Patrons Official Movie Review: LoTR Trilogy

[Sir_Brass]

also, remember that they fought Uruk Hei, NOT orcs, at the battle for helms deep. Uruk Hei (sp?) are a mix between orc and goblin. they were stronger and basically far more brutal than your run-of-the-mill orcs and goblins. Get your enemies straight before you go bashing them.

Also, remember that the riders of Rohan are far more deadly on their steeds than they are in hand-to-hand. They trampled the orc army. if it had been on foot, then they would've been nearly wiped out. At the end, they were only fighting a delaying action. had they kept on, they would've been masacred.

ALSO, in the battle for helms deep, it was about 500 vs. 10,000. In RotK it was more like 6,000 vs. 20,00: slightly better odds, plus the battle field was far different.

Patron, I only got a kick out of your post in that it was so moronic-sounding. I'm sorry, but I loved the films and to see them so mercilessly bashed is an insult to the hard work Peter Jackson and crew did into making a book series into 3 movies. They did the best they could to make them good movies and also retain the essence of the books. I think they succeeded. You, on the other hand, don't seem to recognize high quality and an excellent story if it stood up and smacked you in the face.

Sorry for sounding mean and angry, but I am slightly more than a bit ticked about the utter bashing that Patron did to one of the finest movie trillogies ever produced.

[Chojin Man]

7. No hot chicks.
Having that many elves and no hot chicks is inexcusable. Shame on the tubby director for casting only quasi good looking women he thinks his chunky butt can score with. Add to that, shame on anyone for ever casting Liv "Shoulders of the Great Mountain Ox" Tyler in any role. Scratch that, she'd make a good Colossus.

Dude Liv is mad flossy yo! How can you say she is only 'quasi good looking'?

Most of your complaints are fixed in the books.

I was dissapointed in Gandolf too! I wanted to see him cast some wicked awesome lightning spells or something. Instead he only did that weak light trick.

Great review BTW.

[TraXeR]

Originally posted by Chojin Man


Dude Liv is mad flossy yo! How can you say she is only 'quasi good looking'?

Most of your complaints are fixed in the books.

I was dissapointed in Gandolf too! I wanted to see him cast some wicked awesome lightning spells or something. Instead he only did that weak light trick.

Great review BTW.

"Mad Flossy" that has to be the most hilarious term for "attractive" I've ever heard, LOL!

[Patron God of Pirates]

Well, this isn't half as brutal as I had expected. But I will respond none the less:

"Get your enemies straight before you go bashing them"

Good point. Uruk Hia are super wus bags. Based on the unimpeded charge of Aragorn and the king of Rohan on the dawn of the 5th day. You remember, when about 5 guys on horseback charged through about 100 Uruk Hia who looked like defenseless meat sacks. Or we could base it on the fact that an entire column of them was powerless to overcome Aragorn and the stupid Dwarf.


"They trampled the orc army. if it had been on foot, then they would've been nearly wiped out."

I doubt that. Maybe if it had been an army of girl scouts, or the elderly. Then the Orcs would have had a chance.

"Patron, I only got a kick out of your post in that it was so moronic-sounding." - "You, on the other hand, don't seem to recognize high quality and an excellent story if it stood up and smacked you in the face." - "Sorry for sounding mean and angry, but I am slightly more than a bit ticked about the utter bashing that Patron did to one of the finest movie trilogies ever produced."

Clearly you haven't seen the Carnasaur trillogy. :) I'm not offended. While there is a good deal of jest in my posts, I mean what I say. In the end the story is just too fantastical. If you're not drinking the Tolkster kool-aid, and you watch the series objectively, It becomes a "Oh lord, what now!?" kind of experience. Everything is over dramatized and over done.

The biggest problem with the entire story is that it has no tangible primary antagonist. Just a series of mid level bad guys. Suaron himself only seems menacing because we keep getting told he's menacing. But he never actually does anything. In "great stories" you really hate the antagonist.

As to not recognizing a great story if it smacked me in my face, I will only say that nothing great ever smacked me in my face. Part of the official definition of greatness is never smacking me at all... ever.

"Dude Liv is mad flossy yo!"

I would agree with you, but I'm not an Ettin, or a Cyclops. Every time I see Liv Tyler I think I'm watching Attack of the Fifty Foot Woman. Have you seen the shoulders on that behemoth!? No way should she be wearing elegant elven dresses. She should be wearing a red flannel, holding a wood axe, and traveling with a blue ox. If I ever find Liv Tyler attractive I'm going to have a sexual identity crisis.

[Thordic]

Couple things.

First off, the calvary charge absolutely destroying the orcs is accurate. The Riders would effecitively be medium calvary, and NOTHING is going to stand up to 6,000 medium calvary. Those 6,000 troops are worth at least 18,000 infantry. If Theoden had been able to get the 12,000+ men he was expecting, the battle would have been over in a heartbeat.

Didn't you ever see braveheart? They had a large army, and were afraid of 200 heavy calvary. Thats how warfare works. Horses are a huge advantage. I'd love to see try to stare down a calvary charge.

Uruk's in the book were in existence for 500 years in Mordor, they were just a stronger breed of orc. Why Jackson had Saruman "create" them is beyond me, in the book he breed men with orcs. No matter what Jackson did though, the troops at Helms Deep were stronger than those at Pellenor. Barring the many trolls (Not ogres, PGOP, ogres don't exist in Middle Earth), the army at Pellenor wasn't anything special. Orcs arent really any better fighters than human soldiers.

Personally, I want Jackson to do the Hobbit as a single movie. I WANT THE BATTLE OF FIVE ARMIES DAMNIT!

[1stdeadeye]

Originally posted by Patron God of Pirates
"Dude Liv is mad flossy yo!"

I would agree with you, but I'm not an Ettin, or a Cyclops. Every time I see Liv Tyler I think I'm watching Attack of the Fifty Foot Woman. Have you seen the shoulders on that behemoth!? No way should she be wearing elegant elven dresses. She should be wearing a red flannel, holding a wood axe, and traveling with a blue ox. If I ever find Liv Tyler attractive I'm going to have a sexual identity crisis.

ROFL!!!!!

I can't look at Liv Tyler as sexy either. She is Steve Tyler's daughter for god sakes! Eesh. Creepy!

[Patron God of Pirates]

I don't know how I got dragged into the argument over the accuracy of the war elements. I think it stems from my "Orcs are wus bags" point. Well, I didn't come to that conclusion based on Either one of the great battles. Orcs being wus bags happens throughout all three films. It's just a fact.

So let me wash my hands of the war thing. Aside from a few instances involving the main heroes, the war elements were well done and accurate. I mean, as far as I know. I have no historical reference to the effect of super elephants on mounted cavalry.

Nobody wants to talk about the gross mismanagement of resources involving and invincible spectral army? No, there's really no valid argument there. Instead lets attack me for misspellings and calling trolls ogres. :P

As to me staring down a medium cavalry, no problem... In my car. :P

[lopxtc]

As for the Army of the Undead ... in the books Aragorn knew of this army long before he got to the paths of the dead.

The problem lies in that up until he actually walked the path he was still uncertain about taking his position as the king of men. Like it was said in the book and movie ... the only person who could control the undead army was the king himself. Aragorn didnt feel ready to take that position, and no one else in the world could have controlled the army.

After the battle Gimli even states (para-phrased) ... Dont let them go, lets use them to finish the fight. Instead Aragorn knows that they full-filled their oath from many years ago and now he needs to full-fill his oath and release them from their fate. Not only because he is a man of his word, but they just saw what this army could do ... would you not live up to your word?

This is why the army wasnt called on or used till much later, Aragorn had to believe in himself that he was in fact the king and then ready to take his place in that role.

So if you want to call this arguement invalid, I suggest you read the books instead of just seeing the movie.

Aaron

[Patron God of Pirates]

Seeing as I'm not reviewing the books......

I will add Aragorn to my list of wus bags.

"I'll just let thousands of people die needlessly becuase I don't feel like being king right now"

It makes no sense.

[shartley]

[lopxtc]

As for some of your other points ...

-- Time anomalies ...
In the book Gondor is described as being on the door step of Mordor ... even when you look at the maps being splashed all over the screen you can see how close they are. Seeing as how the army is already assembled is not hard to believe that they could be made ready to ride again. You also need to remember that they marched to the black gate knowing that they would die ... the whole idea was simply to draw the eye of Sauron to them and away from the hobbits. In the book Gandalf uses the palantir to give Sauron an idea that they are massing their army for an assualt, not a delaying action.

-- We need a guide ...
Again read the book ... They could not find their way through Mordor due to the way the land is enchanted I guess you could say. The ring doesnt want them getting to Mt. Doom and neither does the land itself ... both are working against them. Sauron had no clue that Gollum would come along to help them find their way through the land. Again leading us to the line when Gandalf says to Frodo that he wonders if Gollum has yet a part to play in the whole war.

-- Mighty wizard ...
Argh ... read the book ... During the whole battle of Gondor and Minas Tirith he only ever casts the one spell on the fields of pelennor ... and that is the light spell that he casts. He knows that the ring wraiths cannot stand sunlight, and since at this time the whole field is bathed in darkness and smoke, etc ... he casts a spell that is basically intese focused sun-light to drive off the ring wraith. Also in the book it is mentioned that he is an excellent fighter also and does do some HTH combat. Remember he is several ages old and has had the time to learn to fight.

-- Elf's as Ninjas ...
Lets see, only Legolas is ever shown displaying this better then bruce lee fighting style ... other then that, the elves only fight with bow and pole-arms ... While I do agree it was over the top, legolas is described in the book as fighter of great skill and daring. Jackson just chose to display this is a way that probably wasnt thought of when Tolkein originally wrote the novels.

-- No real bad-guy ...
Unfortunately we dont see the real evil that is Saruman .. his power isnt a direct power, but an in-direct power. He seeks to control people and use them to his will and not directly oppose someone. He doesnt see that he is just a pawn of Sauron's till much later. His real evil comes when he is disposed of Sauron and attempts to strike back the only way he can ... by attempting to destroy/enslave the creatures that caused him to fall, the hobbits.
Both bad-guys are powerful, but both are also arrogant as is described in the book. Both underestimate their opponents and strike with everything they have when they think they can win. In the case of Sauron he was smart enough to amass a bigger force and keep some in reserve should he fail the first time. Saruman did not, and was then taken by surprise when not only does his army fail ... but he is then attacked by an army he didnt expect. Typical military blunder (remember Tolkein was in the military and had some experience with this). You also need to remember that the impact of Sauron had been being felt for a long time ... the movie makes it seem like he has just come back into power, when in reality (aka the books) he has been building back up for some time and had been terrorizing the land for many years.

Aaron

[lopxtc]

You mean much along the lines of "Lets let thousands, possible millions of people die, because we dont feel like getting involved since its not our soil they are fighting on?" ... does that sound familiar ... but that couldnt possible make sense could it?

Aragorn believed that the war could be won without him taking the place as King. He doesnt even consider becoming king until he realizes that he needs to in-order to ensure victory. He believes up till then that the battle can be won, and that the hobbits can finish their tasks. Only when that becomes clouded does he realize that he needs to put aside his fears of the past and his bloodlines past and do what he needs to do at this moment to help win the war. Its not that he doesnt want to be king, he is afraid that he will fail as he ancestor did and possible sealing the fate of all the people with this action.

Aaron

Originally posted by Patron God of Pirates
Seeing as I'm not reviewing the books......

I will add Aragorn to my list of wus bags.

"I'll just let thousands of people die needlessly becuase I don't feel like being king right now"

It makes no sense.

[Thordic]

Just a note on two characters:

Gandalf

For some reason people seem to think he is human. He is most definitely not. Gandalf, along with Saruman and Sauron, are members of a race known as they Ainur, which had two branches, the Valar, who became the gods of Middle Earth, and the Maiar, a "lesser bloodline", so to speak, of which Gandalf and the others come from. He is a "little brother" to the gods, and very far from human. Besides his wizardly powers, he is also an accomplished fighter (his sword is one of the more potent magical blades in Middle Earth).

Legolas

First off, I think they cheesed him up in the movie. Does anyone remember the final kill tallies for Gimli and Legolas in the book? I think it was fairly close...

In any case, the Fellowship was made up of some of the most powerful and experienced fighters available in Middle Earth. Gimli and Legolas aren't supposed to be typical of elves or dwarves.

And as for Legolas's ninja skills, he isn't of the same line of elves as all the other elves in the movie. All the elves in the movie are Silvan Elves (The ones from Rivendell and such), while Legolas is one of the Sindar, a different line of elves entirely. (They are the elves who fought in the battle of five armies) Perhaps the Sindar are a more powerful line, or some such.

I still think they cheesed up Legolas too much. And yes, it would have been nice to see Gandalf tossing some fire or lightning. But in any case, the movies were still well done, and I don't really have any complaints.

[Patron God of Pirates]

Originally posted by shartley

Thanks. I try to avoid this place becuase it cuases me to spend way to much money. I love the people here, but geez. I added it back to my favorites last week and I allready have about $1500 worth of projects in mind.

Speeking of that... So if I got a slug body and flatened the sides and top, then had it tapped for small mounting screws, think you could cook up a wooden mainbody pannel (peferably wrap around for duability reasons) to match the ultra slick Z-Grips you made for me?

This project is awhile out since I've allready got my mind set on getting nicad's Karta body for my E-Mag. I also still plan on having the extended grip ready gas through I told you abou way back made.

You see. This is an expensive place to hang out. :)

[Patron God of Pirates]

Originally posted by lopxtc
Aragorn believed that the war could be won without him taking the place as King. He doesnt even consider becoming king until he realizes that he needs to in-order to ensure victory. He believes up till then that the battle can be won, and that the hobbits can finish their tasks. Only when that becomes clouded does he realize that he needs to put aside his fears of the past and his bloodlines past and do what he needs to do at this moment to help win the war. Its not that he doesnt want to be king, he is afraid that he will fail as he ancestor did and possible sealing the fate of all the people with this action.

Aaron

Well done. Point conceded.