WGP Resurrects the STO!

[Ov3rmind]

http://www.tammyandchris.com/tmp/karnivor.jpg

Authentic WGP Bud Orr lightweight body
Custom CNC machined
Worrblade E-frame w/eye
New STO P-block style back block
New STO solenoid manifold housing (patent pending)
New STO front block w/ergonomically correct ASA (patent pending)
New STO ram w/TRV's
New STO input reg w/positioning collar
New STO Protective wire Guard
New STO Karnivor trigger
New STO Karnivor spring kit
New STO Karnivor ICS (internal cocking system) w/titanium cocking rod (patent pending)
New STO snatch grip
Torpedo bottom line w/on-off
New Tickler regulator
Delron bolt w/O-rings
Delron pull pin
Aluminum pump rod
Grip feed tube
Stainless steel hose
Includes all new full STO Kaner kit
WGP global limited lifetime warrantee

Interesting, I'm surprised they didn't spring for Karnivorr. I like the internal cocking concept (and the integrated frontblock. $10 says that wouldn't have happened if Eclipse didn't do it with their Nexus), but IMO the inverted 15 degree ASA is butt ugly (and I hate how they elongated the valve chamber, but obviously they are going for low pressure).

[50 cal]

I like it. I may have to get a 'cocker again.

[Jack & Coke]

What does STO stand for ?

[Torbo]

very interasting. some nice ideas. I think it looks absolutly hideous. and i wish they would have called it something different, i like having a now 'classic' 2k2 STO:)

Im not sure how itll do. I think it might be a little too radical to do all at once. and the backwards 15* is terrible.


edit: STO stood for Special Tournament Operations. When they were first introduced, they had vert. feed, so that set them apart as more 'tournament' markers.

[Cryer]

I like it. 'cept the ghey foregrip. too far forward and its friggin backwards. gnasty...

[punkncat]

I don't like the reverse angles ASA either, too wierd.
I think the internal cocking rod is a neat idea , but wonder how easy adjustments are made with it.
I little oversculpted for my taste though, I like mine with simpler milling.

[Ov3rmind]

Originally posted by punkncat
I think the internal cocking rod is a neat idea , but wonder how easy adjustments are made with it.
Yeah, if you have to remove the backblock and bolt to do it now, that would be a major pain. I'm hoping the IVG is similar to what Eclipse does now, and nothing has to be removed (or possibly they have thought up something new all together).

Just some other things: It needs a frickin beavertail. That snatch grip does not look like it comes out far enough, and I'm sure the pointy tip is not lense friendly (atleast it's a cheap upgrade). It also looks as if WGP is trying to patent electronic 3-ways!:eek:

[-=Squid=-]

Wow... I really like the look of that, except that fugly foregrip. What were they thinking? I like the milling, even though it does make me think of system X... shudders...

[Ov3rmind]

Ew, it does remind me of System-X milling.

[barberjohn]

hmm, i wonder where they got the idea for that negative 15* asa, since they also put it on their new scenario cocker too. i havent ever tried one, but they do not look at all comfy, and they are def ugly.

[LeatherPants]

GaH! I don't really know if I like it. I do hate the reverse 15deg. The body looks like an RDL Jackal body. The Inline looks boring. It looks like system X got the OK to design an official cocker.

[teufelhunden]

I like the milling and finish. Also, STO standards for Special Tournament Options, not Operations.

The backwards ASA is... yucky.

[funkykarl]

Wow. I think they had lots of potential with this idea but fudged up majorly. For one, what kind of a name is that!? Are they advertising to 9 year olds? And perhaps a little less ugly and a little more class would have helped out. Sure, it will shoot nice, regardless...

[Trauma]

the milling is cool looking, may have to get this thing in the future

[tony3]

What is wgp trying to beat system x at there own game or something? System x rips off there product and they rip off theres? All I can say is that is extremely ugly. Were they trying to write the bible on the manifold? Also, I don't like the reg at all. It also looks like you can't change it or anything. I have lost most hope in wgp after this.

[Ov3rmind]

LOL, I'm wondering if they are purposely trying to make it uncomfortable to hold.

[WARPED1]

Tell them to turn the friggin' regulator around!

[nippinout]

I am digging the Delron. :D

[Thordic]

Originally posted by Torbo
edit: STO stood for Special Tournament Operations. When they were first introduced, they had vert. feed, so that set them apart as more 'tournament' markers.

You sure? I thought it was "Standard Tournament Options" or something along those lines.

[SpecialBlend2786]

Wow.... its beautiful.
and I thought the origional STO looked cool. This changes everything.

[WARPED1]

I recently went to the "dark side" as some of the zombies here call it. I might have to get a second cocker now!

[xrancid_milkx]

I personally love the milling, BUT hate the name, color, and tacky reversed front grip.

If that thing had the option of a normal vertical ASA, and different color fades (specifically black to yellow for me) it would be beautiful.

I'm stuck in the middle on this one. They could have done a better job.

[P4ULuk]

Reverse 15 degree reg's is actually really comfortable!

Paul
:)

[Torbo]

hmm maybe it is options not operations, oh well no biggie.

[jeffremiller]

OK... so where can I get one?

J_

[thei3ug]

oh my GOD.

They're trying SO hard to make a blazer. they're so close, SO close, but in almost 7 years of prototyping they STILL haven't go it right!

well, at least it has an electro. that's one up on PPS.

[paint magnet]

Originally posted by thei3ug
oh my GOD.

They're trying SO hard to make a blazer. they're so close, SO close, but in almost 7 years of prototyping they STILL haven't go it right!

well, at least it has an electro. that's one up on PPS.

Hardly, IMO the Blazer is still everything the cocker wants to be when it grows up.

My opinions on the new STO's - milling is cool, everyone replaces stock regs anyway so that doesn't really matter, don't really like the internal cocking as it looks difficult and complicated to adjust, never liked E-frames, WGP is obviously conceited and has to rename everything to make it look like they made it/include the "Orr" name in there somewhere, the reverse asa is fugly but I bet it's comfortable. I'd be interested in knowing what pressure it runs at, price range, and if this is just a prototype or if they have actually come out yet.

[Rocky Knuth]

Guys,

Try the foregrip first! You would be suprised how it feels.

Roc

[poolshark5226]

yeah the reverse grips are actually VERY comfy

[deathstalker]

Originally posted by paint magnet
...WGP is obviously conceited and has to rename everything to make it look like they made it/include the "Orr" name in there somewhere...
Conceit? I call it branding. One of the most important aspects of many businesses and industries today.

Most people today use the word "Kleenex" whenever they need facial tissue. Most people use the word "Band-Aid" whenever they need an adhesive bandage. By using the naming convention they do, WGP is differentiating themselves from the countless knock-offs and clones on the market by reminding people of who developed the Autococker. The Orr name is widely recognized. No reason not to cash in on it. You know you're getting the real thing when you buy one.

Now I wonder... Is the Action Village TKO 'Mag the "Tom Kaye Options" AutoMag? :D

[LeatherPants]

One thing i do like is the new solenoid cover. Not the engraving but the top of it now covers the barbs for the micro lines.

[poolshark5226]

Deathstalker, when's the last time you came into a store to hear someone ask for a Bud Orr Autococker?

[JesseB]

ouch thats not pretty.

I wish they would have atleast just called it an STO instead of the gay looking tiger wolf thingy.

[wyn1370]

Originally posted by LeatherPants
One thing i do like is the new solenoid cover. Not the engraving but the top of it now covers the barbs for the micro lines.
It almost looks like the lines come out the sides of the hump there, instead of coming out the top like they do now.

[JEDI]

I think WGP had a good opportunity here, but in some ways missed the boat. The majority of the milling looks good, but some of it is cheesed up. I liked the simpler manifold on the originals. WGP always made simple/standard look good (ie The Orracle). I think this marker looks too cheap.

reverse asa = bad.

Now this is an Eblade!
http://www.automags.org/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=980457

[845]

I definately like the idea of the foregrip but the rest of the milling is sought of fugly. The name is not very good either. I would have to see it in person it might grow on me like the DM4 is (very slowly).

[paint magnet]

Originally posted by 845
I definately like the idea of the foregrip but the rest of the milling is sought of fugly. The name is not very good either. I would have to see it in person it might grow on me like the DM4 is (very slowly).

Yes, rather like fungus isn't it? :D

Deathstalker - come on, you're saying Orracle (and later they hyphenated it to emphasize the Orr), Orr-acle, Worr-Blade, Worrlock, and army of Orr isn't conceited? It's just like Dye who has to make sure they have 18 different logos on their $144 pants. Not saying that the products aren't good by any means, but they are conceited.

It's fine if they do it once in a while, like a Glenn Palmer signature series Blazer or something, but this is rediculous.

[JesseB]

boo hoo who cares it is their product not yours they are able to name it however they please and if that doesnt suit you dont buy it... there is no reason to whine about them putting Orr in the name... so quit whining this goes for everyone on the internet that whines about anything that was inpertenent.

[PsychoBaller]

Bahh..... they just saw my Sig Image... one thing led to another and they were like... lets kik it up a notch...

Lol... nah but in all Seriousness, i almost had an STO yrs ago. Had a Sniper 2 and a Red PTP FX MicroCocker that was just plain gorgeous.

-baller

[robdamanii]

I must be one of the few that likes the feel of the reverse 15* ASA.

I like this sucker. Milling is pretty nice, the internal cocking is interesting...too bad it's a cocker which I suck at life using.

[member#10,261]

I agree with rob...I like the -15*

[robdamanii]

Originally posted by member#10,261
I agree with rob...I like the -15*
It just feels pretty natural when tucked in tight. Although, a Y grip and -15* asa would be REALLY tight and feel really good in my hands.

Hmmm...

[dinger]

worrblade = good
that asa = fscuking STUPID

THE VF TACTICAL IS A STUPID PIECE OF CRAP!! look at how nasty the trigger is... and its lame. except the ram is like an orracle ram, or its better i forget.

vert asa on that thing would = a win

[paint magnet]

Originally posted by JesseB
boo hoo who cares it is their product not yours they are able to name it however they please and if that doesnt suit you dont buy it... there is no reason to whine about them putting Orr in the name... so quit whining this goes for everyone on the internet that whines about anything that was inpertenent.

Now who's whining?

[Odder]

butchering STO all base on a fuzzy picture.
Why the internal cocking system? is a logical next in the development of Autocokers. considering that no Autocker owner that knows what they doing uses the IVG to adjust the velocity anymore, all the fine tuning is done using the regulator.
and the backward ASA, 1st of all close you fist as if you were holding something, than relax your wrist, take a look at it, your grip naturally has a backward angle to it, it is more comfortable following the natural relax state of you wrist than to fight with it like the forward pointing ASA.

[tyrion2323]

I really like the milling a lot, and I guess the -15 could take some getting used to. Ahhh - who am I kidding - I'll never have enough money to even think about getting this!

Jacob

[Ov3rmind]

Originally posted by Odder
butchering STO all base on a fuzzy picture.
Why the internal cocking system? is a logical next in the development of Autocokers. considering that no Autocker owner that knows what they doing uses the IVG to adjust the velocity anymore, all the fine tuning is done using the regulator.

Actually you should adjust your IVG and inline reg. If you adjust your velocity solely with your inline reg on a Cocker you should be shot.

and the backward ASA, 1st of all close you fist as if you were holding something, than relax your wrist, take a look at it, your grip naturally has a backward angle to it, it is more comfortable following the natural relax state of you wrist than to fight with it like the forward pointing ASA.

Actually that's backwards from what would be ergonomically comfortable. Why do you think WDP, AGD, and a host of other companies are making vertical grip frames and grip frames that point forwards? The last thing I want to be doing is goosnecking my wrist for the grip frame AND the vertical reg.

[Odder]

Originally posted by Ov3rmind
If you adjust your velocity solely with your inline reg on a Cocker you should be shot.
Care to tell that to every Automag owner that they are wrong?
have you ever try and used y grip in any position other than standing vertical? try firing for you hips or god forbid you have to shoot from a prone position.

[robdamanii]

That's why I like the vertical grip on WDP markers. The 90* frame offers versatility in the way you can shoot, without stressing the wrist too much.

[Ov3rmind]

Originally posted by Odder
Care to tell that to every Automag owner that they are wrong?

An Automag is a totally different gun that works off of a different design. That has no relevance whatsoever.

have you ever try and used y grip in any position other than standing vertical? try firing for you hips or god forbid you have to shoot from a prone position.

I didn't say it was perfect for all positions. However, a rearward angled grip is practical for NO positions. I'm personally a fan of a vertical grip due to the fact that it is so versatile.

[Meph]

The reason being is because most cocker owners prefer to sweet-spot their regulators. Since the regulator works on a Parabola curve, after a certain PSI the FPS will actually start to decrease. So fps adjustment with the reg is not exactly typical or suggested. It's mostly all done with spring tension on hammer.

[DiRTyBuNNy]

after having seen this marker in action in my own hands and also in the hands of people like Brimstone Smoke and the Bushwhackers this past weekend...this baby rocks...

[evilhomer]

I can't wait until the STO Kaner Kits come out... I can't find normal Kaners anywhere...

[DiRTyBuNNy]

did you try talking to RogueFactor about the Kaner kit?

[evilhomer]

Yea, they're not in stock at WGP, so they're hard to get your hands on them.

[Odder]

Have you look at a Chipley Carbon Fibre System? Chipley Custom Machine (http://www.chipleymachine.com/barrels.htm#system)

[chasden]

The Karnivor is pretty pimp. The new internal cocking rod, -15 ASA, and new body mounted pneuos are all clever refinements of the existing design. About time! Bravo, WGP!