Another day off from school, yay (if I were still in high school) :(

[PyRo]

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=572&ncid=572&e=2&u=/nm/20040212/lf_nm/darwin_dc_1
Darwin day :)

[ZAust]

unfortunately, this day will never happen. christian-biased governments around the world will successfully keep this down, while court houses in alabama continue to display the ten commandments. :rolleyes:

[PyRo]

Hmm, I thought they made them get rid off all the 10 commandments things.

[ZAust]

Originally posted by PyRo
Hmm, I thought they made them get rid off all the 10 commandments things.

correct. i meant that our government is still heavily biased towards christianity. what kind of country can honestly promote freedom of religion when every piece of currency says "in god we trust"?

[bleachit]

"It is very, very scary," says Amanda Chesworth, head of the U.S. Darwin Day movement which works to counter the trend by organizing community festivals marking the biologist's birthday. "Creationism is spreading further and further."

Oh no!! creationism is spreading, like its going to destroy us all :rolleyes:

[Restola]

Originally posted by bleachit
Oh no!! creationism is spreading, like its going to destroy us all :rolleyes:
I would say that confusing people by teaching creationism as science is dangerous.

(oh yeah, and I'm in before the lock! :))

[Lopy]

Originally posted by ZAust


what kind of country can honestly promote freedom of religion when every piece of currency says "in god we trust"?

That isn't to byast, because even though their are many religions, alot of them still worship god. Almost every religion has one main God, so it deosn't just apply to christianity, but then again, if your a pasionate athiast, then you could be pissed, but W/e. :rolleyes:

[Restola]

Originally posted by Lopy
if your a pasionate athiast, then you could be pissed, but W/e. :rolleyes:
I am a passionate athiest, and it doesn't bother me at all. "God" is a generic term. If our money said "Jesus saves!", or "Buddah is the way to enlightenment" it would be a lot different. Plus I think we only make up something like 4% of the population, so I doubt the atheists will be marching on washington anytime soon.

What bothers me is when religion is turned into law (in a way abortion laws, laws forcing the teaching of creationism, prayer in school, stuff like that).

I honestly can't understand why anyone would want something as dirty as the law or government anywhere near something as important as their religion. But I think it really boils down to the need for everyone to believe what they believe, and their inability to respect others.

[bleachit]

Originally posted by Restola

I would say that confusing people by teaching creationism as science is dangerous.

(oh yeah, and I'm in before the lock! :))

I would say teaching evoulution as fact is more dangerous

(and I respond before the lock :) )

[Thordic]

Originally posted by bleachit

I would say teaching evoulution as fact is more dangerous


Thats just frightening.

[The Deacon]

Atheists: best way to protest the phrase "In God We Trust" is to boycott money. Send it all my way.

If anything, the atheists are dominating the scene. No one talks openly about religion anymore and religion is constantly getting slammed. Look at that article, it was a huge attack on religion, blaming the Catholic church for the shortcomings of Latin America without allowing a proper rebuttal.

Next thing you know, there will be "Atheist Eye for the Religious Guy" on Bravo. :rolleyes:

[Thordic]

I dont understand why people think Darwin automatically means athiest.

[penguinpunk555]

You guys know Darwin renounced evolution right. He doesn't even belive it. Makes you think huh...

[Fixion]

Originally posted by ZAust


correct. i meant that our government is still heavily biased towards christianity. what kind of country can honestly promote freedom of religion when every piece of currency says "in god we trust"?

It doesn't specify a specific god now does it?

I agree with The Deacon.

[Restola]

Originally posted by penguinpunk555
You guys know Darwin renounced evolution right. He doesn't even belive it. Makes you think huh...
Ever heard of the scientific method?

Just because someone changes their faith doesn't mean they can discount peer reviewed scientific papers. And I don't think anyone is saying that evolution is perfect. Evolution is taught as a theory. The same way that atomic laws are taught as theories. A theory is ever changing. Its constantly being reviewed by many different scientists all around the world. Not in an effort to prove the original scientist was a genious, but in an effort to try to disprove it. "Science" isn't a underground force trying to prove itself. It's a very public and peer-reviewed system to explain the things we observe. If you want to prove Creationism, start doing research. Publish it. Let other scientists review you work. Assuming it stands up to that test you'll have your evidence. My guess is if that was possible, it would have been done.

Science isn't the enemy. Science is not a "thing". Science is a collection of thousands of researchers all trying to prove the next guy is an idiot. Don't hate "science" because your faith can't be proved by it. Faith shouldn't need to be proved to anyone but yourself.

And Deacon. Atheists aren't dominating the scene. We are a tiny minority. People who love and respect the Constitution are dominating the scene (a huge majority of which are God loving people who don't want or need the government to tell them their faith is right).



And this is my absolute final post in this thread. I'm not going to try to disprove the Bible. I'm going to trust peer-reviewed science by independant (and God loving) scientists over anything you can dig up. I'm not here to change your opinion. If you want to force by law people to learn about your faith...that's your choice to try (although once again I wouldn't want the courts anywhere near my religion if I had one). But what I posted is a brief summary of how I feel.

[1stdeadeye]

Seperation of Church and State was meant to protect Churches from state control ala the Church of England. Right now you have Athiests forcing their beliefs on America.

Why can't groups of students form prayer clubs if they wish? Why can't a little boy read a story from the Bible on his turn to read day?

Just seems hypocritical.

[Ov3rmind]

Originally posted by 1stdeadeye
Seperation of Church and State was meant to protect Churches from state control ala the Church of England. Right now you have Athiests forcing their beliefs on America.

How so?

Why can't groups of students form prayer clubs if they wish? Why can't a little boy read a story from the Bible on his turn to read day?

Just seems hypocritical.

How is it hypocritical? It's not like kids are being allowed to read literature that states there is no God and that anyone who disagrees is wrong.
Personally I think we don't really need a day for Darwin, and it's not worth the arguments it's bringing up.

[Restola]

Originally posted by 1stdeadeye
Why can't groups of students form prayer clubs if they wish? Why can't a little boy read a story from the Bible on his turn to read day?
I agree many laws are rediculous. Not establishing a religion doesn't mean barring it from all public places.

[Jaasper]

Come on, of course we need a Darwin day. Just think of all the gift ideas. I mean who wouldn't want a Bobble Head Darwin doll... I believe that in this poor economy more holidays are the way to go. Make people go out and buy stuff to celibrate more stuff.

-Jaasper
Capitalist Pig.
Thank You.

[ERut]

Originally posted by ZAust
what kind of country can honestly promote freedom of religion when every piece of currency says "in god we trust"?

Are you saying that you're not free to believe whatever you want? You really don't think that this country has religious freedom?

Whatever you choose to believe, Christianity is a part of our country's history. Putting "In God we trust" on currency is part of that tratdition.

[1stdeadeye]

Originally posted by Restola

I agree many laws are rediculous. Not establishing a religion doesn't mean barring it from all public places.

Exactly! If you are an athiest fine! Don't try to bar religion from the world. We have just as much right to our beliefs as you do to yours.

Overmind-
How so?
Simple, The king controlled all aspects of life in England at the time. This included the Church of England as the king was the head of the church too! So Freedom of religion was intended to prevent state sponsored religion which would inevitably persecute smaller faiths. So we are all free to worship as we please without state interference, but some athiest take it to far trying to force us only to worhip at church. Forcing people to take religion out of more regular aspects of life is as oppressive as other forms of discrimination.

That's my $0.02!

[gamarada717]

I think that what ERut said was a very good point. This country was based off of christianity. The best thing about America is that if you don't like the words that we put on dollar bills, you have the freedom to leave. :) Also, I think that God is a very general term. Every religion has a God. If it said "In Jesus we trust", even though I'm a Christian, I would be pretty pissed off.

[Sir_Brass]

Originally posted by 1stdeadeye
Seperation of Church and State was meant to protect Churches from state control ala the Church of England. Right now you have Athiests forcing their beliefs on America.

Why can't groups of students form prayer clubs if they wish? Why can't a little boy read a story from the Bible on his turn to read day?

Just seems hypocritical.

Thank you deadeye! :) I was trying to keep my temper down reading those anti-Christian statements (which are quite false from what I've seen and experienced outside of church), but here you are with the voice of reason :).

Now, not to jinx us or anything, but how long till CB throws this whole thread into the toilet (or was he banned for good)?

[tony3]

I don't know, even though church and state "should" be seperated, our nation is christan. Our nation was formed and founded under God by the early settlers. The bible is a religious book, but it is not completely meant to praise God, it has life lessons in it that you won't here anywhere else. I guess I am biased beacuse I go to a Catholic High School and we pray before every class and relgion is one of our classes, and I have never not been in a Catholic school so I couldn't really tell you about religious diversity.

[Restola]

I lied terribly. I'm still posting in this thread. Sorry :)

Ignoring garamada this thread has been quite well thought out and civil, which is excellent! Lets not lose our tempers over this and get this locked in the middle of an excellent discussion.

I have a question for some of you Christians. What isn't happening now that you would like to see? Do you think your ability to practice your religion has ever been infringed? Do you think our country would benifit from a government policy of promoting Christianity? Why do you want/not want the government involved with religion (specifically your religion)?

[1stdeadeye]

Originally posted by Restola
I lied terribly. I'm still posting in this thread. Sorry :)

Just like a liberal! ;)

I have a question for some of you Christians. What isn't happening now that you would like to see? Do you think your ability to practice your religion has ever been infringed? Do you think our country would benifit from a government policy of promoting Christianity? Why do you want/not want the government involved with religion (specifically your religion)?

See here is where you are missing out point. I do not want the government to promote any religion. That is to include Athiesm which is a belief system. I send my son to Catholic Schools so that he may learn right from wrong the same way I see it. I hate character education in public schools that stress PC values to children that their parents may not agree with.

It is okay for a little boy in school to read to his class "Why Joey has 2 mommys", but not for my son to read a bible verse. How sick and twisted is that. If you teach values in school, you will discriminate against someone. Teach Reading, Writing , and Arithmatic! I'll teach my children right from wrong.

Disclosure: I am not some right wing bigot! I do not feel all gays should be killed. Do I approve of their behavior, no. Should they be persecuted for it, no. Should they be allowed to force it into my face or that of my child? HELL NO!!!!!!!!!

[bleachit]

very well said deadeye, especially concerning liberals ;)

[Sir_Brass]

Originally posted by 1stdeadeye
Originally posted by Restola
I lied terribly. I'm still posting in this thread. Sorry :)

Just like a liberal! ;)

I have a question for some of you Christians. What isn't happening now that you would like to see? Do you think your ability to practice your religion has ever been infringed? Do you think our country would benifit from a government policy of promoting Christianity? Why do you want/not want the government involved with religion (specifically your religion)?

See here is where you are missing out point. I do not want the government to promote any religion. That is to include Athiesm which is a belief system. I send my son to Catholic Schools so that he may learn right from wrong the same way I see it. I hate character education in public schools that stress PC values to children that their parents may not agree with.

It is okay for a little boy in school to read to his class "Why Joey has 2 mommys", but not for my son to read a bible verse. How sick and twisted is that. If you teach values in school, you will discriminate against someone. Teach Reading, Writing , and Arithmatic! I'll teach my children right from wrong.

Disclosure: I am not some right wing bigot! I do not feel all gays should be killed. Do I approve of their behavior, no. Should they be persecuted for it, no. Should they be allowed to force it into my face or that of my child? HELL NO!!!!!!!!!


Agreed 100%. That's a very nice Christian view you have, Deadeye. Hate the sin, not the sinner (as we christians see it). :)

[Ov3rmind]

Originally posted by 1stdeadeye

Overmind-
How so?
Simple, The king controlled all aspects of life in England at the time. This included the Church of England as the king was the head of the church too! So Freedom of religion was intended to prevent state sponsored religion which would inevitably persecute smaller faiths. So we are all free to worship as we please without state interference, but some athiest take it to far trying to force us only to worhip at church. Forcing people to take religion out of more regular aspects of life is as oppressive as other forms of discrimination.
Absence of organized religion is not Atheism. Schools are not preaching that their is no God, therefore they are not preaching Atheist beliefs. Neither Atheism nor Christianity is being favored in schools, and that's probably the best way to run things. Also, children are allowed to say their own prayers by themselves (and are allowed to bring religious texts to schools), so no one is really restricting their rights. They're just not allowed to make it part of the curriculum, which is how it should be (this falls under the same area as group prayer).

[Restola]

Originally posted by 1stdeadeye
Just like a liberal! ;)

Oh I hate you...:D That little online test said I'm the farthest right on these boards! :D

Other than that, there's nothing you've said that I don't agree with. It's the 1% that are ultra-sensitive and want no religion visible anywhere and the 1% that insist that this country is Christian at any price that are really screwing both sides.

[bleachit]

"Absence of organized religion is not Atheism. Schools are not preaching that their is no God, therefore they are not preaching Atheist beliefs. Neither Atheism nor Christianity is being favored in schools, and that's probably the best way to run things."

I was just wondering, when was the last time you were in school? because..... atheism is definately being taught and favored in school, at least the ones I have been in. And teaching evolution is just as good as teaching that there is no god, because according to evolution, there isnt one.

[1stdeadeye]

Originally posted by Ov3rmind

Absence of organized religion is not Atheism. Schools are not preaching that their is no God, therefore they are not preaching Atheist beliefs. Neither Atheism nor Christianity is being favored in schools, and that's probably the best way to run things. Also, children are allowed to say their own prayers by themselves (and are allowed to bring religious texts to schools), so no one is really restricting their rights. They're just not allowed to make it part of the curriculum, which is how it should be (this falls under the same area as group prayer).

No, not organized, but absence of God is atheism.

Atheism is actually be fostered in schools. I could share my heritage, my sexuality, my sex life, but not my faith in publc schools. That is the problem. Leave character and PC out of the schools all together and you are fine. No one can protest math! The numbers are the numbers!;)

[1stdeadeye]

Originally posted by Restola

Oh I hate you...:D That little online test said I'm the farthest right on these boards! :D

Sorry, it was just too easy! :)

Other than that, there's nothing you've said that I don't agree with. It's the 1% that are ultra-sensitive and want no religion visible anywhere and the 1% that insist that this country is Christian at any price that are really screwing both sides.

The 1 percenters ruin everything. Ask motorcycle enthusiests!

[RT pRo AuToMaG]

actually, christians believe in evoluton, just that god started the whole process. I seriously think people have too much time on their hands to have protest against god. If you don't believe in something, don't believe in it, but don't force it upon us to follow YOUR religion.

[Restola]

Originally posted by bleachit
And teaching evolution is just as good as teaching that there is no god, because according to evolution, there isnt one.
k...

What would you have taught in a science class? Find out what the scientific method is before you reply (or don't, I don't care)


Originally posted by RT pRo AuToMaG
actually, christians believe in evoluton, just that god started the whole process.
Well some seem to. Even if we prove everything beyond any doubt, we'll never fully understand God's role in it all (for those who believe He exists). And I have no problem with that idea. Just don't try to discredit science with faith. They are totally different games.

[Ov3rmind]

Originally posted by bleachit
"Absence of organized religion is not Atheism. Schools are not preaching that their is no God, therefore they are not preaching Atheist beliefs. Neither Atheism nor Christianity is being favored in schools, and that's probably the best way to run things."

I was just wondering, when was the last time you were in school? because..... atheism is definately being taught and favored in school, at least the ones I have been in. And teaching evolution is just as good as teaching that there is no god, because according to evolution, there isnt one.
Teaching evolution is not teaching Atheism. Maybe some Christians believe that in their feverish anti-science craze, but the theory of evolution says nothing about God (for all anyone knows maybe evolution is the way God created man).

And for Atheism being taught in school, I doubt students would be allowed to take Christian seminary classes as class periods.

Originally posted by 1stdeadeye
No, not organized, but absence of God is atheism.

Okay, whatever. So you're basically saying any organization that does not allow religious meetings is teaching Atheism?

Atheism is actually be fostered in schools. I could share my heritage, my sexuality, my sex life, but not my faith in publc schools. That is the problem. Leave character and PC out of the schools all together and you are fine. No one can protest math! The numbers are the numbers!

Your heritage, sexuality, and sex life are irrelevant to the matter. I really don't want to get much further into this because it's obvious we both have opinions that will not change. IMO religious beliefs have NO place in a public school's required curriculum.

EDIT: I think a thing here a lot of people don't understand is that religious activity between students is unrestricted. Students are allowed to pray individually or bring religious texts to school. I know in my highschool there are Mormon and Christian seminary courses you can take as a class period. The problem arises when asking religious activities and such should be funded by schools. School funding of a religious activity is absurd, students already have plenty of outlets for religious based activites in school if they would like. Asking for it to be funded by the government is not something that should happen.

[bleachit]

"What would you have taught in a science class? Find out what the scientific method is before you reply (or don't, I don't care)"

umm I have taken plenty of science classes. I know what the scientific method is. I have learned enough science to know that God and science can co exist. you dont need to teach science in an anti god manner.
I love science, I think its great. I definately am not in an anti science craze
:rolleyes:



as far as Christians believing in evolution.... in Genesis it says "Then God said "lets make people in our own image..." it doesnt say God created monkeys so they can evolve into our own image.... ok, maybe thats a little off topic, but as a Christian, if you dont believe His word, why bother?

[Ov3rmind]

bleachit, he still made people in his own image. Does it really matter if he did it through evolution (we did not come from monkeys BTW. Evolution does not state that)?

[1stdeadeye]

Originally posted by Ov3rmind
And for Atheism being taught in school, I doubt students would be allowed to take Christian seminary classes as class periods.

Still missing the point. I am not asking to inject religion into the schools. I am saying take all "Character education" and Morals education out and leave it to the parents. That is my job as a father bottom line.

EDIT: I think a thing here a lot of people don't understand is that religious activity between students is unrestricted. Students are allowed to pray individually or bring religious texts to school. I know in my highschool there are Mormon and Christian seminary courses you can take as a class period. The problem arises when asking religious activities and such should be funded by schools. School funding of a religious activity is absurd, students already have plenty of outlets for religious based activites in school if they would like. Asking for it to be funded by the government is not something that should happen.

I am not asking anyone to fund religious groups. However if you are going to fund Gay and Lesbian Student Groups, shouldn't you fund christian groups as well? Better yet, fund neither and there is no problem eh? Let them both go out and raise their own funds with car washes, coin drops, etc......

In public schools in MD where I was raised, a student could not read from the bible on his turn to read day in the 2nd grade, but could read "Why Joey has 2 mommies." That is my problem. Equal protection under the law works both ways. If one works, so does the other. You can't have it both ways. You can not teach a child morals that are PC approved and not allow them to see the other side of the coin. It is an education, not brain washing!

This is why I like the new French law barring ALL symbols of religion from their schools: Muslim, Jewish, and Christian alike. Leave it out, teach the fundamentals (not fundamentalism) and let the parents teach religion and morals.

[bleachit]

"bleachit, he still made people in his own image. Does it really matter if he did it through evolution (we did not come from monkeys BTW. Evolution does not state that)?"

ok, I am really not trying to cause problems, but later on in Genesis it says that God formed Adam from the dust of the Earth... still no evolution there, and then He breathed the breath of life into him.


edited because apparantly I only make sense to myself

[1stdeadeye]

Originally posted by Ov3rmind
bleachit, he still made people in his own image. Does it really matter if he did it through evolution (we did not come from monkeys BTW. Evolution does not state that)?

I don't know about that. CollegeBoy is a monkey, so mayne there is something to this evolution business after all? Or is he just a trained chimp?:eek:

;) :p

[Restola]

Originally posted by bleachit
ok, I am really not trying to cause problems, but later on in Genesis it says that God formed Adam from the dust of the Earth... still no evolution there, and then He breathed the breath of life into him.
You didn't answer my question. Do you want that taught in a science class?

(we may get locked no matter what, lets just stay civil and discuss this while we can)

1stDE, I agree with everything you've said once again. Keep everything out. Teach the kids the basics.

[Ov3rmind]

Originally posted by bleachit
ok, I am really not trying to cause problems, but later on in Genesis it says that God formed Adam from the dust of the Earth... still no evolution there, and then He breathed the breath of life into him.
A lot of the stuff in the Bible is not meant to be taken word for word or literally. I think a lot of people over the years have taken metaphors and anologies to be fact.

Still missing the point. I am not asking to inject religion into the schools. I am saying take all "Character education" and Morals education out and leave it to the parents. That is my job as a father bottom line.
I agree totally with you on that.

I am not asking anyone to fund religious groups. However if you are going to fund Gay and Lesbian Student Groups, shouldn't you fund christian groups as well? Better yet, fund neither and there is no problem eh? Let them both go out and raise their own funds with car washes, coin drops, etc......
Actually, I'm against the funding of clubs regarding sexual orientation. IMO, it is very much the same animal as a religious clubs.

In public schools in MD where I was raised, a student could not read from the bible on his turn to read day in the 2nd grade, but could read "Why Joey has 2 mommies." That is my problem. Equal protection under the law works both ways. If one works, so does the other. You can't have it both ways. You can not teach a child morals that are PC approved and not allow them to see the other side of the coin. It is an education, not brain washing!
That's odd, because that's not the case where I live. It is okay for students to read from religious texts aloud here (understand that they are not teaching it, but more for examples during an English or a history class. Or maybe one of those utterly pointless times when a student has to share something about themselves).

This is why I like the new French law barring ALL symbols of religion from their schools: Muslim, Jewish, and Christian alike. Leave it out, teach the fundamentals (not fundamentalism) and let the parents teach religion and morals.
I agree. it seems that we are just disagreeing on some small technicalities.

[bleachit]

Originally posted by bleachit

I have learned enough science to know that God and science can co exist. you dont need to teach science in an anti god manner.



you dont need to teach evolution as FACT cuz it isnt. most of the people I have had as teachers teach it as fact. and often with an anti god tone. If you want to teach science you can, just leave out the "oh, there is a ton of evidence proving that evolution is fact and that we all evolved from other forms of life." that part is not needed.

[Restola]

Originally posted by bleachit
you dont need to teach evolution as FACT cuz it isnt.
Yeah...

We all know theories aren't facts. Any student with a dictionary can prove that for himself.

And isn't evidence an important part of science? (I'll get some conspiracy theorist replies to this one).

[bleachit]

you can find just as much evidence for creation as you can for evolution. the only problem is both sides are heavily biased and neither side wants to give any ground to the other.

[Ov3rmind]

Originally posted by bleachit
you can find just as much evidence for creation as you can for evolution.
Discounting the Bible as evidence, no you can't.

[bleachit]

do an online search, I am sure you wont come up with anything.

[Restola]

One thing though. I don't care if evolution is proved wrong, as long as its proved scientifically. I care about science. My beliefs don't involve faith. Just working to explain the world around us. I have nothing at stake. It doesn't mean anything to me personally. It wont effect my life in the least. You however can never accept your faith being wrong...ever...no matter what the facts show.

No matter how far this trying to prove whatever discussion continues, its worthless.

[sgt_easton]

OK, a couple of things....

gamarada717 - If you think every religion has a God, you're not reading enough.

tony3 - "our nation is christian." These are percentages of the population of the United States as reported in the 2000 census.

Christianity - 76.5%
Nonreligious/Secular - 13.2%
Judaism - 1.3%
(The rest are below 1% each, and I don't feel like typing them all, but I'm not saying they don't exist or anything.)

My point is, 3/4 does NOT make a whole nation something.

1stdeadeye - "Teach Reading, Writing , and Arithmatic! I'll teach my children right from wrong." is the best statement yet. That is, I'm applying it to keeping religion out of public schools.

bleachit - "Atheism is definately being taught and favored in school." Wrong. Websters Collegiate Dictionary defines an Atheist as "one who denies the existence of God." There is no public school that I have ever been to, or heard of, that is actively saying "there is no god."
---
Now on to proving/disproving creation. In my opinion, the bible cannot be used as a factual source. It is a great book, has a lot of good teachings, but in the end, you don't know if it's fact or fiction. If I take out my Mead notebook and write in it "bleachit pranced around naked at school yesterday" will any of you believe it? Or will you want photos? You know what, let's pretend I never said that. It'll get way out of hand.

My point is, citing the bible as a source is downright pointless. How is this situation different: I take out my journal, write in it that yesterday I went to the zoo. Then I bury it, and someone finds it in 1000 years. When someone reads it, the zoo won't be there because a new mall will be, and they won't know who wrote the book. Would you believe some guy went to a zoo that you don't know ever existed 1000 years ago?
- - -
http://www.religioustolerance.org/ is a very good site that I suggest everyone take a look at. It's also very handy for research papers in high school/college.

...I await the onslaught....

[bleachit]

"bleachit pranced around naked at school yesterday"

bah, you leave UB before I show up, besides, you dont know what those 5 pm classes are like.

and I have actually had a college professor say there is no god, and a bio teacher who was pretty close to that.

and the Bible quotes were for the Christians, not meant to prove anything to anyone else.

[sgt_easton]

I also have to add -

"Islam is the fastest-growing religion in the United States" NEW YORK TIMES, Feb 21, 1989, p.1.

This being said, statistically speaking, it will eventually be the majority. Will people still call the US a christian nation then?

[Sir_Brass]

Originally posted by sgt_easton
I also have to add -

"Islam is the fastest-growing religion in the United States" NEW YORK TIMES, Feb 21, 1989, p.1.

This being said, statistically speaking, it will eventually be the majority. Will people still call the US a christian nation then?

what we mean by "Christian nation" is that we were founded upon Christian principles. It's been researched and proven that the vast majority of the founding fathers were orthadox Christians and were active church leaders in their areas.

Also, Islam may be fast growing, but like the vast # of americans professing Christianity: the majority of those converting to Islam won't actually be islamic, just simply profess to be and do nothing to support that claim.

[Restola]

Originally posted by bleachit
and I have actually had a college professor say there is no god
Who cares what a college professor says?

Wasn't everyone else here talking about the public schools?

It's amusing though that you seem to think you are so under attack from your teachers, but never experienced anything negative until college. You were what? 20? Must have been pretty tramatic.

sgt_easton, please don't try to provide evidence for either side. It's worthless, off topic, and will certainly get this locked.

[bleachit]

actually, I took bio in 9th grade, of a public high school. to be perfectly clear.:rolleyes:

[Restola]

To be perfectly clear, your bio teacher didn't say anything. :rolleyes:

[1stdeadeye]

Originally posted by sgt_easton
I also have to add -

"Islam is the fastest-growing religion in the United States" NEW YORK TIMES, Feb 21, 1989, p.1.

This being said, statistically speaking, it will eventually be the majority. Will people still call the US a christian nation then?

It is the fastest growing percentage wise. However going from 1 million to 1.5 million is indeed a 50% jump, however your starting point was far lower. For terms of numbers, the Pentacostal Christians (sp?) are blowing everyone away.

[sgt_easton]

Originally posted by Restola

sgt_easton, please don't try to provide evidence for either side. It's worthless, off topic, and will certainly get this locked.

Right, shame on me for doing some homework! I guess we can just call each other poopy-heads. It could end up being more fun.

[Restola]

Originally posted by sgt_easton


Right, shame on me for doing some homework! I guess we can just call each other poopy-heads. It could end up being more fun.
Well next provide evidence for why cheese tastes good, 'cause we're not talking about that either.

[sgt_easton]

Originally posted by 1stdeadeye


It is the fastest growing percentage wise. However going from 1 million to 1.5 million is indeed a 50% jump, however your starting point was far lower. For terms of numbers, the Pentacostal Christians (sp?) are blowing everyone away.

Growth factor is still the speed at which the population grows. If it stays constant, which there is no way to prove, it <b>will</b> become the most practiced religion. And no, just FYI, I am not Muslim. I wanted to state that so people don't think I'm biased.


Originally posted by Sir_Brass
Also, Islam may be fast growing, but like the vast # of americans professing Christianity: the majority of those converting to Islam won't actually be islamic, just simply profess to be and do nothing to support that claim.

This could end up being true, but there is no way to really know until it happens and they are polled.

[sgt_easton]

Originally posted by Restola

Well next provide evidence for why cheese tastes good, 'cause we're not talking about that either.

OK, cheese tastes good due to the "yummy molecules" being arranged in a ......wait.....what are we talking about?