What The Heck Happened??

[LATS]

i have a few questions for ya..in the earlyh to mid 90's i played tourney paintball on the nppl circuit.. my last game of paintball was the '96 world cup..then the team diasbanded because of all of our family and business commitments.. now we are planning to hit the circuit again next year..older and slower but , what the hell.. there was only two guns worth the money on the circuit..the autococker (many different mods were done to them.. i owned a eclipse, evolution, and bob long versions)and the automag (i owned two of them at various times..) electronic versions of guns were just a "fad" or so i thought..anyway.. we have visited a couple of tourney including the world cup and have noticed virtually no automags..i did see that bad company is using the new xmag but, that is basically about it..what the heck happened?? i fail to believe that a electronic automag is inferior to a impulse or a bob long timmy..so why have teams abandon them.. one thing a aplayer told me was that with the paint being more brittle now, low pressure is a must and tha the mad has too high a pressure setting..my tean is looking at guns right now and are trying every thing out there (we ahave tried the timmys, strange impulse, matrix, angel, and the new shocker plus, the e orracle) we have not been able to try the new x mag yet.. but will next week... so what gives?? look forward to hearing replies... :confused: :D

[sneakyhacker420]

because they are not a mainstream gun

AGD remains small and dependable, while other companies go off and grow, and become less dependable


i really dont know how to explain it anymore... oh well... its life

[magman007]

well, the e-mag is a venerable gun, it just cant seem to cut it any more. The mag design is older, and it just isnt as refined as some of these other super guns. For one thing, the mag is now considered some what inefficient. Other guns are out there, and shooting fast, and using less air, and this gives them the ability to dump more for less air.

The e-mag trigger is harder to shoot at faster speeds. I have noticed this when i owned my e-mag and my sfl e-mag ( shocktechs rare and discontinued version of an x-mag) I noticed when i picked up my trix, and later my speed, that am currently shooting. There is something about a microswitched trigger that is easier to blaze than the e-mags trigger. now while i could sustain good ROF with my e, i can get better ROF with my speed. this is another thing that people have noticed, and another reason mags arent as popular.

Also, im sure you remember that mags used to chop. well so many markers are out, that already have better specs than the e-mag like the ones i had listed above, and they already come with Anti chop systems. while the e-mag has lvl 1 and the x -mag ahs this and ace, it is things people do not recognize. its a too little too late sorta deal

[MayAMonkeyBeYourPinata]

And add to the fact AG sponsers vary few teams, thus not many teams use automags

[Xyxyll]

Oh, and Bad Company was shooting Spyder AMGs, not Xmags. :D

[Mateo]

Paintball sold its soul to the coporate devil and it will never be the same again:rolleyes:

[LATS]

XYXYLL, bad company switched to x mags before the world cup.. they said that the spyders did not shoot fast enough and that they missed their automags..the new paintballxtremes magazine has a picture of some of the bad company guns also..

[Ov3rmind]

Originally posted by LATS
XYXYLL, bad company switched to x mags before the world cup.. they said that the spyders did not shoot fast enough and that they missed their automags..the new paintballxtremes magazine has a picture of some of the bad company guns also..
Whoever told you that was misinformed.

Here are pics of Bad Company from the NPPL Super 7 World Cup. They are clearly shooting Spyder AMGs:

http://www.warpig.com/paintball/tournament/nppl/2003/miami/gallery/IMG1885.jpg

http://www.warpig.com/paintball/tournament/nppl/2003/miami/gallery/IMG1884.jpg

http://www.warpig.com/paintball/tournament/nppl/2003/miami/gallery/IMG1882.jpg

[03vert]

Originally posted by Mateo
Paintball sold its soul to the coporate devil and it will never be the same again:rolleyes:

Cough cough (smart parts) cough cough...

[LATS]

MY BAD... ya have to remember that we have been out of the loop for many years lol.. when my friend talked to them he heard them say amg's..i just talked to him and he thought it meant some automags..i am in the process of looking at a new shocker.. i am having a problem looking at it since the smart parts brain fart about the patent.. i hate to put anything into their pocket..just a couple of hours ago i shot another matrix..nice gun also.. there is just too many toys out there now lol..

[Athius]

Why do pros doesnt use Mags cause they are very heavy guns and well they are sponsored and have to use the guns of their sponsors. And the automag eventhough it is very innovative but it is too old i think AGD gotta start making a new design cuz' hey they havent been true to thier company name AirGun Designs which has DESINGS in plural form and theres only blowfowards guns with diferent versions thats all.

I know that AGD solve the problem of the weight with ULE but i think AGD should have thrown the ULE line like 5 years ago and well the x-mag is cool and kicks *** but many people hate the idea to have the biggest battery as a foregrip.

LATS check the 2k3 or wait for the 2k4 bushmaster with pds it rips stock, hell it doesnt need any upgrades, and it has a very good price.

[Steelrat]

Also check out the Viking. Reliability, speed, and efficiency.

[temps]

just so you know i have not shot an e-mag or an x-mag (i do own a mini) but i have been reading these forms for the past year and a bit (long time reader short time writer) anyway.. what i have concluded to be the downside of all e-mags and x-mags is there ablitly for the majority of people to be able to rip on them.. yes a few people can get those insane rate of fires out of them, but the majority and general public can't and that is the down side of the e-mag.

And yes ALOT has changed since the 96 world cup....

if your planing on getting back into the tournies look at the speeds, the timmys, and the supped up trixes.. or if you are one of those people who can rip on a mag, pick one up and spread the work of AGD!!

also I sould LOVE to see a micro switch e-mag!!! IF anyone has a custom one made like that i would like to hear from you!!

anywayz! laterz yall! i'm drunk and need to sleep :D as i can barly see what i'm writing and most of my room is spining around me...

[notime2smile]

Ok, sorry to have a little outburst here, but there was a time back in the day, when i was young, and automags were the schnit, well that time i think has passes, i preordered a xmag 6 months ago, and i'm not even sure if i want to blow the money of it, why the h e double hocky sitck can't they cange the on off to accominadate a nine volte battery, or an recaragable battery. take a look at the valve, obisoully this thing was designed to accomindate the fastest rate possible by a mechanical pb gun around, dahh, don't slap a huge battery pack on it and call it good, take the time to responsibally put out a product capable of what AGD has the right and integerdy to be the best possible, and the e-x mag has to offer, why a trigger that feels like a mushroom, i've shot one and to tell you the truth my buddies spyder is just as fast, and don't even mention my little bros BKO, whick is sick, and he doesn't even have it set up right. face realities, smart parts isn't gonna win, research a sweet gun, with same valve comcept lightest possible body, small battery. like my football coach used to say "250 pounds, getting pushed back, doesn't matter how many guys are on your butt, get it done" that's what made elite 45, starting nose guard, and thats what AGD has gotta do, "fastest recharging valve on earth, get it done, lets go now, get rid of the stupid battery pack" sorry i'm kind of drunk like the other guy, i'm still getting an x cuaz i love agd, but i think they arn't shooting tword what they need to.

peace all, with all love

scott

[Lee]

ditto to athius. 2k3 bushy rips out of the box.

i love and will always own a mag, but for serious play i opt for my bushmaster.

weight, efficiancy and rof along with a fully adjustable trigger make for a sweet marker, as well as affordability and ease of operation. the pds is simple and works well and icd's customer service ranks right up there with agd.

[Tunaman]

Originally posted by magman007 well so many markers are out, that already have better specs than the e-mag like the ones i had listed above, [/B]
this is a total bull statement. Show me ONE marker that can hold a candle to the emags' .005" tolerance specifications...show me just one. Face it, the AGD guns ARE the HIGHEST quality markers on the planet...bar none.

[cledford]

This post is the heart of what kills AGD - crap myth and rumors. Personally I'm sick by what I see here, posted by forum regulars who should be showing the "light" to people not loading them down with inaccurate information to steer them away.

First, the ULE Emag is lighter then a fly angel - where did this heavy classification come from?!?!? The first gen Emag from 3 years ago? Come on...

Second, the trigger. That problem has been resolved with the 3.2 software. It's a little like comparing apples to oranges when the fastest markers (like Viking and Timmy) have software gimmicks built in to allow them to shoot faster (like shot buffering) there is an unfair advantage. Now the playing field is level with AGD using shot buffering also and EVERYONE who's see my ULE-Emag has been shocked by the ROF. Does the HES trigger setup require about .5 millimeter more travel distance? Sure, but if you are so incredibly fast that .5mm makes a difference in your shooting speed you then need to be asking "OK, my gun can cycle at XXbps, but can it fully recharge?" The Emag can - every other marker on the market is going to beat down.

On to the battery. 9vs? You've got to be kidding me! 9vs drop off in cold weather, 9vs can come out of the package bad, 9vs have to be changed and cost money. The single Emag battery can power your ENTIRE marker - gun, hopper, and warp feed. (This includes HALOs) Dump 3 9vs and 6 AAs from your marker setup and you at least break even on the Emag battery.

Efficiency? The issue is that the mag can't go as deep into the bottle (I can run my Viking down to about ~300psi) as it requires about ~850psi to operate. If we're talking about tourney ball here I fail to see the problem since you get all day air and fill before every game. Manny and Jay both run with 45/45s so with one of the new 72s I can't see a problem for anyone other then a back player - but even then you've got a choice of an 88.

The reason the Mag has disappeared from the tourney scene is due to AGD turning virtually all of their resources away from paintball to develop the FN303 non-lethal launcher which uses the mag valve! If the US military considered the valve tough enough then that should be good enough for everyone else... Anyhow, with the marketing, hype, MYTH driven nature of paintball AGD has gotten passed by other companies that market better but don't engineer half as good. Paintball always suffered from a myth driven market - but with all of the glossy magazines and "professional players" these days things have gotten a lot worse. Tom tries to market the AGD line the product, not the personality using it. Unfortunately with the kids (95% of the sport) inundated with images of good "bad-boy" pros with "images" that they can model their personalities after AGD doesn't really stand a chance. In reality, the AGD line appeals to the geeks of the world. The ones who expect performance, engineering, and data to back it up. Those (in the majority) who need to be like Chris, Rocky, Ed or whoever will buy their marker based on it being an accessory to their outfit.

-Calvin

[Gman63]

Just to chime in here. Anyone who thinks an Emag cannot keep up, your kidden yourself. If you really think you can work a trigger at 20 BPS or more I am sure the government would like to find out how your able to get your fast twitch muscles to do it. I have shot just about every marker out there and ripped on them as fast as I could. Sure the E-bladed free flows, Timmy's and even some Impys I shot were sick fast. Would I let you on the field with them? No Way, Bounce or shooting more than once per trigger pull is illegal, Peroid! With that said, my E-mag with ULE and lvl 10 is very light, and with the 3.2 software and a properly wired solinoid gets no bounce even with my shot buffer at 4 and when comparied with guns shooting legally, I have yet to find anything as fast. And as far as chopping, I have only had the marker about 1 month, more than 5 cases, No chops! Even though the gun requires high input pressure the actual pressure in the barrel acting on the paintball is no more than What everyone refers to as a low pressure marker. Oh yeah, before anyone starts trying to flame me on that statement, I would suggest you go back and review some of your Physics notes relating to pressure and do the calculations. Everything has to balance..

[xXHavokXx]

I think the reason the mag got left behind was the lack of advertising on the field. People are groupies, if you go to a field when you are new and you see people doing well and look at their set up its going to leave an opinion in your mind. Personally when i was new i saw angels tearing it up so ive had that impression. This especially holds true to "pro" or circuit tourney teams. How many teams are out with mags besides the AGD teams?


AGD also makes very little presence out here on the west coast.Out here it is rare to see a mag other than a beat up faded, drab grey old classic being used as a rental. When i went back east i saw more mags per hour than i had in my entire life.

With the Xmag i can see AGD progressing from drab and block to smooth and bright, now they just need more teams and more ads to get it out.