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Thread: Chris Lasoya banned from Pan-Am

  1. #1
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    Chris Lasoya banned from Pan-Am

    "The MSTS finals were held at the Denver, Colorado USA, National Western, Indoor complex, November 23-24. Wayde Samuel was the last player of the Yarddog team facing four of the opponents. Chris Lasoya, bunkered Wayde. His move was very good, but it was not necessary to shoot him twelve times in the head. As a result, Wayde was knocked out cold and was unresponsive. Paramedics deemed it necessary to have him ambulanced to the hospital. He was cat scanned etc.. and released 7 hours later, having suffered a concussion.

    Lasoya claimed he only pulled the trigger 6 or so times while admitting he put 12 balls onto Wayde. It does not matter whether he pulled the trigger 12 times, trigger bounce occured, the marker was set on burst mode
    illegally, or there was a malfunction, pulling the trigger 6 times to shoot someone in the head deliberately is inexcusable. A player, especially a professional level player such as Lasoya with years of experience, is
    responsible for being in control of the marker, marker settings, and particularly of his trigger finger. There is no excuse for putting that many balls onto someone's head or forehead, at point blank range.

    I think this is unacceptable paintball. It is not cool, not fun, hurts the sport and does not impress me one bit. The high rates of fire and this kind of pointblank headshot shooting or any other kind of punishment bunkering is not going to attract recreational paintball players. It does
    nothing but put players at risk for serious injury, blindness in one or both eyes should a goggle system be dislodged or possibly even death.

    It is time to change the rules and get rid of Prima Donnas that think punishment bunkering is a cool thing to do. Shouldn't we, as industry leaders work to protect the industry from players like LaSoya, who are truly no good for the future of paintball? Here is the kicker, LaSoya has been banned "for life" from the Pan Am and the WPF (when the WPF was run by Jim Lively with Bill Bryant as the director of judging). Banned for similar unacceptable behavior. Wayne Samuel runs the largest paintball field in
    Colorado. He and myself also sponsor one of the oldest teams in the country, the Yarddogs. Wayne has informed the MSTS that the Yarddogs will not play in next years MSTS if LaSoya is allowed in the tournament."

    I think this is just pure BS, I know when you go to bunker someone in a tournament your not gonna fire 1 shot, but you could stop yourself after the third or fourth ball.

    heres my questions..
    What is he doing at the Pan-Am
    What was he thinking??

    Thought some pple might be interested in this
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  2. #2
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    i agree man, i also think money should be pulled as a prize, thats one of the reasons all these things occure, its greed plain and simple.


    btw, do you play for team dynast? or did you just like the name?
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  3. #3
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    Lasoya=cheating bastard.
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  4. #4
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    Wow, I never knew HE would act so improperly.

    I had a great amount of respect for Lasoya, but after this event, it has dropped.

    He is very highly sponsored, but no company has taken a look at THIS situation I believe.

    I think that he would and should be baned for a long while so that he can learn the functions on his markewr and get a fell for the trigger.
    I wish I wasn't broke....

  5. #5
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    yet another higher-up in paintball to tarnish the sport that we play

    Drink Wine

  6. #6
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    i used to go to warped sportz in denver a long time ago to get my tank filled, he ran that shop, he was not a very nice guy back then either. Now he works for rocky mountain paintball and i've played with him at their field a few times, he is not a fair player to say the least...
    Last edited by jwren00; 03-13-2003 at 01:37 AM.

  7. #7
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    They shoulda....

    shave the guys head to see how many welts could be detected... but even so.... that is inexcusable behavior..... 12 shots to the head.... jesus.......

    High End players should know better than that. I'm happy with the decision to ban him.

    ~da baller

  8. #8
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    Re: They shoulda....

    Originally posted by PsychoBaller


    High End players should know better than that. I'm happy with the decision to ban him.

    ~da baller

    Yeah cause he won't be playing in a few weeks. Seems to me that the higher up "pro's" do/say whatever they want with no reprecussions. Big deal, they banned him. Not like he can't go somewhere else and do whatever he pleases. There are plenty of other leagues to play. For once i would love to see a one of the company's sponsering them take some action against to quell such childish occurances. Not that it'll happen anytime soon.
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  9. #9
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    Re: Re: They shoulda....

    Originally posted by TheBigRaguPB4L
    For once i would love to see a one of the company's sponsering them take some action against to quell such childish occurances. Not that it'll happen anytime soon.
    JT vs. Jeremy Salm after the 2k2 World Cup debacle...
    (he can never play for another team sponsored by any BrassEagle company like JT or Viewloader)

    But I do agree with you whole-heartedly. A 'rogue' player's entire sponsorship should be pulled (if not indefinately, at least until he/she makes a visible effort to reform).

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  10. #10
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    This, my friends, is one of the reasons paintball is not TV ready. As far as his ban from the PanAm, good riddance. Hopefully other tourny producers will follow suit. It is, however, very good to see people banding together AGAINST his behavior, rather than blindly forgiving it (as is the case with many other sports celebrities). I'm glad people recognize how thin the ice under our sport really is. Unfortunately this was perpetrated by one of the most prevalent paintball players in the world, and will more than likely be a very big news story, at least in our circle of the world. Yet another shadow cast, hopefully we can shine beyond it. Mr. Lasoya, shame on you. May you never play paintball again.

    Another discussion this will likely recussitate is the oft forgotten speed limit. Would Lasoya have gotten off 12 shots if his gun were capped at a more reasonable level? If it were capped at 13 (the most frequently used number for a proposed cap) those 12 shots would have taken at least a full second. In paintball time, that's quite a stretch, and it's likely all 12 of them wouldn't have happened. Would this have solved the problem of Lasoya overshooting? No. But would it hae increased the safety level and reduced the damage inflicted? Yes. It's a pro and con discussion that's tainted by the industry's influence over tournament producers. But I digress...

    Another dark day for paintball is upon us. It is up to every one of us to make it right, and to personally vow to never do anything this awfully reckless. And keep in mind, friends: whether you're laying into a guy's head with 12 point blank shots, picking off opponents from the sidelines, or "just wiping"... they're all the same rules, and they all hurt the sport. We must play with honor if we want paintball to be more than a 20 year flash in the pan, because there are plenty of people who would be glad to ban the sport for any reason they can dig up. Let's not give them any help.

    "To tell others that / it is a rumor / will not do. / When your own heart asks / how will you respond? " ~ ancient japanese poem

  11. #11
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    Re: Re: Re: They shoulda....

    Originally posted by Cryer
    JT vs. Jeremy Salm after the 2k2 World Cup debacle...
    (he can never play for another team sponsored by any BrassEagle company like JT or Viewloader)
    Enter the cynic.

    Like that'll happen. I guarantee that he'll be playing for a JT team in a year or two. Hell, he was AT the NPPL Huntington Beach as a COACH.

    I'm a cynic, until the players get roped in, thye'll do what they want, when they want, becasue they can. It's that simple.

    My solution is to not give him money, or tell his sponsors that I won't give them my money by buying the products he uses. If enough people do this, you'll be amazed how fast they clean up...

    -Tyger


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  12. #12
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    I don't know who Chris Lasoya is or which team he plays for but shame on his team, sponsors, and league for letting this punk continue to play paintball professionally. It makes me so furious reading the vicious actions of Chris Lasoya. I hope the kid who was injured is taking legal actions against him. I pray one day Mr. Lasoya and I cross paths so I can tell him how much disrespect I have for him.

  13. #13
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    man, that's gotta hurt, 6 to the body from a normal range kinda hurts where you just kinda walk off the feild and sit down and re-gain your strength. 12 to the head at point blank!!!! damn, no wonder the guy suffered a concusion
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  14. #14
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    Rumours and embellishments make me sick. Just because something gets printed all of a sudden it's fact?

    Who are you guys to slate Chris just on the basis of one other person's views? Maybe you should get both sides of the story before preaching about it. Next time I see Chris I'll get his side. Notice how the person writing that piece is affiliated with the guy that got shot. So it's not exactly an unbiased representative giving a report now is it?

    When this story first broke it was 5 hits, and the guy was ok but felt concussed (I do after just one head hit!) and so went to get checked. Chris was apparently immediately sorry and trying to help the guy.

    Now I agree 5 hits is way too much, and I am by no means condoning that, but there may be other circumstances and things we don't know, and Chris is the fastest person on the trigger that I have EVER seen. In the heat of a game, with the adrenalin flowing and with a fast finger I've seen lots of people pull 5-6 shots in a bunkering move, especially if the person they are shooting at shoots back or swings to fire.

    I don't know the facts for sure, but nor do you guys. You just seem to be on a witch hunt

    Chris is a friend of mine, he can get het up on the field and plays on the edge, but he is also a nice guy who is a phenomenal ambassador for the sport for kids and people that take the time to want to talk to him (and don't just hate him based upon what they have read or 'heard' . When you've seen him give signatures and equipment to young kids, and take the time to talk to old couples explaining what paintball is about and what it means to be a paintballer, you will appreciate the whole person that is Chris Lasoya.

    He gives a huge amount back. Yes he screws up now and then, but I for one DO NOT think paintball would be a better place without him.

  15. #15
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    Originally posted by manike
    Rumours and embellishments make me sick. Just because something gets printed all of a sudden it's fact?

    Who are you guys to slate Chris just on the basis of one other person's views? Maybe you should get both sides of the story before preaching about it. Next time I see Chris I'll get his side. Notice how the person writing that piece is affiliated with the guy that got shot. So it's not exactly an unbiased representative giving a report now is it?

    When this story first broke it was 5 hits, and the guy was ok but felt concussed (I do after just one head hit!) and so went to get checked. Chris was apparently immediately sorry and trying to help the guy.

    Now I agree 5 hits is way too much, and I am by no means condoning that, but there may be other circumstances and things we don't know, and Chris is the fastest person on the trigger that I have EVER seen. In the heat of a game, with the adrenalin flowing and with a fast finger I've seen lots of people pull 5-6 shots in a bunkering move, especially if the person they are shooting at shoots back or swings to fire.

    I don't know the facts for sure, but nor do you guys. You just seem to be on a witch hunt

    Chris is a friend of mine, he can get het up on the field and plays on the edge, but he is also a nice guy who is a phenomenal ambassador for the sport for kids and people that take the time to want to talk to him (and don't just hate him based upon what they have read or 'heard' . When you've seen him give signatures and equipment to young kids, and take the time to talk to old couples explaining what paintball is about and what it means to be a paintballer, you will appreciate the whole person that is Chris Lasoya.

    He gives a huge amount back. Yes he screws up now and then, but I for one DO NOT think paintball would be a better place without him.
    After thinking about it more I changed my post. It is not a reversal of views but a clarification of them.

    How nice a player is, or how liked he is, does not excuse the infraction….. with that said, overshooting does happen, and even unintentionally. This does not excuse the action either, but it means that you should not vilify a person for an indiscretion that is a common part of the game and can be done without ill intent… which very well may have been the case here.

    Accident also happen. The overshooting would still be overshooting if the other player had not been knocked out. And the penalties for gross overshooting should have been the same, whether they hit him in the head or in the back/chest. It would send a strong message that you must control your fire. Heck even most Rec Fields have a 3-5 ball rule to help eliminate overshooting. Why should be expect anything less for the “Pros”? Simply put, we should not.

    No, Chris is not an evil person to be forced out of the sport. But he also should not be cut any slack for his actual actions.

    I would like to read a totally unbiased article on this matter.
    Last edited by shartley; 03-13-2003 at 07:23 AM.

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  16. #16
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    Sam I don't know if your post was a general one or aimed directly at me, but just in case you missed it...

    Originally posted by manike
    Now I agree 5 hits is way too much, and I am by no means condoning that
    Originally posted by manike
    Yes he screws up
    Oh and EVERYBODY is accountable for their actions on the paintball field in my book, not just once they reach a certain level.

    Originally posted by shartley
    I would like to see an unbiased article on this matter, not written by an associate of the “victim” or refuted by a friend of the one being accused. And even so, good people sometimes make mistakes. That does not make them “bad” people. But you can’t just brush aside the wrong doing JUST because they are “good” people. And that does not mean they should not be punished for their actions either.
    I agree completely

  17. #17
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    LOL You were typing while I was re-typing. No, I was not aiming anything directly at you but used your post as a springboard. If you read what I wrote in my “edit” it is much more clear. Which is why I edited it.

  18. #18
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    .. my thoughts...

    I think people are over reacting...... in the pro levels your average shoots per second are 14+ ..... and guys shoot that with out thinking... it's part of being a pro...

    The last 3 man I was in, I put TWO at point blank range into a guys head, and you know what..... the reffs couldn't find paint, so I was out and he got the pull and hang....

    Why do we question this when someone get's knocked out... nothing would have been said if he wasn't out cold... but even so, I don't blame Chris... sure he shot him 15 times, but there is NOTHING in the rule book about over shooting!
    NOTHING....

    hurting the sport? how so? if they are shooting to fast and hard get the fps dropped 190-180 or something, b/c this stuff happens, and it happens within seconds!

    I haven't seen a video of this event, but unless he just stood there for 5 seconds shooting the poor guy in the head then I have no problem...

    bunkering is part of the game, if you don't like this style of play, don't play the tournys.... b/c guys are out to win, and will do so by all means possible...
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  19. #19
    As one of, if not the highest sponsored pros there is, one would assume he has some sort of control of his actions. This is regardless of the heat of the battle. If I'd done the same thing (either 12 or 5 to someones head) I'd have been facing: banishment from the field, a butt kicking by EVERYONE present for being stupid and dangerous, and possible legal action. It is for certain I’d be held accountable in a similar situation.

    Simon's opinion carries a lot of weight with me and I'm willing to cut Chris the benefit of the doubt on the issue as to whether he *intended* to do this. On the other hand he(Manike) is one of the few I've ever seen write something positive about Chris on these boards. That having been said I'd like to hear Chris's side of the story AND the rendition of a 3rd party. In either case (as others have stated) he still gets held accountable. Intent and how great (or not great you might be) you are on or off the field doesn't excuse you from the results of being stupid.

    I see this as another case of a pro not being aware of how his actions represent the sport that pays his living. To me that is like biting the hand that feeds. I have to wonder as to the overall intelligence of some of these people.

    On to issue of BPS and short, light triggers. To anyone who wants to use this as an excuse - you are way off base. This issue isn't someone running into a rope of paint being fired down a lane and already in the air. During a bunker move you know precisely when to start *pulling* the trigger. If your trigger is so light and short you can't control it any longer then you're gun is malfunctioning and is UNSAFE. This is the first time I've ever been in favor of minimum trigger standards but maybe it's time. I'd say that first though REAL ENFORCEMENT of the overshooting/bonus-ball rule needs to go into effect, along with REAL ENFORCEMENT of "playing on" penalties. There wouldn’t be a need for all of the over shooting if it weren’t for the established behavior of "playing until I'm pulled" in the first place. In the second, this is a sport that requires a certain level of safety consciousness at all times. If the *pro* level is disregarding this because of the MONEY involved (winning the PRIZE is clouding the JUDGEMENT of the players) then I'm all for banning THAT (as in professional paintball). Unlike other professional sports, I don't enjoy watching paintball, I enjoy playing it! That is how it started for me and everything we now have (innovation, new products, magazines, tournaments) existed a LONG TIME before people got paid to play the game. I'm sure that paintball would do JUST fine without the pros - as paintball is a sport (like golf) that lends more enjoyment to participation then viewing.

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  20. #20
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    Re: Re: Re: Re: They shoulda....

    This incident happened in Novemeber of last year. We discussed it back then and the views were just about the same. However, I distincly remember that in the two articles that I read about the incident (both written by "neutral" publications) the player LaSoya hit actually lost consciousness.

    I tried to run a quick search to find the old thread, but I could not find it. But that thread had links to the articles.

    Originally posted by Tyger

    Like that'll happen. I guarantee that he'll be playing for a JT team in a year or two. Hell, he was AT the NPPL Huntington Beach as a COACH.
    And I had such high hopes for the Super 7. I heard it was well run and that the paintball was very clean (compared to last season). The fact that Salm was allowed to participate IN ANY WAY with the NPPL while he is officially banned, just makes me mad I know that the ban was from playing and not from couching, but it still just pisses me off.

    This should also be indicative of just how sorry he really is for the events that occured at WC.

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  21. #21
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    Hmmm...I am willing to wait and get to the bottom of this. Sounds like there is reason to do that enough here. Someone is searching out the facts I assume? Please post em when you know them and can provide some documentation to back them up.


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  22. #22
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    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: They shoulda....

    Originally posted by ogre55
    And I had such high hopes for the Super 7. I heard it was well run and that the paintball was very clean (compared to last season). The fact that Salm was allowed to participate IN ANY WAY with the NPPL while he is officially banned, just makes me mad I know that the ban was from playing and not from couching, but it still just pisses me off.

    This should also be indicative of just how sorry he really is for the events that occured at WC.
    I'm not sure but this may be a political thing...

    Jerry Braun and the PSP banned him, and it was Jerry's team that the incident was against. It may be that the NPPL banned him also as part of the PSP event, but I am not sure...

    The new NPPL and new PSP are both different from when the incident happened. Maybe both should ban him? (maybe he is banned from playing in both, but not from supporting teams?)

  23. #23
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    I posited the question of whether Salm was banned from both the NPPL and the PSP a little while ago and no one really had an answer. Considering that the Super 7 is now going and the PSP season is fast approaching, I think this question needs to be answered quick.

    Ogre

  24. #24
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    Originally posted by cphilip
    Hmmm...I am willing to wait and get to the bottom of this. Sounds like there is reason to do that enough here. Someone is searching out the facts I assume? Please post em when you know them and can provide some documentation to back them up.
    I'm trying to find some of the other articles that were written about it, but not with a lot of luck

    But in that search I have found some other information... None of this is hard fact. There are some rumours of a video and that I would like to see!

    There has been a post on PBN by one of Wayde's team mates saying that as Chris bunkered Wayde they were both shooting at each other. And that Wayde went to put his 'gun down'? which is when Chris was shooting him in the head. He may have been trying to put the gun down because he already felt concussed?

    I'm not sure how to read that... I've seen many bunker moves where one guy shot back after being hit and so both keep shooting until until they signal they are out. Both sides are at fault if they just kept shooting at each other. And putting your gun down, definitely isn't a signal for being out. Gun up, or hand up, or hand on the head is.

    It's one reason why pro's shoot for the goggles, to stop other shooting back or trying to pretend they didn't know they were hit. It's unfortunately come about because so many people play on or swing on the guy that just shot them

    I don't know but am guessing Chris went and bunkered the guy, who shot back, so they had at each other, and Chris's temper flared and he went over the top. Just a guess though.

  25. #25
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    This is all hearsay.

    I think I'll withhold my opinion until I can read something from both of the parties involved or see this mythical video.

    I am curious though...

  26. #26
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    is there anybody else from colorado that knows more about this? I don't play in the msts so i dont know much about his tournament play, i've only played with him at the field. surely there must be someone that plays in the msts that posts on here, probably even someone that was actually at the finals.

  27. #27
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    umm......i thought when he was banned from the GWS back in 1999 he would of automatically been banned for the PanAm. I guess history repeats itself IF that situation is similar to how he got banned in the first place.

  28. #28
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    Hey. I'm not gonna make a judgement until the facts are in.

    What I know about Chris Lasoya:

    Off field: Nice guy, helped me get good equipment, taught me how to fix little things, helped me go to my first tourny.

    On field: cough....well. yeah... not the best.
    Last edited by ShooterJM; 03-13-2003 at 03:16 PM.

  29. #29
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    To be band for one infraction seems a little extreme to me.....


    Hey Manike why not just call/email Chris and ask him about it, or even better ask him to come here and comment on it personally. I doubt the story is as bad as was first posted.

  30. #30
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    shooter jm what do you mean about exageration etc etc etc?

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