Why no Clear hoppers?

[Wierd-Guy]

The NPPL just banned clear hoppers in tourny. Why?

And I just purchased a Clear Halo.:mad:

[Muzikman]

Too hard to see hits on it.

[SlartyBartFast]

Originally posted by Wierd-Guy
And I just purchased a Clear Halo.:mad:

Just dye it yourself.

Or, for the opaque ghetto look, paint it on the inside.

[Creative Mayhem]

Originally posted by SlartyBartFast


Just dye it yourself.

Or, for the opaque ghetto look, paint it on the inside.

Can't dye a HALO... if only... :(

[phantomhitman]

that is kind of dumb imo. then again i am not a tourney freak so i wouldnt know how things are in the "big picture". i can sure as hell see paint on any hopper i hit. :D

[TeamNausea]

Yes, hits were almost invisible due to the paint in the hopper's color.

[-=Squid=-]

Originally posted by Creative Mayhem


Can't dye a HALO... if only... :( You can... it just takes MUCH longer.

Personally, I Think the banning of clear hoppers is simply because they have lazy refs. If the ref would actually LOOK it wouldnt be an issue.

[SlartyBartFast]

Originally posted by Creative Mayhem
Can't dye a HALO... if only... :(

With the right dye you can stain just about anything ...

But I've never done a HALO so I could be wrong.

Paint is always an option. Use something that can be removed and go back to clear after the event.

[TeamNausea]

True squid, a quick finger swipe and itd be no problem but hey gotta listen to the refs so they say no clears no clears it is...

[Tyger]

I was wondering when they'd pick that up...

One of the original cheats. Clear hoppers, then stickers, then MORE stickers, then Plexus a clear hopper with no stickers...

If only these guys put as much effort in being good at playing...

-Tyger

[GoatBoy]

How about using paint that has a fill color that isn't the same as the shell? Black shell, pink paint, anyone?

You'd think that might actually work in the ref's favor, say, for a clear hopper that's mostly empty, you can see through the hopper and perhaps detect a hit on the other side where previously you wouldn't with an opaque hopper.

[845]

Glasses for the refs.

[lopxtc]

Because then most people with HALO's would be SOL. Mine will not work correctly at all with black (dark coloured) shells at all.

Aaron


Originally posted by GoatBoy
How about using paint that has a fill color that isn't the same as the shell? Black shell, pink paint, anyone?

[Altimas]

What they should come out with is a Hopper Cover for the Halo. There....Problem solved...

[845]

Those are illegal too.

[zacbot]

why are hopper covers illegal?

[GoatBoy]

Originally posted by lopxtc
Because then most people with HALO's would be SOL. Mine will not work correctly at all with black (dark coloured) shells at all.

Aaron



Ah.

How about, "some color shell", "some contrasting color fill"?


*pulling out color wheel o' fun*

[JEDI]

This rule (12.01 in NPPL rules) doesn't go into effect until after July 31. I've already emailed Camille of the NPPL, and questioned whether or not this includes "clear colors" like red Halos, blue revvies... We'll see what she says.

I think the idea of shells and fills being different would have solved the problem... actually though, come to think of it, NPPL is not event paint only, so theres a ton of different shell/fill combos out there.

Still, kinda Nazi/weak if you ask me. Suck it up! Do your job ref! :D

[JEDI]

Originally posted by GoatBoy
How about using paint that has a fill color that isn't the same as the shell? Black shell, pink paint, anyone?


NPPL is not "event paint only". Teams can use what ever paint they want (hence sponsorships) So we're not talking about a standard brand of paint.

[barberjohn]

ha. why not just go to a tourney, and when they tell you that clear hoppers arent allowed, then put on a hopper cover. once they tell you that a cover isnt allowed, then just go back to your clear hopper, and tell them to screw themselves. problem solved:D .

[rikkter]

Originally posted by barberjohn
ha. why not just go to a tourney, and when they tell you that clear hoppers arent allowed, then put on a hopper cover. once they tell you that a cover isnt allowed, then just go back to your clear hopper, and tell them to screw themselves. problem solved:D .

the problem would be solved by you not being allowed to play :P

[GoatBoy]

Originally posted by JEDI
This rule (12.01 in NPPL rules) doesn't go into effect until after July 31. I've already emailed Camille of the NPPL, and questioned whether or not this includes "clear colors" like red Halos, blue revvies... We'll see what she says.

I think the idea of shells and fills being different would have solved the problem... actually though, come to think of it, NPPL is not event paint only, so theres a ton of different shell/fill combos out there.

Still, kinda Nazi/weak if you ask me. Suck it up! Do your job ref! :D

Hrm. While I can't join in the ref bashing on this one, I can say your comment made me think of other things... Like how much clear is clear? Lets say part of your hopper is clear, but not all. Like... clear hopper lids? Or hey, how about clear elbows? Clear feed necks? Half-and-half's?



As far as the paint thing... Hrm, that's too bad. I figure they're going to start regulating paint next. How about those 4 gram paintballs, eh?

[JEDI]

The rules state clear hopper lids are ok.

12.01 Loaders must be made of a solid color, and stickers on loaders or other feed devices will
not be allowed except for one 2” by 4” sticker on each side of the loaders or other feeding devices
in any color. Clear loaders are not permitted. (Note this rule will not be enforced until July 31 st
2004) Clear lids on hoppers are permitted.

[cphilip]

I was gonna get rich selling clear paint balls with clear fill. Now I gotta do something else I guess...

:D

[GT]

Originally posted by lopxtc
Because then most people with HALO's would be SOL. Mine will not work correctly at all with black (dark coloured) shells at all.

why does the industry have to change because of a hopper? Doesnt make sense to me..

[lopxtc]

Yeah but how often have we seen where the tourneys bow down to the industry itself. Remember there was at one time supposed to be a limit on BPS ... dont see that being enforced anywhere. Why? Because if they enforced the limit then companies wouldnt show their support to the tourneys themselves.

If a tourney came out and said we are going to enforce this rule, which do you think would happen first;

1 -- People would ensure their markers fit this limit.
2 -- People would just goto another tourney that didnt enforce this limit.

Aaron


Originally posted by gtrsi
why does the industry have to change because of a hopper? Doesnt make sense to me..

[845]

People would double hopper covers and make super bouncy hoppers.

[Top Secret]

Whats the rules on Half and Half hoppers? I'd like to be able to run my half black, half red Reloader, but I'm not sure what NPPL and PSP's opinion on them are.

[Torbo]

do any of you ref? i guess not since some seem to say its for lazy refs.

If someone breaks paint on the inside of a clear hopper for example, it looks like a solid hit. they get pulled, simple as that.

[-=Squid=-]

Originally posted by Torbo
do any of you ref? i guess not since some seem to say its for lazy refs.

If someone breaks paint on the inside of a clear hopper for example, it looks like a solid hit. they get pulled, simple as that. I do ref, and I also know how. Its is NOT hard to tell when a player is hit... in fact, its very simple. Sometimes you have to get closer than 20 feet away to check. Fact of the matter is, if a ref wanted he could easily tell if the players hopper was hit regardless of the shell color.

[CoFFeY[NiTrO]]

As mad as I am about just buying a clear shell, it is a genious idea. I never even thought about the whiping part, of course I have a warp so my arm is usually covering most of the hopper.

[Blennidae]

OK, I don't play tourneys, so maybe I'm missing something.

Its a rule to make things easier on the Refs so they can watch for other things. I'd think it was more important for the ref to be looking for someone wiping or something instead of having to concentrate on if that color he/she sees on a hopper is a hit or not.

The sponsored players should not care as its not money out of their pocket.

The serious unsponsored players have probably put a boatload of cash into their gear already. A set of different colored shells isn't going to break them.

The new to tournament player gets a taste of the unexpected expenses a tournament has.

If you want to play in the NPPL, its a new rule. Accept it and move on. You pay to play.

Just my opinion...

[JEDI]

Originally posted by -=Squid=-
I do ref, and I also know how. Its is NOT hard to tell when a player is hit... in fact, its very simple. Sometimes you have to get closer than 20 feet away to check. Fact of the matter is, if a ref wanted he could easily tell if the players hopper was hit regardless of the shell color.

My sentiments exactly!

And Blennidae, its your own opinion, fine. But in a sense you're wrong. I fall into the category of serious unsponsored player. I own 3 hoppers, all of which are clear to some degree. Buying new shells at the whim of some promoter is rediculous.
Sure, you're right, its a new rule we're forced to accept. But where does it lead to next? Everyone HAS to wear black pants?
And as far as refs needing to keep their eyes on other things... Hits are basically the ONLY thing they need to look for. Its not the ref's game, its the players. The refs should be doing everything in their power to make a judgement. We cant change little minute details of the game just to make reffing easier.

[Blennidae]

Jedi:

Fair enough, I can see your viewpoint. You said your hoppers were "clear to some degree". I thought I read somewhere that smoke and other transparent colors were OK, only "clear" was banned.

Its true that refs should only be looking for hits, but they are pretty busy out there and might not actually see the impact. Since not everyone calls themselves out, wouldn't you rather have the ref not having to to do a double take on someones equipment when he/she should be looking for hits.

A hypothetical example:
You break a ball inside your clear hopper. Ref sees it and calls you out. You either leave and contest it, or contest it on the field. Either way is no good for the players, as you are either out, or the ref is distracted.

The rules get changed to cover a problem (real or not) that the officials see as a potential problem.

As for your point about the pants, I'd bet if people tried to market and wear pants with quarter sized colored dots all over them, they would ban those as well.

[SlartyBartFast]

Originally posted by JEDI
But where does it lead to next? Everyone HAS to wear black pants?

It might just come to that. It may be a good thing too.;)

Ever try to distinguish splats on Belgian camo?

If players will stretch the limits of the rules, eventually they will be snapped back into line by more draconian rules that aren't open to interpretation.

Hopper covers were abused to increase bounces. = No hopper covers at all.

Hundreds of stickers over the hopper to conceal hits. = No stickers at all/one black and white sticker.

As the various clothing manufacturers are pushing the limit of bagginess and included padding, there may just be a mandated uniform at some point.

[JEDI]

Yeah, I wont DISAGREE with either of you. Fairly good points. I'm just looking at it from a financial point of view. Do you know what its gonna be like to tell the other 6 guys on my team that all recently spent +/- $100 on hoppers, that now they all have to be solid?

If we all knew this kind of ruling wouldn't get out of hand, the hopper thing wouldnt be that bad... Its down the line that I'm afraid of. My gear is at a point where all I need to do is maintain it. I dont need to be buying new sh*t every time a rule comes out.

[Strider]

I know that clear hoppers were one thing I semi complained about last time I reffed a big tourney. While I hate the idea of buying new shells (esp for Egg users) I agree with the rule.

Personally I'd like to see paintball companies just not make same color shell to fill balls... :rolleyes:

[JEDI]

Originally posted by Strider
I know that clear hoppers were one thing I semi complained about last time I reffed a big tourney. While I hate the idea of buying new shells (esp for Egg users) I agree with the rule.

Personally I'd like to see paintball companies just not make same color shell to fill balls... :rolleyes:
Dude, I dont want to say you're missing the point, but its not really about same color shell/fill. In the NPPL, players are free to use what ever paint they want. If it was event paint only, no one would benefit from their paint sponsorship. So, that translates to hundreds of teams using 10 to 20 different kinds of paint.

Even if every company agreed to not make their shell the same as their fill, you might STILL have one companies shell the same as ANOTHER companies fill.

A pink fill ball could break on a hopper filled with pink shelled paint. In fact, their arent many companies that DO make same shell to fill balls. Changing shells/fill color isnt the answer, nor should changing the hoppers.

Their needs to be an answer that doesn't require us schmucks to spend even more money. But why would we expect any different from $$ hungry companies.

[Brophog]

Here's a good answer.

Support the NPPL in similiar movements to start retroactively enforcing this kind of stuff. As long as they dont go back on their word (again....) then people will only have to make the changes once.

[sneakyhacker420]

god damn!

and i just got a clear reloader b...

time to check on when yellow shells will be available again :o *sigh*

[Oddball]

So are tinted hoppers ok or does the hopper need to be solid, as in not see the balls inside?

[sneakyhacker420]

sounds like its only crystal clear to me

[AcemanPB]

What about Warps and Q-loaders? Aren't they clear? Are they considered "hoppers?"

[-=Squid=-]

Originally posted by AcemanPB
What about Warps and Q-loaders? Aren't they clear? Are they considered "hoppers?" Aye! Excellent question which I to would like to see the answer to. Golf clap, everybody.

[RoadDawg]

I've been to the HB NPPL 7 event the last two days and I've seen plenty of crystal clear hoppers. So looks like to me it isn't in effect for this event.

[AcemanPB]

Originally posted by JEDI
This rule (12.01 in NPPL rules) doesn't go into effect until after July 31.