Glenn Palmer investigates paintball death

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  • Rope a Dope
    Hug me, I squeak!
    • Oct 2003
    • 407

    #1

    Glenn Palmer investigates paintball death

    Source: http://www.sacpaintball.com/cgi-bin/...823431&start=0



    Since there seems to be a bit of misinformation and mystery floating about with regard to Colete Contois' death and the accident, I hope some of the following information helps clear it up. I have talked to the Contois family, mostly through a mutual friend, this is what I learned:

    The Contois family decided to take their son to play paintball for his 10th birthday party. After a day of paintball at a comercial field, the accident occurred at the end of the day as everyone was preparing to leave. Apparently the boy who's tank malfunctioned was not associated with the birthday party and the family does not know him. He was a walk-on who owned his own equipment and was 15 or 16 (I've heard both). The people attending the birthday party rented their gear from ROA paintball, where they played.

    I have also been in contact with Glenn Palmer, who is helping out with the ASTM safety committee investigation. Here is what he had to say about his inspection of the equipment and sheriff's photos:
    'The only thing that I saw wrong with any of the hardware was: There were no signs that the valve had been tightened sufficiently into the tank and there was no sign of chemical bonding materials having been used at the last installation of the valve. However, the Safety vent hole in valve neck was plugged with an unknown substance.

    Another contributing factor was that the anti-siphon tube was installed in such a way as to require that the tank/valve be tightened fully into the ASA to put the tube in the appropriate position.

    IMHO, the hardware itself is not the issue but the handling of it is.
    Apparently, the complete rig was bought off of the internet. As is.
    Sheriff's dept. investigation not yet complete and there has bee no word about who may have done the anti-siphon modification.

    That's about all I have on it at this time.'

    As you can see ROA did not own the equipment nor sell or install the tank or valve, as many have claimed, as it was purchased from the internet. So please don't call for them to be prosecuted as many here have.

    What exactly will unfold from this incident is still unknown, and only time will tell.


    I don't know how many times I have said that DOT does not recomend loctite and if the valve was properly installed this would not have happened. And if it did happen there is a bleed hole on the valve and the only way the tank could shoot off is if that hole was plugged.

    But I still got "Shoulda used Loctite!! duuhhhuurr!! The hole on the ASA would do nothing to prevent this Duuurrhhuuurrr!!!!"

    Asshats.

    Also quote from Tom:

    Originally posted by AGD


    Lock tight IS NOT suposed to be used on tank threads, they are suposed to be TORQUED on with a special strap wrench.

    Original thread: http://www.automags.org/forums/showt...0&pagenumber=1
    Last edited by Rope a Dope; 02-27-2004, 12:29 AM.

    www.ValleyThunder.com
  • edweird
    IP lawsuits > innovation
    • Dec 2001
    • 1859

    #2
    Glenn is superb ppl for investigating this... whoever did the shoddy maintance on this bottle should take a long hard look at them selves...

    and I think we all need to to take a long hard look at buying stuff as is from the internet and not having it checked out by a reputible airsmith

    AFTICA 4 Life! the low rent (unsponsored) AGD team at IAO
    Team Sandbaggers: 2k4 Texball Champs of the world!

    SFL Emag
    RTP abomination
    Sydarm + scenario project VM-68 to be featured later.

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    • toolfan62
      Registered User
      • Apr 2003
      • 436

      #3
      ...asshats...

      Comment

      • QUINCYMASSGUY
        Registered User
        • Dec 2002
        • 914

        #4
        tank

        Whoever set the tank up like that, especially if they are professional servicers of paintball gear, should be held to civil and possibly criminal penalties.
        Feedback: http://www.automags.org/forums/showt...hreadid=105565
        Feedback on EBAY under QUINCYMASSGUY
        Good traders: paintcatcher, a few others

        Comment

        • Kevmaster
          Owners Group Div: Director
          • Oct 2001
          • 5475

          #5
          i'll totally disagree with tom here on this, but i guess thats me. However, our arguement is neither here nor there...

          good work glenn....

          Comment

          • QUINCYMASSGUY
            Registered User
            • Dec 2002
            • 914

            #6
            Kevin, maybe it was a little harsh, I guess unless it was truly negligent work with the full intent of it overriding all safety measures done by someone who knew exactly what they were doing should it then be criminal. It was an accident, but imagine how the family must feel and the economic hardships they may be encountering, they deserve to be comped in some fashion and whoever was responsible for the clearly faulty gear should be the one to compensate it.

            And I do think Glen is a standup guy for helping to identify what happened and how to help prevent it from ever happening again.
            Feedback: http://www.automags.org/forums/showt...hreadid=105565
            Feedback on EBAY under QUINCYMASSGUY
            Good traders: paintcatcher, a few others

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            • Rope a Dope
              Hug me, I squeak!
              • Oct 2003
              • 407

              #7
              You'll be disagreeing with Tom, who invented things such as HPA for paintball and the entire Department Of Transportation (DOT).

              If ya torque the valve on properly with the proper tools it won't un-screw with human hands, let alone the hands of a kid... I am pretty sure when that Co2 tank came from the factory it was torqued on to the proper foot pounds.

              Plus theses kids need to learn how to connect and disconnect a pin valved tank. Such as not screwing it in ALL the way to the ASA but only a half turn once the pin enguages (although for his anti siphon he had to, another mistake by the installer) and when you disconnect it you give the tank one full turn and shoot out the remaining air.

              Really sad... the kid who owned the tank and the person who installed the tank didn't posses a shred of comon sense, so.. a mother dies in front of her son who will be messed up for the rest of his life since it was at an event for HIM and will be reminded of that every birthday, and as a sport, paintball will have to start all over in getting it's good rep as being a safe sport.

              www.ValleyThunder.com

              Comment

              • Mag_SEAL-6

                #8
                My friend and I saw the pics of the tanks' anti-syphon on the news and discussed the matter. We thought it looked like a ghetto home job and the kid obviously screwed the tank on with insufficient force.

                The kid also must have not been paying attention when the entire tank began unthreading from the valve. You can't really blame it on the kid, but he should've been paying a little closer attention.

                The local news last night said that there was another case in June 03 up in washington. A 17 year old kid was degassing his gun and the CO2 tank shot off and cracked him between the eyes. He died 5 days later in the hospital.

                Comment

                • Muzikman
                  Everything AGD
                  • Dec 2000
                  • 6229

                  #9
                  Rope, I think you are getting CO2 and HPA tanks confused. Everything I ever read and or seen, you use blue lock-tite on CO2 tanks. This is also even the case with some HPA screw-ins. The idea is you do not use a lot.

                  Comment

                  • Rope a Dope
                    Hug me, I squeak!
                    • Oct 2003
                    • 407

                    #10
                    Originally posted by Muzikman
                    Rope, I think you are getting CO2 and HPA tanks confused. Everything I ever read and or seen, you use blue lock-tite on CO2 tanks. This is also even the case with some HPA screw-ins. The idea is you do not use a lot.
                    No, I know the difference. I work at a paintball shop and I'm versed in the DOT regulations because if something bad happens I wanna cover my caboose by proving I followed DOT procedure. You do NOT put loctite on Co2 tanks.

                    Putting a tiny bit won't harm anything, if you torgue the valve on correctly you don't need any, I guess if you don't have the proper tools then loctite would be somewhat safer...

                    www.ValleyThunder.com

                    Comment

                    • Wat
                      Registered User
                      • Jan 2002
                      • 105

                      #11
                      Originally posted by Rope a Dope
                      I guess if you don't have the proper tools then loctite would be somewhat safer...
                      I say if you don't have the proper tools, you shouldn't be working on pressure vessels at all.

                      Comment

                      • trains are bad
                        Registered User
                        • Oct 2003
                        • 1751

                        #12
                        I use a little loctite ABOVE the safety bleed hole thing. I also tighten my tank into the ASA all the way, otherwise they shift around too much.
                        TRB's feedback

                        Comment

                        • -=Squid=-

                          #13
                          There is a difference between loc-titing an HPA tank and loc-titing a CO2 tank. Co2 tanks are supposed to be loc-tited, and I believe the reason is because they are not under as high of a pressure as HPA.

                          Comment

                          • hitech
                            Not a shedder of vortices
                            • Nov 2001
                            • 4775

                            #14
                            BTW, the reason you are not supposed to use loctite is that it can damage the threads when the valve is removed. This can cause the tank to fail a visual inspection. Or worse, fail a hydro. I guess if you never remove the valve, loctite won't hurt.


                            Hey Hitech your starting to sound like me! - AGD
                            Hitech is the man.... :eek: - Blennidae
                            The only Hitech Lubricant

                            Comment

                            • gtrsi
                              Automag?
                              • Dec 2001
                              • 5786

                              #15
                              here is what you guys are missing

                              These kids were tech'ing RENTALS! its not like they were working on thier own guns. Renters should never take the rental gear apart, that service is part of the rental fee they pay when walking in the door!
                              FOR SALE
                              on/off, sear, PROConnect
                              AGD back bottle asa, laser logo

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