spring, which i'm not sure how to do.
    Mags use more air when dry fired than with paint.
    The bolt will have more force after it travels .25". Before it travels .25" it is gentle on paint.
    As for reset time, we are probably talking about milliseconds here. It makes no difference when the valve can only (I use that word lightly) cycle at ~30 cycles per second.

    Read the last paragraph here if you want to fine tune: http://automags.org/resource/level10/index.shtml

  9. #1869
    thanks for the reply!

    i was testing the bolt with my finger right up against the bolt and it's pushing it a far distance (to the other side of the breech) and fairly hard. i have tried the other springs but both won't fire. I assume this is because of the length so I was wondering what was the proper way to cut down in the spring?

    i did totally forget about the back pressure caused by the paintball in the barrel in measuring air consumption, that makes me a bit happier

  10. #1870
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Summerfield, FL
    Posts
    1,131
    Quote Originally Posted by gunangel
    thanks for the reply!

    i was testing the bolt with my finger right up against the bolt and it's pushing it a far distance (to the other side of the breech) and fairly hard. i have tried the other springs but both won't fire. I assume this is because of the length so I was wondering what was the proper way to cut down in the spring?

    i did totally forget about the back pressure caused by the paintball in the barrel in measuring air consumption, that makes me a bit happier
    A stronger spring requires that you turn up your velocity to counter the extra spring force.

    I wouldn't cut down a spring.

  11. #1871
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Halifax, N.S., Canada
    Posts
    7,371
    Quote Originally Posted by gunangel
    thanks for the reply!

    i was testing the bolt with my finger right up against the bolt and it's pushing it a far distance (to the other side of the breech) and fairly hard. i have tried the other springs but both won't fire. I assume this is because of the length so I was wondering what was the proper way to cut down in the spring?

    i did totally forget about the back pressure caused by the paintball in the barrel in measuring air consumption, that makes me a bit happier
    As mentioned by secretweaponevan, don't cut your spring just yet. The extra spring force does require extra chamber pressure, so you will have to increase your velocity setting to overcome the extra tension and get the gun back up to normal shooting velocity.

    The red spring is stronger than the short gold one. The long grey spring is the stiffest but may not allow your gun to shoot properly in the range of operation you need. Experimentation will tel you that.

    The longer springs are actually slower in cycle time than the shorter/lighter springs. Its the slower forward movement and the higher residual chamber pressure that slows the cycle down although its not really noticed for normal operation. Even electro guns that are properly tuned would be hard pressed to outshoot the capability of a level 10 mag with a stiff spring vs one that had a regular spring.

  12. #1872
    kind of a noob level 10?

    How do i read the carriers. what size is what?

    got them all in a bag from agd and would like to know what the lines and dots actualy mean

  13. #1873
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Halifax, N.S., Canada
    Posts
    7,371
    Quote Originally Posted by Blacksnake
    kind of a noob level 10?

    How do i read the carriers. what size is what?

    got them all in a bag from agd and would like to know what the lines and dots actualy mean
    No lines is the lowest number. Each line represents a number. A dot represents 0.5. Sizing goes from lowest to highest.

  14. #1874
    well i put it all togather and put air to it and it just was makeing a loud click and the bolt was not moving
    is it the spring,shimms,carrier
    please help

  15. #1875
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Halifax, N.S., Canada
    Posts
    7,371
    Quote Originally Posted by Tweety
    well i put it all togather and put air to it and it just was makeing a loud click and the bolt was not moving
    is it the spring,shimms,carrier
    please help
    What's your setup? What type of mag are you using?

    Most likely it is bolt stick. Make sure you turned the velocity up after a level 10 installation. The valve uses a higher chamber pressure to operate the level 10 bolt at the same velocitiy as before. If it still sticks, then you are using a carrier size that is too small making the carrier oring too tight on the bolt stem.

  16. #1876
    Quote Originally Posted by athomas
    What's your setup? What type of mag are you using?

    Most likely it is bolt stick. Make sure you turned the velocity up after a level 10 installation. The valve uses a higher chamber pressure to operate the level 10 bolt at the same velocitiy as before. If it still sticks, then you are using a carrier size that is too small making the carrier oring too tight on the bolt stem.
    it is a e-mag i was useing a pure energy tank the level 10 i have a med spring on it and the carrier was only a little tight should the carrier. lean more to the loose side
    it makes a little poping sound when when i move the bolt is that a sighn

    would the larger chamber pessure efect the air in the tank

  17. #1877
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Halifax, N.S., Canada
    Posts
    7,371
    Quote Originally Posted by Tweety
    it is a e-mag i was useing a pure energy tank the level 10 i have a med spring on it and the carrier was only a little tight should the carrier. lean more to the loose side
    it makes a little poping sound when when i move the bolt is that a sighn

    would the larger chamber pessure efect the air in the tank
    Your setup should be fine. I use a PE tank on my emag. It works great.

    Like I mentioned before, turn up the velocity setting first. The carrier should be as loose as you can get it without leaking (ie; use the largest carrier that doesn't leak). Any tightness on the bolt stem will cause bolt stick. Always test for leaks without any shims installed.

  18. #1878
    Quote Originally Posted by athomas
    Your setup should be fine. I use a PE tank on my emag. It works great.

    Like I mentioned before, turn up the velocity setting first. The carrier should be as loose as you can get it without leaking (ie; use the largest carrier that doesn't leak). Any tightness on the bolt stem will cause bolt stick. Always test for leaks without any shims installed.
    how can you test for leaks other than the putting it all togather

    i was mess around with the velocity. i think i made it worse

    how do you ajust the velocity i never realy had too with the lvl7 bolt
    Last edited by Tweety; 02-24-2009 at 04:08 PM.

  19. #1879
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Halifax, N.S., Canada
    Posts
    7,371
    Quote Originally Posted by Tweety
    how can you test for leaks other than the putting it all togather
    You can't. You use an educated guess based on feel for your first attempt at a carrier size. It should take almost no force to push the carrier-oring combination onto the bolt stem. With the bolt in the vertical position and the carrier installed onto the stem, pick the bolt up by holding the carrier. Any slight bump should cause the bolt to slide out of the carrier. If it takes more than a slight bump, then it is too tight. If it can't be picked up at all, then it is too loose. That should be a good first test. If you find that it leaks when installed, use the next smaller size. If it doesn't leak, use the next larger size. Always use the size smaller than the one that leaks. Always use the same white oring when testing carrier sizes.

  20. #1880
    crazyjoe12 Guest
    what if i have tested all the carriers and im still getting a leak? i have carrier size #0 in and it fits right but im still getting the leak, i also have 2 shims. do i add more shims? try a harder spring?

  21. #1881
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Summerfield, FL
    Posts
    1,131
    Quote Originally Posted by crazyjoe12
    what if i have tested all the carriers and im still getting a leak? i have carrier size #0 in and it fits right but im still getting the leak, i also have 2 shims. do i add more shims? try a harder spring?
    The shims might be causing the leak. Start with no shims and the largest carrier that doesn't leak. Only add a shim if the bolt fails to reset after a jam.

  22. #1882
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Halifax, N.S., Canada
    Posts
    7,371
    Quote Originally Posted by crazyjoe12
    what if i have tested all the carriers and im still getting a leak? i have carrier size #0 in and it fits right but im still getting the leak, i also have 2 shims. do i add more shims? try a harder spring?
    As mentioned above, your leak is most likely caused by too many shims. Too many shims will push the carrier and oring so that the bolt stem vent hole is exposed and it will continually leak. Remove your shims and recalibrate your level 10 carrier setup. Always remove the shims when checking carrier sizes to prevent this type of leak from happening.

  23. #1883
    crazyjoe12 Guest
    ok so im still getting a leak down the barrel. i tried removing all the shims and the gun fires but still leaks, i then added shims one at a time up to three and still had leaking. i tryed changing to the red spring but it is too hard and causes the gun not to recock after firing. i have the smallest size carrier in too. not only am i getting the leak but every few shots the gun will uncock and i have to push on the bolt to get it going again. so what is it i need to try doing? im very lost all help is needed and apreciated

  24. #1884
    I just purchased and installed a level 10 bolt on my Automag classic. When I gas it up, there is resistance behind the trigger but the marker will not fire until I turn up the pressure. About an 1/8th of a turn past where the marker will fire, the valve begins to leak out the back. I have tried several carriers and two and no shims. Any ideas?

  25. #1885
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Halifax, N.S., Canada
    Posts
    7,371
    Quote Originally Posted by crazyjoe12
    ok so im still getting a leak down the barrel. i tried removing all the shims and the gun fires but still leaks, i then added shims one at a time up to three and still had leaking. i tryed changing to the red spring but it is too hard and causes the gun not to recock after firing. i have the smallest size carrier in too. not only am i getting the leak but every few shots the gun will uncock and i have to push on the bolt to get it going again. so what is it i need to try doing? im very lost all help is needed and apreciated
    Adding more shims will never make a leak go away and will usually make the leak worst. Adding a stiffer spring (ie; red spring) requires turning the velocity setting up to get the operating velocity back up to where it was. It won't fire if you don't. If you are getting bolt stick (gun won't re-cock after a shot), you are using a carrier size that is too tight. It is quite possible you have a defective white powertube oring. Change it. Clean your powertube to make sure there is no debris that might cause leaking. Retune your setup once you install the new oring. Use the largest carrier size that doesn't leak. Don't use any shims when testing the carrier size. Always use the same white oring when changing carriers.

    Check your sear for wear. A worn sear will allow the bolt to sit too far forward and cause leaking. A missing rail bushing could cause problems too.

  26. #1886
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Halifax, N.S., Canada
    Posts
    7,371
    Quote Originally Posted by Posey
    I just purchased and installed a level 10 bolt on my Automag classic. When I gas it up, there is resistance behind the trigger but the marker will not fire until I turn up the pressure. About an 1/8th of a turn past where the marker will fire, the valve begins to leak out the back. I have tried several carriers and two and no shims. Any ideas?
    Your regulator piston assembly is an older low pressure version. The higher pressure requirements of the level 10 bolt sometimes exceed the safety release pressure of the regulator piston assembly in the older units. You might get away with using the older unit if you make your system more efficient. Use the short gold spring. Use an 11" unported barrel or one that has minimal or very small porting. Keep your velocity down around 280fps or lower. This may get you by until you can get a new piston assembly.

  27. #1887
    So if I order a new regulator piston assembly from the AGD website I should be fine? Should I also replace the spring pack?

  28. #1888
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Halifax, N.S., Canada
    Posts
    7,371
    Quote Originally Posted by Posey
    So if I order a new regulator piston assembly from the AGD website I should be fine? Should I also replace the spring pack?
    Spring pack will be fine. You only need the regulator piston assembly.

  29. #1889
    crazyjoe12 Guest
    if the washer that goes behind the carrier is chipped on the inside could that cause leaking?

  30. #1890
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Halifax, N.S., Canada
    Posts
    7,371
    Quote Originally Posted by crazyjoe12
    if the washer that goes behind the carrier is chipped on the inside could that cause leaking?
    It shouldn't. The washer is only a spacer to prevent the bolt from pushng the carrer oring back into the chamber when there is no air pressure.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •