Jim Drew: Banned from PBN, mounting a sanitation campain on other boards!

[cledford]

Looks like Jim finally nailed his coffin shut on PBN. It appears he posted some things that later he decided could get him into trouble and asked that his user_id be deleted and EVERY post he ever made removed. It smacks of some type of sanitation campaign and he admitted that he was deleting hundreds of old posts a day from PBN as well as all other forums as well. I'm wondering if there is some sort of law suit pending due to the advent of his Impulse board :)

Anyhow, it might be worth the time find and archive all of the WAS posts you can find as quickly as possible - they look to become collectors items soon.

Here is the PBN thread about the whole thing.

http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=356944&perpage=21&pagenumber=1

Jim tries to claim that he is just "consolidating all information about his products onto a (his)single forum" but Manike slaps him down with a pointed comment about what an insult deleting such posts are to his client who he used to brag about selling to by word of mouth.

The funniest part of the thread is when he threatens to sue PBN for not removing posts he freely made in the public domain!

As an aside, way back to the days of the first run-ins with Jim over his "pioneering use of the HES in paintball" and the classic Timmy shootdown issue his posts have had a funny way of disappearing.

-Calvin

[Harbinger[TG]]

PBN is NOT deleting his posts for obvious reasons.

Heres some pertinent links:

http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=3558590#post3558590

http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=3558601#post3558601

http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=368993

Its pretty spread out across those threads, and there are additional links in said threads as well.


As for his stuff mysteriously dissappearing, i have locked and saved as much as possible in this matter wherever possible. I dont MOD alot of sections, but i do however MOD the ICD area.

IMO it was his constant "poop" starting vs. the ICD users that caused him to leave. After repeatedly getting owned on the PBN boards, post after post....i think he finally realized we gave him enough rope to hang himself. It was only a matter of time before everyone realized what a complete dip he is. Here is the last ICD thread, locked and saved for again...obvious reasons.

[email protected] if you need anything else

[shartley]

I don't see any legal grounds for a law suit. But that ploy often works against those too ignorant to know better.

This is all very interesting to say the least…. And it really does not make any rational sense. You want your information on as many places as possible, not organized in one spot…. Unless you are trying to protect yourself... for whatever reason.

[Steelrat]

I was just going to post about this. I don't know what happened, but the mods would be well advised to just delete the stuff rather than create a headache for themselves. You would think this would affect Jim's company, but as the SP case has proven, massive public outcry on the PB forums does not equate to actual impact on the companies.

Were his account and posts deleted from AO?

[Miscue]

Maybe his TurboRev can hack into PBN and baleet all his stuff.

[Dayspring]

I was waiting to see how long it would take for Miscue to chime in. :D

[shartley]

Originally posted by Steelrat
I was just going to post about this. I don't know what happened, but the mods would be well advised to just delete the stuff rather than create a headache for themselves. You would think this would affect Jim's company, but as the SP case has proven, massive public outcry on the PB forums does not equate to actual impact on the companies.

Were his account and posts deleted from AO?
Why would PBN need to delete his posts? If Jim Drew MADE the posts on an open forum, then HE can go and delete them if he wants. PBN is under NO obligation to delete something JIM DREW posted of his own free will.

I can see it now.. “I know ABC interviewed me, but because I said something stupid I will demand they not show it.” Yeah, that’s the ticket!

But you are right, the PBN posts will not affect his sales to the manufacturers, who are his main target. But it also does not mean his product is better either. Sales alone does not indicate anything but sales, not quality… no matter how much those with high sales want people to believe. If that was true, a Ford Escort would be a better car than a McClaren F-1. ;)

I have been reading all those threads since I first posted in this thread…. and sorry, Jim does not have a leg to stand on. It is entertaining though.

[beam]

He was trying to delete them and PBN mod banned his WAS account. So he can't delete them himself. So, in a way, PBN is preventing him from deleting his own posts. But that still is in their right and power to do.

[Harbinger[TG]]

Originally posted by beam
He was trying to delete them and PBN mod banned his WAS account. So he can't delete them himself. So, in a way, PBN is preventing him from deleting his own posts. But that still is in their right and power to do.

Even if he wasnt banned he CANNOT delete posts in locked threads.

[Jack & Coke]

Originally posted by Miscue
Maybe his TurboRev can hack into PBN and baleet all his stuff.

http://www.automags.org/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=433686

[shartley]

Correct, even if prevented from deleting his own posts, it is in their right to do so. JD published these posts himself. He does not control PBN, but can control whether he posts or not. His choice.

We all make bad choices now and again, and some more than others. Such is life….

[Harbinger[TG]]

LMFAO

thats a good one. Dont forget the sidewinder missle technology used for testing...did you know that sidewinders are from china in the late 1950s...

[SlartyBartFast]

Maybe one of the original board manufacturers are suing for slander. Considering all the unsubstantiated claims he made....

[cledford]

I doubt Jim's account is banned here and it is likely he will (or has) destroyed his legacy on this site already.

Jim Drew has been a hot topic for almost 2 years and has (IMHO) come to be the human embodiment of what many of us find fault with in most of Paintball's product developers. He only helped fuel this image by how he put himself out there time and again with all of his double speak and back tracking. Someday in the future of paintball I expect his name to stand out as one of those who actions led to a big change for the better in our still emerging/developing infant sport. Jim in my mind is destined to be infamous and his posts should remain as part of the record.

We at AO are actively trying to usher in a new "age" for paintball, one where product manufacturers provide more than hot-air to back up their marketing and claims. Jim Drew has helped create this movement. His posts should be protected.

-Calvin

[hardr0ck68]

he makes so many false statements its amusing to finally see him squirm....does this mean no WAS warp board?? i was lookin forward to Miscue takin a look at one. I have never laughed as hard as Miscues tear down of the turbo rev board, i was lookin forwatd to the was warp....oh well

[DiRTyBuNNy]

Hey..don't I get any love for my "Bea vs. WAS" thread (that was ultimately deleted)?

[ScatterPlot]

If it's not too hard to do, could someone please explain what the crap is going on? Who is Jim Drew (WAS guy I think?) What did he do wrong? And is there no new Warp board? :(

[SlartyBartFast]

The Jim Drew saga isn't new and it isn't limited to paintball.

Is history repeating itself?
http://www.lysator.liu.se/amiga/al/guide/al102/jim_drew_good_or_bad.HTML

[DiRTyBuNNy]

Originally posted by SlartyBartFast
The Jim Drew saga isn't new and it isn't limited to paintball.

Is history repeating itself?
http://www.lysator.liu.se/amiga/al/guide/al102/jim_drew_good_or_bad.HTML

yeah...probably...but if he wasn't such a self-promoting jerk it wouldn't happen...and if people were smart enough to do some research and call people on the carpet for acting that way..it wouldn't keep happening..

[cledford]

Some Drew goodies from his last thread...

================================================== ==
The sensor that I created has the ability to measure distance. By having this capability, we know exactly where the ball is located in the breech.

With the Intimdiator, Angel Speed (with Equalizer), Viking, Bushmaster, etc. there is some delay period required due to the eyes being placed too high in the breech. This delay period must be made for the worst case scenario (gravity feed hopper), and thus the potential rate of fire will be reduced because of it. With the Intimidator, the time it takes to pressurize the hoses is sufficient enough of a delay, but with the Angel and Bushmaster (where the pneumatics are faster) the delay must be much longer. When using the sensor that I designed (which has a specific focal point based on a .690 ball curvature), I can tell you exactly how far from the bottom of the breech the ball is to within ~.001" accuracy. There is absolutely no delay period necessary, and as a result the potential rate of fire is highest possible.
================================================== ===

I would expect this type of response from you. I have provided real data, backed by test equipment results and independant testing. You seem to forget that developing cutting edge products is what I do daily, so I am use to having test equipment running and comparing competing products. "Lies" don't exist, and I have never taken people's money for product and not given anything to them for months on end. I run a real multi-million dollar business, not some fly-by-night operation.

================================================== ====

Manufacturers have a pretty reasonable say in what goes in their markers, as they have the power to void warranties for anything that is not approved by them (regardless of what laws you look at).

Goldie, I have no clue who you are. I know that Defiance was involved with the board at some point and his business history is what I was referring to... something that is easy to find with a quick search via PBNATION.

Want a hugely successful company? How about 7 of them (like what I now have)? Make cutting edge products and promote them until people are absolutely sick of you! Who knew of Wicked Air Sportz a year ago? Nobody... but now with more than 20,000 Equalizer boards being used, I can go to any event and hang out with pros, celebrities, and regular players, and everyone knows who I am. We will exceed Smart Parts' net profit this year in revenue. Not bad for a company that has spent $0 advertising. Get agressive... but you better have the best product going or you will go down in flames!

================================================== =====

The quality difference is probably easy to prove... our boards are made and inspected with panels of sidewinder missle controller boards. The PCBs are electrically tested prior to SMT. They are then built, x-ray'd, hand inspected, electrically tested, and then a sample is cross sectioned to check quality of each run. You get what you pay for.

================================================== =====

Someone asked about how to make a company bigger, and I was siting stats... this had nothing to do with better coding.

Contribution margin without R&D costs is roughly 93%. The R&D number is a variable that is controlled by the CPAs to work their magic. We are not a public company (and neither is the company that owns Wicked Air Sportz), but the return on equity is exceptionally high because of the fact that the technology is repeatitive, requiring no real maintenance or change. Once the initial investment was made, there were no unexpected expendatures. In fact, I made it a point that when the boards were designed that all boards use the exact same components to further the production cost savings. Using a military contractor allows us to offer a lifetime warranty (an attactive selling point), as well as limit the number of returns which requires resources to correct. In the end, the use of the contractor has saved us thousands of dollars.

================================================== =====

[cledford]

================================================== =========

I didn't get banned. I asked that all of the posts made by WickedAirSportz be removed from PBNATION and the account be terminated (I PM'd Timebomb asking for this request, and fortunately I saved his reply so that Jon could view it if necessary). Instead of following through with my request (which he stated he would), he left all of the messages and banned the account. Brilliant. I will be contacting Jon about this matter.

P.S. Nobody hacked our boards, and there are no "special" boards except for Bob's personal boards that show cycle time and other diagnostic info.

================================================== ==========

I want all of the messages posted under WickedAirSportz removed, as you stated you would. If necessary I will seek a court order to see that this is done.

================================================== ==========

I was told that my posts would be removed. Prior to that, I had been deleting dozens of posts daily. Banning the account removes the ability to do this. Nonetheless, I am already in contact with Tony, so I believe this situation will be taken care of now.

================================================== ==========

Technically, it is liable (because of being in print). Not too funny, actually.

================================================== ===========

After chatting with Bob Long and doing inventory this week, we have calculated that about 91% of all Intimidators sold have Equalizer boards installed in them! This is assuming we have sold about 300 Intimidator Equalizer boards to Bushmaster owners (as we have noted).

I just wanted to say THANKS to all Intimidator owners for their support and believing in our products!
FRom last 2 threads...

================================================== ============

I just asked that my 3000+ posts be removed from the database. I have already deliberately deleted posts in the middle of numerous threads so that don't make any sense now when you read them. I asked you to remove them all, and you stated exactly what you would do (including "taking care of the imposter account"). I was told by several of the mods that removing all posts from a user is accomplished with a few simple mouse clicks. It would have been far easier to comply (and never have to deal with me again) than to start a war with me.

After seeing PBNATION magazine on the newstand and getting ad rates, I was seriously considering using that magazine as the mainstay for our ads. After the issue with the mods, and now this, I can't see spending my money with anything associated with PBNATION.

[cledford]

Hmmm, rumors of special "cheater boards" for the Ironmen...

================================================== =======

Posted by timebomb at http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=356944&perpage=21&pagenumber=4

I read most of the thread as well, he's a tard. And another funny thing to mention is the fact that I recently came across a cheater board of his from the Bob Long Ironmen (has players name written on board, and it's a 2.0 which equalinks do not work with.), funny how he claimed none of his stuff was cheater yet this board (even tried in 3 guns to ensure it wasn't a weird microswitch) starts bouncing at 10bps and over, even though the debounce is set to 30ms. So he has one of two things he can say...

1. he can claim someone hacked his board and changed the settings so his argument against those of you guys with new boards and what not will also fall onto his shoulders

2. he put it in on his own knowingly, willingly, and illegally.

OH well, guess his lies extend yet again.

Mike

================================================== ========

posted by GZgurl at same URL

Mike, I've shot a gun with that board in it, and I beleive it's reffered to as the mysterious white board, I was unaware who produced it til now tho

================================================== =========

[Pacifist_Farmer]

I think stories like these warrant actions!

We need to coin a phrase, kinda like calling someone a Benedict Arnold, except it would be Jim Drew

[SlartyBartFast]

If so, sounds like the death nell of WAS.

Could it also be the death nell of ALL electronic programmable boards? THAT might be a good thing for the tournament scene.

Cheater boards. Who'd have thought it.:rolleyes:

And as far as deleting posts goes, that's pathetic. Although I use it, I'm even against the posibility of editing posts. What you say in public SHOULD be kept. Especially when the posts of so many others in a thread depend on what you've posted.

Well, if WAS wasn't behind cheater boards, it's hardly rocket science. Spend a couple of minutes on Google looking at PIC programming. A few bucks, some time spent, and you can be programming your own microcontrollers.

Even if a chip is locked, it's not much work or skill to solder in a new PIC with the clandestine code.

WAS would have liked you to beleive it's rocket science, but it isn't.

So what are everyones guesses as to who is after Jim Drew?

[AGD]

[i]
So what are everyones guesses as to who is after Jim Drew? [/B]

Hey I will step up, need to find my marketing hat, its around here somewhere......

AGD

[SlartyBartFast]

Originally posted by AGD
Hey I will step up, need to find my marketing hat, its around here somewhere......

AGD

Cute.:D

But you'd need a magician's hat to replace WAS. Only a true conjurer can make that much use out of smoke and mirrors. :D

But that's not what I meant. What I meant is, does anybody know who/what has WAS in such a panic? Obviously someone has threatened him with serious harm (financial or otherwise) based on something he said and he's in a panic to remove all traces.

Which brings up an interesting point. In a legal battle, discussion boards could get sued for destruction of evidence if they didn't keep good backups.

But try as he might, if it's serious Jim will learn that lot's of things posted on the 'Net are eternal.;)

[Smoke]

My my my....this certainly is interesting.....

[adam shannon]

if hes being sued by...oh, say, the gardners their lawyers already have every word he has ever written or spoken in public before they ever filed. so hes just adding a charge of destruction of evidence. its like watching a tv crime show and seeing the clumsy after the act attempt to wipe fingerprints and such...funny.

the funniest thing was sying that he was going to use pbn magazine for all his advertising. from what ive heard pbn magazine and the pbn boards are two seperate entities from diffrent people and theres already a legal battle between those two for name swiping.

[ogre55]

Originally posted by adam shannon
if hes being sued by...oh, say, the gardners their lawyers already have every word he has ever written or spoken in public before they ever filed. so hes just adding a charge of destruction of evidence. its like watching a tv crime show and seeing the clumsy after the act attempt to wipe fingerprints and such...funny.

the funniest thing was sying that he was going to use pbn magazine for all his advertising. from what ive heard pbn magazine and the pbn boards are two seperate entities from diffrent people and theres already a legal battle between those two for name swiping.

I second that notion. What is obvious is that someone definetely have Jim Drew's gonads in a vice and they are squeezing....hard.

This guy does most of his advertising on the pb boards. For him to try to take down all those post, it seems that he is killing the goose that lays his golden eggs.

Ogre

[hitech]

Originally posted by SlartyBartFast
In a legal battle, discussion boards could get sued for destruction of evidence if they didn't keep good backups.


Are you sure about that? I doubt it. I'm not aware of any law requiring anyone to keep information just in case someone wants it for a law suit.

[adam shannon]

but if a suit has already been filed and records requested or subpoenad and you conciously attempt to destroy them then your hosed. people are going under the assumption that some legal action has been threatened or taken.

[hitech]

Originally posted by adam shannon
but if a suit has already been filed and records requested or subpoenad and you conciously attempt to destroy them then your hosed. people are going under the assumption that some legal action has been threatened or taken.

I don't know the law, but unless the records have been subpoenaed it's unlikely that anyone would be responsible for destroying it. Also, even if PBN was subpoenaed, if Jim Drew deletes the posts, PBN is unlikely to be held responsible. Jim on the other hand...

[Jack & Coke]

http://imageshack.us/files/wasbanned.JPG

[pbzmag]

Eventhough WAS deleted most of his posts, PBN will still have the backups.

[Jon/xpm]

I heard Jim Drew ask to get banned him self
so no one can try and use his user name....
But i dont really care
Everything gets blow out of proportion
like the smart parts thing...
Probably most of this and that talk is total bs
and rumors

[shartley]

Originally posted by Jon/xpm
I heard Jim Drew ask to get banned him self
so no one can try and use his user name....
But i dont really care
Everything gets blow out of proportion
like the smart parts thing...
Probably most of this and that talk is total bs
and rumors
The speculation of WHY may be rumors, but what he POSTED is not. The last time I checked (earlier in the day) quite a lot of his posts were still there…. feel free to go read.

And I wonder…. If someone QUOTES someone, and then they (the one being qouted) deleted all their posts, would their “quoted” stuff disappear as well? ;)

[ej_y4]

i bet Lasoya had one of those cheater boards when he was bann from the Pan Am. he claimed he pulled the trigger 6 times, but the guy was hit in the head 12 times.
As for Jim drew....Why did people listen to his crazy claims in the first place?

[Jon/xpm]

"I don't put faces in my posts to make them 'credible'. I do it because there has been a HUGE problem with folks not taking my posts in the manner in which they were intended." -Shartley
---
You know, when there's a "HUGE problem" with folks not taking your posts the way they were intended, possibilities are, smilies and winks arent the remedy... Just a thought...
...

[DiRTyBuNNy]

I don't know if I believe that...but I don't think it would out of the realm of possibility that some teams may actually be using a different version of software (it's really firmware..but oh well..details details) than what the general public can obtain...

[shartley]

Originally posted by Jon/xpm
"I don't put faces in my posts to make them 'credible'. I do it because there has been a HUGE problem with folks not taking my posts in the manner in which they were intended." -Shartley
---
You know, when there's a "HUGE problem" with folks not taking your posts the way they were intended, possibilities are, smilies and winks arent the remedy... Just a thought...
...
Yeah, I saw that in another member’s signature as well. But unlike THAT, I was talking about quoting the WHOLE post and not taking parts out of context.

And to rebut that…… No, there are many folks that will see exactly what they WANT to see in a post… and THAT was the problem, not what I was posting.

But hey, if folks are so concerned with me, and feel the need to put things like that in their signatures who really has the problem? ;) Just a thought….

And I would suggest NOT making this into an issue about ME. I have NOTHING to do with the topic being discussed. Thanks. :D

[Steelrat]

For all his bluster, his products are pretty good. The WAS board transformed the Viking.

And when I said the mods were better off deleting the stuff; He probably doesnt have a leg to stand on legally, but that doesnt mean he couldn't create a giant headache for all the PBM mods if he wanted to. If he wants to cut and run, they should just let him, and be done with him. At this point they are just aggrivating him for their own amusement. Why not taking a higher moral ground and just end it all?

[Meph]

Originally posted by cledford
================================================== =========

After seeing PBNATION magazine on the newstand and getting ad rates, I was seriously considering using that magazine as the mainstay for our ads. After the issue with the mods, and now this, I can't see spending my money with anything associated with PBNATION.


Best part about this is that Brainiac doesn't realize that not only is Paintball Nation Magazine completely seperate and owned by Jon. But to prove how truly seperate they are Jon was actually banned on PBN.com for "corporate spamming" (aka plugging his magazine).

[cledford]

According to this poster (amb8):

"No wonder Bob droped you like a bad habit, for those of you that dont know, new Timmy's will not becoming out with WAS boards, but there own board, and from what i have heard its better, and cheaper.... O wait i best chill, or hes gonna sue me ROFL..... Sounds like some 12 year old kid..."

Nor sure if it's true - but it can be found here...

http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=348591&perpage=21&highlight=\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\%20jim%20\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\%20 drew&pagenumber=12

(cut and paste link)

[Phil]

Its hard to imagine that a company associated with paintball products or any company for that matter might make extra-ordinary claims about their products. I don't think I have ever read a post by an owner of one of his products saying anything other than they love it. When he posted on here about a board for the warp feed everyone was kissing his butt. It seems to me that alot of people get a charge out of beating the Jim Drew/dead horse. Alot of it just seems to be out of meaness to me. How hard would it have been for the pbn guy to "rise above it" and just do as he asked.

[Jon/xpm]

shartley-where do you think i got it from....
I got it from another member because its fuNNy...
So please post a smile in each post
so people would read what you post
hahahah....

Sry i did not want to read the whole post
I only posted and left...
This is like a smart parts thing all over again
HyPe :p

Well if you did not have a problem with it
You would not waste your time of typing something up
So im under your skin and you hate it...

[shartley]

Originally posted by Jon/xpm
shartley-where do you think i got it from....
I got it from another member because its fuNNy...
So please post a smile in each post
so people would read what you post
hahahah....

Sry i did not want to read the whole post
I only posted and left...
This is like a smart parts thing all over again
HyPe :p

Well if you did not have a problem with it
You would not waste your time of typing something up
So im under your skin and you hate it...
LOL :D

Or would a simple :) work better? ;)

Actually though, I don’t need to have a “problem” with something to take a little time to post about it. And you are also not under my skin and I don’t “hate” it. ;)

Now that THAT is cleared up… on with the actual topic of the thread…….

(oh, I forgot......)

:)

[Jon/xpm]

Subject is over rated in this thread...

Enough with the smiles
they do not persuade me or anyone
that your very serious

[GT]

honestly,
if Jim didnt pony up and build a board for the excal and vik they wouldnt be as popular, however the guy is still schlong.

[Harbinger[TG]]

Originally posted by Phil
Its hard to imagine that a company associated with paintball products or any company for that matter might make extra-ordinary claims about their products. I don't think I have ever read a post by an owner of one of his products saying anything other than they love it. When he posted on here about a board for the warp feed everyone was kissing his butt. It seems to me that alot of people get a charge out of beating the Jim Drew/dead horse. Alot of it just seems to be out of meaness to me. How hard would it have been for the pbn guy to "rise above it" and just do as he asked.
Rise above what?
You probably just dont get it. im not gonna explain it again. Why should we delete evidence after he threatened to sue us/me/PBN numerous times. We would be either fools or morons to delete evidence

[GatoLoco]

why would he WANT delete them all in the first place?

[rdb123]

[TC]Harbringer, care to enlighten us as to why in the middle of reading the link you posted, I clicked to move to a different page of that thread, and received the invalid link error message? ;)

Thanks

[cledford]

Anyone know where the info from the PBN Angel Forum thread that pissed Jim off with the details of how to build an Equilink cable at home is?

-Calvin

[SlartyBartFast]

Originally posted by cledford
Anyone know where the info from the PBN Angel Forum thread that pissed Jim off with the details of how to build an Equilink cable at home is?

-Calvin

You'd have to be pretty retarded not to be able to figure it out yourself. It's just a serial connector, some wire, and a standard micro four-pin connector. The way you connect them is standard for any onboard programming for any PIC microcontroller out there.

Go to the chip manufacturers website and you can be up a programming chips in no time. The compilers and chip programming software is even free from many sources.

Despite some people's claims *cough*WAS*cough* it is far from rocket science. That's why all electronic markers are really a cheater's paradise....

And that applies to WAS Equaliser boards, E-mags, and any other electronic marker that's controled by a microchip.

[M-a-s-sDriver]

"WAS"...As in:
"Who WAS that Guy?"
"Jim Drew WAS making Timmy Boards"
"WAS that a cheater board?"
"Why WAS he here?"
"What WAS the big deal"
"Hey! WAS that my beer you spilled, you D*ck?!"

Feel free to chime in.
Brent.

[MayAMonkeyBeYourPinata]

Originally posted by GatoLoco
why would he WANT delete them all in the first place?

To dispose of evidence incase, he gets sued

[Harbinger[TG]]

Originally posted by rdb123
[TC]Harbringer, care to enlighten us as to why in the middle of reading the link you posted, I clicked to move to a different page of that thread, and received the invalid link error message? ;)

Thanks

Its Harbinger[TG]

and last night the admins deleted everything. They dont want any reason for Jim to come back and start more problems.

[rdb123]

Originally posted by Harbinger[TG]


Its Harbinger[TG]

and last night the admins deleted everything. They dont want any reason for Jim to come back and start more problems.

Ah ok. Sorry for butchering your name. ;)

[Miscue]

Caved in huh... :rolleyes:

[shartley]

I would like to know how Jim Drew could come back and cause more trouble? They were HIS posts that HE made of his own free will. If he came back to “cause problems” he would only be making himself look worse. He KNEW he was publishing comments on a medium that was open to the public and that he did not have control over.

It would be one thing if he was complaining about other people’s posts, and bringing up slander/libel issues (although I have not seen any of that happening, or other than his claims), but if he was to cause problems because of his own posts he would have to take himself to court as well. Now THAT would be entertaining.

I suppose that PBN has to do what they think is best for them, but I don’t see how this is really preventing anything to worry about.

[cledford]

Originally posted by Harbinger[TG]

And last night the admins deleted everything. They dont want any reason for Jim to come back and start more problems.

How lame - I've got zero respect for PBN now. Losers like Jim make pseudo compelling threats and instead of bothering to even decide if they are valid, people just knuckle under and claim "is was just easier - now we're done with him." What a bunch of lame, no-spine, pansies. Who knows what they destroyed or how much they may have helped him out while setting someone else back.

People like the PBN Admins are the ones whole give the Jim Drew's reason to keep up teir ways; why wouldn't someone continue to make lbogus legal threats and do as he likes - when everyone always caves to his agenda?

-Calvin

[cledford]

Originally posted by shartley

I suppose that PBN has to do what they think is best for them, but I don’t see how this is really preventing anything to worry about.

I have no way of proving anything - but back during the "Timmy shootdown war" once Jims lies from previous threads really started haunting him he started a clean up campaign. It involved mods and mysteriously, the database crashed right in the midst of the whole thing - causing months of threads/posts to be lost. I always wonder about that...

-Calvin

[WARPED1]

My question, who cares? We all know he's the best source for disinformation and outright lies. And who cares what BSNation does?

[QUINCYMASSGUY]

EDIT: It wasn't WARPED1 it was CPSUPERKID or something like that who really made a big deal of J+C and I not believing Jim Drew. My bad WARPED1, sorry.

[WARPED1]

He has been proven wrong, won't offer proof of tests, and has been caught in lies. He has earned any critizism I give him.

[thei3ug]

jthis action by PBN shows what little respect the admins have for their own customers as well as the average consumer.

To delete any of his posts or to modify them in any way is a sham in itself.

[Jack & Coke]

Originally posted by WARPED1
He has been proven wrong, won't offer proof of tests, and has been caught in lies. He has earned any critizism I give him.

Just for my clarification... to whom are you refering to?

[FallNAngel]

Originally posted by cledford

How lame - I've got zero respect for PBN now. Losers like Jim make pseudo compelling threats and instead of bothering to even decide if they are valid, people just knuckle under and claim "is was just easier - now we're done with him." What a bunch of lame, no-spine, pansies. Who knows what they destroyed or how much they may have helped him out while setting someone else back.

People like the PBN Admins are the ones whole give the Jim Drew's reason to keep up teir ways; why wouldn't someone continue to make lbogus legal threats and do as he likes - when everyone always caves to his agenda?

-Calvin

I completely 100% agree. I had been planning on coming back to this thread (which is why I'm here now) to applaud their decision to basically say "piss off" to Jim, but instead I find they caved in. Now perhaps there were other things that the PBN staff isn't saying, but does it matter? It's not like we'd ever find out anyway. My point is JDrew basically lied about his products and put down others for no reason. Now instead of having the proof of what was said to discredit these claims, there's nothing. Of course, if you were to go to the WAS forums to ask about these things, I'm sure you'd just be banned and your post deleted. Personally, I would've just banned the JDrew name on the basis that the WAS user was banned and he created another name to circumvent that, which is a violation of the TOS on the board. But that's just me.

[Barfly]

actually I have a video of a guy claiming 40 cps on his was viking. I think if it isn't 40 it is frickin close though

[Furby]

Jim's first mistake was asking Timebomb for help...he should have known better.

Now that Jim is banned from PBN, where will he go now?

Ah well...it's all drama.

[Jack & Coke]

Originally posted by Barfly
actually I have a video of a guy claiming 40 cps on his was viking. I think if it isn't 40 it is frickin close though

Awesome! Could you please post it in a new thread?

Unfortunately, EVERY "proof video" of 40 BPS to date has been to so poorly recorded and encoded, that it is impossible to analyze for any ROF conclusions.:(

(back to the topic of Jim Drew and PBN)

[Barfly]

alright I will try, but it is low quality like what you were talkin about. I need to find the link, I might have got it off of darkviking.com, but I looked for it and couldn't find it.

[FallNAngel]

Originally posted by Jack & Coke


Awesome! Could you please post it in a new thread?

Unfortunately, EVERY "proof video" of 40 BPS to date has been to so poorly recorded and encoded, that it is impossible to analyze for any ROF conclusions.:(

(back to the topic of Jim Drew and PBN)

Notice he said 40cps, not 40bps. Big difference. 40cps isn't a huge deal, 40bps would be though.

[QUINCYMASSGUY]

I think he's referring to the Frosh (Froth? Whatever that guy's name is) vid and it definitely was too distorted to measure, plus he admitted echoes may have factored in, which makes sense if he enhanced it.

I am dying to know what specifically happened to send Jim scurrying with his tail between his legs, because it's apparently enough of a deal that he hasn't even dared post his opinion in this thread about all of us talking about it. He's still active on AO right?

[Barfly]

yeah it is the froth one and I did post the link it was under the thread "jim drew is an honest man mmmkay"
Froth is going fast.

[QUINCYMASSGUY]

Whoah, I just looked at Wickedairsportz's info for AO and it says he's banned here too, but none of his last threads seem to indicate why or even seem to hold a valid reason. Anyone know what it happened here too?

[raehl]

Jim owns the copyright to his posts. Unless there's some verbage to the contrary in the PBN user agreement, all it would take for Jim to have his stuff taken down would be a DMCA-compliant notice. (Well, PBN would have to comply with the notice, but they'd be opening themselves up to legal action if they didn't.) At best, it's legal grey-area, and nobody wants to be the test case.

On the other hand, just because someone threatens to sue you doesn't mean you should do anything. If someone threatens to sue you on a web board, the only thing you should do is laugh. If someone is serious about suing you, the first you'll hear about it is in a nice letter from their lawyer mailed to the office of your registered agent.


- Chris

[shartley]

Originally posted by raehl
Jim owns the copyright to his posts. Unless there's some verbage to the contrary in the PBN user agreement, all it would take for Jim to have his stuff taken down would be a DMCA-compliant notice. (Well, PBN would have to comply with the notice, but they'd be opening themselves up to legal action if they didn't.) At best, it's legal grey-area, and nobody wants to be the test case.

On the other hand, just because someone threatens to sue you doesn't mean you should do anything. If someone threatens to sue you on a web board, the only thing you should do is laugh. If someone is serious about suing you, the first you'll hear about it is in a nice letter from their lawyer mailed to the office of your registered agent.


- Chris
I agree with this...

Yes there IS verbiage to the contrary in the PBN user agreement.

By clicking the Agree button, you warrant that you will not post any messages that are obscene, vulgar, sexually-orientated, hateful, threatening, or otherwise violative of any laws. You also agree that all messages and any other material once submitted become the property of PbNation LLC. If you are caught attempting to rip people off we will post your name and address publicly. We do not tolerate scam artists and we will use all resources and law enforcement agencies to find them.

Jim Drew lost all rights to his posts the second he set up his account… as it is with most Internet Forums. ;)

[raehl]

Now that you've established that you have free time on your hands, shoot me an email, I have some stuff you can do for me. ;)

- Chris

[shartley]

Originally posted by raehl
Now that you've established that you have free time on your hands, shoot me an email, I have some stuff you can do for me. ;)

- Chris
LOL Not so sure about the "free time" thing, but I sent you off an e-mail. ;)

[cledford]

Morning Conspiracy Theory...

Anyone notice to PBN database crapped out? I noticed that the last time JD needed posts deleted the database went down losing over a years worth of data. Funny how it's not working now. I'm not saying anything - just pointing out unusual circumstances...

-Calvin

[SlartyBartFast]

Originally posted by raehl
Jim owns the copyright to his posts.

No he doesn't. You lose control over your thoughts and posts as soon as they hit the public domain.

The language of the user agreement in virtually all on-line discussion boards underlines that fact quite clearly.

[Jack & Coke]

I am proud of AO.

This thread has turned into a meaningful discussion.

Although some may feel he deserves it, this thread's not just a flame war trashing Jim Drew.

Intersting topics regarding what you think your rights are on a forum...

...please continue. :)

[Meph]

Originally posted by Jack & Coke


...this thread's not just a flame war trashing Jim Drew.



Oh is it now? We'll see about THAT now shall we? Just you wait!

[agdemagman69]

I've spent a LONG time on pbn reading Jim's old posts, and there hilarious!!!! I saved every thread i found right before PBN deleted them.

Which i am also Dissapointed in PBN's decision to delete the posts. Have we recieved a formal explanation from them about it yet?

[raehl]

Originally posted by SlartyBartFast
No he doesn't. You lose control over your thoughts and posts as soon as they hit the public domain.

The language of the user agreement in virtually all on-line discussion boards underlines that fact quite clearly.

Poppycock. While it is true that you lose control of material that is in the public domain, it is obvious that you do not understand what the public domain is, or what material is in the public domain. NONE of the material Jim posted is in the public domain. Placing copywritten material in public certainly does not make the material in the public domain - the ONLY ways material is placed in the public domain is if 1) the Copyright term on that material expires or 2) the owner of the copyright on that material expressly places it in the public domain.

The pbnation user agreement says that by placing your material on their forums, PBNation becomes the owner of the material. The material *DOES NOT* go into the public domain. Assuming that that clause of the pbnation user agreement is enforcable (of which I have my doubts), pbnation is the owner of the material. The pbnation.com user agreement underscores the fact that whoever owns Jim's posts, they most certainly are NOT in thepublic domain.


- Chris

[Meph]

Why do you deserve an explaination? It's their business, they run it as they see fit. Beyond that you don't have any special reason why you should be informed on Anything they do or plan to do in the future.

[SlartyBartFast]

Originally posted by raehl
The pbnation user agreement says that by placing your material on their forums, PBNation becomes the owner of the material. The material *DOES NOT* go into the public domain.

I may have mispoken. However, PBNation owns all content on it, AO owns all the content on AO, and jurisprudence has already said e-mail is open to those who own the servers on which it passes.

Chat rooms or bulletin boards could easily be proven to be like open conversation. If you record someone making a public statement you can replay it as many times as you want.

While you may get into trouble profiting from those statemetns, you certainly can't get into trouble for airing them. In the case of AO, PBN, and others, the fact that you agree to the terms as a member means they can profot from and otherwise do as they please with your posts.