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Thread: BlackVCG's ULT Thread

  1. #151
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Winthrop, MA
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    56
    Ya, I had to tighten the screw as tight as it can go, and it works. I feel like such an idiot for getting mad when it was sumthing so little. Ok, well thanks alot for helping me

  2. #152
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
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    San Jose, CA
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    151
    this may been asked already but i dont feel like searching fot it so bare wit me. Can the rt on/off assem fit in the Emag valve and shoot properly? The emag valve is not going to be used in the emag.

    thanks

  3. #153
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
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    bay area, CA
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    2,473
    Originally posted by SpdElemts
    this may been asked already but i dont feel like searching fot it so bare wit me. Can the rt on/off assem fit in the Emag valve and shoot properly? The emag valve is not going to be used in the emag.

    thanks
    yes, b/c an rt valve is an rt valve, and a ULT will work in any rt valve

    i got a question! will you get enough "reactiveness" for you to sweetspot on about an output of 800 psi?


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  4. #154
    Join Date
    May 2003
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    kentucky
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    376
    prolly not.
    "[T]he evidence also strongly suggests that neither Billy nor Adam could have invented what is claimed."

    -United States District Court judge G.M. King,
    on Smart Parts' patent claim, August 23rd, 2004, page 16.



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  5. #155
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Miami FL
    Posts
    71

    Exclamation Set up Help

    I have a classic mag, with x valve, stock trigger, ult, and a 68 4000 tank. What would be a good starting point shim wise in the level 10 and the ULT?

  6. #156
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    NYC
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    100

    Angry i have a major problem

    I just bought my ULT with my X-valve. When i put in the ULT it doesnt do anything. I can push the trigger all the way in but it doesnt do anything. Its not charging or anything. When i put the old on/off in it works fine. No leaks or anything. it works great without the ULT. I have a preset tank, a PMI 68/45, its full. i tried all the shims, 1 shim, no shims, everything. please help, this thing sucks. Very disappointed.
    I really need a Battery.....

    CHUFF CHUFF

  7. #157
    Got mine yesterday, it works good. But I have a few problems w/ it. 1st: the bolt sticks forward just slightly sometimes(no venting).2nd: should I have take the smaller white oring out w/ the old on/off. I did and it has no leaks i couldn't get enough shims in with that oring on. i believe i have 3 ULT shims. I also have lvl 10. 3rd: what is a good way to keep fomies in. The cost is adding up. I use super glue.

    Still short-stroking but i can get past that. It's in a minimag AIR valve. a new one if that makes a difference.

    Thanks,
    Shocker=spyder that shoots out it's butt

    -Minimag w/ lvl10 and ult
    black ule body
    black blade intelli
    fatty aci foregrip
    12" dye ultralite

  8. #158
    Join Date
    Oct 2000
    Location
    North Plains, OR
    Posts
    4,956
    There shouldn't be any other o-rings in the on/off other than the ones that are held in on the ULT assembly. The one at the base of the on/off, the one in the top that the pin seals on and the black one inside the two pieces.

    Bolt stick with ULT is usually a result of not enough shims or it not being broke in enough.

  9. #159
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Syracuse, NY
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    43
    How can I tell if I have a SS or aluminum valve without taking out the on/off?

  10. #160
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    162
    If your valve is anodized, it's aluminum.

  11. #161
    My ULT is acting up again. It has a small leak holding pressure against the bolt. So that is why it sticks. It doesnt stick so much anymore but it is shortstroking when it shouldn't. I cycle it fully and it short strokes every other shot because of the leak. I have tried all the shims, no shims, everything. The gun won't function w/ less than 2 in it. i have 3 now. 4 makes no difference. should I have ALL ULT and ALL lvl 10 I have left in. I believe that would be 8 shims.

    thanks,
    Jared

  12. #162
    Also, my on/off pin is very slow about coming out. I am using a PE 850psi preset.

  13. #163
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Newtown Square, PA
    Posts
    381
    Ok Jared I have a minimag AIR valve, ULT, and Lvl 10 too... and everything works with me.

    Here's what I did.. I would have to check, but I believe I have 2 Lvl 10 shims in the Lvl 10 setup (check your carrier size and be sure that its not leaking there). I have 4 ULT shims and 2 Lvl 10 shims in the ULT valve, and everything else is properly oiled and all. Try that setup if you havent already and see what happens...be sure to oil everything REALLY ridiculously in that ULT.

    What I've noticed (by the way I have a preset 850 too) with my ULT in this valve and with my air tanks is that the pin DOES come out slowly. The thing is, I have so many shims in that it doesnt matter--the pin shoots out far enough only because I have put effectively 8 ULT shims in. Putting extra shims in means shortening the essential length of the on/off pin, meaning it needs to return less distance each time, thus less short stroking. With no shims in, you have absolutely no hope of that pin returning to its initial position--the gun cant handle pushing it for that long of a time. If we were running an RT, it would push on that pin until it went back to its normal position...AIR valves dont do this.

    With your setup (even 4 ULT shims) you will STILL encounter this problem. So to counter this, make sure you have that pin oiled very very very well, make sure it slides in and out easily and freely, and put 4 ULT shims in and 2 Lvl 10 shims...if you find that its working better but not enough..put more in..just also make sure that the on/off assembly is screwed in tightly.

    FYI... 1 ULT shim is 1/2 the width of a Lvl 10 shim....so 2 ULT shims = 1 Lvl 10 shim
    MM19223 -=Minimag=-
    [Level-10]&[ULT]
    -Self Polished Body
    -Intelliframe nickel
    -Lapco SS 12 inch
    -KAPP Chrome gas thru-grip
    -32* Flame Drop Chrome
    -Black Macro
    -47ci 3000psi Crossfire tank
    My minimag-link working

    email: dr975@yahoo.com
    aim SN: drx975

  14. #164
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Dallas / college st., TEXAS
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    1,170
    Holy Shaith. I had a classic 68. then i got a x-valve and ult. intalled them at the same time and tried it out, my gun was acting out of breath, i'd get 1 or 2 shots off full power then it would just puff.

    i messed with my x forever to no avail, then i thought it might be ult so i put in the regular on/off and it worked kinda well, so i went lookin for a ult forum found this, and read some then realized i prolly need more shims in the ult and BAM!!@@#!@%#%!#%!#$^ it works like a charm, my gun is beast now! woot. 5 shims works great for me. GG ULT thread
    -fully upped mech mag (magzilla) www.havoc-online.com
    -upped 68 mag (class) My Feedback AIM = nate2k191
    -live in peace TK-
    AO-TX

  15. #165
    thanks drx975 that shim setup works great. everything is fine except the o-ring on top of the on/off leaks only sometimes. I'll just go pick a parts kit and fix that.

  16. #166
    Ok guys my gun will not even shoot now...it shoots once if I smack it with the palm of my hand on the back of the gun.I had six shims and there was way to much response, I have 5 shims in it now and it does not shoot. Its like the trigger rod does not have enough pressure or something, to make things worse a guy at my field said he could adjust the trigger rod and make it work so he did but it did not work so now that maybe messed up too.....please help.
    I'm running a me'lee 68ci. 3000 and I have the stock single trigger frame on.

  17. #167
    r u running in a classic, and by the way dont mess w/ the trigger rod.

  18. #168
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    West Coast
    Posts
    3,711
    Hey I just had my ULT cleaned up and tuned by my local pro shop. I decided to take her for a spin and video it. Here is a link to the video: CLICK HERE FOR MY ULT VIDEO

    That's my collection site, but just scroll down and you'll see the links for the video under my ULE Mag. I think the ULT is sweet, but it's way to fast for me. I'm looking to trade it for a stock On/Off for my X-valve and like $30. Also does anyone know if a classic on/off will work in a X-valve?

  19. #169
    I just have a few questions, I will be getting my RT mag from AGD in a few days with everything installed and tested by them, everything should work correctly, but if the ULT isn't how I would like it then I would probably have to add shims, right? If I am getting the Mag with the UTL already installed by them how many will be on the ULT and how many extras will I get, is it the same 2 on the ULT and 3 extras like when you get the ULT kit?


    Mag Owner #2

    Green / Black RT Pro:
    1. Evil Pipe Barrel 12" Green Tip | 2. Blade Trigger/Intelliframe
    3. X-Valve | 4. 32* Green Gel Grips
    5. Level 10 | 6. ULT (5 ULT Shims 1 Lvl 10 Shim)
    7. ULE Verticle Green Body | 8. Ricochet Apache
    9. Centerflag 68/4500 HPA Tank | 10. Dye 68ci HP Tank Cover
    11. Green Shocktech Stumpy Dropforward | 12. Shocktech on/off ASA
    13. Rogue Rail | 14. VA w/ Green CP Foregrip

  20. #170
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    kentucky
    Posts
    376
    Well, assuming that they actually tune and test it, Then there is no telling how many shims they may have on it. It seems that every mag is just a little different and just requires a little patience and some air to tune. Remember if you have level 10 shims, they are exactly double the thickness of one ULT and can be used in their place. Do you have an adjustable reg on your tank?

  21. #171
    Nope my tank is preset at 850 psi.

    So if they tune and test it at the factory, should I already have a great reactivity?

  22. #172
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    kentucky
    Posts
    376
    Well, Alot of your reactivity actually depends on your tank. Higher pressures often increase your reactivity.
    A ule trigger mod actually reduces your reactivity while making the trigger lighter. You have to just juggle the variables to find a set up that works for your marker.
    If your marker is set up and shooting, I would add ule shims until it went into run away and then back off one shim. I would then start turning the input pressure up to see if I could get better reactivity. I actually got mine to were the tension in my finger would allow the trigger to bounce. I got some VERY respectable rates of fire from that.

  23. #173
    Alright, thanks for the help.

  24. #174
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Sunshine Coast Australia
    Posts
    25
    I have set up my mini mag just as "drx975" described and it is working great.
    Im using a standard Minimag AIR valve, with a 6 hole mod in the back.
    850 PSI preset.
    LX bolt with 2 shims & medium spring.
    ULT with 4 standard shims & 2 LX shims.
    I found that is is easier to short stroke if you are not use to the trigger, but the lightness of the trigger pull is fantastic.

    cheers


    Ive allso had reports from friends using a standard valve with a hyperframe and the ULT works really well in the system.

  25. #175
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    455
    Do I remove the O-ring in my X-valve before installing the ULT?????

  26. #176
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    Marion, IN
    Posts
    1,855
    Originally posted by Mag89
    Do I remove the O-ring in my X-valve before installing the ULT?????
    If you're talking about the 2 in the bottom when you take the stock on/off assembly out, yes.

  27. #177
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    455
    Thanks man

  28. #178
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    543
    I have a few questions about this upgrade.

    first off, the shims. they go inbetween the double o-rings and the on/off assembly? I'm assuming thier job is to keep the pin from going in too far, thus keeping the recharge rate as high as possible, without "runaway" or leaking.
    so what they really do is lower the on/off assembly, which means the back of the sear hits the bottom of the on/off keeping the sear from pushing the pin in to far. if so, isn't the hardened steel sear hitting the bottom of the brass on/off everytime you pull the trigger?

    as for the new pin:
    I take it it has a new smaller diameter head and a smaller reduced diameter shaft? if so, what are the new measurements?
    I know the original RT pin is about .117" at the head and reduced shaft is about .078" in diameter.

    if anybody could answer these question I would definitely appreciate it.

    I'm working on an on/off design that would produce the same light trigger pull for a standard valve, but not adversely effect the recharge rate.
    ~E~

  29. #179
    The ULT on/off screws into two pieces (on/off top and bottom) the shims go in between where it screws together. the hardened steel sear touches the hole in your body and not the on/off so there is no harm there.
    What AGD did with this on/off is shave mass off so the air would have "less to grab and push down", that's the only way I can explain it. The head is just big enough to shut off air from the top and I don't know the measurements. It would be impossible to make one better. If it was they would have. You might be able to make one lighter but the reactivity would be killed, and you might also be able to make one more reactive but heavier. But not both, to my knowledge anyway.

    Hope this helps

  30. #180
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    543
    the shims make the on/off assembly longer. no matter where you put them. on top or in the middle. this means you using the bottom of the on off as a type of sear stop. to keep it from pushing the pin in farther than you want.

    the back of the sear has a "nub" that sticks up and that is the part that pushes the on/off pin in. this "nub" can and does go through the hole in the body. if you trigger pull allows it, it will go all the way up and "top out" on the bottom of the on/off assembly.

    if you read my post you will see that I understand what they did to make the trigger pull lighter. less dia on the top of the pin means less of a force factor, and less force created by the applied psi. now if the smaller bottom part of the pin has also been reduced from the original RT design(.072" actually, not .078") this means the initial part of a trigger pull will be very light.

    impossible to make one better? I'm not trying to. like I said, this ULT is not recommended for the standard or classic valve. the reason being the pressure on top of the on/off is not enough to make the pin reset the sear completely everytime and this can cause bolt and sear wear problems along with just plain not functioning properly.

    so like I said, I'm looking to design a version that would help the STANDARD valve. a lighter trigger pull without sacrificing too much on the recharge rate. I don't care about reactivity.
    this is why I'm looking for the measurements of the ULT pin. somebody, anybody with a ULT and some calipers.
    I want to know what to start with.

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