When You Get Hit......

[bunkermaster10]

Wondering what most people do when they are playing speed ball and get hit w/ a clear break w/ refs.

Where I play usualy you keep playing untill refs call you out or you get gogged or something thats tottally obvious. But When playing rec most people call themselves out honestly usually.

[Derman2k]

Rec I call myself, just cuz i'm that kinda guy and i'm friends with the refs... makes it easier on them

Tournaments I wait til the ref pulls my band

[FreakBaller12]

rec i usually call myself out, soemtimes i just wait a lil and shoot some more shots

[shartley]

I do not play in tournaments, but play all styles. And I ALWAYS call myself out. That is a no brainer.

The true test of character is doing the right thing no matter whether you are seen or not.

[Fred]

if i get hit the first thing i do is get behind cover, then have a ref check me if I can't see the spot where i felt the hit (mask, back, sides, shoulders...)... if i'm out, i'm out. it happens 50% of the time, if it doesn't, i'm not playing hard enough.

edit added: if i see it break on me, duh, I'm calling myself out and leaving the field. I expect my opponents to show me the same courtesy.

---Fred

[Crime Dog]

What Sam says.

I don't understand why someone would continue to play during a tournament and just wait for a ref to pull the band.

If you know you've been hit, then be a man of integrity and call yourself out. What happened to fair play? I've even been known to call myself even for bounces. Why? Because the way I see it, it's not the opponent's fault the ball didn't break. If you're good enough to hit me, then I'd better be fair enough to call myself out...break or not sometimes. Granted, I don't ALWAYS go that far...but sometimes, I do.

I believe it's fairly black and white that if you know you've got a break on you...then you should be man enough to call yourself out.

[Torbo]

I've even been known to call myself even for bounces. Why? Because the way I see it, it's not the opponent's fault the ball didn't break lol, how do you do in tourneys?:rolleyes:

anyway, yea i call myself out if its obvious. If i cant tell if it broke i call a ref over to check me. That way you wont accientally call yourself out, but you wont get called for playing on either.

[-=Squid=-]

I dont cheat, but I also dont immediately call myself out. 90% of the time I call paint check, because you never know what the refs might see it as. I was hit all big and clear, and the ref wiped it ... For me, it just depends.

[pbguy888]

Originally posted by Crime Dog
I don't understand why someone would continue to play during a tournament and just wait for a ref to pull the band.

From my experiences, you dont look down to see if you're hit. Everythings so fast that if its not an obvouse hit(gogged or the like) you let the ref do his job and you consintrate on your jon.

[Derman2k]

Originally posted by Crime Dog
What Sam says.

I don't understand why someone would continue to play during a tournament and just wait for a ref to pull the band.

If you know you've been hit, then be a man of integrity and call yourself out. What happened to fair play? I've even been known to call myself even for bounces. Why? Because the way I see it, it's not the opponent's fault the ball didn't break. If you're good enough to hit me, then I'd better be fair enough to call myself out...break or not sometimes. Granted, I don't ALWAYS go that far...but sometimes, I do.

I believe it's fairly black and white that if you know you've got a break on you...then you should be man enough to call yourself out.

And if I think it broke on my back.. you expect me to call myself out? no, i'm going to wait for a ref to pull my band if it did. if its blatantly obvious, ie gog, hand, chest... somewhere i can see i will call myself out, but not if its somewhere i can't see

[shartley]

Originally posted by Derman2k


And if I think it broke on my back.. you expect me to call myself out? no, i'm going to wait for a ref to pull my band if it did. if its blatantly obvious, ie gog, hand, chest... somewhere i can see i will call myself out, but not if its somewhere i can't see
I have had this happen... and what I do is YELL for a PAINT CHECK. ;)

It isn't that hard............

[Tyger]

You're missing something from your poll.

"Check to see if the ball broke"?

Just makes sense.

-Tyger

[*captain_cox*37]

Originally posted by Crime Dog
What happened to fair play? I've even been known to call myself even for bounces. Why? Because the way I see it, it's not the opponent's fault the ball didn't break. If you're good enough to hit me, then I'd better be fair enough to call myself out

I mean I am all for fair play but that is going to far. I dont expect anyone else to actually leave their team one man down when the ball didnt even break. Just call a paint check or wait for the ref to see it and call u out. You dont have to wipe but seems like that would just make ur teamtates mad. Maybe I dont know ur friend though. ;)

[Barfly]

What do I do when I get shot?

I cry like a baby, but that is only when I get caught for wiping. j/k;)

[SpongeBobSquarePants]

Well unless it is very obvious IE I got gogged, or I can see it without looking for it. Other wise if I feel a hit in my leg I will say "Ref, check me leg." Until the ref acknowledges me. I then will continue playing until he pulls me. Trust me looking for hits on you almost always put you in the line of fire. Unless I'm playing rec ball then I will just call my self out.

[Crime Dog]

My first tourney is in April.

I most likely WON'T call myself out on bounces. As Sam said, I'll call for Paintcheck.

Note: I DID say that I don't ALWAYS do that.

Anyways...

Yeah...there's this thing called "Paintcheck that we all know about as well."

Playing through a hit until a ref pulls your band is one of those things that I'm not looking forward to from other teams in tournament ball. I've heard that cheating is fairly horrific in that scene. Hopefully Team Fireproof, and others like us will be able to help turn that around a bit and reintroduce fair play.

If you don't know if you've had one break on ya...call for a paintcheck, and quit firing. That's the rule I've heard over and over. And I think that it's quite fair...

[Jeffy-CanCon]

Originally posted by Tyger

"Check to see if the ball broke"?


Bingo.

I always leave if the ball breaks, but I check first. If I know I'm in a bad spot and about to get hammered - then I just call myself out, whether the ball breaks or not. I've had my share of welts, and don't see the point of waiting around for extras.

[Lohman446]

I normally spend about a half second looking for an obvious hit - I did this once when a ref was close and he told me "I will tell you when your out" - his next words were "didn't break, didn't break, didn't break, no, oh.. that one did, your out" maybe I should have moved LOL

[Digits]

If you called yourself out on a bouncer in a tournament.. Your whole team would be mad at you, and everyone would think your a noob.. You NEVER call yourself out if there's things at stake unless you KNOW you got hit.. If it means calling for a ref then you do that.. But you don't just call yourself out after feeling something.. It could make or break the game, trust me, every man counts in a tournament.

And the cheating isn't that bad in the tourny seen.. Rarelly do rookie/novice/am teams cheat.. It's usually the Pro's you hear about.. And if they do cheat chances are someone will see and they will get called out on it... Just make sure you shoot people a good 3-5 times so that they can't wipe them all.

[Ov3rmind]

If I can see the hit, I call myself out. If I feel a hit but can't see it, I call for a paint check on myself and continue to play on. If I take a hit as I'm sliding and it gets whiped off, I'll continue to play (but I don't intentionally whipe).

[painball]

I usually call myself out if there's a break. I've even called myself out for hits on my knee the ref didn't see. I've wiped only once in my life. I don't know whether the hit broke or not though. I just kinda rubbed it with my arm and kept on shootin. That was because I had never really stayed in long for the whole day. I'd get picked off early almost every game.

Once in a tourney I actually stopped running on the break when I was hit in the chest. I checked in the middle of the field and noticed there was no break and kept runnin. I'm surprised I made it. :p

[danoxide]

i had to vote for keep playing untill a ref spots it...not because i am a disshonest person, but just because when i get hit i don't waste time checking to see if it broke, i keep playing. Once a ref calls me out i WILL walk away no hard feelings...



EDIT:i made my post before i read all of these responses...and now going threw and reading them makes me wonder how many people are being honest right here...not to flame but come on, if your in a tournie and your team needs you(witch should be everyone if your in an tournie) your going to do everything you can to get that other person...even if it means takeing a few extra shots while the ref checks you...

[Digits]

Originally posted by Ov3rmind
If I can see the hit, I call myself out. If I feel a hit but can't see it, I call for a paint check on myself and continue to play on. If I take a hit as I'm sliding and it gets whiped off, I'll continue to play (but I don't intentionally whipe).

I was playing on a sawdust field last weekend and got hit when I was laying on the ground trying to crawl up, once I made it to point x there were like 4 people looking and shooting at me, and only 1 actually hit me, and it was on my wrist, so I scurried back to my bunker and the hit was covered in sawdust, so I was hoping the ref would call me in (he was watching me the whole time).. But nope :(, not enough sawdust lol.. I would never intentially wipe though, but if a ref says im in.. I aint leaving..

[NJPaint]

I was told today at PBX Battlezone:

"You are a good player, but too honest, you need to at least finish your run"



Another thing:

Me: Whats the difference between an amateur team like the NJ Jesters and a pro team?

(I'm sitting with a few refs and a few players watching the Jesters do their stuff on the field)

Ref sitting next to me: "Pro teams cheat better"


Made me feel sad :(

[Crime Dog]

A sad commentary on the "pros" of our sport...to be sure. I hope younger players learn somethin' from them...what NOT to do.

Whatever happened to honor?

[tony3]

I put wipe that mofo away, just because it sounded funny.....I always check to see if it broke, and if it did then I'll call myself out, if not I'll keep playing.

[coolcatpete]

I will be honest when I play with neewbs I dont directly wipe, I will brush up on a bunker or a ref will do it for me, I only would do this in the woods. The rason for this is that I ref and when I get to plaY that day I want to get a full game in not just 2 sec. So I figure I should be rewared for reffing. Most of the time when I do this I try not to shoot very many people, and I just guide neewbs around.

IN tounies I always call for a paint check no matter what, this is only because I want to know what is happing in the game if I am not out.

Rec play with my friend I always call my self out same with rec speed ball.
Pete

[50 cal]

If I see the hit I will call myself.
If I'm reffing and I see someone flinch and not even look to check themselves I will penalize them for intentional playing on and try to slap them with the max penalty.

[jdev]

so, what alot of you are saying, is this:

you have a clear hit on you. you don't call yourself, you wait for a ref to do it.

say the ref doesn't call it the entire match, until the end of the match, where you're team is hanging the flag. at that point, you are called out, and lose points for your team (now, it didn't matter there, because whether you were called out when you were hit, or there, you lose points for your team.) but, by your reasoning.. do you then argue with the ref and say "hey, I was hit way back in the beginning.. he didn't call me on it then, why now? isn't it a little late?"

this is what we call ethics.

if you are hit, and you see it, clearly. (as the situation stipulates) walk off the field. If you are hit, and are unsure whether it broke, call a ref over and have them check you.

.. yet another reason i am looking forward to playing tourney ball this year. to learn and see how many people are in it for the sport (and keep in mind, your portrayal and ethics and how you act promote the sport.. whether it be negatively or positively.) or for the little trophy, prizes and bragging rights..

**edit (addition)**

this is also the reason why people are getting hit with lanes of paint. because honest players like myself, have to worry about dishonest players downfield that either wipe, dont call when they are hit, or something along those lines. so, you play me in a tourney situation, you better be prepared to have a lane shot at you, to ensure you are out. (also, on that same note, if I can clearly see you are hit (such as a break on you and splatter), I will call a ref to check you. if you have wiped by then, you just get twice as much the next time you pop out of your bunker.

[yeahthatsme]

i said wipe it cus i'm in a lying mood













i'm actually always honest and call myself out unless i dont notice the hit

[845]

Depends on the situation.

[laxster08]

if its rec and extremely easy play i will call my self out...but if its tournie or challenging..i will have the ref check me evertime i get hit

[Pullman]

I do know to yell "paintcheck" rather than "out", but I'm still learning techniques like get back behind your bunker before checking yourself and stuff like that. I generally know when I have been hit and checking for a break seems kind of silly, but when your team needs you in you gotta play to the letter. However I think it's lame to keep shooting when you oughtta be checking yourself. I'm a rec sport squid.:D

[InexactMelissa]

I usually call myself out, but to be honest, most of those times I didn't have to....maybe 'cause I have a little voice or something, I don't get checked when I ask - and really I get ignored a lot on the field even by my own team sometimes....I could play on and on if it weren't for my own honesty (sometimes to my disadvantage.) I find myself leaving the field and once in the deadbox with a good chance to look myself over, I should still be playing. From now on, If I call for a check and noone listens, I'm gonna just keep playing.

[dinger]

out of the 96 so far that took the poll, 34.38% of you are technically cheating bastards :o

waiting for a ref to pull you is a no no... you can really get penalized for doing that

[tyrion2323]

Unless I can see the hit, I automatically call for a paintcheck. I learned to do this after calling myself out for unbroken balls all day during a rec game. We were playing limited target zones, and I called myself out for a hand hit...doh!

So, unless I can easily look down and see it, I call a ref over immediately. This also builds rapport with the refs, and they know that I am an honest guy, and therefore I tend to gain friends and respect at the field for being an honest guy.

Jacob

[Mindflux]

Originally posted by tyrion2323
Unless I can see the hit, I automatically call for a paintcheck. I learned to do this after calling myself out for unbroken balls all day during a rec game. We were playing limited target zones, and I called myself out for a hand hit...doh!

So, unless I can easily look down and see it, I call a ref over immediately. This also builds rapport with the refs, and they know that I am an honest guy, and therefore I tend to gain friends and respect at the field for being an honest guy.

Jacob

They may also find you annoying asking for paintchecks constantly. But yeah, I've called myself out on accident when I felt a hit somewhere I couldn't see and then realised it was a bounce after I was in the dead box.

But atleast I'm being honest.

[breg]

If I feel a hit, I usually look to the area of the sing and see if there is the appropriate sized mark. If there is, well it’s time to slap the barrel blocking device on and hold ‘er up high and walk off hoping that I don’t get tagged in the cross fire.
If I take hit some where that I can’t see very well: top of the head, pack, or my back, I do the whole “paint check” and do what the ref says.
The wiping thing really gets to me. I can’t understand why you would need to win that bad. It is just a game after all. No one is going to lose life or limb if they get tagged out. What really gets to me is that wiping is condoned or even considered appropriate at times. From what I have seen, wiping violates one of the basic tenants of our sport. There is no “God Mode” in paintball. What does playing on after you’ve been hit get you in the end? Just a shady win, that I won’t even call a victory.


Well, I've made no sense for long enough,

Breg

[elpimpo]

man we got 69 people who are fibbing us already.

[dcmander]

I would say that if checking for a break takes away from my game, I won't do it. Example, if I feel like I was hit and it is an obvious spot, I will take a quick look. If I see a hit, I'll call out. If I don't, I will assume a bounce. If I get hit somewhere I know I can't see, I wouldn't do anything because it will slow you down and you will miss an opponent moving up. The refs have to do their job too. ANd yes, even calling for a paintcheck could give your position away to other opponents.

[NJestars#1STUNNNAA!!]

Originally posted by NJPaint
I was told today at PBX Battlezone:

"You are a good player, but too honest, you need to at least finish your run"



Another thing:

Me: Whats the difference between an amateur team like the NJ Jesters and a pro team?

(I'm sitting with a few refs and a few players watching the Jesters do their stuff on the field)

Ref sitting next to me: "Pro teams cheat better"


Made me feel sad :(

Yo why dont you tell every one who you are if you are willing to publicly say that we cheat?, we will gladly scrimage you anyday, bring all your ref buddies.
-max

[Radeon]

Are there two jesters? Jester Kidz and NJ Jesters? The people who work at Paintball Depot? Turtle? etc. etc.?

[Tim Trentacoste]

Dear NJpaint

my name is Tim and I am one of two captains of a paintball
team based out of PBX named the New Jersey Jesters. You obviously know who we are but you don't really seem to watch us play. I don't know you, your team, or what your deal is exactly, but you seem to have the time to sit down and try to give my team a bad reputation. I find my team to actually be one of the cleanest teams at all of the places that we go and practice. While you may sit and compare us to pro players, I will sit here and compare you to my teammates. We do not sit around pretending to be better than the next team, or people that we don't know at all like you do. What is amusing to me though is the fact that we practice against ourselves at the Battlezone so in fact you are commenting that we cheat against each other. I have advice for you, stop worrying about what my team is doing, and in line with that stop trying to call us cheaters online. You know my name and what team I play on obviously, just come and say it to my face. My team would be glad to scrimmage against your team, you can even invite your friends to referee. Until then stop trying to be such a tough guy when it is pretty obvious you're just jealous.
Look forward to seeing you,
Tim Trentacoste / NJpaint fan club member #1

[FallNAngel]

Hmm... how to put this...

If I get hit and I can tell, I'm out. If I get hit in the chest and I look down and I see it broke, I'm done. What's the point of playing the game if you're not going to follow the rules.

Now, if I'm running to my bunker off the break and just before I slide in, something hits my kneepad and I'm not sure if it broke or not (pad was skidding across the ground), I just keep playing. If I see there's a hit there, like I said, I'm out. If I can't tell, I keep playing unless a ref thinks otherwise. Before anyone starts screaming, this doesn't mean I slide to wipe hits, I'm talking legitimate "I don't know if it broke or not"

[NJestars#1STUNNNAA!!]

Originally posted by Radeon
Are there two jesters? Jester Kidz and NJ Jesters? The people who work at Paintball Depot? Turtle? etc. etc.?
yes and no, jesters kids are young players that compete in local YG tournies that are freinds with max(myself a player on the NJ Jesters)no turtle or anyone that works at paintball depot is on that team

[NJPaint]

Okay, lets see. I have no idea what the heck you are talking about. If you are going to rant to me about something, PLEASE link me to what I said so I can explain my comments or at least know where you are coming from.

The ONLY post that I have on record that EVER mentions the NJ Jesters was one about calling ones self out. In it I commented that I was told that I was called "too honest" and that one of the refs commented to me about the differences between the Jesters and a Pro team.

Lets set some things straight. I never said ANYTHING bad about the Jesters. They are one of the few teams that I have seen in action and having talked to a few of you, you guys seem like great guys. I'm not out to flatter you, but the reason why I asked the ref about the difference between you guys and the Pro teams is because I was THAT impressed with how you guys were playing against each other. I really did and DO want to know what seperates levels of play.

NO WHERE in my post do I EVER degrade NJ Jesters or give them a bad name. I simply quoted a ref on the differences in levels in paintball teams. "Stop worrying about us... You have the time to comment about us" What the heck are you saying? Here I quoted myself:


Originally posted by NJPaint
I was told today at PBX Battlezone:

"You are a good player, but too honest, you need to at least finish your run"



Another thing:

Me: Whats the difference between an amateur team like the NJ Jesters and a pro team?

(I'm sitting with a few refs and a few players watching the Jesters do their stuff on the field)

Ref sitting next to me: "Pro teams cheat better"


Made me feel sad :(

OBVIOUSLY I didn't say ANYTHING about the NJ Jesters cheating. That is what a PBX Ref said TO ME AND TO PHILIP. If you are the Max that I am thinking of (the one that borrowed a pod of paint while on the field) you know philip and YOU can ask HIM what the ref said.

Look, I really didn't mean to attack your team or make you sound like cheaters. I'll see you this saturday at the YG tourney at Top Gun and I don't want there to be hard feelings. (i'm playing with philip)



NJestars#1STUNNNAA!! wrote on 02-03-2004 11:20 PM:
Dear NJpaint

my name is Max and I am one of players of a paintball
team based out of PBX named the New Jersey Jesters. You obviously know who we are but you don't really seem to watch us play. I don't know you, your team, or what your deal is exactly, but you seem to have the time to sit down and try to give my team a bad reputation. I find my team to actually be one of the cleanest teams at all of the places that we go and practice. While you may sit and compare us to pro players, I will sit here and compare you to my teammates. We do not sit around pretending to be better than the next team, or people that we don't know at all like you do. What is amusing to me though is the fact that we practice against ourselves at the Battlezone so in fact you are commenting that we cheat against each other. I have advice for you, stop worrying about what my team is doing, and in line with that stop trying to call us cheaters online. You know my name and what team I play on obviously, just come and say it to my face. My team would be glad to scrimmage against your team, you can even invite your friends to referee. Until then stop trying to be such a tough guy when it is pretty obvious you're just jealous.
Look forward to seeing you

[NJPaint]

Originally posted by Tim Trentacoste
Dear NJpaint

my name is Tim and I am one of two captains of a paintball
team based out of PBX named the New Jersey Jesters. You obviously know who we are but you don't really seem to watch us play. I don't know you, your team, or what your deal is exactly, but you seem to have the time to sit down and try to give my team a bad reputation. I find my team to actually be one of the cleanest teams at all of the places that we go and practice. While you may sit and compare us to pro players, I will sit here and compare you to my teammates. We do not sit around pretending to be better than the next team, or people that we don't know at all like you do. What is amusing to me though is the fact that we practice against ourselves at the Battlezone so in fact you are commenting that we cheat against each other. I have advice for you, stop worrying about what my team is doing, and in line with that stop trying to call us cheaters online. You know my name and what team I play on obviously, just come and say it to my face. My team would be glad to scrimmage against your team, you can even invite your friends to referee. Until then stop trying to be such a tough guy when it is pretty obvious you're just jealous.
Look forward to seeing you,
Tim Trentacoste / NJpaint fan club member #1

You guys are really impressive on the field, but 2/2 your reading comprehension skills need some work. Note what I said, and what theREF said. He is a PBX employee (THE SAME STORE THE SPONSERS YOU), I have never accused or seen a Jester cheat and after meeting at least one don't think I ever will. But please, for the love of God... READ the POST THE WORLD IS NOT OUT TO GET YOU

Edit: btw, was it planned that you both sent me the same paragraph? You have 2-3 posts total each so its kinda wierd... same person?

[Sir_Brass]

If I can't see the hit, and thus can't be sure if it broke or not, I get behind cover and call for a paintcheck. but till the ref gets there and calls me neutral, I keep playing.

If I can see the hit and it's definately a hit, then I will be the man of integrity and call myself out. The guy who shot me deserves to have his opponent (me) go to the deadbox, after all, since I'd want him to do the same if I hit him and it broke. If I SEE it broke and he can't, I'll either call for HIM to check his ______ (name where I saw the ball break) or call for the ref to check him if he can't hear me or I don't want him to know where I was shooting from.

[NJestars#1STUNNNAA!!]

Originally posted by NJPaint


You guys are really impressive on the field, but 2/2 your reading comprehension skills need some work. Note what I said, and what theREF said. He is a PBX employee (THE SAME STORE THE SPONSERS YOU), I have never accused or seen a Jester cheat and after meeting at least one don't think I ever will. But please, for the love of God... READ the POST THE WORLD IS NOT OUT TO GET YOU

Edit: btw, was it planned that you both sent me the same paragraph? You have 2-3 posts total each so its kinda wierd... same person?

My team doesnt aggree with with your subject matter.

[NJPaint]

This is an open forum, though it is moderated (and should be), there is free discussion. This is a thread about cheating in paintball. This is not MY subject matter, this is an open discussion. Teams get bashed for cheating almost every day. I did not accuse you, or claim anything, I reported as is. If the NJ Jesters don't wipe, they will be one of the few teams that doesn't.

If you don't accept that, I'm sorry, I'm a nice person, I suppose it isn't very humble to say, but I am generally. But in this case, tough. Grow a little skin. Thats what was said and it wasn't a private conversation. You don't like it, dispute it, tell us how you are all self-richeous and play clean paintball. But give me a break with this paranoia.

[digital]

read the original post guys, no need to get defensive. It's the internet and views can easily get distorted through reading comprehension. I was there when the ref said it. there was no implication of the NJ/PBX Jesters cheating, the ref said that pro teams cheat better. Better than what? Better than how the jesters cheat or how the jesters don't cheat. You INFERED from what was said that someone said that the jesters cheated, where in fact nothing was said about how the jesters cheat, but about how pro teams cheat.

You guys are obviously a well established amateur team, representing many different companies, let's be civilized and leave the "calling out" at home.

[A5 Capo]

Originally posted by pbguy888

From my experiences, you dont look down to see if you're hit. Everythings so fast that if its not an obvouse hit(gogged or the like) you let the ref do his job and you consintrate on your job.

i completely agree. to me, many times a break feels the same as a bounce, and i can't count how many times i thought i was hit, stopped shooting, and checked myself only to find out it was a bounce. however, while checking, i get bunkered or hit. the refs are there for a reason, and the actual rules say that you're not out until a ref calls you out.

[NJPaint]

Originally posted by A5 Capo


i completely agree. to me, many times a break feels the same as a bounce, and i can't count how many times i thought i was hit, stopped shooting, and checked myself only to find out it was a bounce. however, while checking, i get bunkered or hit. the refs are there for a reason, and the actual rules say that you're not out until a ref calls you out.

I agree for tournaments and games with ample refs, but in rec ball, I think it makes sense for people to call themselves out just to be honest, its more fun for everyone.

[A5 Capo]

Originally posted by NJestars#1STUNNNAA!!

My team doesnt aggree with with your subject matter.

ok, can i just say that this single sentence make you and your team seem REALLY peculiar and extremely defensive. personally, i've never heard anything bad about the Jesters. (plz let the record show that I DO NOT HOLD ANY NEGATIVE FEELINGS CONCERNING THE JESTERS AS A TEAM, THE MEMBERS, OR THEIR PLAYING STRATEGIES WHATSOEVER.) HOWEVER, when a representative of the team, in this case NJestars#1STUNNNAA!!, tries to tell another player not to discuss cheating and censor him, there does seem to be a certain level of impropriety in the situation and implicit guilt. (plz refer again to above, where i specifically state i harbor no grudges or negative impressions of the Jesters before you get your bowels in an opera.) i say this only out of concern for the integrity of the team; i do not want any other readers to interpret the quoted statement as defensive.
furthermore, i feel NJPaint said absolutely nothing wrong. he simply QUOTED (meaning he repeated something SOMEONE ELSE said). if you want to go after ANYONE, i think it would more appropriately be the ref who said it. but that's just me...

EDIT: honestly, wtf is with the "me and my team will scrimmage you any day"? (not an exact quote, but close enough) cmon guys, how old are you? 6? 7? maybe 8 or 9? why don't you just go ahead and tell NJPaint you won't be his friend any more/won't invite him to your b-day party? i generally tend to think of myself as literate, but i don't recall NJPaint challenging you to a "duel"--he didn't EVER doubt your playing ability, so how is a scrimmage at all relevant? what, can't solve your problems and disagreements with some civilized discussion, so you have to metaphorically duke it out?

EDIT 2: i said before i harbor no negative feelings towards the Jesters. however, i'd like to amend this statement by saying I DO NOT FEEL ANY NEGATIVE FEELINGS TOWARDS THE JESTERS OTHER THAN THAT THEY ARE RESPONDING TO THIS COMPLETELY BENIGN SITUATION WITH HOSTILITY AND IMMATURITY, neither of which helps their reputation.

[Tim Trentacoste]

This is for NJpaint and A5 Capo. I appreciate you trying to clear the situation up with my player. However this is just a misunderstanding obviously. When you said that pros cheat better, it implies something. The word better is comparitive. In your sentence you compared us to pros, which I deeply appreciate however it was brought up that they cheat better. We were the only other party in your question, it wasn't what is the difference between pros and amateurs. Thus we were called cheaters, you are correct that you didn't say it, which is very clear in your reply, however you brought it up. And for both of you we don't want to duel with anyone, we said that we would gladly scrimmage to show you what a straight group of players we are. When we step on the field we represent our sponsors and ourselves and that is the only reason we get defensive when someone calls us cheaters. Your reputation is everything. However I would just like to state that there are definitley no hard feelings, it couldn't be further from the truth. Either of you can find me at the PBX battlezone regularly, and can feel free to come up and introduce yourselves.

[A5 Capo]

Tim,
I definitely agree that this was all due to a misunderstanding. While NJPaint and I figured he was innocently quoting someone else, others interpreted it differently. That stuff happens, especially when it's through writing, as there is no "tone" one can hear. I, too, think this "argument"/issue is unnecessary, and am glad we can leave it civilly rather than as enemies. I'd love to come down and play at PBX, and look forward to meeting you, the Jesters, and seeing them play (honestly :p).

[DementedRabbit]

If I can see the break, I'm gone right away. If I feel a hit but can't see a break, I have a teammate check me right away.

That being said, I smoke the bejeezus out of people who keep playing with unobvious hits.

[phantomhitman]

i have screwed myself over too many times to call myself out right away :mad: . i do however stop shooting and make the ref come check me.

[~WarpedRT#2~]

Playing on while you have a hit isnt illegal. It's making the refs do their job, and besides, most of the time, the ref is watching you so closly that he will see the hit when it happens, and take your band. But if it his in an unobvious place, you just keep playing. They wont penalize you for it, because it's unobvious. Now, if I get hit in the gun, I will call myself out. It's right in front of my face, and hard to not notice. It's bending the rules, not breaking them. Kind of like, getting bunkered, and spinning to get him. You KNOW you were hit first, but you turned and hit him in order to get a one for one.

Until tney make full body suits that can tell if a paintball has hit, and broke on you, that automatically shuts down your gun, this will go on.

[islandboi]

I used to just try and reach where i was hit see if I could feel paint there but people seemes to take that as wiping so I get paint checks in rec ball or tourney in rec ball i came here to play so i dont wanna call my self out on a bounce or a ball that broke on something in front of me and just gave me alot of splatter

[FallNAngel]

Originally posted by ~WarpedRT#2~
It's bending the rules, not breaking them. Kind of like, getting bunkered, and spinning to get him. You KNOW you were hit first, but you turned and hit him in order to get a one for one.

Actually, no.. that's breaking the rules. If he shot you first, then you're out. That's it. By the rules, you shouldn't get the extra time to turn around to shoot him so you can hope for a one for one. If you know you're hit and you're taking that time to shoot back anyway, then that's basically considered playing on.

[raehl]

98% of the time, I'll call myself out or stop playing long enough to figure out if it broke or not if I'm not sure. That's the rule for the NCPA, and that's the way we enforce it.

There are those times, however, where I'm going to keep playing until the ref calls me out - HOWEVER - I expect that if I have been playing with a hit that I'll be penalized for it. It's just that if it's 1 on 1 and I get hit somewhere I can't see without stopping play, I'm gonna shoot the other guy and let the refs sort it out. The risk of playing on (and getting the penalty for doing it) is worth it when calling yourself out when you're not hit is going to cost you 76 points.

12 seconds in the game and you're down by 1, foul the other team and hope they blow a free throw. Same deal.

The problem with the sport is in situations like that, most of the time the refs don't do their jobs.

While I think it sucks that people actively cheat, I also think it's silly to expect them to stop "just because". If we want cheating to be severely curbed, we gotta have refs who know what they're doing and are enabled and have the balls to enforce the rules and the penalties.

And that requires a culture change just as much as it requires better training.


- Chris

[raehl]

Originally posted by ~WarpedRT#2~
They wont penalize you for it, because it's unobvious.

They should - anytime you think you might be hit, that hit is obvious, and it's your responsibility to verify that you're not hit before continuing to play, and it's the ref's responsibility to penalize you if you continue to play with an obvious hit.

Unfortunately not the way it usually happens in a lot of leagues, but definitely the way it should happen.


I shoot you, don't keep playing and act all surprised when the refs send one of your teammates to the deadbox with you.


- Chris

[NJestars#1STUNNNAA!!]

Originally posted by A5 Capo
invite him to your b-day party?
hey NJpaint wanna come to my b-day party next week at the arcade?
a5capo sadly enuff your not invited for 2 reasons
1) you are a poopie head big fat dumb face.
2) the present you would have gotten me would haved sucked.

[A5 Capo]

i hope that was a joke. if not, your captain was able to respond maturally, at least. wtvr, i'll just laugh...;)

[NJestars#1STUNNNAA!!]

Originally posted by A5 Capo
i hope that was a joke. if not, your captain was able to respond maturally, at least. wtvr, i'll just laugh...;)

it wasnt, my dad can beat up your dad

[NJPaint]

NOOOO YOU LIE MY MOMMY WOULD BEAT THE CRAP OUT OF YOUR DADDY

[NJestars#1STUNNNAA!!]

Originally posted by NJPaint
NOOOO YOU LIE MY MOMMY WOULD BEAT THE CRAP OUT OF YOUR DADDY

you are no longer invited to my birthday party

[Duke Henry]

I entered "depends" because it depends if it actually breaks.

I don't call myself out on bounces, only if it breaks bigger than the rule-defined size.

If I get hit, I stop advancing, check myself, call a ref, etc.

If I am performing a run through or something similar and I get plastered, I always call myself out - can't quite stop and call for a check!

[f3rr3+]

in a tourney if i cant see it without stoping what im doing i will wait to be called, but in rec ball i usually just call myself out or at least call paintcheck to make it easy on refs...

i never wipe tho

[~WarpedRT#2~]

Originally posted by FallNAngel


Actually, no.. that's breaking the rules. If he shot you first, then you're out. That's it. By the rules, you shouldn't get the extra time to turn around to shoot him so you can hope for a one for one. If you know you're hit and you're taking that time to shoot back anyway, then that's basically considered playing on.

Man, I'm not even going to count how many times I've seen this happen, and they get a one for one, so dont tell me whats illegal and isnt. Generally, when you get bunkered, you get shot in an unobvious place. you can count this as an unobvious hit. You can say you only saw him coming, and shot at him after he passed you, not feeling the shot hit you. That is what the players will say. Just watch any footage of a game, and you will see this happen. They always turn and fire.

[~WarpedRT#2~]

Originally posted by raehl


They should - anytime you think you might be hit, that hit is obvious, and it's your responsibility to verify that you're not hit before continuing to play, and it's the ref's responsibility to penalize you if you continue to play with an obvious hit.

Unfortunately not the way it usually happens in a lot of leagues, but definitely the way it should happen.


I shoot you, don't keep playing and act all surprised when the refs send one of your teammates to the deadbox with you.


- Chris

But what if the hit really was unobvious? I'm sorry that I cannot sence the paint flying from your gun, and I'm sorry I cant read your mind to tell if you hit me or not, but still, if it's a real unobvious hit, then you cant say anything. Put it this way, If i run to bunker you, and someone hits my pack ( I know it hit, but it's in an unobvious place) I'll keep running to bunker you, get it done, and then call myself out. Thats playing by the rule book , an unobvious hit was a hit taht you didnt notice, and therefore isnt illegal. Get it? Like I said before, the refs are watching closely anyway, and will see a hit most of the time.

[TheTramp]

Originally posted by Torbo
i call myself out if its obvious. If i cant tell if it broke i call a ref over to check me. That way you wont accientally call yourself out, but you wont get called for playing on either.

This is exactly what I do.

[raehl]

Originally posted by ~WarpedRT#2~


Man, I'm not even going to count how many times I've seen this happen, and they get a one for one, so dont tell me whats illegal and isnt. Generally, when you get bunkered, you get shot in an unobvious place. you can count this as an unobvious hit. You can say you only saw him coming, and shot at him after he passed you, not feeling the shot hit you. That is what the players will say. Just watch any footage of a game, and you will see this happen. They always turn and fire.

That's not the rules, that's bad reffing. If it *REALLY* is unobvious (the only way it's true is if you got shot in the pack), you wouldn't know the guy was there, and you wouldn't turn around at all. On the off chance you get shot in the pack, then somehow see the guy and shoot him, the ref is supposed to pull you and leave that player in. If you get shot ANYWHERE where you can feel it, and you proceed to turn and shoot the other player, that player should stay in, you should be pulled, *AND* one of your teammates should be pulled as a penalty.


- Chris

[~WarpedRT#2~]

You dont seem to get what I'm saying. I've seen it happen so many times. It's a reaction to turn and shoot. You see, you arent sure if it broke at all. You may have been bunkered, and none of the balls break. Why risk it, and call yourself out? If you did such a thing on my team, I'd beat the living crap out of you for not just shooting him back. The point is, when you get bunkered, you might as well jsut turn and shoot him back. you cant get penalized for it. The ref will just pull you and say that he got you first. Are you really willing to chance it, and simply give up? Why not take the chance and turn to get him? The most you can do at that point is get a one for one. The most the ref can do is say that he got you first. It happens in such a short amount of time that he wont call it playing on. It's a reaction.

[raehl]

Originally posted by ~WarpedRT#2~
Why risk it, and call yourself out?

Because you are *SUPPOSED* to be penalized if you "risk it". That's the whole point of penalties - they provide an incentive for players to follow the rules. It makes ZERO sense to penalize your OPPONENT because *YOU* decided to "risk it". If you decide to "risk it" and you're wrong, *YOU* should be penalized.

The game plays better if the decision is not "Call myself out when it might have bounced or shoot the guy" but "Call myself out when it might have bounced or get a penalty."

Yeah, it MIGHT have broke, but if you get shot in the back, 90-95% of the time it *DID* break. Without the penalty, people who are hit 90-95% of the time are trying to shoot people they shouldn't be shooting at.

Your team wouldn't last long at a NCPA event.


- Chris

[-Tab]

Originally posted by Derman2k


And if I think it broke on my back.. you expect me to call myself out? no, i'm going to wait for a ref to pull my band if it did. if its blatantly obvious, ie gog, hand, chest... somewhere i can see i will call myself out, but not if its somewhere i can't see


i kinda agree with him. i usually play rec-ball and if i get hit where i can't see it, i call for a paint check. if it's where i can see it, i always call myself out.

[WicKeD_WaYz]

uhh what if you never get hit?:confused:



















;) jk

[lamby]

I play tourneys only.. I only get of the field if it is an obvious hit (gogged) or the ref tells me I am out.

I have trained myself to not flinch, I keep playing till told to stop. If I get you before they notice... bonus for my team.. If I get call for a 1+1, I will challenge it.. (unless it was close to the time I knew I was hit and then walk off the field. And then buy my team a round for "not playing correctly" at the local bar when it was over)

All and all, there is money on the line and the rules change. I will never be called on a bounce I guarentee that!!!!!!!!!!!!

[SlartyBartFast]

Originally posted by ~WarpedRT#2~
You see, you arent sure if it broke at all. You may have been bunkered, and none of the balls break.

And there's one of the reasons that tournaments are full of bovine excrement IMO.

You were bunkered, out witted and out maneuvered. Except for the asinine clinging to the rule of the ball having broken or not you were beat.

IMO, refs should be given the power to yank you as soon as it's obvious you were beat.

Otherwise, perhaps a hybrid/new rule needs to be developed. All the rules around paintchecks really make no sense at the speed tournament games are played. Perhaps a bunkered player should go to their flag station for a paintcheck and be reinserted at the station after being cleared.

Otherwise, IMO the bunkered player should be checked first and if anything broke there should without a doubt be a penalty assessed. Indeed penalties should be assessed far more often.


Originally posted by lamby
I keep playing till told to stop. If I get you before they notice... bonus for my team.. If I get call for a 1+1, I will challenge it..

This is a prime example of where a penalty should be applied.
- Ref thinks they see a hit.
- Ref runs over while you are still playing.
- Ref finds a hit. Calls the elimination.

The ball DID break. The player was still playing AFTER the ball broke while the ref was coming over for the paintcheck.

How much clearer a fit of the definition of “playing-on” can this be? Challenging the call should be another penalty.

As for obvious or not, un-obvious hits should only count for hits on hard equipment and packs. It’s your fault you’re too padded/armoured to feel a hit. Or worse, you’ve “trained yourself not to flinch”.

Refs have to become more aggressive. If they see a ball bounce off a player, call the elimination (after all hockey can have a puck score without the puck staying in the net). Every time they run to check a player, the call should be eliminated and a penalty unless the player is clean or simply an elimination if the player did not fire in the time since the ref suspected the hit.

I’m sure it’ll tick some people off, but IMO arguing that “I trained myself not to flinch” and “I play until told to stop” shows that you are not interested in playing in a sportsman-like manner and that you view the contest as one of simple brute domination/luck and not one of skill or talent.

[dansim]

i call myself out before the game starts, its much easier that way

[lamby]

SHARTLY:

two things you must do, and in this order!!!

Play national tourneys,

then post.. You had the order wrong.

I was being honest, what the post asked for.

If I run to the forty and get hit at the 30 in the chest I slide on it..

If I get tagged in the leg I do a foot first to my bunker.

You have no idea what you are are talking about... I wanted to be honest, all that honesty makes you is a loser when it comes to check issueing time.

I am all for not "cheating" but "cheating" begets "cheating"

PS.. A goal in Hockey is crossing the plain of the goal, not "staying in the net" just get your rules right before you comment

[SlartyBartFast]

Originally posted by lamby
SHARTLY:

Good god. At least get my name right.:rolleyes:

Sorry, but I don't think anyone playing national tournaments is worth a rodents patoot. If you like it fine. But your status as a tourny player or not just doesn't interest me.

Nice to see that you get off on wasting/gambling your money on a competition of who can get away with the most. If you enjoy participating in an event that has no honour or honesty then so be it. It just turns me off.

Winning money based on blatent lies and cheating is something I NEVER want to be a part of. I'll take the moral win of knowing I like playing a sport and enjoy good clean competition. I'm also farther above every player in tournament ball that doesn't win. I at least haven't lined the pockets of organisers and low life cheats to receive nothing in return.

Seeing as it's tournament players that are by far the minority in paintball, isn't it time they were shown by the majority the way things should be and not the other way around?

[UltimatePaintballer]

i have only played rec ball and 98% of the time ill call myself out, but if i have an amazing spot on the field, i will play on till someone sees it and tells the ref to check me or the ref sees it and checks me. other wise yea, its rec ball and their mostly newbs so ill just leave and grab a beef stick:D

[lamby]

sorry SLARTY. I am used to fighting with the other guy (grin)

then don't play plain and simple. The original poster was not refering to you anyway. When I practice, or play rec ball (god forbid I am that bored)I will call myself out. When there is cash on the line ($100 or $10000) I will do what I need to do to win. I will not take stupid gambles with my or my teammates "lives" (lives are points and points are needed) If you come around a bunker and shoot someone and they shoot you back after you shot them it is normally a wash and you are both 'dead' unless there was a ref right there that knows who was shot first. Playing on is part of the game, but you cant play on if you flinch. The other tourney guys in this thread will understand, and that is as far as I as willing to take it right now

edited to fix the bad grammer...

[SlartyBartFast]

Originally posted by lamby
The other tourney guys in this thread will understand, and that is as far as I as willing to take it right now

It's all a little like Pete Rose isn't it. You'll admit you're doing something wrong. But you didn't do anything wrong.

And you're right, I won't play tournaments. Unless there's good reffing and it doesn't cost a fortune to simply give the organisers a huge payoff and the winners huge prizes.

I'd much rather know I played right and got beat, than know that I'm willing to whore my principles to win money then make it worse by using the wins as bragging rights and lording over the 'inferior' and 'boring' rec players.

As long as you and other tournament players accept the way tournaments are played you'll have no respect or interest from me. Judging from many of the posts on this and other "why tournaments are bad" threads and the numbers of players playing rec/scenario compared to tourney players I'm not alone.

Regardless, the tired and pathetic refrain from the usual suspects of AO tournament players is what doesn't belong in these discussions. Come up with something constructive to sell the current format that's better than every one cheats and that's the way it'll stay. Current tournament players are free to devolve all they want. It would be refreshing however for some of them to champion the good fight and propose changes.

So far however all player initiatives to change the tournament scene have been perverted by the paintball industry and self serving promoters.

Players have their part of the blame as well. Too many are quick to judge a tournament not on its organisation and reffing but on the prizes it offers.

It may just be that good, clean, sportsman-like competition will not 'make it big'. But these discussions may make it possible for those looking for this type of play to organise at a grass-roots level.

For some paintball is about the game and comraderie, not about the flash and fame.

[MayAMonkeyBeYourPinata]

One thing about sports in general.

Everyone cheats, people hold in football, foul in basketball, etc... etc... And wiping is no different, you get caught, and you are penalized. And that is why we have refs at tournies. But during rec, where refs are less prominent not cool. It should result in a reduction of points imo. Just to discourage it more.

[robdamanii]

When I'm on the speedball field, and it's an OBVIOUS hit, I'll call out. If it's not obvious (pack, shoe) I will play until called. That's what the refs are there for, is to watch for those hits.

In the woods, I'll check myself or call a paintcheck on what I can't see.

[Sir_Brass]

Originally posted by MayAMonkeyBeYourPinata
One thing about sports in general.

Everyone cheats, people hold in football, foul in basketball, etc... etc... And wiping is no different, you get caught, and you are penalized. And that is why we have refs at tournies. But during rec, where refs are less prominent not cool. It should result in a reduction of points imo. Just to discourage it more.

That's such bs that it's not funny. What you refered to can sometimes be unintentional, or just a reflex by the player, but penalties assesed ANYWAY b/c the rules were broken. It isn't cheating, b/c the rules don't define it as such.

In paintball, it has been made OBVIOUS over and over that wiping is cheating, pure and simple. Not something reactionary or unintentional (if I think the shot bounced, I'll call paintcheck and keep playing till the ref calls me neutral, and THEN if I keep playing while he's checking and finds a hit, then I'd be guilty of playing on) like playing on CAN be (but penalities still assessed).

Wiping is cheating and practicing wiping is encouraging cheating. Those who encourage it should be banned for life, and those who practice it should have the same penalty given to them (if constant consistant wiping [aka cheating] is occuring).

slarty, I agree with you for the most part, except for the playing on, thing. If one is hit in the mask above the visor, he won't necessarilly feel it. It's happened to me before where I didn't even know a shot HIT me till after the game and I took off my mask off the field and saw the hit there.

Anyway, you TWiBs are making me sick, trying to defend your cheating. It just shows you have no honor and care nothing except winning that money. Disgusting. I'd rather lose and keep my honor than win and lose my honor.


Originally said by actor Al Pachino in the movie "Scarface", I think . . .
All I have left are my honor and my balls, and I bust them for nobody.

[SyntaxError]

Man if you mow somebody good they'll leave, otherwise call a check on em real quick when the flinch cuz then a ref will see them wipe it.

I know just about every dirty trick in the book, I was taught by the best (much love guys:p ) but I won't out and out cheat a team out of a win, Im not gonna wipe a hit I know broke unless its against a team who I know is doing the same to us.

I'll freight train, sandbag in a division, shoot refs, use refs as distractions, distract the refs themselves, but its not cool wiping hits, if I know i'm out i'll leave. if im not sure and I think i could get in trouble for not doing so I'll ask a ref.

to tell the truth I dont get shot all that often:p

[laxkid]

I always call my self out just to get into the habit of it if I see a break on me it is just I am an honorable player and can tell when I have been out played

[~WarpedRT#2~]

Originally posted by raehl


Because you are *SUPPOSED* to be penalized if you "risk it". That's the whole point of penalties - they provide an incentive for players to follow the rules. It makes ZERO sense to penalize your OPPONENT because *YOU* decided to "risk it". If you decide to "risk it" and you're wrong, *YOU* should be penalized.

The game plays better if the decision is not "Call myself out when it might have bounced or shoot the guy" but "Call myself out when it might have bounced or get a penalty."

Yeah, it MIGHT have broke, but if you get shot in the back, 90-95% of the time it *DID* break. Without the penalty, people who are hit 90-95% of the time are trying to shoot people they shouldn't be shooting at.

Your team wouldn't last long at a NCPA event.


- Chris

And the NCPA is...? Thats right, I dont care. What I'm talking about happens in bigger cicuits. Watch the 300FPS movie. It happens like 50 times. And I cant count how many times I've see a guy go for a bunker attempt and get shot up, even though he got the guy, the ref just pulled both. Because he didnt want to deal with an arguement. I dont think you realize how many pros use everything to their advantage. They let themselves get covered in spray to make it hard to distinguish hits from spray, they do superman dives when they get hit, and yes, they also play on for a hundredth of a second to secure the fate of their bunkerer. They also wait for a ref to pull them sometimes because they know they can get away with an unobvious hit. Thats the point, if they cant read your mind, they have to go on your word that it was unobvious. Meaning, you didnt feel it, and you didnt know it was there. Kind of like you cant send an "insane" person to jail. They plead insanity, and they got off. It wasnt his fault that his wife fell on to the kitchen knife 15 times. Or she may have even fallen onto the bullet, which then drove itself through her...getting off track... but either way, tahts what the unobvious hit rule was made for, when you get hit, and dont feel it.

[WicKeD_WaYz]

Originally posted by MayAMonkeyBeYourPinata
One thing about sports in general.

Everyone cheats, people hold in football, foul in basketball, etc... etc... And wiping is no different, you get caught, and you are penalized. And that is why we have refs at tournies. But during rec, where refs are less prominent not cool. It should result in a reduction of points imo. Just to discourage it more.

its not the same type of cheating. Its the same as playing football and maybe putting a little helium in the ball with the air to make it fly farther. (dont kno if it can be done). Or putting glue on the recievers gloves. Thats the same as wiping off a hit. Wrong? Ya. Is it done all the time in tournies? You bet. Any way to stop it? Nope.

[SlartyBartFast]

Originally posted by Sir_Brass
slarty, I agree with you for the most part, except for the playing on, thing. If one is hit in the mask above the visor, he won't necessarilly feel it. It's happened to me before where I didn't even know a shot HIT me till after the game and I took off my mask off the field and saw the hit there.

Been there, done that. If you read back I did allow that hits on hard equipment could be considered unobvious.

But then again, the solution is probably in removing the ambiguity of the rules. Clear rules, clearly enforced, diminished cheating.

[SlartyBartFast]

Originally posted by WicKeD_WaYz
Wrong? Ya. Is it done all the time in tournies? You bet. Any way to stop it? Nope.

It's only unstoppable as long as tourny players, promoters, advertisers, and spectators want to put up with it.

Good refs that know the rules and who aren't afraid to enforce them would be a good start.

Next, would be some will to tighten the loopholes and identify any additionally required rules. Some creative thought on how to enforce the rules would be another step in the right direction.

Say prize money was linked to the honesty of the winning team and any future proof could be used to eliminate the team and require them to forfeit the prizes. So if the event is filmed and the film clearly shows wiping, fine the team. Fine them even if it isn't clearly wiping. Simply too bad, there was a hit and the team needs to have the rule enforced against them.

[tyrion2323]

SlartyBartFast,

I agree with you wholeheartedly. These guys who argue that cheating is okay because, well, they "want the money," or, "it happens all the time" have some serious issues. Yeah, lots of things "happen all the time," but it doesn't make them right.

Cheating is a serious issue in tournament paintball. I play in tournaments, and will soon be playing in some NCPA as well. Cheating is not okay on my team, even if the other team is cheating like crazy.

Guess a $100 prize isn't enough to break down my ideals, unlike some of the morons on this forum.

[Trina]

Originally posted by coolcatpete
I will be honest when I play with neewbs I dont directly wipe, I will brush up on a bunker or a ref will do it for me, I only would do this in the woods. The rason for this is that I ref and when I get to plaY that day I want to get a full game in not just 2 sec. So I figure I should be rewared for reffing. Most of the time when I do this I try not to shoot very many people, and I just guide neewbs around.
What a good example to all the new players who are looking up to you:rolleyes:

Okay, you're playing with mostly "newbs" and you keep getting out in the beginning of the game...step it up a level dude...then you don't have to worry about wiping...

I can't stand playing with cheaters...you wipe...you're a cheater, it's as basic as that. There's no excuse.

Sorry, for ranting guys, but I've seen it happen too often and it's just one of those things that really annoy me.

[WicKeD_WaYz]

Originally posted by SlartyBartFast


It's only unstoppable as long as tourny players, promoters, advertisers, and spectators want to put up with it.

Good refs that know the rules and who aren't afraid to enforce them would be a good start.

Next, would be some will to tighten the loopholes and identify any additionally required rules. Some creative thought on how to enforce the rules would be another step in the right direction.

Say prize money was linked to the honesty of the winning team and any future proof could be used to eliminate the team and require them to forfeit the prizes. So if the event is filmed and the film clearly shows wiping, fine the team. Fine them even if it isn't clearly wiping. Simply too bad, there was a hit and the team needs to have the rule enforced against them.


But no matter what you do, cheating will still be there. There will always be ways to bend the rules. Everyone is human and when theres money involved lots of teams will do what it takes to win. Thats one of the reasons I got out of tourney ball, that and I didnt have the cash to keep going.

Although it is possible for cheating to be reduced, I dont think you could completely get rid of it.

But one of the things I thought would be good, in big tournies, have a camera ZOOMED on every bunker, from all the angles you can get. Have refs on the field AND on the side watching each players every move from tv's. :D