What would you do?

[afrankart]

I was playing at my local indoor field today, much like every Sunday. On one of the games of speedball, it came down to me vs some other guy who isn't a regular. He was called out for playing with an inobvious hit on his hopper. I knew he was the last one left, so I ran up to get the flag while he was arguing with a ref, and as I go to hang it, I start getting shot in the back. I am not afraid of getting bonus balled, but it just kept coming. The guy just kept on shooting me at about 6 bps. I tried to ignore the first few out of habit, but he wouldn't stop. The refs just stood there like they had suddenly been rendered incompetent. After the first few, I could hear him still shooting, so I tried to find a bunker for cover. I didn't make it to one in time. I don't know if it was a combination of adrenalin, getting into the game too much, or just defending myself from the seemingly never-ending barrage of bonus balls. Due to all of the emotions I was feeling, I reacted in the worst possible way, I turned and started shooting him. It took about 5 seconds of paint to get him to stop shooting me and concede. I ended up with 26 welts along my back, side, arm, and chest. He ended up getting banned, and hopefully enough welts that he learned a lesson. I probably shot 60-80 shots at him.

Now, in retrospect, I feel like I was given a test of sorts, and I think I failed it in the worst possible way. Ideally, I would have liked to handled the situation much differently, but I wasn't able to do that.

I am asking everyone what they would do if they were in the situation that someone was shooting them and there was seemingly no hope of stopping them. What do you see as the proper procedure for handling this situation yourself and being a good sportsman at the same time? I am sadly dissapointed in myself for flying off the handle like that, but the other side of my brain is telling me it was self defence, making it alright.:(

[Lohman446]

I whined really loud once at a tournament about being overshot, even here... frankly I don't think I was overshot anymore, just very unlucky. It was the same sitation, occassionally you do things that make you look like less than what you want to be. You apologize to thsoe around you, remember it so you dont do it again, and then move foreward, use it as an example to others. The refs should have handled it better though, and you can only take part of the blame.

[DementedRabbit]

At some point it stopped being unsportsmanlike and turned into an attack. You defended yourself, and he stopped.

Nothing to feel bad about.

[bokraham]

I probably would have done the same exact thing that you did, which in my view is the right thing. If the law dosn't do anything, then you should do something about it.

[afrankart]

It did feel kind of good to watch a nice loooooong fast string find its way to his torso. :D

[MicroMiniMe]

I would chew out the ref more for not taking care of the nub. Part of the field having refs is for insurance and if a refs inactivity leads to injury that could have been avoided by him doing his job, then DAMN.

You shouldn't have had to endure that much to make the snap decision later anyways. Ref does his job and grabs the guys marker, you wouldn't have to decide and make a slightly bad call. 60 shots back is too much. Maybe under 10 would be forgivable...

[afrankart]

I thought it was too much, too, but I did quit shooting right after he did.

[Brophog]

I got a question.

Was he called out by the ref, or was he still live.

If he was still live, did you make an attempt to call yourself out?

[afrankart]

He was called out for a hopper hit. I hadn't been hit and was the last remaining player.

After the first two or so hit, I put my gun and left hand up, my head down, signaling to the shooter that I was obviously through with being shot.

[Brophog]

Thanks.

Even if he was still live, it was in my book a reason to ban the guy. As we have seen in some of the discussions though, we don't all agree on such matters all of the time. Some of us stop shooting a player sooner than others.

If you couldn't get cover, I don't see what other option you had. You couldn't protect yourself and the refs refused to protect you.

I agree that maybe you should have stopped shooting earlier, but the fact remains it seems your last option was to shoot back in order to get the guy to halt his activity, and you accomplished that.

I wouldn't feel too bad if I was you.

[shartley]

I am going to go against the grain on this one….

Shooting him back was NOT self defense. It may have made him stop, but what you did was not a “defensive” action, but an offensive one. I do not think anyone should shoot back in a situation like that. I think they should either make it to behind a bunker, or lay flat on the ground. And shooting back was FAR from being your last resort, finding cover and getting off the field would have been.

And no one can use the excuse of not being able to find any cover…. Because you can RUN a full field all day while taking hits.

Can I understand your anger? You bet! Can I understand what you did? You bet! But that does not make it right, and you even admitted as much yourself.

(Added: Oh yeah… it was “what would you do”.. LOL I would have either found cover, or laid on the floor until he stopped shooting. I would then have him removed from the facility, or if he wanted to escalate it further have him charged with assault. But first I would just have him removed from play… for the day or permanently.)

[Emily]

High site is 20/20. Most people, in any event will think " i should of done this, i should of dont that". I think you did what you had to do. It sounds to me that he was not going to stop for nothing so you had to shoot him up in order to get his to stop. He aparently thought he could bully you into a win for him. The ref is also at fault. If he had done his job then this would have not gone this far. It turned into an attack after about 10 hits. Everyone can say what they think they would do, but no one know until they are involved in something simular. Sorry you have so many welps on you but be glad it didn't turn into worse.

[Digits]

I woulda did what you did.. But I wouldn't of stopped..

But how could you not find cover? Was this woodsball or something, because in speedball there are always bunkers not to far away

[afrankart]

I found a bunker to get to pretty quickly, but by the time I got next to it, for some reason, I decided to take actions into my own hands. I kind of wish I had just went behing that bunker. Oh well.

[penguinpunk555]

I would have done the same thing just as a natural reaction. Don't feel bad about it.

[painball]

I woulda shot him back too. Once it gets too a certain point where someone makes you mad enough. Your emotions take over and you have to hurt him. :D Seriously though. Anyone does that to me they'll get dumped on till they stop.

[hostage]

you did the right thing, duno what others may think, though I am pretty sure if anyone else was in that situtation they should do the same.
-Doron

[Beemer]

This is from another thread, have to put this one in the Quotes.



Wes Janson:
It's things like that which make one desire very strongly to beat the crap out of unsportmanlike players.


You just got yourself some experience and from that you are better for the next time

[bryer44]

Self defence , plain and simple.
i would have done the same

[devildog]

i would have walked over to him through the relentless barage of paint, and flat out jaw jacked him. he would have been picking teeth up off the floor.

[Crighton]

It's pretty hard to keep your cool in a situation like that. I probably would have done something much worse after my temper snapped.


no harm, no foul. The guy was banned and got a little taste of his own medicine. Maybe he will think twice about it next time.

[Crime Dog]

Sorry to hear about that man... :(

I'm pretty much with shartley though. But also, as he said, I totally understand why you did that. It would have been hard for me too if I was getting lit up that bad...

Hope to be there soon man. My Emag should be back today. We'll try to hook up and play some ball...

[robdamanii]

To be perfectly honest, I've had something similar happen.

Playing on one field, right after I got my angel, I went for the flag, and took it in. Hung the flag, and got utterly lit up in the back by a guy with an R/T A5.

Being shot up doesn't bother me, but when he kept on going (about 60 or so rounds), I just got pissed off, turned around, and unloaded the rest of my halo (about 80 rounds) right into him.

Should I have? Probably not, but I don't particularly enjoy taking head shots from about 15 yards.

The onyl saving grace for both of us was that it was cold outside, and about 5 layers helped deaden the impact some, but the head shots hurt just a bit. We both got to sit out a game and cool off, but surprisingly, the guy was cool about it. He apologized for being trigger happy, I apologized for blowing through half a hopper on him, we shook hands, and went back out and played each other again for the better part of the day.

It's all in how you handle it afterwards, regardless of your "without thinking" decisions. Since both of us were willing to admit wrong and apologize, it became a pretty cool situation real fast. That, and the fact that we both had to sit for overshooting made it feel like we were both wrong and we both made a mistake.

[Mindflux]

Originally posted by Emily
High site is 20/20.

What sight?

It's Hindsight (All one word, not high site) is 20/20. As in, "when i look back blah blah"

I don't know what I personally would have done... I've never been in that situation, thankfully.

[Wc Keep]

i have to agree with shartley in that the correct thing to do was to find cover and be like what the **** is your problem. but what i would have done is probably emptied my hopper on him. again its not the right thing to do. i feel that over shooting someone especially in an unsportsman like manner is very wrong.

[Torbo]

i would have blasted him. the ref really should have done something. Yes, the "right" thing to do would be to hide or something. But thats definatly not what would happen. I would spontaneously lay the nastiest stream ever at him.

[afrankart]

Originally posted by Torbo
I would spontaneously lay the nastiest stream ever at him.

I threw everything me and my viking had at him.:eek:

[Barfly]

yeah I believe it is called Fight or Flight. I would have done the same thing turned and started shooing back at him. It is defensive action though, someone punches you, you better punch him back or run away. Either choice would be defensive imo.

[FutureMagOwner]

when similar stuff like that happens i normally just swear very very loudly but if someone did that intentionally in a situation id end up doing something similar to that derder trailer because if i ever got that pissed i would nail him.

[$tevo]

I would have met him in the parking lot, kick the poop out of him. then blown his car up.

not really. but i would have been so pissed! i would have just ran away and look for a bunker then try to find out why he did it after he ran out of paint or until the refs had stopped him, then if he gave me the wrong answere, pop him one in the mask

[tony3]

I would of loaded anoth pod and kept going;)

But really, anyone that is human, there first action should be to defend themselves. I definitely would of turned around and starting ripping on him. I think you could of simply ran away and found a bunker, theres got to be atleast 1 bunker to hide behind. That though is the ideal reaction. Most people would of turned around and lit him up like a christmas tree.

[funkykarl]

I honestly don't know if I would run for a bunker and hide or turn around and light him up. But what I really want to know is what he had to say for himself afterwards. Was he like "oh, sorry about that" or what?

[hitech]

I am generally the "king" of do the right thing, don't give the sport a bad name, etc. However, I can say for certain that I would have shot back at him while screaming obscenities at him. I know I would, since I have...

However, it's not generally the best thing to do. ;)

[afrankart]

CrimeDog: you'll probably be lucky to see me there as I don't plan on playing there anytime in the near future. I can't stand incompetent reffing, especially when someone's safety is at their mercy. I'm even good friends with most of the refs there. I don't know why they didn't step in.:(

funkykarl: I didn't get a chance to see him before he left.:mad: Me and a few teammates took our time getting off of the field. I had a feeling if I got a chance to hear what he had to say, I might have had assault charges pressed on me. He is one of THOSE people with one of THOSE attitudes.

[Crime Dog]

Well phooey.

Let me know where you might play. I'll try to hook up with ya when I can. Looks like I'll be playin' there less myself as well. For different reasons though. Fireproof will have me pretty busy this season...

[Trina]

Originally posted by Mindflux


What sight?

It's Hindsight (All one word, not high site) is 20/20. As in, "when i look back blah blah"
Hey look guys!! It's AO English 101!! LOL! :D

I really hope you still get out and play again, not at that field, but maybe you'll find a better field in your area. :D For the most part paintball players are some of the nicest people I've ever met! :D Don't let one jerk ruin it for you! ;)

[afrankart]

Don't fret, this experience isn't going to result in me playing any less paintball. there are like 4 pretty decent other fields within an hour of me.

[MayAMonkeyBeYourPinata]

Did you do what was right no...

But did you do what every other human being short of Gandhi would have done yes..

[yourBFHD]

Unfortunately when you play paintball for long enough, you are bound to run into people like that...in fact, you will run into people like that in everything you do. I like to refer to them as the 2%...those who think that they are God's gift to the game and who honestly believe that when they are on the field, time stands still as everyone else watches poetry in motion. About a month ago I ran into one of those players at a local field. I had taken some friends out to play at the field because it had just opened, and we wanted to see how it was. There was a group of six of us; only two of us have tournament experience, and all of the others are relatively new to the game. Unfortunately we were given the pleasure of playing with a teenager who thought that he was the next big thing. Dressed from head to toe in the latest gear and sporting a tricked-out cocker, I must admit, he was a little intimidating...that is until he couldn't even get his gun to work. Apparently when mommy and daddy bought that shiny new gun for him, they forgot to grab an instruction manual. After having the airsmith work on his gun for about an hour, he finally joined the rest of us on the fields. Since my group was on the field, and he was all by himself, you would think that he would be grateful to even get to set foot on the field, but unfortunately it just wasn't so. He spent the next several games complaining about how the teams were divided up, despite the fact that we changed teams after every other game. After awhile, his complaints were falling of deaf ears so he decided to start taking cheap-shots at people as they walked off of the field, and bunkering newbies. It was doing wonders for his ego until the table turned on him. He tried to make a move up the tape and was just pelted by about 3 players...what do you think happened next? Well Mr. Allstar immediately runs over to the ref and starts whining about how he was lit up...honestly I wouldn't consider being shot a total of twenty times by three different guys being lit up...especially when you are moving up the tape right into their line of fire. Things escalated from there and soon everyone was arguing. Now, there is something unique about that 2% of the population...because they believe that they received their "skills" from some divine source they forget what they really are. So there we stood toe to toe both ready to snap the other in half...the only funny thing is that he was about 5'8" and 145 pounds while I am 6'4" 250 pounds. It took all of my restraint to keep from just laying him out right then and there...and similar to your situation, the ref was not about to get involved. Deciding that since I had spent about $150 to go and play that night I walked away and decided it wasn't worth it. In the end he was booted from the field and the rest of the night went smoothly. My point is (and yes there actually is one...well kind of) that people like that are going to surround any competition where adrenaline is prevalent...it is up to the other 98% of us to be the bigger people and walk away. I don't claim to be perfect, and anyone will lose their temper if pushed far enough...in fact, in your situation I probably would have done the same thing. What is important though is that if we do have a temporary lapse in judgement and react out of anger, we need to learn from it and just come to accept the fact that there will always be that 2% who just get under our skin (like i am probably doing to some of the other members of this forum right now), and we can't let them ruin this great game for us.

[RT pRo AuToMaG]

lol, I'd say you kept your cool, I would have emptied my hopper+ all extra pods plus a swift kick in the ribs. If the ref called him out, he's out. It doesn't matter what he thinks, if the ref says he is gone, that is it, no arguing.

[E==Mag MAN]

I was playing some woodsball not to long ago for laughs with one of my buddies. Well I was just running around like a lunatic and having fun. Well i get shot, turn around and start walking off the field. After getting shot another 7-8 times I turn around. This player keeps shooting me. I stand there for another 2-3 seconds and he continues to shoot me. Well this isn't the first time I had been blatently over shot that day so I just went off. This guy also had a tippman, so its not like it was a couple xtra from electro that you expect. Well after putting about 30 balls in him i simply felt satisfied and walked off the field. This time he wasn't shooting me. All though it wasn't the right thing, I dont know if he will be blatently overshooting people anymore. I was threatened to be kicked out of the field, I gave them my 2 cents and didn't here anything else. I dont think you should feel bad, he is a jerk.

Peace
Thomas

[Miscue]

I had somebody do that to me. I was stuck in a hole in the woods, in a fetal position as he continued pelting me, gogged blind. He was close range. The game was over already.

I took my barrel off and tried to throw it at him. I must have missed because he kept shooting. If I was able to see, I would have taken him to the ground. I bought a stainless steel Lapco after that. :)

There comes a point, where it's no longer paintball and it becomes assault.

[Emily]

Originally posted by Mindflux


What sight?

It's Hindsight (All one word, not high site) is 20/20. As in, "when i look back blah blah"

I don't know what I personally would have done... I've never been in that situation, thankfully.

You know excatly what I meant and this is not an English class. It's the internet. It was also a typo. Sheesh

[Wes Janson]

I had somebody do that to me. I was stuck in a hole in the woods, in a fetal position as he continued pelting me, gogged blind. He was close range. The game was over already.

I took my barrel off and tried to throw it at him. I must have missed because he kept shooting. If I was able to see, I would have taken him to the ground. I bought a stainless steel Lapco after that.

There comes a point, where it's no longer paintball and it becomes assault.
What happened after you threw the barrel?

Regardless to appropriated comments prior to this post ;), I would say that there is a point when retaliation for purposes of self-preservation is entirely ethical. Or to put it more simply, if the dumbass is lighting you up deliberately, repeatedly, and unceasingly, you have every right to stop him (while being sure not to injure anyone else with stray shots). Ejection from the field should also be mandatory, or highly advised.

Personally, I don't know how I would react. Depending on my adrenaline level, pain threshold, fps, and range, I might or might not try to flee the shooter. If not, and if the shots continued for 5-10+ seconds without showing signs of ceasing, I think I might very well retaliate with fire intended to incapacitate. In a just world, such a player should have their gun taken from them, reported to the police on charges of assault, banned from local fields, and be generally removed from all things paintball. Heat-of-the-moment is one thing, but I've known people who would do such a thing deliberately, and not out of blinding anger.

[Garrum]

Originally posted by Miscue
I had somebody do that to me. I was stuck in a hole in the woods, in a fetal position as he continued pelting me, gogged blind. He was close range. The game was over already.

I took my barrel off and tried to throw it at him. I must have missed because he kept shooting. If I was able to see, I would have taken him to the ground. I bought a stainless steel Lapco after that. :)

There comes a point, where it's no longer paintball and it becomes assault.

If someone were to do that to me, they would be wise to leave and never be in my presence, ever again. Depending on just how it all happened, I might either soak it up until he was empty, jump up tear off my goggles so I could see, and then beat him to death with his own gun, or I might soak it up, and when he finished, make some weak complaint, and then start playing again. Then, do the same thing to him, concentrating all of my fire on his head and neck, and stomp a mudhole in his retarded *** to boot. I don't play that intentional overshooting crap.

[sbpyro]

I think I would have brought this up to the ref and the owner of the field at the same time. Shooting back (as great of an instinct that it is) is not a good idea. I have been in the same situation before being lit up at close range (I'm not talking about 10 balls or so more like 30 that hit) it takes a lot of restraint not to go lay the punk bastich out but you've got to be an example out there for some of the newbies. Last time that happened to me
I went back to the staging area to cool off and when the ref stepped off the field I showed him the welts on the back and calmly asked him if he could be a little more proactive in preventing that from happening. The players who lit me up were forced to sit out the next game. But if the ref isn't doing his job the owner of the field needs to know that there is a dangerous situation developing from the ref's indifference to the situation.

[tyrion2323]

I don't think I would have really shot back at him. I would have gone up to him and tried to have gotten the ref into the fray by addressing him. I also would have made a big freaking deal about safety and asked for free paint or something.

[speedyejl]

My opinion?

Next time go for the throat. You'd be surprised how fast a trachea can collapse.

[Mindflux]

Originally posted by Emily


You know excatly what I meant and this is not an English class. It's the internet. It was also a typo. Sheesh


Typo = Typographical error = Hit wrong key.

Blatant Miss-spelling is more like it.

But whatever, don't learn. Don't ever get corrected and go through life spelling things wrong. It'll make you look brilliant some day.

:rolleyes:

[Sir_Brass]

I would've first finished hanging the flag, then got behind cover, stayed there, and yelled for a ref to make him stop as fast as possible.

[Jeffy-CanCon]

afrankart, IMO what you did wasn't the best thing you could have, but far from the worst, either. It was a pretty natural reaction.

Pressing assault charges, as some have suggested, would be a bad idea IMO. It's be unneccessary bad press for all concerned, and the sport of paintball in general. And you may be setting a dangerous precedent in the courts.

For myself, I think my reaction would have been to seek cover and start yelling & cursing. I've lit people up once or twice before in situations like that, but I always felt a bit bad about it afterwards. It makes it hard to keep up my "holier than thou" attitude. ;)