Distance

[sirmagalot]

a lot of people seem to be telling me that the type of gun you have matters when it comes to distance (even people on various teams). I would think that because of physics that if the ball leaves any gun at the same velocity and direction that it will go the same distance. Am I right, and if so, are there any studys to prove it?

[sniper1rfa]

you are right, there is definately no difference. Unless, of course, we are talking about a smarty parts gun, which of course defies the laws of motion, which SP conveniently patented... :)

[spydervenom]

exactamundo!

[sirmagalot]

they were tryin to say that since some guns operate at a higher pressure, it distorts the ball more and makes it less accurate. Is this true?

[FooTemps]

high pressure means nothing... bolt pressure is where it's at. Not to mention it affects nothing since the ball will be distorted due to accelleration

[Miscue]

Originally posted by sirmagalot
they were tryin to say that since some guns operate at a higher pressure, it distorts the ball more and makes it less accurate. Is this true?

No. First of all, operation pressure is not directly related with pressure behind the ball. And, the ball does not distort out of the barrel.

[PyRo]

Well there are exceptions :)
Z-body, and flatlines will increase your range by putting backspin on the ball, but it will probably be moving too slowly to break if it hit a damn nail by the time it gets beyond the range of a normal gun. Not sure if there are any others.

[spydervenom]

the WERM undertow bolts are supposed to direct airflow more towards the bottom of the ball giving it a slight backspin.

i dont know how good of an idea this is or not but WERM's got a good point on it improving accuracy.

[Kevmaster]

yep

the Flatline barrel system and the Z-Body on the mag ar the only two systems that do ANYTHING to make the ball go further. Jimmys cocker will shoot no further than your Mag nor Timmys Talon if they're all shooting the same speed from the same height...Newton came up with this concept years ago

[LaW]

Originally posted by Kevmaster
yep

the Flatline barrel system and the Z-Body on the mag ar the only two systems that do ANYTHING to make the ball go further. Jimmys cocker will shoot no further than your Mag nor Timmys Talon if they're all shooting the same speed from the same height...Newton came up with this concept years ago

Also keep in mind that for the Z-body to do anything it must be using a large bore barrel with small bore paint or else its pretty much worthless.

[rdb123]

I'm sure there has been a study done, but look over my calculations and I hope you'll pretty much understand that all guns fire the same distance under identical conditions.

So, alright here we go, a quick physics lesson:

Two objects dropped at the same height drop at the exact same rate (9.8 meters per second). Also, after the ball leaves the barrel of the gun, there is no more force acting on it in the X direction.

Therefore, we can surmise this for a paintball shot directly parallel to the horizon from 1.5 meters up:

Using one of the kinematic equations for displacement, Delta(Y) = (acceleration)(time^2)/2 we have -1.5 meters = (-9.8 m/s)(time^2)/2.

-1.5/-9.8 = t^2/2 = .55 Seconds.

Now, we also know the initial velocity of the paintball leaving the barrel is 300fps which equals 91.44 meters per second.

Multiply the time (.18 Seconds) by the velocity (91.44 meters per second) and you end with 16.2 meters traveled by the ball. 16.2m = 165feet.

Why is this relevant? Well, if you think about it, any gun firing 1.5m above the ground at 300fps directly parallel will travel 165feet disregarding air resistance.

Sorry for any typos, I typed this in a hurry. ;)

[Evil Bob]

Quite correct, this is why we play "lob ball" or "indirect artillery" most of the time for the long shots, you have to compensate for the low velocity we intentionally shoot at (for safety) with increased trajectory.

The only way to overcome the need for increased trajectory is through the Magnus effect where back spin is specifically induced to create lift.

-Evil Bob

[Lohman446]

I have always wondered if ball weight makes a difference - I am told it does not but it just nags at me that it should.

[Kevmaster]

while doing tat simple physics...you kinda messed some numbers....16.5m does NOT equal 165 feet....

d(y) = 1/2 * a * t^ 2

1.5 = 1/2 * -9.8 * t^2
t^2 = .306
t = .55

d(x) = v * t = 91.5 * .55 = 50.6m = 156 feet

just to clarify


now...

mass will not make a difference in the simple air-resestance-free physics we are doing, however, in REAL physics with air resistance, mass will have an effect on the decrease in speed.

[rdb123]

Kev, I forgot to change that in my edit. ;)

And yes, of course air resistance in real life would make a difference, but that doesn't mean that a ball shot out of an impulse would react any differently than a ball shot out of a spyder. Also, to take into account air resistance, we would need to involve some calculus and I'm not too sure people would want to read through that. :)

[athomas]

Originally posted by Lohman446
I have always wondered if ball weight makes a difference - I am told it does not but it just nags at me that it should.

Two balls fired at the same velocity will travel the same distance regardless of weight as long as they are the same size and shape.

A gun that is set up to fire the lighter ball at a set velocity uses less energy than a similar gun set up to fire the heavier ball. Therefore, if the gun that is set up for the light ball shoots the heavy ball, it will not have the muzzel velocity to travel the same distance.

Also, a smaller ball of a certain weight will travel farther than a larger ball of the same weight. The larger ball has more air resistance causing it to decrease velocity at a greater rate.

[manike]

Originally posted by athomas
Two balls fired at the same velocity will travel the same distance regardless of weight as long as they are the same size and shape.

I think you made a mistake there. If they are fired at the same velocity the heavier ball will go further because it's decelleration due to air resistance is less. And because as you point out below it would have to be carrying more energy to be travelling at the same velocity in the first place.


Originally posted by athomas
A gun that is set up to fire the lighter ball at a set velocity uses less energy than a similar gun set up to fire the heavier ball. Therefore, if the gun that is set up for the light ball shoots the heavy ball, it will not have the muzzel velocity to travel the same distance.

Also, a smaller ball of a certain weight will travel farther than a larger ball of the same weight. The larger ball has more air resistance causing it to decrease velocity at a greater rate.

All very true. :D

[PyRo]

Originally posted by LaW


Also keep in mind that for the Z-body to do anything it must be using a large bore barrel with small bore paint or else its pretty much worthless.

Which means its going to be a pig on gas and not shoot straight.

[PyRo]

The little kits with the cockers shoot further than everyone else because they turn up there velocity to 400fps thinking its cool.

[athomas]

Originally posted by manike


I think you made a mistake there. If they are fired at the same velocity the heavier ball will go further because it's decelleration due to air resistance is less. And because as you point out below it would have to be carrying more energy to be travelling at the same velocity in the first place.


I toiled with this and then thought of the fact that two objects of the same size and shape will accelerate at the same rate regardless of weight.


Then I thought about it again after you pointed out the flaw in my reasoning. Since the frictional forces are the same for both the heavy and the light balls, then the forces would have a greater affect on the lighter ball since there is less mass to move/change. I now stand totally corrected.:)

[manike]

Originally posted by athomas
I toiled with this and then thought of the fact that two objects of the same size and shape will accelerate at the same rate regardless of weight.


Then I thought about it again after you pointed out the flaw in my reasoning. Since the frictional forces are the same for both the heavy and the light balls, then the forces would have a greater affect on the lighter ball since there is less mass to move/change.

http://www.automags.org/forums/images/icons/icon14.gif Great posts, reasoning and information. http://www.automags.org/forums/images/icons/icon14.gif