My idea (or half idea) for a closed bolt automag

[Nomad]

The only advantage of a mag close bolt I could really think of is noise reduction. I have yet to see an open bolt marker that that's quiet (with the exception of electros).

However most close bolts I've ever fired are surprisingly quiet (again, cept for maybe the AT85).

That's my useless .00002 cents.

[InvisibleBill]

Hehehe...Mass? Go fire a m98 as fast as you can. The thing climbs. Now, having a gun climb isn't that bad, you just compensate for the rise. The main reason I would like a closed bolt mag is because it would be a bit more accurate. Now if any one tells me theres no difference between open and closed, go shoot a m98 or procarbine with out a hopper, then shoot an autococker. me and my friend did a little test, since so many people say that the 98 has massive amounts of air going in to the hopper. we stacked balls into the elbow of each gun (a m98 and a procarbine) and fired. Each time the balls jumped up a bit. We haven't done this with an autococker, since no-one that I know in Bend has an autococker, but I have heard that there is no "ball bounce", so if any one does try this, I would love to know the results. Ah, well, if any of you people would help me with my design delimma (did I spell that right? probably not), That would be real cool. Thanks, IB.

[Gambit22]

Oh, Jesus. That's his proof.

Have you ever thought that perhaps the reason why the Cocker doesn't jump as much is because it uses a ram to recock rather than an unregulated burst of air?And that the blowback burst is normally around 800 psi, compared to 100 psi? Cockers DO have blowback, violent blowback if they are mistimed.

[Kweasi]

As for the claim that closed bolt marker as quieter- that may be a trend but it's certainly not a rule.

A well tuned Matrix is possibly the questest marker on the feild, anywhere, ever. It's a very bold claim, and not one that I have the means to varify, so I have to ask that you "just trust me".

Anyway, it's an open bolt.

-Kweasi

[Gambit22]

Well, that may be a byproduct of another overused term: low pressure. I don't think the gas would make quite the same bang at the end of a barrel as if it used higher pressure.

[thei3ug]

Originally posted by Gambit22
Well, that may be a byproduct of another overused term: low pressure. I don't think the gas would make quite the same bang at the end of a barrel as if it used higher pressure.

Doesn't matter, he still countered your statement.

You do understand why you shouldn't be allowed to say "A = B" and if someone said "not if A is one and B is two" you said "well it shouldn't count then."

This really is a horrible argument for both sides, especially considering so many exceptions apply to every "rule" of open bolt and closed bolt comparasins.

It's all in the gun...

[Gambit22]

Uh...which statement of mine exactly did he counter? I simply hypothesized on the reason why the Matrix may make less noise.

[Kweasi]

Let's keep it Blue gentlemen....

The point of by previous post is supported by what both of you say. That is, "quiet" is not something that can be attributed to bolt operation, there are other, WAY more important factors. Like valve dwell, and operating pressure.

-Kweasi

[Gambit22]

I don't think that bolt operation affects much of anything. In an Autococker a hammer still strikers the valve, and it still uses a Sheridan system to release gases through the bolt. Like I said previously, the only think that really separates it from a JABB is the method of recocking via a ram.

[chris99506]

blazers and cocker's are closed bolt and that's why they shoot so straight and far

[Have Blue]

Cockers and Blazers shoot straight and far - that I will give you. However, they shoot no straighter and no farther than any other gun, closed bolt or not. There are no closed bolt pixies that gently carry your ball through the atmosphere - the ball doesn't care what sort of gun it was launched from. Clamp down a cocker next to a mag and you'll see that there is no discernable difference in how the ball flies.

[Kweasi]

Nuh-uh!

My pro-shop owner, Jub-Jub, says that cockers can shoot all the way across the feild at 50fps, but mags only go straight for 20ft then suddenly drop no matter how fast you shoot. Unless you have a boomstick. And a really expensive tank.

-Kweasi

[Gambit22]

I think that was MuffinButt, I don't know a Jub-Jub.

[thei3ug]

i have a HUGE muffin butt.

[chris99506]

i have a stock class phantom (which is closed bolt) with an all american barrel and an old spyder compact that i use as a backup for my RT, the spyder has an All American barrel the same length as the one on my phantom pump. my phantom shoots further and straighter than my spyder or my rt, i'm not saying it's way way better but it is noticeable.