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Thread: Some Thoughtfull Words sent from Glenn Palmer

  1. #1
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    Post Some Thoughtfull Words sent from Glenn Palmer

    This came in on email from Glenn:

    << << This is so true, it is scary. . . . . Hard to
    believe this was written by a high school student. . .


    The paradox of our time in history is that we have
    taller buildings, but shorter tempers;
    wider freeways, but narrower viewpoints;
    we spend more, but have less;
    we buy more, but enjoy it less.

    We have bigger houses and smaller families;
    more conveniences, but less time;
    we have more degrees, but less sense;
    more knowledge, but less judgment;
    more experts, but fewer solutions;
    more medicine, but less wellness.

    We have multiplied our possessions,
    but reduced our values.

    We talk too much, love too seldom, and hate too often.

    We've learned how to make a living, but not a life;
    we've added years to life, not life to years.

    We've been all the way to the moon and back, but
    have trouble crossing the street to meet the new
    neighbor.

    We've conquered outer space, but not inner space;
    we've cleaned up the air, but polluted the soul;
    we've split the atom, but not our prejudice.

    We have higher incomes, but lower morals;
    we've become long on quantity, but short on quality.

    These are the times of tall men, and short character;
    steep profits, and shallow relationships.

    These are the times of world peace, but domestic warfare;
    more leisure, but less fun;
    more kinds of food, but less nutrition.

    These are days of two incomes, but more divorce;
    of fancier houses, but broken homes.

    It is a time when there is much in the show window
    and nothing in the stockroom.

    A time when technology can bring this letter to
    you, and a time when you can choose either to forward
    this message and make a difference. . . or just hit
    delete

  2. #2
    shartley Guest

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    FANTASTIC! I could not agree more.

    But on a side note though (as I always seem to be the one with the darker side of things)….

    “Love thy neighbor is a fine sentiment for a Poet, but not a King.” Anyone heard that one? Goes hand in hand with the striking coincidence that poets and great authors seldom live in the same world the rest of us do. LOL The same is true for Priests and most other spiritual leaders.

    This is not saying that what they say is not valid, but it is SO easy to view things clearly when you are looking at them from the OUTSIDE. And far too often what we would LIKE to happen just is not a possibility due to the way things really ARE. No wonder most of the best poets ended up going crazy or killing themselves.

    And Paintball Players tend NOT to be the “poet” types. LOL I don’t agree with violence, but it DOES get people’s attention. LOL And experience is the only thing this fine young poet is lacking.. but that one thing outweighs any fancy verbiage.

    It is like someone new to the Paintball industry bringing up fantastic points, but having no actual “hands on” experience. Sure, it sounds great, but I would rather hear it from someone who has been around a bit.. like maybe Tom. My kids also come out with profound things too from time to time, but sages they are not. LOL

  3. #3
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    janstah, i tend to agree. not because it's sentimental... but because i think i'm one of the people ruining this poor kids life, and i still don't care.

  4. #4
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    Well he's wrong.

    Less nutrition? Guess he's not up with the latest in genetic engineering. We have corn that makes it's own insecticide. works great. Have had it for years.

    Spend more but have less? we live like KINGS. At any time of the night or day I can go out and buy a cheesburger. that's power. I don't know about you but I enjoy the heck out of my Microwave, home entertainment system, house, couch, rug and any number of other things I have because of mass production.

    I could go on, but won't bother tit-for-tat. This is bleeding-heart liberalism at its worst. "look how bad thigns are, take my word for it". People, please, look around and think for yourselves. Try to take less for granted and realize how good we have it. Our understanding of the world around us has given us everything from modern medicine to bungee jumping. Our standard of living (yes even in other countries, do some research) is unreasonably high.

    Sorry that my first post to this board has to be a sort-of rant. But it caught my eye and this kind of thing pushes my buttons.

    -Curt


  5. #5
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    You're not alone Curt. While the above is poetically sentimental, it only reinforces the "get along" attitude that is prevalent in society today. All of the "more of" passages are because of people who refuse to say 'well, that's good enough'. The "less of" passages are because of people who refuse to think for themselves.

    I have "more of" than my father did at my age, solely due to the fact that he did not wait to be given anything, but went out and worked for it. He has been married to my mother for 55 years now, because they did not believe in simply saying 'well, that was good enough,.

    If you are a thinker, more power to you. If you are a thinker and innovator, bless you for all that you have achieved for mankind.

    BTW; while Glen Palmer is a hell of a guy, it is too bad he thinks the poem is scary. I think of it as a first draft into getting it right.

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  6. #6

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    Um. My post got deleted.

    If it was because I used a mild swearword, then fair enough.

    If it was because somebody didnt agree with what I wrote, then I'm dissappointed. I tried extra hard to be very reasonable in what I wrote; I certainly wasnt rude to anyone.

    Could whoever deleted it please respond or email me and let me know why? Thanks.

    Jan.


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  7. #7
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    HEY!!!! Someone else is using MONTY PYTHON LINES IN THEIR SIGGY!!!!!! I cornered the market on that!!!!! Stop that, stop that...bloody weather.

    ~Fred
    ------------------------------
    And thanks a lot for the gold and frankincense, er, but don't worry too much about the myrrh next time

  8. #8
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    AAhhhhh!!!

    My head hurts! I should not have to be thinking now, it is summer time!

    But yes it has a very nice poetic thought to it. Some true, some true only in his eyes. But nice none the less.


    Jan, dude, what happened?

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    That was...WoW. Well Said.

  10. #10
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    i think some of you guys are missing the point. you can be happy but a lot us are not satisfid(sp) with what we have no matter what we have. i am not like that but think of it this way, when you where 7 and you had 10 bucks i remember enjoying it a lot more then now with 40 bucks. i knew this girl that in my opinion is very pretty but she keeps on bashing her self because magazines say she has to look like this or that.
    people are too busy to take their time with their familys.
    people get addicted to medicene that should make them fell better feel better.
    we live for 90 years yet are on diets and aneraxea(sp).
    throwing away freindships because somone looks like a geek.
    people live longer but dont enjoy it to the fullest and they spend the last 20 years of their life in a nursing home.
    i think he hit it right on the mark


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  11. #11
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    I think thats a good one too..

    I also thing some of you need to read a bit more carefully and think about the words before replying..

    IE - curt - you attack a couple sentences while missing the over all meaning.

    Yes - genetically engineered food is why the USA is #1 in food production and why we can sell the Russians back wheat that originally came from thier own country.

    I believe its all the diet foods (diet pop has NO nutrition) and the 101 other bad food for you that are prepackaged and passed out. He not talking about your beef and potatoes - its your twinkies and coke.

    When I grew up - Pop was for pizza night and cook outs. Thats it. It was special. Milk was the standard.

    I dont find this poem liberal at all. Indeed - its a call back to the days of our fathers when family and life were more important than cable and SUVs.

    As for Big Red One - I think you too miss a few things. I dont feel Palmer "fears" this poem like what you seem to suggest. I think he "fears" it in a way that someone so young has such insight. Sort of like wisdom from the mouths of babes. I also think that you too miss the whole meaning by focuasing on certain parts. Ever hear of too much of a good thing? Yes its good to have nice modern things - but I think his point was that these things have eroded us to a degree and we become slaves to the machine.

    I could be wrong - as poetry by nature is interpretative. But I feel one should take 10 secs to really find the true voice, rather than jump at the first shadow.

    Also - Im just pointing out curt and big red 1 cuz they jumped out at me. Im not trying to start a war - I just had a reaction to your comments, just as you had one to the original post.

    Finally - Big Red One - where you ever at Ft Riley? I used to be in Manhattan. Did you play there ever?



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  12. #12
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    You guys want to see how things "used" to be?--As in how this student said the days "used" to be?

    Take away all the technology, pull out the board games and intereact. We tried it once, took away the t.v., and I actually found out I had other people living with me; lol.

    Adam

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    ~delete[this is not an official AGD delete, the poster wrote this]...who gives a [this area was filled with asterix's to symbolize a bad word, your moderators have deleted this to spare all of you the anguish] about the past...its over and done with...it can not be changed...live for today and you'll be a much happier person...lead your own life, dont try to lead someone elses...

    sov82

    [This message has been edited by Army (edited 07-23-2001).]

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    Wow. That guy has life typed out right in front of us. He know exactly what he is talking about, which is that we have material items that we long for and desire, but nothing else.

    It amazes me how poets can do stuff like this. I could never do this if I tried, it just seems to come naturaly to this guy. Kinda weird if you think about it...



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    But I'm a parasite,
    Creep and crawl I step into the night.
    Two pints of booze,
    Tell me are you a Badfish too?

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  15. #15
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    Wow.

  16. #16
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    Deep stuff

  17. #17
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    that is really good. that kid will be some famous writer someday.

  18. #18
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    I think everyone here is right.

    The writer of this poem is saying that things today are missing heart, and it's all about mass production and, basically, money. He's also saying that family values/morals aren't as good as they used to be which I think, in some ways, is true also.

    However, Curt, you do have a point. We do live like Kings. I mean, who can order Groceries from their computers? or who can go to taco bell and get chalupas for 99 cents? which is nothing to us?

    I guess what I'm trying to say is that we should remember our past, and learn from it, however don't take what we have now for granted (sp?). Our past, present, and future all have things that the others dont.

    Just make the best of it.

  19. #19
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    I'll try and not make it too long, as I always do!

    Curt - "People, please, look around and think for yourselves. Try to take less for granted and realize how good we have it..."

    In a way both of what was written in the kid's Poetry/writings and your own thoughts expressed above have the same meanings.

    Give it a chance and go through it once more, might be surprised. At times it seems like most of the arguments and disagreements that take places aren't out of difference in ideals, but rather miscommunication. Whether that stems from stubbornness, and refusal to listen or not being able to and simply misunderstanding.. Both of which I'm often guilty of. So give it a chance.

    And Shartly, sometimes it's those of us who are naive and innocent... the dreamers and the ones without 'hands' on experience who see the clearest. A viewpoint without the obstructions of the bitterness, mistrust, cyncism and all the other little grays life brings us. Just my thoughts... Not disagreeing with you, but only further enforcing some of your points. Clarity afterall is what most of us seek in life.

    Oh and loved that witty little qoute -

    "Love thy neighbor is a fine sentiment for a Poet, but not a King"

    So often true.


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  20. #20
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    AWESOME! This is a keeper.

  21. #21
    shartley Guest

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    Arturus,
    Thank you for your response. I agree.

    I was only trying to make the point that being able to see a problem is far too often just that.. seeing it. I just got one of those twinges (you know the kind) from hearing people’s “wow”’s and “how insightful”… when it was NOT insightful, it was out-sightfull. LOL

    Someone can only get insight from being IN something. No offense to young folks, but until you wallow in the World on your own for more than a year (understatement) all you do is REFLECT what you see, not actually know about it.

    I like to point people to the movie “Good Will Hunting.” Remember the part when Will and the Dr. were talking about the Dr.’s dead wife and his dead pals in Vietnam? Will could sure tell you a few things about a few things, but in all actuality, he didn’t personally KNOW anything.

    This is not a bad thing, we have all been there. But lets all be honest about it. THAT is what got my goat. LOL Good poem, but don’t impart any special talent or attribute to the young author than the ability to write a good poem. LOL

    And as for seeing things clearly without all the muck surrounding things… LOL That would be like designing a marker that shot perfect in space with no outside influences…. Try shooting the marker in a real game. What actual good did it do you? But it sure sounds good doesn’t it? Point being that the MUCK is life, and seeing “clearly” without all the MUCK is actually not seeing life at all.

    It is like someone saying anyone could win a race if all things were equal. Well, not all things ARE equal. LOL And the sooner this is realized, the sooner actual problems get solved. That is unless all people want to do is dream.

    I liked your post though.

    (edited was adding the darn R to "you" making it YOUR... LOL I hate it when that happens.. LOL)

    [This message has been edited by shartley (edited 07-23-2001).]

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    thats one opinion. sounds like something from Confucius. I prefer the TAO myself. I cant really agree with all that. It seems like a gross overgeneralization. Not everyone is an empty materialistic monster that hates everybody.
    It's a great poem though. I'm in high school myself and think it's pretty good for one my peers. I'd change the ending though, it's not as powerful as the rest of the poem.

    -cybrllama

  23. #23
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    Sorry i had to post again, didn't read everyone's comments b4 posting.

    "Milk was the standard." -Webmaster

    Milk is still the most popular drink in the nation.

    Curt, i agree with you partially. We do live like kings, but he is saying we don't appreciate it.He's not literally talking about less nutrition. As cheesy as this is going to sound: its a metaphor. He says spend more but have less. He's not talking about being able to buy a cheese burger at midnight or your home entertainment system. He's talking about non-material things. If you enjoy all that stuff then great. That's what it is about. Enjoying what you have.
    Big red one, i agree more so with what you said. Not entirely though(as if two ppl would ever agree on anything entirely). Listen carefully im gonna tell you all the secret to life. LOL, im 17. Well in my extensive experience im come up with this.

    The key to life is knowing when to be satisfied.

    If you are always satisfied you aren't doing any good because you shouldn't be happy with everything, especially things like prejudice. However, as it seems is the case with out well spoken poet, you also shouldn't be dissatisfied with everything because you can't change it all and you will never be happy.It's finding the balance. It's always about some sort of happy medium isn't it? in everything we do it seems like we need to find the happy medium. It's the Goldilox principle. You remember, the pouridge...

    nastymag, every body has some sort of fault. It's not about addictions or anorexia, its about fighting it. Not everybody feels they need to live up to what society wants us to be. Everyone is different.

    Webmaster said it, poetry is all in how you interprate it. Glenn might not see it the same way we do. Also he can feel whatever he wants just as the rest of us can. Please dont feel im trying to tell anyone what or how to think, Im just telling you what and how I THINK.

    In closing my rant, Joey joe and sovereign had it on the tips of their tongues. Things are the way they are.

    Just Be.

    -cybrllama

  24. #24
    shartley Guest

    Smile

    Okay, most, least, more, or less? It is also about (dare I say it again?) “perception”.

    How about this saying (and it is one I live my life by… maybe I should make it part of my signature?):

    “The richest man is not the one who has the most, but the one who needs the least.”

    I don’t know who originally said it, but I LOVE it. Every time I WANT more, or feel I have LESS, I look at my family….My Wonderful Wife, Fantastic children (4 ranging from 1 year to 18… yes all STILL living at home. LOL) and the life we share.

    Yah, I know.. sappy… I will stop now. LOL

  25. #25
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    wow. i just sent this to all 724 members of my adres book. it basically sums up society. my parents talk about it a lot. its true. im sitting in my room, looking at all the crap i have that they didnt, and i realize i use each once once or twice a day. that was powerful stuff. a well written page my friend. thanks for the insight

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  26. #26
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    Shartley - I guess like most topics we can respond by pointing to each and every little detail made, but overall I think we do agree on the 'big' picture. That and I'm still half asleep...

    You do need real life experiences and like the scene in 'Good Will Hunting' - which by the way is one of my favorite movies - you have to have been there for certain things. Especially in the areas of life that concern humanity... Art, Love, Passion, Hate, Death, and Hunger. The list goes on...

    Keep in mind though, that Will himself in the movie was blinded by life 'experiences' that taught him to be bitter, distrusting of others... Cynical. Robin William's character in turn had to use his own lessons and experiences in life to give Matt's character a little helping hand. Just another side of the story.

    Thanks for your reply Shartley and by the way, wish you well on the little contest AGD's having! AGD PM Elite - Piece-Maker 2x. Has a valid meaning to those of us who know the story behind it and 'fancy' enough to sell.

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    [This message has been edited by Arturus (edited 07-23-2001).]

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    its not saying anything we dont already know...nor is it gonna make anyone pay any more notice to these things. the poem comes off as a complaint letter to society and no one cares. i mean...go turn on your tv right now and tell me the programming hasnt gotten progressively worse over the last few years. what about the radio or music? i havnt heard a new song/band(popular stuff that makes it onto tv or radio) i felt good about in a couple years..and im only 22!!! that aint right. and as for the tv? i woke up one day and it was full frontal nudity after 6pm, game shows glorifying infidelity..well, hell that and every other sitcom... and utter tripe on most of the other channels...or maybe im just angry. i need to play more paintball
    btw if your wondering about the nudity im in canada and yes they do that, if your also from canada and would like to catch this check out ..uhhh sexual century?? on either history or showcase midday weekends i believe(not sure how it is in the states)

  28. #28
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    Gee... do we always have to analyze, criticize and over-think this? I for one and glad to see the kid is thinking about things and writing about how he feels about them from his perspective. No matter the content or correctness. More power to him.

    PS: my Kid was chosen to be Published in Young Writers of America this year. For a poem he wrote. Proud of that boy.

  29. #29
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    wow.... very profound stuff... very nice...

  30. #30
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    There you go Cphilip, agree with you wholeheartedly.

    And congrats on your son's poem and writings. Should definately be proud of him.

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