Smart Parts Patent Will Destroy Paintball! - Read!

[bryceeden]

Originally posted by jinxed


So Bill Gardner is being "very open about the patent".

But then DOES NOT EXPLAIN WHY HE IS SUING ICD AND WDP.
SO THIS IS LIE #1

Then it completely contradicts the statement from SPESH.
SO ThIS IS LIE #2.

So until SP comes forward and actually tells us what there intentions are, then I have to assume they are going to contunue to lie to us.

So, in a way you helped confirm the worst for us!!

Nick

[icegod]

Just another thought on some possibilities....... people are also failing to see some of the OTHER affects such as smart parts europe, international patents, and possible international affects that this *could* have, granted that is a BROAD look, but so is their patent, and this isnt really just a US matter, for now it is with ICD, but after ICD, it quiet possibly be an international ordeal.


I know its thinking a little *TOO* far ahead but in reality, everything about this is going fast, so it could be one day this next day the world (not literally but ya get the point)

Just some "food for thought" or however that saying goes.

[icegod]

Originally posted by jinxed


Well.
The Kingman Spyder is a NEAR EXACT COPY of the ICD Promaster.
The ICD Promaster was loosely based on the Sheridan PMI3, which was not patented to "encourage the market to produce aftermarket parts". (only the PMI3 detent is patented).
The PMI3 itself was loosely based on the "Enforcer Semi" designed by Chauncey of CooperT-.

How does this relate to the SMart Parts case?
Someone in 2002 just patented the generic stacked-tube blowback!!!! 12 years after the PMI-3.HERE IS THE LINK

This fact alone proves that the patent system is a compelete waste. How could the patent office grant that patent?
But they did, which partially explains how they awarded SmartParts its ridiculous patents..

Nick

Nice point on the patent system, also, not just kingman look at ALL of the stacked-tube clones out there. EVERYONE of them has an electro - 32*, m3, and all those little no name ones. Those clones are the most common and popular marker on the entire paintball scene as a whole. When releasing electro's around 100 bucks they sell thousands on end and that will kill ALOT of business's if they are allowed to control a patent over the entire electro market, which their revisions and patents out there claim.

[manike]

Why I don't think SP will stop at just ICD and WDP

2 years ago SP sent out notices of possible infringement to EVERY electronic gun manufacturer offering to work out a deal. That includes ICD, BL, AGD, WDP and Kingman, as far as I am aware it was to everyone.

No-one took them seriously or thought they had valid claims so nothing was done and no deals made.

Then SP start out by going after ICD.

The very fact 2 years ago they though they had a case against all electro gun manufacturers leads me to think they will not stop after ICD or WDP now that they think their case is stronger and they have more patents granted.

[slushee]

Assuming, of coarse, that these notices were actually sent out (again, proof?)

One would wonder, was no research into these patents done 2 years ago?

If 2 years ago, the claim was dismissed, how can things have changed in 2 years?

What would SP have gained by sitting on their hands for 2 years .. when nothing would change the facts in the matter .. therefore, their case would be just as strong (or lack thereof) as 2 years ago.

Is there any documentation regarding your claim that SP was/is "going after ICD."

Believe me, I am in no way 'sticking up' for SP .. I am just trying to curb any 'flying off the handle' before we can even assertain that SP plans on doing anything with these patents .. I mean, they've had 2 years already and not a peep out of them regarding any lawsuits (that I am aware of)

[-Carnifex-]

I've got an idea, how about we let the companies being sued handle this?

[manike]

Originally posted by -Carnifex-
I've got an idea, how about we let the companies being sued handle this?

If you saw someone being mugged would you stand there and watch or go to their assistance?

[jinxed]

Originally posted by -Carnifex-
I've got an idea, how about we let the companies being sued handle this?

OK-
Smart Parts
Huge Company
Lots of Money
Owned by corrupt patent lawyers

vs

ICD
Small Company
Owner is in hospital
Daughter running the shop
Lawyers paid out of pocket (or even probono).

So, not exactly a fair fight and ICD -has asked for help-

-NIck

[Ov3rmind]

Originally posted by slushee
Assuming, of coarse, that these notices were actually sent out (again, proof?)

Could someone provide proof?

One would wonder, was no research into these patents done 2 years ago?

I'm sure it was, it's just no one thought SP would act on them.

If 2 years ago, the claim was dismissed, how can things have changed in 2 years?

Companies are bigger, SP can get a bigger chunk of the pie now.

What would SP have gained by sitting on their hands for 2 years .. when nothing would change the facts in the matter .. therefore, their case would be just as strong (or lack thereof) as 2 years ago.

Check what I said last.

Is there any documentation regarding your claim that SP was/is "going after ICD."

I guess we'll see on Sept. 3.

Believe me, I am in no way 'sticking up' for SP .. I am just trying to curb any 'flying off the handle' before we can even assertain that SP plans on doing anything with these patents .. I mean, they've had 2 years already and not a peep out of them regarding any lawsuits (that I am aware of)

That's understandable, it's hard to acurately speculate right now.

[manike]

Assuming, of coarse, that these notices were actually sent out (again, proof?)

Ask any of the e-gun manufacturers. I think you may also be able to find it via a search because it was discussed at the time (you may get lost in all the current stuff though)

One would wonder, was no research into these patents done 2 years ago?

yes, but the patents cited then seemed to tight and didn't relate to many of the e-guns out there. Also people looked at the prior art and didn't take SP too seriously

If 2 years ago, the claim was dismissed, how can things have changed in 2 years?

I don't think it was dismissed. I'm not certain what happened but I think SP drew it out until they got new broader patents granted, and then went back at ICD using the new patents

What would SP have gained by sitting on their hands for 2 years .. when nothing would change the facts in the matter .. therefore, their case would be just as strong (or lack thereof) as 2 years ago.

They got broader patent claims which makes it easier to go after the e-gun companies. I think they have had at least 2 patents granted since then. They also have 2 or 3 more in the pending stages

Is there any documentation regarding your claim that SP was/is "going after ICD."

? apart from the Court cases, SP's e-mails, letters to all the e-gun companies, people talking to ICD and SP, and people being deposed to give evidence in the case?... nah not much

Believe me, I am in no way 'sticking up' for SP .. I am just trying to curb any 'flying off the handle' before we can even assertain that SP plans on doing anything with these patents .. I mean, they've had 2 years already and not a peep out of them regarding any lawsuits (that I am aware of)

They have been busy during those 2 years, the case has been on going (law takes a long time) and they have been working on new patents and new claims. The 'peep' is happening now.

[slushee]

WoW


Thanks manike and Ov3rmind! We all will benifit with that info.

Do you have a link to the court proceedings on that suit against ICD?

[toolfan62]

Originally posted by manike


If you saw someone being mugged would you stand there and watch or go to their assistance?

hmmmm,i would watch,especially if the guy had a gun

[manike]

Originally posted by toolfan62
hmmmm,i would watch,especially if the guy had a gun

Would it make a difference if the gun was electronic or mechanical???

[askman]

I wanted to add some information about patent law. lot of misinformation flyiing around here.

US patent is only good for US. most country have their own patent office, and europe has one for the EU. There is 1 year grace period in US for filing patent after making the information public. In europe, once the information is public, you cannot file patent.(no grace period) Patent must be filed in each country.


You can file a patent on anything not already patented. It cannot be obvious. Now, if another person can prove prior art(that the patent idea was already being used) before the filing date, the patent will get thrown out. Because of this, if it is too broad, it has greater chance of being voided. this usually takes a court action.

For example, you could possibly patent how the trigger set off the electrical switch in paintball marker. They can even cover using variety of switches including contact, opto and magnetic. (I don't know if that is what SP did as i have not read their patent) There is trick to writing a good patent. cover as much as possible, but not make it so broad. Another example. Usuing battery for electronic trigger system is probably not patentable. anything electronic by default use battery, so it is obvious. Of course, using windup capacitive discharge system to power it, might be patentable.

I am not a lawyer, but I had a seminar on patent, when I filed for mine. (work for fortune 500 company in r&d)

Hope this helps clear some stuff up...

[pputkowski]

Ghetto-reasoning for all of this: