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Hephaestus
10-24-2003, 12:24 AM
Hi to all Machinist and CNC Techs out there!

I would like to start a Show and Tell thread for those who like to scratch build or tinker with their own guns.

Reading up on all your custom projects and getting lots of great ideas inspired me to also try my skills at some simple machining.

Well here are some pics of my current project.
http://www3.telus.net/papaneko/images/wbarrel.jpg
http://www3.telus.net/papaneko/images/vertadptor1.jpg
http://www3.telus.net/papaneko/images/wsear.jpg
Any comments on possible improvements are always welcome.

Thanks

PS - I wouldn't mind seeing your project pics too!

<EDITED 10/28/03>

billybob_81067
10-25-2003, 03:16 AM
Go to www.imagestation.com and upload your pictures and then put them into an album. To link to the pictures, go into your album, find the pictures that you want to post and click on them to enlarge them. It will bring up the pictures in a new window, and all you have to do is copy the address from the adress bar. Then when you are posting your pictures, click the IMG button near the top and paste the links to the pictures that you want posted.

Hope this helps you out. If I have confused you just let me know and I'll try to describe it in more depth... (It's 2:30 AM and I dunno if I'm making much sense :D)

JonDaAzn
10-26-2003, 06:47 PM
or you could just click the attach file button and let ao.org host it for you!

Hephaestus
10-26-2003, 08:59 PM
Thanks for your advise billybob and JonDaAzn. Had a few hurdels in my way but finally I am getting my way about.
Can you believe that these are the first 3 pics that I have ever uploaded on to the web.

Anyone have any comments as to what else could be done at this milling stage before anno. Should it be kept simple or milled down more to save weight? I kinda like the glockish looks right now but was also thinking about what it would look like if the top half was more rounder taking off that angular look.

Better keep this short.
Thanks for checking it out.

billybob_81067
10-26-2003, 11:33 PM
Originally posted by JonDaAzn
or you could just click the attach file button and let ao.org host it for you!

A.O.'s picture hosting was wacked the past few days and the only way to post a pic was to host it somewhere else.

Hephaestus,

That's pretty sweet man! How long did it take you to machine that? Keep up the good work! :D

vf-xx
10-27-2003, 12:18 AM
How did you do the sear pin?

Is that just the stock sear pin pressed into place, or is that an RT sear?

Whats going on at the base of your feedneck, maybe i'm looking at it wrong but I thought I saw a wire in there.

Overall it looks good, but a little strange. Maybe some minor cuts to make it flow into the barrel better.

Hephaestus
10-27-2003, 01:33 AM
billybob

The body took about an hour to turn on the lathe and the milling around 30mins. The toughest part was to cut that sear slot which I did mostly by hand with a drill press, dremel, and file at home.(2hrs min)

vf-xx

The sear pin is just a cut down 3/16 stell dowel pin and an older sear that was shaved down to save weight.
There are no wires running about yet.... the connection between the vert feed and body has a slight gap from drilling and I kind of like it because it lets air vent insted of pushing on the balls.


The body still needs some cosmetic nip and tucks and I am taking my time. Screwed up a couple of times already.
Taking the body down to flow smoothly to the barrel might be the next step. (your input please) If a foregrip is nessary then I would just leave it and machine an adaptor to bolt onto the front.

Well better go and catch some sleep.
Like hearing your feedbacks.
Gives me something to think about in the next few steps and maybe notice something I may have missed.

Thanks again!

billybob_81067
10-27-2003, 01:54 AM
Originally posted by Hephaestus
The toughest part was to cut that sear slot which I did mostly by hand with a drill press, dremel, and file at home.(2hrs min)



I'm just curious as to why you didn't mill the slot for the sear with the miling machine instead of the old drill n' file method? :D

The only thing I can think of that this beast needs now is some cosmetic milling...

Hephaestus
10-27-2003, 07:32 PM
billybob

Did the slotting during my spare time on the weekend.
I really wanted to try it out and could not wait for Monday. Plus the endmills we had in stock were not long enough for the job.

vf-xx
10-27-2003, 07:44 PM
Honestly I'd look into getting an RT sear assembly, i really think that'd work better.

What you should do is make up another blank or two then work out something with Nicad, cause that's a great sluggo and I think that people could do some wonderful cosmetics with it (not that you couldn't, but variatey is good).

Overall it looks like a good functional body (supposing it works and you've tested it).

How did you do the retaining washer for the bolt spring? did you do a steel insert or just milled aluminum? If I'm not mistaken AGD's sluggos use a steel insert, but hey, I could be wrong.

Person
10-27-2003, 07:54 PM
Now take off about 80 percent of the current ammount of aluminum and you gotchaself an awsome body :D

Hephaestus
10-27-2003, 08:11 PM
vf-xx

Everything works and the bore for the barrel is quite true to the valve and bolt assembly. Have to look into rt sears. Have not seen one up close so I am not so sure what are some of their benifits.

There is no retaining washer needed in the body since the spring shoulder was all bored with a boring bar. All depths and internal diameters were milked from a classic frame.

http://www3.telus.net/papaneko/images/frontview.jpg

As to the production of these slugs I am not much into anykind of production thoughts right now.
My goal is to eventually make a bullpup marker with the hopper in the stock driven by a built in feed system. Some kind of simple belt drive. The trigger frame is going to be next on my list.

I am currently looking around for information on solonoids and driver bords. I was even thinking about fliping around the slug and make it a bottom feed system with wires running to the small solonoid up top to fire the thing.

Again I have to keep things short.
Can ramble too easly.

vf-xx
10-27-2003, 09:38 PM
Hrm, we may need to talk if you really want to to the bottom feed thing with a solinoid. I'm currently working on a project that involves putting a noid on an ULT RT. Can't promise anything as of yet, cause I'm still looking for a sponsor to help out the cost of my entire project and I might be offering rights for it.

Anyway It'll be interesting to see hot the aluminium shoulder holds up under wear.

the pin on RT sears screw in from the side, I believe that the newer PTP Micro mags use those as well.

As for smoothing things out towards the barrel you might put some simple sloping cuts that run from close the the barrel out to what you've got there just following the existing sides. (I have no clue if that made sense, if it didn't let me know and I'll try to photoshop your drawing later.

Fixion
10-27-2003, 11:57 PM
How did you make the treads in it, especially the barrel threads?

Hephaestus
10-28-2003, 07:32 PM
Fixion

Cutting threads are simple on a lathe, you can cut almost any barrel thread types you want. Its all depends on what type of thread pitch (TPI threads per inch) the manufacturer used. The machining process can be done manualy or programed to cut on a CNC machine. Or just cheat and buy a specialty tap and just drill out your size needed and tap it by hand if you wish.

vf-xx

Feel free to use photoshop on the pics if you like. I have used a jiffy marker to do some quick mockups for myself.

Right now the body weight is at 240g or 8.5oz(wo/valve) What would be considered light by paintballers standard?
I plan to mill out around the sear slot next to lighten things out a bit more

billybob_81067
10-29-2003, 04:56 PM
It's already lookin mucho better! :D Keep up the good work!

Matt_mg
10-29-2003, 08:36 PM
I don't know about the other guys here but I have only one complaint, no foregrip!

Otherwise it just looks AWESOME :O Do you think you will be selling them?

BlackHalo
10-29-2003, 09:48 PM
Just wanted to say Hi to another B.C. Mag person.

You in the Lower Mainland or elsewhere?

Hephaestus
10-29-2003, 11:13 PM
Matt_mg

Foregrips will be comming soon. The reason why I left the bottom of the front untapered is to mount a removable bracket.


Having some time to look at the latest work done, I am not too satisfied of the fromt milling job. Kind of wished that I had left it alone. The leading lines at the front point downwards insted of straight forward. Don't know how to fix that one.

Can you believe that after all that milling to shave off some weight. I only took off 30grams. Frame is now down to 210g/7.5oz. Dose anyone know the weight of a ULE body and Rail?

BlackHalo
10-29-2003, 11:18 PM
I'm in North Vancouver but I work downtown. I usually play at Panther whenever work lets me out of my cave. Unfortunately I'm usually the only one around that plays with a Mag. If you ever see a Filipino bunker running around with a Z-Grip no-rise classic mag - that's me. It's fun watching people try to figure out the Z.

Where do you usually play?

vf-xx
10-30-2003, 12:12 AM
You did about what I was going to suggest. You're right, I think that it might have been better to leave the top alone.

Personally I would like to see one with a straight top, but an angled bottom (at least at the front of it).

Of course if you must have a foregrip then don't, but I think with a long drop it might look/work just fine.

Also I liked the OTV look from before. If you do another run at this maybe leave a bit over the valve? You could always take it off later.

Any chance I could get some shop drawings of this? I wonder if the tolerances are good enough to run a RT valve in it. Don't suppose you have one to test do you?

Like I said before I'm working on a project this semester and I'm beginning to think it may be worth my while to just make my own unibody slugs, I'd want to play with the idea of putting in an RT sear, however. Maybe we could team up somehow.

Hephaestus
10-30-2003, 12:38 AM
vf-xx

Learning how to use CAD right now (when I am not surfing AO)and it might take awile. But sure I would like to swap ideas or drawings. Its always good to network on a project. Could you toss me some dimensions about the RT valve and point out their differences to the classic valve. Sad to say I gave one of my spare slug bodies to a co-worker for his B-day.
It might just fit that RT at this stage not much work was done to it, mostly the internal boreing and top half milled.

Right now I am thinking about the posibility of using a radiusing cutter to reshape the front. If I'm lucky to find some more scrap material long enough, I might make another run for 2 more slugs tomorrow.



PS - I'm curious what course are you taking at the moment? Anything to do with electronics by chance?

PSS - What is OTV?

vf-xx
10-30-2003, 12:48 AM
OTV = Over the Valve

I'm in Mechanical Engineering, my class is Design 1.

My class does not involve electronics (thank you very much) but my design does. I hope to shop this out to our EE department.

The more I think about it, the more I believe that it should work just fine, we just need to re-dimention for an RT Sear.

Considering the RT valve is a drop in mod for a classic valve I don't see why it wouldn't work. Especially if you're using an ULT because the shims effectivly change the On/off pin lenght which is the critical dimention in question I believe.

I tell you what, my partner is a machinest and if you can send me the rawest of the slugs I have an RT sear assembly here that I can fit it to. If you're interested catch me on AIM and we can work out more details.

billybob_81067
10-30-2003, 12:48 AM
OTV = Over The Valve :D

athomas
10-30-2003, 10:57 AM
Originally posted by Hephaestus

There is no retaining washer needed in the body since the spring shoulder was all bored with a boring bar. All depths and internal diameters were copied from a classic frame.

The retaining washer is needed to protect the body from damage. The force of the bolt slamming into the aluminum body will cause it to mushroom, eventually throwing the body out of tolerance and possibly causing the bolt to jam.

Drill the back opening a little deeper. ie; the thickness of a steel washer. Cut a groove to hold a retaining clip which will hold the washer in place. The steel washer will take a lot of the impact force and spread it out over a larger area in the aluminum body and prevent it from damage.

Hephaestus
10-30-2003, 07:22 PM
athomas

Thats a good point! I kind of forgot about the impact pressure of that bolt. Will have one in place by next week for sure. I would use a slight press fit insted of a clip, too much trouble to groove. Thanks for your input!

vf-xx

I studied as a Tool and Die maker and now work as a machinist.

These projects are going to be a collection of my mag design evolution and so I would like to keep all versions to put them to the test of time and see what technique used stands up the best. Plus I don't want to step on anyones toes.

That second slug I had made only took 30mins to complete on the radial drill. Saving almost half the time needed on the lathe. But the true test is to later see the accuracy of the barrel to valve assembly. Threading has to be done on the lathe and I don't know how well I can pick up the bore to aling everything. (Glad I gave it to someone else to tinker with) But I know that the easiest thing is to make up a mandrel and dial it up.

Sorry to say but there are not too many slugs to spare. As it is I have found only enough material for 2 more mags and 2 cocker style bodies to come.

billybob_81067
10-30-2003, 10:55 PM
Make your grips either a 90 degree, or a Y grip... that would be sweet. Or if you don't like those style grips, at least make them not so much of an angle back like the stock frame and angle the grip forward a bit...

Just a suggestion :D

Hephaestus
10-31-2003, 12:40 AM
Ergo. grips eh? Its wourth a try eventhough its not my style of play. I like to play with a stock and remote.
But how realy comfortable is that grip unless you like to keep it tight. What degree offset is the y-grip and z-grip anyways?

luke
10-31-2003, 02:08 PM
Originally posted by vf-xx

The more I think about it, the more I believe that it should work just fine, we just need to re-dimention for an RT Sear.

The only difference I know of between the two, is the RT sear is lighter than the classic. When you upgrade from classic to RT, you simply drop in the new sear.


Nice work by the way....

BlackHalo
10-31-2003, 02:18 PM
Hold a .45 grip backwards and that's a Y.

The Z is 45* I think. If you pop by Panther this Sunday afternoon I'll be there and you can have a look at my Z.

Hephaestus
10-31-2003, 07:48 PM
Update

Finished boreing and threading a second slug. This one is about 8 inches in length. And again I am at the stage where a slot is needed to test fire it.

New longer Slug (16oz/450g hollowed out)

theraidenproject
11-03-2003, 12:21 AM
Your mag is looking very good. I can't wait to see where you go with the rest of the project.
http://www.uploadit.org/files2/031103-hephaestus%20mag.jpg
You need the z-lock slot, though.
http://www.automags.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=82504&highlight=rail+unscrew

Hephaestus
11-03-2003, 05:13 PM
theraidenproject,

You are right on that one. I did miss the z-lock on this slug. It was hard to adjust the velocity safely. Have to think about how to mod this on. The next one will have it on for sure.

http://www.jayloo.com/lib/get_file.php?id=2273

The total weight of it now before the valve is 16oz/450g and there still are places to nip off some material. But I don't care to shave that little bit off. All I want to do is play with it for a few games. Its now on to that trig frame.

xrancid_milkx
11-03-2003, 07:09 PM
Did you make that trigger? I'll buy it off you...:D

But seriously I will.

Hephaestus
11-03-2003, 07:35 PM
xrancid_milkx

I have made several triggers for myself (Plus with working safety:)) , and I am still tweaking their design. You do realize that when you put this on it would void your warranty. Do you really want it? Got anything to trade? I could use another AGD rubber grip or WHU.


Project Update

Well here are some early drafts for the hopper enclosed stock with a warp type feed system. I plan to carve the first prototype out of wood. Hope the pics are clear enough, if not tell me and I will try with a higher res.



I plan to run a clear tube to an adaptor that will feed the pb to the chamber. Will be bottom feeding at a 45 upward angle. Will draft another view soon.

FooTemps
11-03-2003, 08:04 PM
Sweet! BULLPUP MAG!

Hephaestus
11-04-2003, 01:20 AM
xrancid_milkx,

Sorry I forgot about my AO settings. I try to cut down on spam as many ways as possible. And my hotmail filter is set on Maximum. Post me your e-mail here and I will put you on my hotmail list.(same for anyone here who wants to contact me)

x_m, I will send you the one on the slug insted. That unmounted one was the first one I ever made. I'd like to keep that for momento sake. Thanks for offering your spare parts. I can mount a second slug for testing easly with another trig frame.

Big'n slo
11-04-2003, 09:55 AM
Hey Hephaestus, great work!

I was working on a similar hopper/warp setup a while back, just a forgrip mount instead of stock mounted.
My Thread (http://www.automags.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=76841)

http://www.automags.org/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=740068

If you've got a screen shot of your design, I can host it for you.
sigma_kier@yahoo.com

BlackHalo
11-04-2003, 12:05 PM
Quick and ugly way of doing it is to highlight the window you want. Hit alt+print scrn. Open up Paint and go File - Paste. Then just Save it somewhere.


edited - didn't realize the stuff I put between the greater and less than sign didn't show up.

BlackHalo
11-04-2003, 01:35 PM
Halloween Havoc tourney was on that day so it was pretty busy there. Actually saw a team with an E-Mag and couple of Mini-Mags.

Next time!

Big'n slo
11-04-2003, 02:07 PM
Hephaestus,

Just like most projects I start its on the back burner. When I put it aside I had the mounting rail mocked up, a rough wood mold for the fiberglass hopper out front, and one hacked up warp.
I wasn't sure how I wanted the feed setup. (warp, vert, powerfeed...) I was thinking of cutting a trap door feed but the trigger is in the way. I was also concerned about feeding the warp from the hopper. The slight slope would have to funnel the paint into a uniform line before it hits the warp wheels but also put enough force on the stack to allow the warp to grab. I was thinking Halo/Egg style feed in the front of the hopper to force the stack but.... its way down on the list.

Keep us updated on you progress, its great to see some new ideas.

Hephaestus
11-04-2003, 06:07 PM
My coworker gave back the second slug that I gave him for his b-day. (He wants to make one of his own design from scratch too:)) Well its his loss and my gain.

So here are some pics of the differences in design.
This slug might be adapted into the bullpup.
I kind of like the pistol look right now.

http://www.uploadit.org/files2/041103-Slug2a.jpg
http://www.uploadit.org/files2/041103-Slug2b.jpg
http://www.uploadit.org/files2/041103-Slug2 Machined.jpg

I was debaiting about having it a top feed or bottom feed design. Anyone have any comments about their pro and cons?
What would you rather see?

Hephaestus
11-05-2003, 12:45 AM
X_M,

I just PM you. Sorry for the delay.
Tomorrow "If" I get the chance I will mail it out to you.

X_M,

Its been mailed. Will take at least 5 days min. to reach you.

vf-xx
11-05-2003, 01:37 AM
It would be interesting to have a Unibody with a downward sloped feed tube (aka warp style) You'd probably want to gate it somehow tho, maybe use some nubbins or ball detents.


edit: IE like the bottom side of a PF tube.

vf-xx
11-05-2003, 10:42 PM
I was honestly thinking something more along the lines of this:

http://members.cox.net/novaprime/061103-BFeed.jpg

Pardon the paint skills, i'm at work and that's what I've got...

Hephaestus
11-06-2003, 12:43 AM
vf-xx,

There is a drawback to that design. If you do break paint or even chop a ball there will be a big mess dripping down the feed tube. And much harder to flush out. Thats why I had designed a higher loading point.

Is that a gate you mention about in your drawing mod? Its not a tap door of some sort is it?

vf-xx
11-06-2003, 01:46 AM
no, the gate isn't in there. I'm not sure if you'd HAVE to have a gate, or if a detent would be good enough.

I'm not saying that, that specific placement is the best, I was just looking for something along those lines.

As for the chops, since LX is becoming the standard I really don't think that's an issue.

After looking at all this stuff, i'm seriously considering a bolt on bull-pup warp/stock combo. I dunno, gotta think about it.

Hephaestus
11-06-2003, 02:28 AM
vf-xx,

Give it a try! My ideas are open for anyone to tackel. I just want to see a working prototype made. Right now I can't get access to the shops CNC. I want to finish tweaking out the CAD drawings before trying to CAM it out.

I had been having so much fun with CAD that I drew up some of my other floating ideas. Here is something else I was working on. A different kind of On/Off Valve. I wanted to make it more reactive. I have to learn how to do 3D next to better show the design.

http://www.uploadit.org/files2/061103-on off.JPG

xrancid_milkx
11-06-2003, 06:29 PM
Package Sent!

Lady at post office said although 5 to 7 days for shippment.

I'll delete my previous posts to clean the thread up.

I'll give ya feedback on the trigger once I try it out.

Thanks again!

vf-xx
11-07-2003, 02:21 AM
it honestly depends on price. and personally I'd still want to use an RT sear.

If I go through with the project I have now I could use it because I need light vert feed bodies on a budget.

If I do a bull pup design I don't think I"d be able to use a unibody.

FooTemps
11-07-2003, 02:22 AM
I like it. If it can be affordibly made I know that there would be interest. And it looks like there's enough meat on there for milling still...

As for the feeding design, I agree with vf-xx. I think that a side feed breech like on the ule warp or the xmag would be a better idea. There shouldn't be much chopping with a properly tuned lx.

Actually, I have an even better idea than vf-xx's idea... Do you remember the trapdoor feed? Just have one of those but instead of pointing down towards the war, have it point to the back towards the bulpup assembly.

Hephaestus
11-10-2003, 08:11 PM
Update Pics.

Here is my Beta Slug body with some improvements.
Space enough for the Z-slot and foregrip.

http://www.uploadit.org/files2/111103-Beta Slug.jpg

How many of you like the squarish front end?

http://www.uploadit.org/files2/111103-Alpha n Beta Slugs.jpg

Did anyone think that it was an impossibility to mount the foregrip like that:)

studley192
11-10-2003, 10:23 PM
well, i have a project of my own. i posted it previously, but ill put it in this thread too.

With my dremel, i carved my body rail. Both sides as pretty damn symetrical, and it looks decent. People come up to me all the time. Also, its the lightest tourny gun i have ever held. But that is also due to the ULE and x valve.

Also, i did a ton of work to my valves ( AIR and X) I recieved the air non working. the X worked, but the lvl ten was pretty harsh. It put a 5 mm mark in a pencil, and shattered the tip after five shots. When i was done it put a 1 mm mark, and never went any deeper or broke the pencil. Also, i got the spacer and rings just right that its sweet spots like no gun i have ever seen. In fact, i got a guy with a Emag to turn his gun onto manual (non electro) to try and sweetspot because i was just destroying all the timmies and other electros in ROF. But it only work above 2000 psi (on a preset tank pressure inside, not output), so i need a adjustable reg tank to fully get it working.

Anyways, heres the pics. I would liek to buy a slug, but i just dont have enough money as of now and for a long time.
Hephaestus, if you have any of you extra slugs ( with no cosmetic milling , just square, but ready to accept barrel, valve, detent, etc. Basically ready to use) i would loveto take the dremel to it and see what i can do. i could pay you if its not too much. Also, if you have a no rise but with extra metal on it ready to mill, that rock

heres my pics though.

http://www.automags.org/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=1033877
http://www.automags.org/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=1033879
http://www.automags.org/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=1033883

details on body rail milling (http://www.automags.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=1036802#post1036802)

Now that my mags are mechanically complete, i just need to get a slug and anno then, cuz my raw ULE is oxidizing badly. Also, id like to start some work on cockers. If anyone has a really crappy one to sell for cheap tell me

angels one
11-10-2003, 11:07 PM
I would like a block slug so I can mill. HOW MUCH????

Hephaestus
11-11-2003, 01:04 AM
Studley 192,

Nice work with that dremel! I still have to learn how to set up my LvX, any tips for that great setup of yours:)

quote

"I put a 5 mm mark in a pencil, and shattered the tip after five shots. When i was done it put a 1 mm mark, and never went any deeper or broke the pencil."

Where abouts is this mark that you are talking about? Are you refering the bolt or something else.

And what kind of valve work had you done? :)
Not many AOer have talked about their tinkering so far:( I had done some mods to my on/off too but am not so sure yet of its effectiveness. I'm glad to hear that yours worked out so well! Got anything else to show and tell:)

As to your question about me selling these slugs.. I am not too sure if TK would approve of it. To justify selling these I have to ask permission first.

To everyone else,

As to the cost of these right now... I recon that the most basic slug would cost a minimum of a $50 (USD) to manufacture. And as you want more machining done starting from a rectangular block just bored, slot milled, and threaded. Up to an ultra light slug with detents and low rise) the price can climb easly to $100 and up.

The purchasing of bar stock and shop rate machine time, all adds up when I do a low run. (min dozen at a time) I don't think that too many would be willing to fork out that much. I myself included.

The consumer desire is also quite low considering the feedback I'm getting.

My objectives as of now is to continue to work on my prototypes and make sure that it is safe to use. And
figure out the optimum setup that proves to be 100% reliable and adaptable.

Hephaestus

SpongeBobSquarePants
11-11-2003, 11:30 AM
I have to say that looks mighty fine. I really like the look of it, and the trigger is totally boss. Kepp up the the good work bro.:)

vf-xx
11-11-2003, 11:40 AM
Heph: Its good that you're doing testing before anything else. Don't let anyone rush you on that.

That being said, if you can do the standard block with all the holes tapped and ready to go I think many people would be interested in a slug unibody for $50-75. Consider that most people pay about $60 ish for the SS bodies, and $150ish for the ULE bodies.

Did you get the steel bolt spring retainer worked out?

Hephaestus
11-11-2003, 01:37 PM
SpongeBobSquarePants,

Thanks for the compliments:)
Glad to hear that some like it square.

vf-xx,

If you take a really close look at the CAD drawing you can see how I designed the steel washer for the spring. It has been designed and intergrated into the beta slug body. I will try to post some pics of it when I get to it. The Z-slot will be done by tomorrow and maybe that washer too.

Hey could anyone post a close up pic of a rt sear. I keep hearing so much about it but haven't seen one yet. Since I haven't drilled out for the sear pin yet I might try this beta slug out with that rt sear pin.

vf-xx
11-11-2003, 05:35 PM
i'm busy until thursday, but if you still want em then, I can get some RT sear picts for you. I can get you some measuremetnts too.

billybob_81067
11-12-2003, 12:08 AM
:D Can you say slug bodied sydarm??? :D

That is totally awesome!

xrancid_milkx
11-12-2003, 12:14 AM
Originally posted by Hephaestus
xrancid_milkx,

Package Received!
Hope you get yours soon too.

Thanks for trading with me:)
If there is anything I can help you with just ask!

Sincerely,

Heph.

I got yours yesterday, thanks man! It really is a nice trigger. I'm going to go out and try it real soon
:D

(I included all that other stuff thinking you could use em, hope they become useful ;) )

Big'n slo
11-12-2003, 09:22 AM
Originally posted by Hephaestus
Another Crazy Idea!

Zeus magazine feed for those that don't need a rattle of paintballs giving your position away. My sniping setup:)

http://server3.uploadit.org/files/111103-ZnM.jpg

Heph,

Beat ya to that one!

http://home.comcast.net/~jeffreykier/Pics/ghetto-syd.jpg

Although mine ain't as pretty

FooTemps
11-12-2003, 10:30 AM
Hahaha, that's great, ghetto but great!

How is that adapter held on? Is it welded/soddered to the mainbody or is it part of the rail?

Seems like the field strip screw isn't very field strippalbe anymore. lol, I'm guessing that is a spare parts mag you just use to tinker with.

Big'n slo
11-12-2003, 10:48 AM
Originally posted by FooTemps
Hahaha, that's great, ghetto but great!

How is that adapter held on? Is it welded/soddered to the mainbody or is it part of the rail?

Seems like the field strip screw isn't very field strippalbe anymore. lol, I'm guessing that is a spare parts mag you just use to tinker with.

Foo,
Ya hit the nail on the head, I nicknamed that one the "Ghetto-syd".
Its bored to the O.D. of the standard body and sorta dovetailed to slip over the rail. The opposite side has a set screw that joins the adapter to the rail. I'll prolly discard the adapter and just weld tabs on the body to hold the clip on, with the adapter it sits too far off the body.

Its made of all spare parts, as of now the trigger frame is
being modified to accept a 12g cartridge. Just having a little trouble routing an air feed from the frame to the valve.

Hephaestus
11-12-2003, 01:24 PM
Big'n slo,

Can't see your pics. Can you fix the problem.

I intend to use the pins on the magazine to hold it in place. It has some kind of spring release that I find cool.
I will have to drill some slots carefully for the setup to work. Will keep you posted once I get to it.

Big'n slo
11-12-2003, 01:36 PM
Heph,

Comcast is down at the moment, basically I have the same setup (PT enforcer magazine) fitted to a standard body via an AL adapter. I was after a stock class setup for my mag pump but figured the design would work well for a semi pistol.

Hopefully my pic host will be back up soon. Keep up the good work, you've definitely got me beat in machinist skill.

Hephaestus
11-12-2003, 11:32 PM
Latest crazy idea!

I had another inspiration for one of the next slugs.
While I was taking some measurements off my Zeus. It just occured to me that I could adapt that 12g co2 into the slug frame. Its too bad the material cut was cut too short, not long enough to have a barrel built in.
http://server3.uploadit.org/files/131103-Zeus.jpg

As you can see I modeled my slug to look somewhat like the almighty Zeus;)

vf-xx
11-13-2003, 12:13 AM
I just realized something. I hadn't noticed but are you leaving clearance in your body for a rail bushing?

Hephaestus
11-13-2003, 01:31 AM
vf-xx,

You got me stumped there? What is a rail bushing? Where is it located? What is it for?

vf-xx
11-13-2003, 02:05 AM
The rail bushing ususally sits in the rail and partly in the gripframe through the feild strip screw hole. I'll try and get picts of it tomorrow when I do the RT Sear screw.

vf-xx
11-15-2003, 10:18 AM
RT Sear picts n such.

http://members.cox.net/novaprime/sear-assembly.jpg

Hephaestus
11-15-2003, 08:31 PM
vf-xx,

Thanks for the pics. Now I do get a better idea about that RT sear. A smaller diameter shaft with a bushing makes less friction for that sear to pivot. Great Idea!
I could guess that the 1/4 inch thread on the pin is a National Coarse thread?
Overall that sear looks just like a regular sear but with a bushing pressed in. Just curious what is the bushings diameter? Now I see why you like it so much.

Heph.

vf-xx
11-15-2003, 10:23 PM
I'm no good at eyeballing the thread type. I'll bring it with me to class on monday and take a side trip to the shop and check it. I'll also check the bushing diameter when I get home.

I strongly suggest you just buy a RT sear and pin (at least to start with) so we don't have any confusion.

Oh and I'll try and remember to get picts of a rail bushing.

Like the test plate that my partner made? The plate mimicks a gripframe allowing everything to be mounted up right and fired, but with direct access to the sear. Give you a guess as to why I needed that.

the electrician
11-15-2003, 11:41 PM
very cool stuff man.
I love seeing other peoples custom stuff.
I love the body rail, really makes me want to cut into mine.

I mostly do performance mods, but they would do nicely paired with some ideas you got goin' on there.

thanks for sharing the cool and interesting stuff.

Hephaestus
11-16-2003, 01:19 PM
the electrician,

Thanks! I also would like to check out your performance mods. Got any tips to share:) I like to trade ideas!

vf-xx,

Don't worry about posting a pic of that rail bushing.
I now know what you are talking about now. It is actually a spring pin pressed in to locate the trigger frame. Easly done! Thanks for the reminder!

Heph.

PS - No one able to help me figure out the hookup of that Egg2 board? Over 1700 views without any help:( I am sure that someone out there has one. All I want to know is where to hookup the batteries and motor drive. I really want to get that bullpup going.

mh53eplt
11-16-2003, 09:16 PM
same here "electrician", I have alot of spare time as I'm 100% disabled. Ya'll have great ideas:D

Hephaestus
12-01-2003, 09:22 PM
http://server4.uploadit.org/files/021203-Bolt 1.jpg
Here is a teaser!
Can anyone guess what is it?
Will slowly post more pics. that will answer riddle.

Heph.

xrancid_milkx
12-01-2003, 10:05 PM
Is it a cocker bolt :confused:

Hephaestus
12-01-2003, 10:20 PM
NOPE:)

angels one
12-01-2003, 10:25 PM
spyder bolt?

Hephaestus
12-01-2003, 10:33 PM
Sharp eye angels one!
A unique type of spyder bolt!
http://server4.uploadit.org/files/021203-Flush Bolt.jpg

xrancid_milkx
12-01-2003, 10:46 PM
Thats pretty cool, how does it shoot/cycle?

xrancid_milkx
12-01-2003, 10:48 PM
Oh ya, just a quick thought. Is it possible to make an improved striker as well? I know on my old TL the striker has always been the cause of its problems. Ranging from its o-ring to side ware. By making it lighter/heavier or out of different material could you make the marker cycle faster? More efficently?

Hephaestus
12-01-2003, 11:02 PM
x_m,

Great Project Idea! I could make a lighter striker and see if it dose have enought force to open the valve.
Might increase the cycling rate with less momentum.
Wish I could get my hands on some titanum.
So.....do you have a TL as a loaner too! :)
TL was my first gun till my eyes fell on a mag.
It was love at first sight! :)

Heph.

the electrician
12-01-2003, 11:21 PM
looks like a homemade spyder antichop bolt. kinda like JAM is making for cockers now.

good idea, as long as the spring is stiff enough to not let the bolt move back during the discharge(firing) I'm guessin' 2.5 lbs of spring force is enough to keep it still?

Hephaestus
12-01-2003, 11:29 PM
Not quite an antichop bolt. But homemade it is:)
Have to now check out what JAM is making.

xrancid_milkx
12-02-2003, 01:10 AM
My TL is what got me into this sport. I'll keep it till I quit, even if I don't use it.

I had a few ideas for mods back when I used it, but never really got past that, they stayed ideas. And the ones I did attempt turned the same as with all my projects, things got ugly and broke :D . That partly my fault, I can think of stuff, but don't have the skills or knowledge to execute them.

I spent at least a month trying to figure out a way to replace the velocity spring adjustment assembly with a new system or assembly of some form, something much more consistant and that didn't need adjusting/cutting on cold days. Like a rod instead of a spring. Never got anywhere with that...

Another one was I wanted to drill out my stock valve to increase air flow. Well, lets just say that got ugly, and I ended up having to buy another valve.

And finally, (my worst idea yet) I ghetto rigged a new connecting pin that held the bolt and striker together. I purpusely made it loose (width wise) in hopes it would have a "wack" effect, kind of like non-steel golf clubs. They bend when you swing them but when it gets to the ball it bends back forward giving an extra "wack" hitting the ball farther. It shot, but only 5 times before snapping, each time slaughtering a paintball. :rolleyes: Luckly it didn't damage anything internally, I just replaced it with the stock pin connector.

The last one I'm not sure what I was thinking, but its the thought that counts right? Right? :D

Hephaestus
12-02-2003, 01:31 PM
x_m,

You are a true tinker and defenately belong in here!
Networking your ideas would have seen possible results.
I want to talk to you further about idea 2 and 3.
Making a high folw valve is easy. Got to show you my TL mods and projects later today. That spring part idea of yours got me stumped?

As one of my friends said "Spyders are the AK-47 of paintball guns" Ugly but dam reliable. ;)

Heph.

Hephaestus
12-02-2003, 01:35 PM
Next hint.

Notice that it dosen't need a beaver tail anymore :)

ScatterPlot
12-02-2003, 02:21 PM
It's one of those bolts that you cock and then they don't move when you fire them.

ScatterPlot
12-02-2003, 02:25 PM
If that's what it is, good job on making one! I was thinking about getting one back when I had my spyder. Here's a link to one:
http://www.pbreview.com/products/reviews/1147/?n=1

xrancid_milkx
12-02-2003, 04:03 PM
Ok, as for the spring thing, I was tired of having to buy multiple springs so I could cut them different lengths for different days. So I tried to think of something that could replace the spring, like an adjustable rod or something. But then where would the tension come from? See why I never got anywhere :rolleyes:

angels one
12-02-2003, 04:48 PM
are the springs different lengths? or tension? cause if its just different lengths then you can just modify the length of the adjustment screw? I have a old spyder too... looking to make it into a nice scenario marker.

Hephaestus
12-02-2003, 04:55 PM
X_M,

I would make spring guide spacers to solve spring tension problems. Why bother cutting when all you need is to tweak the compression. Have you not seen them around. They are aluminum and annoed several colours. Have to find you a pic somewhere.

Or I could just make you one for x-mas! :) A threaded adjuster just like the one posted. LMK.

Heph.

Hephaestus
12-02-2003, 05:05 PM
bertmcmahan,

You figured it out! This was one of my crazy ideas before I had ever seen a flush cocking bolt. Since I had some delrin laying around and wanted to make a lighter bolt with less recoil, I came up with this wacky idea.

So far it works quite nicely. Slightly less recoil.... next project is to lighten the hammer. Might try to make one out of delrin and see what happens.


Heph.

Hephaestus
12-02-2003, 05:46 PM
Another "Whats it?"
Any gusses?
http://server4.uploadit.org/files/021203-New.jpg

Winner with needed setup gets to test it out for me.

xrancid_milkx
12-02-2003, 10:08 PM
That can't be a Spyder valve can it? That would be crazy on air flow.

EDIT Or could it be one of those spacers you where talking about?

Hephaestus
12-02-2003, 11:51 PM
Nope.
Not for a spyder.
Its for a mag.
You are close!

xrancid_milkx
12-03-2003, 12:08 AM
Powertube tip :confused:

AHHHH IT HURTS!!! I can't figure it out......

Hephaestus
12-03-2003, 12:44 AM
Lots of hits:)
Everyone gave up?
Well here is the answer.
A high flow mod for classic on/off valves. Just pull out one and insert the other.
http://server4.uploadit.org/files/031203-New and Old.jpg
Its too bad no one guessed it.
Would have given me the chance to pass it to someone to test it out for me.

I would like to select several volunteers who still use older classic valves and want to try testing this out.

Heph

billybob_81067
12-03-2003, 01:25 PM
I thought that kinda looked like a reactor on/off valve for a mag!

Coolness :D

the electrician
12-03-2003, 10:59 PM
It's just so happens I have the perfect test gun for such a thing.it's my pneumatic-sear standard mag.
it uses a short fat little ram to actuate the sear. it has a reg tapped onto the front of the vertical, and a micro 3-way valve behind the trigger that controls air flow to the ram. it shoots quick. you can get the valve hot and just about outshoot the revy.
I hooked up some parts of the ol' home made electro-cocker grip(morlock and MAC valve) just to test it at higher rof. it can shoot 16 bps without drop off, with a standard on/off valve and a 30 msec on time for the mac controlling the ram/sear.

so if you really want to see if your mod actually does anything, I've got your test gun brother.

more pic will be added later:
http://home.kc.rr.com/theelectrician/images/magsideview.jpg
http://home.kc.rr.com/theelectrician/images/magsideview2.jpg
http://home.kc.rr.com/theelectrician/images/magclose-up.jpg

Hephaestus
12-03-2003, 11:53 PM
Nice Gun Bro!

WOW! I had seen and admired your pics before and didn't pay attension to the maker. Are you an airsmith?

Wished you could set it up so that it will show all the pics on screen. I really want to see all 3 views at once.
Do you mind showing some of the pnumatic hook ups? How did you fit it in such a small space.
Looking forward to getting your mailing address.
You can really put my mod to the test. Excellent!

Heph.

billybob_81067
12-04-2003, 03:37 AM
Hey Heph,

I sent you a PM, but it said your mailbox was full, you might want to check both your sent and recieved messages and clear a few out ;)

Electrician,

That's freakin awesome! You should get it all annoed/powdercoated to match and it would be totally pimpin! :D

Hephaestus
12-04-2003, 06:22 PM
Billybob, X_M, and BlackHalo:)

Special gift mailed to you today.
Hope it gets to you not damaged.

Cheers!

Heph

JonDaAzn
12-04-2003, 06:55 PM
:eek: Did you buy or make that pneu-mag? i remember someone on pbnation had one just like it, is that you? or did you buy it from him?

billybob_81067
12-04-2003, 08:14 PM
Heph,

Here's those HPA compressor designs I was telling you about... Just thought I'd post em up for everyone to see and discuss. :D

I posted this a long time ago in the Deep Blue Forum before they had the Workshop Forum, and had a few people find some flaws in my first design like how the air would leak around the sealing rings and foam the hydraulic fluid causing it to not pump... so I just made a few basic changes and came up with the second design

First Design
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid61/p3d73d6d36c11b88d670457c1caf1ef60/fc3759d5.jpg

Second Design
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid61/p8d82d7544cef1cf620a75879caf73c07/fc3488bd.jpg

the electrician
12-04-2003, 09:20 PM
yes I made it, and yeah that was me.

I'm getting ready to make a pneumatic pulse circuit that will pulse the sear for a certain amount of time. this will let the valve recharge faster than it can now and perhaps shoot better and faster.

we'll find out when the parts get here.

Hephaestus
12-04-2003, 10:33 PM
Billybob,

Check out this simple and effective compressor design.
Found it at http://www.pyramydair.com/site/articles/compressor/

xrancid_milkx
12-05-2003, 01:10 AM
Those are pretty cool. I could easily increase the size of my valve opening with my drill press shouldn't I? I may just have to give that a try :D

VCK
12-05-2003, 10:56 AM
Hey electrician, quick question about your mag. Wheres the ram that activates teh sear? In the grip or built into the rail? If I remember right the pics I saw of the one that Punisher built had the ram on the front of the gun like a cocker. So was just curious as to how you did yours.

BlackHalo
12-05-2003, 12:08 PM
I'm pretty sure the one Punisher did didn't have the ram up front. On one side it looks like he made sleeve to hide the air lines.

quote from his site -
"Your eyes are not deceiving you - this Automag has cocker pneumatics attached. The trigger is now 100% pneumatic - an internal ram toggles the sear. Nearly impervious to short-stroking and blazing fast (a Retro valve is strongly recommended with this mod)."

the electrician
12-05-2003, 09:25 PM
I absolutely love Pun's creations. I didn't know about his cocker/mag creations when I started mine, but I found out about it before I finished.

mines similar, but not the same. same basic technique, different design. he gave me a few bits of advice to help me out.

I ended up modifying a small valve actuator, which is like a ram. to be a really short ram. I was using a smaller bore, longer stroke ram to pull the front of the sear down, but I changed the design to take up less space and just plain work better. the new design , the shorter larger bore ram pushes one the sear where the trigger rod was connected.

Pun's design has to be one of, if not the easiest-to-shoot-fast mechanical(non-electronic) gun.

I'm gonna try to make mine smoother and give it more recharge time, without going electronic. just for the fun of it.
I prefer to just post links to pics, so that people who don't want to see them don't have to wait for them to load, and you don't have to wait for them to load everytime you go to the thread.

latest pics:
http://home.kc.rr.com/theelectrician/images/newmagmodsideview.jpg
http://home.kc.rr.com/theelectrician/images/newmagmodtrigger.jpg
http://home.kc.rr.com/theelectrician/images/newmagmodguts.jpg

Hephaestus
12-05-2003, 09:40 PM
WOW!

I can't imagine how you fitted that large ram into that frame. And the tapping needed to fit the screws on! Very Impressive! What make of frame is that? Dose the trigger guard come off? Now I really want to learn as much about cocker pnu's. Thanks for posting more pics. I really don't mind waiting for them to load up, but I do understand your reasons.

the electrician
12-05-2003, 10:27 PM
it's a benchmark 45-frame.
I just came in through the top with a 9/16 mill bit.
and 3/8 where the valve is. it's tight between the valve and the ram. it leaves plenty of room for other controls.
I'm gonna mill out the rest of the frame for the pneumatic pulse circuit. we'll see if it works or not.

I moved the micro 3-way up more than a 1/4" from it's previous position. this made the trigger pull length go up from 1mm to 1.5mm, but it also went from 10 ounces of force, down to 6. so it's little lighter and easier to shoot quick strings. 1mm was just too short for me to be comfortable with.

it shoots great, but when you hold the trigger back, the ram stays pressurized, so sear stays actuated until you let go. your hand is not near as precise as a machine the could be. this means the on/off pin does not let the dump chamber recharge until you let go of the trigger. from shooting cockers alot, I have a tendency to hold the trigger back more than I let it rest between pulls.
so, by creating a pulse circuit, the pneumatics will actuate the ram for a certain amount of time, then it will depressurize and cannot re-actuate until you let go of the trigger.
after asking around, and doing some tests using electronics, I've found that if you give the ram a 30 msec pulse of air, as long as you don't let go and re-pull within 33 msec, it will shoot about 16 bps without any drop off at all. that's pretty damn quick for a standard valve and a mechanical gun.
it will be hard to be precise with the time controll when using nothing but a flow control valve, but with testing, I beleive I can get a better shooting gun with higher bps on the revy and the halo, without any chopping, and without a lvl10 bolt.

although I'm thinkin' that a lvl10 would be great for christmas :)

if all elae fails, all spend the money and make it a homemade e-mag via morlock board and solenoid valve.

billybob_81067
12-06-2003, 03:43 AM
I figured I'd show off a few of my past and current projects to add to the thread :D

First off is the Ugly duckling mag... the first picture is before I spiffed it up, and the second one is after. Same gun, same exact parts, lots of holes drilled, aluminum filed, and anno stripped. :p This project is basically done except for macro lines, which should be getting here any day now!

Before

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid60/pa2fe14d0a1d82bab3afe6b3a167f866b/fc53578b.jpg

After

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid91/p029acdbd980ddcfad4bda9c70fb4901b/fa5f1c7b.jpg

Next up is my current project rainmaker that I've built a frame adapter/mac mount for. The frame that I've got on it is an autococker hinge frame and I had to mill the frame to get the board to fit, and make the trigger. The trigger switch is out of a computer mouse and is really easy to walk. This project is near completion, and hopefully I'll stop being lazy and get it done. :D

The entire gun

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid91/p020ad9808a752db4c5406fce81aaa23a/fa5f1c7f.jpg

The milled barrel ;)

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid91/pbe13a54f451aaf191c7e0149b6930007/fa5f1c7d.jpg

Also I've got 3 different cockers that I'm milling currently, another project rainmaker that I've yet to do anything with, and I just bought a powdercoating kit yesterday, so hopefully I can find a cheap oven around here and make em all purty! :D

the electrician
12-06-2003, 12:19 PM
I like that mag body rail. cool stuff. buff that whole set-up and anno it your favorite color.

that rainmaker is a tall son-of-a-gun! hey let me know if you want some nickel plated clippard QEVs for that monster. give it a nice touch.

well since this is show and tell, I'll lay some stuff on the table. I don't do mods for looks, so none of it's real purty.

herre's my old homemade electrococker:
this is an older pic with brass bits on there

http://home.kc.rr.com/theelectrician/images/electrocockerfrontblock1.jpg
here's a newer pic
http://home.kc.rr.com/theelectrician/images/Picture%20025.jpgresized.jpg

http://home.kc.rr.com/theelectrician/images/electrocockersideview.jpg
here's the tightly fitted guts
http://home.kc.rr.com/theelectrician/images/electrocockerguts.jpg


here's one I made for my friend:

http://home.kc.rr.com/theelectrician/images/2003electrosideview.jpg
http://home.kc.rr.com/theelectrician/images/2003electrosideview2.jpg
http://home.kc.rr.com/theelectrician/images/2003electroguts.jpg

it is an improved design. one size allen wrench takes the whole electrogrip apart inside. every single thing. it get 20,000 shots per battery charge and the trigger is completely adjustable in every aspect(front stop, back stop, point of actuation, and tension) from the outside.

here's the homemade delrin bolts with all delrin plunger and assorted pins: http://home.kc.rr.com/theelectrician/images/boltnball%20plunger.jpg

here's the 4-way design I invented. it is now called the ct-3way and worr games makes them. wish I would have patented that one. oh well.http://home.kc.rr.com/theelectrician/images/quickdraw4-wayprototype.jpg
http://home.kc.rr.com/theelectrician/images/quickdraw4-wayblueprint.jpg
http://home.kc.rr.com/theelectrician/images/quickdraw4-wayblueprintclose-up.jpg
http://home.kc.rr.com/theelectrician/images/blueprintdateclose-up.jpg

Hephaestus
12-06-2003, 01:19 PM
Elec,

I am very impressed by your work done! Your autococker pneumatic work is awesome. Got to show this to another friend in my PB club who is doing the same thing right now.

What Kind Of Workshop do you have at home!
Now I am really itching to buy a lathe and mill.
Any comments about what make you are using?
Are you capable of cutting threads too?
I am still searching for a compact lathe but so far without luck.

the electrician
12-10-2003, 10:43 PM
I haven't recieved it yet, but I'll let you know when it gets here and it's condition.

billybob_81067
12-11-2003, 12:15 AM
To the best of my knowledge the package hasn't arrived yet. I will be heading home tomorrow night for Christmas break from college, so I will know for sure then. :D

Hephaestus
12-11-2003, 02:41 PM
http://server4.uploadit.org/files2/111203-Connectors.jpg

Having looked around at all the inteli switch to hopper wire connections. I found the plugs too bulky and thought to share a simple designed connector with you. I use it with all my backyard flyers. Its really simple and easy to make.

billybob_81067
12-12-2003, 12:23 AM
Hey Heph,

I just got home from college a couple hours ago and I found out that your package had arrived the previous day and it got here in good shape. Hopefully I'll be able to test it out over the next couple of days. :D

It looks awesome, can't wait to try it out! :p

Thanks man you rock!

xrancid_milkx
12-12-2003, 01:10 AM
Mine was bent a little on the top part, the end that goes down into the valve first.

Pesky mailman....

the electrician
12-12-2003, 07:06 PM
wel mine showed up today. it is damaged also, but I can't really blame it on the mailman. such a fragile piece of aluminum is bound to get bent in an envelope.
if it does show performance improvements, I suggest making them out of brass. it machines better and is a bit stronger.
and stick itin some bubble wrap, or like a smal plastic tube. that'll keep it safe during shipping.

I'll post my test result as soon as possible.

bvy the way nice jobe on the manufacturing, what did you use to make it? looks good.

Hephaestus
12-12-2003, 08:18 PM
Please PM me some pics if you can.
I seriously suggest you DO NOT put it in if you suspect that it is even bent. Height and width tollerance is critical.
If you can measure to check them to be at 0.187"~0.190" in height. Top and bottom parrallel too would be prefered.

If you like to send it back I will send you another if possible. I only have 2 left and thats it. I won't produce anymore for a long time.

BillyBob please take a close look and be sure that it is not bent in any way. If its not then you are the lucky one.

Wished I had not gone cheap and bubble wraped it:(

Oh Well! Live and Learn.

billybob_81067
12-12-2003, 10:38 PM
Hey Heph,

I checked it out again and it wasn't bent at all, then I checked it with my calipers and it measured .196, but I figured I'd try it anyways. I gassed up my minimag with intelliframe and shot with the stock on/off top and couldn't outshoot it. Then I swapped in yours and tried it, and I of course couldn't outshoot it, but the trigger seemed a bit snappier than with the stock on/off top. It seemed to have the slightest bit more reactivity and it seems like I could rip a longer string of shots before my finger got tired... I don't know if it was due to the added length or what, but I'm planning on leaving your custom on/off top in there! :D

I give it a big thumbs up! :D ;)

Hephaestus
12-13-2003, 12:49 AM
Billy,

Glad to hear that you like it.

Having the extra length is just like the mod DanHeneise was talking about. I may have forgotten to sand that one down. Its good to hear about your discoveries with that longer on/off top. Come to think about it I totaly forgot to make notes about the lengths that I passed out for testing. I know that each gun can be slightly different. My valve on my marker is happiest with a 0.215" o/f top. Its really tall compaired to the OEM 0.187" The length will offset the depth that the on/off pin enters into the teflon o-ring.

BTW. What do you mean by not being able to outshoot it? Are you talking about the valve recharge or something else?? Please clarify:)

Thanks!

badtoyz
12-13-2003, 01:26 AM
Heph where in Canada are you YVR ?

billybob_81067
12-13-2003, 01:52 AM
Originally posted by Hephaestus
BTW. What do you mean by not being able to outshoot it? Are you talking about the valve recharge or something else?? Please clarify:)

Heph,

What I meant when I said I wasn't able to outshoot it is that I cannot possibly pull the trigger fast enough and shoot quickly enough to cause the gun to shootdown and starve for air.

If I could shoot the gun fast enough to cause shootdown, your on/off top would probably help. By just the looks of it, your on/off top would probably flow at least 3 times what the stock on/off top would... :D

the electrician
12-13-2003, 10:00 AM
Ahh. so it's not the size of the stock one.
man be careful making them too long. if it restricts the sear movement too much, the sear front won't be able to come down off the bolt enough. then it starts chewing up the bolt and the sear both at a pretty rapid pace. trust me. I screwed up on my first pneuma-mag.

if you take the valve out of the body, then take the sear and push the front down to where it is even and flush with the inside of the body, that is all the movement of the sear that is actaually needed. now you can mark the side of the grip frame with a line that shows the position of the sear, or take measurement or whatever. then put the valve back in. now gas up the gun so the on/off pin gets pushed down. degass the gun. now move the sear to the marked position so it will move the pin just enough. now try and take the valve out with out moving the sear or on/off pin. note how far the on/off pin sticks out of the on/off. pull them out and put it in the same position and that is the longest on/off top you can use.

my pneumatic sear mod only moves the sear this far. the sear has an adjustable back stop made of stainless. this way you can fine tune it to move just enough. that's one of the reasons I think I can get a standard valve to shoot 18 bps with a little more tweaking.

so I don't know if your mod will ake a difference in my gun, but I'll bet it does make a difference in those that don't have a trigger or sear backstop.

Hephaestus
12-13-2003, 01:11 PM
electrician,

Very good points. You are right about finding the proper clearence for that sear or else..... :( I did use a similar technique you mentioned about looking out for the on/off pin travel and sear clearence. When I first had to tune up the slug I found that it needed specific adjustments for optimum sear travel.

I did mod my on/off top specifically for that slug of mine. The sear dose travel the distance to give the bolt clearance without crushing its edge. On my project slug my pivot point is lower than the OEM rails thats why I get away with a longer on/off. I do have a trigger stop but not a sear stop. Mind me asking in which position are you setting your sears stops? When you pull the trigger or when it is set and ready to fire?

*** NOTE ***

To the others who will be reciving these on/off tops please note electricians wise words of caution and sand the larger diameter side of the on/off down till it reaches 0.187"
Thanks

the electrician
12-13-2003, 06:26 PM
the sear should be free to travel all the way forward. this allows it to make good contact withthe bolt. I use a sear back stop because the trigger no longer pushes on the sear with the pnema-mag. with a normal standard mag, a trigger back stop would doo the same thing.

well my pneumatic pulse ciruit is not working very well. it will not recharge fast enough to shoot the gun past 6 bps or so. I added an exhaust valve to spped it up but then i realized that it as going to make it cycle on it's own, which it did. kinda funny. it goes full auto, at a break neck speed of 6 bps. :rolleyes:

so I think I'm going to mill th grip out some more, buy a morlock, and look for a small 3-way solenoid valve to cram in the grip. an e-mag, with no large battery pack, runs off a 9 volt, has a standard valve, and well see how fast I can get it to go.

Hephaestus
02-07-2004, 09:37 PM
WOW! Finally hit over 4000 views. With some people having to dig deep to find out about it. Dedicated bunch out there :) Wish I could show you my custom double trigger guard made for that carbon frame.

It seems that I still can't attach images with AO and uploadit has a time limit with max of 20 pics hosted.

Slowly some of these pics are just going to disapear off these pages. And I will be editing(deleting) out lots of dead posts that have no pics.

Glad some of you had enjoyed following it.

Hephaestus
04-15-2004, 06:47 PM
My Latest Update Pic :)

Trying to upload this pic with Jayloo.com
Hope that this one will work out easier.

http://www.jayloo.com/lib/get_file.php?id=2254

Person
04-15-2004, 10:28 PM
how much for one of those guards :D

Hephaestus
04-15-2004, 10:53 PM
Sorry to say :(

I will not be making any guards to sell because it has to be customized to fit, and the one above will not allow you to attach on your foregrip.

You are welcome to use my shown example and try making one of your own.
If you have any questions about making one yourself just ask.

Having only shot a case of paint I will wait a little longer before annodizing it black. The total weight of the above setup without hopper is only 5 lbs.
Its light enough and I don't want to take off anymore.
Next part to look at is maybe attach on a foregrip of some sort.
http://www.jayloo.com/lib/get_file.php?id=2273
Here is an old pic I had laying around. Re-loading it again.

syko2102
05-10-2004, 02:53 AM
I have just finished my custom sydarm-ish marker and will post a pic as soon as I can figure out how.

syko2102
05-14-2004, 02:09 AM
here's my cutom sydarm projhttp://img13.imageshack.us/img13/1002/sydarmmin.JPG

Hephaestus
05-15-2004, 12:48 AM
syko2102,

I really like your custom sydarm, Especially the quickchange design you got there. Did you TIG weld it yourself? A little polishing and its going to be a show piece for sure. Dare to show me how you plumed the other side from the QC to the valve. Looks like some nice custom machining done for that back end you got there. I like you reloading idea very much on that top tube too. NICE IDEA! Looks really COOL! Bet that you still have lots to do to finish it eh!

Thanks for showing your project.
Keep Updating us with your upgrades.

- Heph

PS - Do you know how to make your own spring for the magazine? Its really easy if you got some of the right stuff (0.015-0.020 piano wire)

syko2102
05-20-2004, 09:27 AM
I did not do the tig welding myself, but thats about it. I made all the internal stuff from aluminum, with the exception of the delrin plunger and agd powerfeed plug. The quickchange is sweet, but the spring feed is the hard part. I cant find a spring that long for the feed. The other side is a micro line hookup and I will post the other side as soon as possible.

paintball_fiend
05-20-2004, 07:52 PM
if you can get ahold of a spring form any clip fed pistol it would work gread with some triming

syko2102
05-21-2004, 12:55 AM
I like both spring ideas, although I dont know if a clip spring is too strong and would dimple the paintballs. If anyone knows where to find a clip spring about 10" long I'm all ears. I really like the piano wire idea, but have no idea how to construct a spring from it, but would be willing to learn.

PS I have it working now, bead blasted and with the first round of abrasive. (pic soon) All I have to say though is wow! :D It's like a hand cannon with noise, and on a warm day will rapid fire three balls REALLY nice.

ryryb123
05-21-2004, 10:37 PM
i made an aluminum trigger frame...but i have no clue how to upload pics?? :confused: does this work?

Ryan

Hephaestus
05-22-2004, 01:11 PM
ryryb123,

Nice CNC work on that frame you got there! Looks sweet! I want to keep track of your progress so please keep us posted.

BTW welcome aboard! Noticed that you had just joined AO this month!
Nice start!

syko2102,

Making your own spring is really easy.
Do you have a drill press by chance?
My contraption uses a simple setup with the drill press chuck.
And "No Electrical Power" is needed because you turn it by hand.
I will be posting you some DIY pictures ASAP.

For the spring you are going to need, I am guessing that you will have to find an object with a 1/4~ 5/16 diameter to wrap the piano wire around. I'd use a 4" long bolt or steel rod if possible. Using a smaller diameter rod is no problem because the coils will expand after the tension is released. To put the tension on the piano wire I simply use anything I can find to put tension on the wire. Try two small blocks of hard wood and a C-clamp. Proper tension is crucial in getting the spring to form properly. I usually have to find out the best combination by trial so don't worry if your first one dosn't turn out. When wrapping the wire around the rod, you can have the wires touching each other when spooling. Try at least 20 good wraps around the rod to start then strech and cut it to length.

Good luck.

Hephaestus
05-22-2004, 02:19 PM
Heres a try with AO's File Attachment.

vf-xx
05-22-2004, 05:26 PM
so you turn your drill press by hand and let the wire cut just a touch into the wood block so it can slide a bit?

Hephaestus
05-22-2004, 05:56 PM
Thats right vf-xx.

Turning it slowly by hand gives you the chance to feel the tension of the wire and also lets you guide the wire accurately on. (keep the tension- do not let out the tension on the wire untill you have at least done 20 turns) Letting the wire cut a groove into the block of wood is no problem. My pic only showed one block but a second thinner one to sandwich the wire would be necessary to do it properly. The end of the wire is kinked into a "L" and inserted to be gripped in the drill chuck. This will keep it from slipping out. All I have to say is that the tension needs to be tight to be able to draw the steel wire into its new form. You can score the wood with a thin blade to give the wire a starting point if you like.

ryryb123
05-22-2004, 06:04 PM
hey guys,
thanks heph! i need to do some final cnc work when i get back to school, but right now im working on polishing. if anyone needs one, i may be able to make them one, depending on the price ;)

here are 2 more pics




thanks guys,

Ryan

Hephaestus
05-22-2004, 06:09 PM
ryryb123,

Just curious:) Got a scale to weigh it?
Looks like a feather lite!
Slotting it will be the next fun part eh!

Kudos. Keep up the nice work.

- Heph

ryryb123
05-22-2004, 06:15 PM
no sorry hept,
i dont have a scale to weigh it on right now, i will when i get to work tomarrow. ill let you know. : )

syko2102
05-22-2004, 06:23 PM
ryry, how were you planning on cutting the hole for the sear's trigger rod? :confused:

syko2102
05-22-2004, 07:08 PM
here's updated sydarm pics

http://http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/6713/airlinesyd11.jpg

http://http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/7382/syd11.jpg

syko2102
05-22-2004, 07:12 PM
ahh thats better


No it's not. 1600x1200 is WAY too big. No reason to punish modem users. Pics deleted.

Gunga

syko2102
05-22-2004, 07:14 PM
My other project, vert feed tippmann. Still has layout dye on it and everything.

*POOF* See post above.

JonDaAzn
05-22-2004, 07:17 PM
mag is very very nice!, can't wait to see how the tippman turns out

ryryb123
05-23-2004, 10:50 AM
skyo,
im planning on clamping it in a vise, making sure its perfectly level, finding 0,0 and cutting it with an 1/8in milling bit. im pretty sure it will work. its really just a straight cut...ya know, one of these would look pretty nice on your gun ;)

Ryan

syko2102
05-23-2004, 04:49 PM
I figured as much, but I was mostly curious as to how you were going to cut more than half inch down into the grip. i.e. Are you using a 1/8" cutter with flutes longer than 1/2 inch?

ryryb123
05-23-2004, 07:51 PM
skyo,
yea, im cutting it with .75in flutes. im pretty sure it will work. ill keep you posted.

Ryan

Hephaestus
12-03-2004, 08:59 PM
My Last update.

Here it is finally Annodized!
Just the way I wanted it :)

luke
12-06-2004, 08:56 AM
Nice work... :cool:

Automaggot88
12-06-2004, 11:23 PM
WoW!! Sweet custom mag man! Nice lookin Mag you made yerself!
:dance: :dance: :dance: Banana

Hephaestus
07-05-2011, 12:54 AM
Amazing to see just how many hits this had gotten even after laying dormant for over so many years :D
Someone had to go through some extra effort to dig this one out to even view it.

Anyways thanks for checking it out!

- Heph

sQuidvision
07-05-2011, 03:30 AM
Amazing to see just how many hits this had gotten even after laying dormant for over so many years :D
Someone had to go through some extra effort to dig this one out to even view it.

Anyways thanks for checking it out!

- Heph


Wow! i was about to call this the greatest necro-post i have seen in years but because it was you Heph i think we can call it a bump ;)

Great work! do you have a current pic of this project?

Hephaestus
07-05-2011, 07:01 PM
Yea just a teaser. I was going to up load a bull pup I designed in S0lidw0rks but hit a snafu.
Haven't uploaded to a file sever in half a decade ;)
Something with a bottom feed using a MILSIG magazine.

- H

billybob_81067
07-05-2011, 11:45 PM
Weird... I have been pulling out all my old guns and starting to work on them again! Ahh this brings back some memories!

Lol.

And it all started cause my kids bought me a BKO at a yardsale for Father's day! It's amazing how this stuff I used to dream of owning is so dirt cheap anymore. :eek:

Big'n slo
07-06-2011, 07:28 AM
:sleeping:

Oh hey!

Sucks that all the pictures are gone...

doc_Zox
07-12-2011, 03:14 PM
last nights effort:
http://premium1.uploadit.org/docZox/PB/LongbowmodLGw.jpg