My Gun Gets Outshot!

[FSUpeej22]

Ok... before I purchased my 68 classin automag about a month ago I read all the reviews about it and they all said that this gun shot very fast! When I got my gun I went out and played with it and it gets outshot but pirranas and tracers. It is impossible to fan the trigger too. can someone tell me why this is happening?

[pharcyde]

um..your not pulling the trigger fast enough???
how long have you been playing, shooting a gun fast takes time.

[FSUpeej22]

I've been playing for about 2 years... it has nothing to do with me. I can shoot other guns very fast but on this one the trigger put sux. Is this normal for a 68 classic mag?

[FSUpeej22]

in that last post i mean the trigger pull* sux

[Paintballboy]

Well this gun was fast when it came out. Now most spyders have nicer trigger than a 68 automag. Though i can shoot my mag realitivly fast there not the fastest gun out. It makes since if spyders shoot faster.

[pharcyde]

trigger pulls are all preference, some people can shoot fast with some guns, others can't. the first time i personally shot a cocker, i couldn't shoot it with my left hand. my suggestion is to keep on shooting and eventually you'll get used to the mags trigger.

[j.t.]

The trigger pull on a mag is very different from most other markers. It is very short and snappy trigger and can be difficult to fire fast at first. I just recently switched from a tricked spyder to a minimag and I am having the same problem. It may just come with practice. I have already begun to excel at firing mine, it just took a lot of dry firing to get used to it.:)

[XspyX]

If its a new mag it takes a while for the trigger to get "broken in"

over time you will learn how to "ride" the trigger with your finger. The trigger does all the work, you just add a little pressure...:D

[FeelTheRT]

ya, give it a few more days of play. Just work on your game and the speed of the trigger will come to you eventually. I rmemeber when i first got my 68 Automag. The trigger was pritty hard, but then either i got used to it or it got softer, i guess it got softer cuz my friends also felt a drematic diffrence. If you think 6-8 bps is too slow, go for a RT valve and have a reactive trigger.

[j.t.]

Dont worry, today you may be getting outshot by spyders, but with a little practice you will be covering those spyders in paint.
Just remember how much more consistent an automag is at high firing rates.

[Ityl]

2 words, double trigger. Mag's can rip, trust me :)

[Cha0tic]

its all in how you are pulling the trigger. i usually use my middle finger and i pull it with almost the tip of the finger. try that somtime.

[MagShooter]

personally..i dont like to worry too much about the RoF issues. I can get my mag about 7bps..and that's more than fast enough for me. I'm more worried about the 1 shot elimination than spray and pray. But, the trigger pull you're experiencing is normal on a new mag. Just keep playing with it, it will get softer.

[ZeroXtreme]

Good point MagShooter, but if he really is concerned about rate of fire, then I agree with Ityl. A double trigger frame with a double trigger would increase your rate of fire. Although the cost could go from $60+ to $90+. If you want to save, chop off your trigger guard and file it smooth with a jewelers file, then replace the stock trigger with a double trigger ($15). Thats what I did and my rate of fire increased dramatically.

I don't believe in "spray and pray," but it is good to have a gun with a high ROF when you get into certain situations that call for it. :D

[Maverick]

Just as an additional statement, a double trigger will greatly increase your rate of fire, BUT it will also, IMO, greatly increase your chance of short-stroking and chopping paint. No that could just be me and the way I pull a trigger, but that is what I experienced. I have since put a hyperframe on my mag and I love it.

[LeadBasedPaint]

The trigger has to be broken in. Personally I think the mag has a much better trigger than a spyder or pirahna. I can get about 7 balls a second with a single trigger and no modifications. I know thats not absolutly blazing, but it is fast. I can't wait to go electro though. Any suggestion as to which electro trigger is best?

[MagShooter]

As far as going electro..I just did that. BUt I took the expensive way out of it and bought an Emag. It ROCKS!!! But the Boo-Yah frame is decent..I had one on my classic, but I couldn't get the dang thing working. However, I heard they're out of business. So the Hyperframe is your other option. From what I heard, it's a good frame too..but tends to eat bolts. That's all the help I can give ya..like I said. I don't have much experience with those frames since I bought an Emag. Hope this helps

[LeadBasedPaint]

Yeah the e-mag looks like its a pretty sweet gun. Even when I was a mag hater ( yes I used to hate mags, but after getting my minimag I got over it) deep down I had to admit that it was sweet. I especially like the way they used magnets for the trigger, and that you can go manual if the battery dies.

[MagShooter]

I never hated mags..I never even liked them until I bought my classic over a year ago. The fact that the Emag can shoot in manual if the batteries die (unlike other electros) definitely influenced my decision to buy it. Plus, the gun just plain old rocks.

[Thordic]

Ok.. heres a personal example:

Last weekend I used my Spyder. I was fanning the trigger pretty fast, not sure of exact BPS, but it was going pretty fast. BUT, the damn gun is so inconsistant it would take 20 balls to hit something a mag would hit in 5. A stream of 10 from a Spyder will have a huge variation in where the balls end up. A mag shooting off a string of ten balls at the same speed will land them in a much tighter nicer more consistant pattern 99.9% of the time, unless someone is shooting a sleeper SpAngel. But if someone has one of those, they probably spent the same or more than you spent on your mag, so don't sweat it. And your gun is probably more reliable anyway :)

Note: For those out there who are confused, it IS possible to totally deck out a Spyder and make it a nice gun. But, by the time you are done, there aren't any stock parts left, so is it really a Spyder? :) I saw a $900+ custom Spyder on a website once. It happens. :)

[LeadBasedPaint]

Yeah. Bottom line. MAGS ROCK!!!! The thing is I just experienced shootdown today. I had heard people complain about it, but today I just got it. I was rapid fireing (bout a 10 shot string) and the last ball just kind rolled out. It only went about 20 feet and didn't break. How do I fix that? New valve? I was lookin at one, I forgot what its called. I think its made by AGD, but anyway supposedly it has a higher recharge rate and allows for cold weather play.

[Puckz]

You probably short stroked that last shot...

[LeadBasedPaint]

Maybe. I'll have to try it again.

[ZeroXtreme]

Maybe you did short stroke the last one, although if you are still interested in the new valve, I think you are talking about a RetroValve. It's made by AGD, and is the backbone of both the RT and the E-Mag.

The RetroValve only woks with nitro and has five (5) times the recharge rate of the old Mag valves. It allows for play in cold weather because of the fact that it uses nitro instead of CO2. With nitro you can play in whatever weather no matter what valve you use. ;)

[LeadBasedPaint]

No. It's not the retro valve. I judt found the site I was looking at it on (skanline.com). It is called the reactor valve. It is an on/off. It says that it allows for sub zero play, it instantly recharges, increases consistency, lightens trigger pull, and reduces ball drop off. Sounds great, but does it work like it says it does?

[Lone Gunman]

Lead, just stick with stock valve parts, they are the best. Unless you want to shell out the money for a Retro.

[FDB1]

ten bucks says you short stoked that last shot...

it happens...

its not the valve...

[pumpamatic]

Yeah, you probably did shortstroke lead, you don't always chop a ball when you do.

Anyways, who cares if you can't shoot faster than other people. Eventually it will come. As for now, just enjoy a gun that never breaks down. Even if my mag and a worse trigger pull than say a Spyder, I wouldn't give it up just because it hasn't let me down yet.

[LeadBasedPaint]

Ok. Although I do wanna try that valve, and pumpamatic my trigger has a much better pull than a spyder. :)

[MikeCouves]

Saw off your trigger frame and put a double on!!!

That's what I have done and I can rrrrrrrrrrip up the field with it. It makes it way easier to pull the trigger.

[Rusty_Jones]

Your gun is still new man, give it time. You also have to get used to your new trigger pull. My Spyder SE from what I thought had a good pull. I had to use my co-worker's RT at a game once and it simply rocked. Some moron burst onto the trail in front of the team I play on and the captain opened up on him, I rushed up behind him while he dropped to one knee. I stood over him and let loose. Yeah, I looked down at my hopper and it was almost empty in less then 6 seconds of sustained fire. No shoot down, just pure unadulterated fire power. The mag I bought used can reef out an easy 9 balls a second before the valve doesn't recycle fast enough to do much more. You'll get up there in bps as soon as your mag is "broken in" and you become accustomed to it's performance. Those guns you mentioned are all sloppy blow backs and are just internal train wrecks with each trigger pull. Those saps who use them paid between 200-350 for a "Tournament Grade" marker, when all they really bought was a 5th generation PMI VM-68. Your gun will last longer then thiers will, and mark my words, within 2 years half of them with upgrade to a mag, cocker or angel because thier gun started to die on them from wear and tear.

Now, what you can do to not be "Out shot" is get a double trigger frame (Just pay the 115 dollars for an Intelliframe, You bought an AGD marker, use thier parts, you won't be sorry.), get a ReTro Valve upgrade, or just work on making sure your shots count. Accuracy by Volume is a nice way to eliminate people, if you can buy 2 cases an outting. Another thing that might help, get a new barrel, it'll help a bit with accuracy and your gun won't look so "stock". Get a nice preset Compressed Air tank, or if you have the cash get an adjustable one. 4500 88CUI is a good size, lots of shots per fill and they're not too bad on compactness.

If you're gonna start choping up your grip frame to put in a double trigger see a more recent thread about making a trigger guard. If you go this route you can email me at arhiman_27@yahoo.com and maybe I'll send you the one I made for mine if you have a verticle bottle adaptor on your mag.

[Temo Vryce]

For now don't worry about a fast trigger, like I tell every new player that wants to be able to shoot fast. Work on hitting your target with the first shot. Once you can do that regularly then you will find that you can fire faster. You need to break in your trigger. When I first got my mag it was very stiff and I caould shoot very fast but, now I'm one of the fastest triggers at my field. Mind you I'm not as accurate as I used to be but I'm fast. So give it time and you will see the speed improve. Oh a 2 finger trigger does help but if you can try a mag with one before you spend the money or hack your frame. 2 finger triggers aren't for everyone.