AMERICA (and the Free World) STRIKES BACK ! (Official thread) [Archive]

cphilip

10-07-2001, 11:45 AM

Originally posted by manike
dropping food will probably be more effective than the bombs... If we do not keep the Islam people on side this will escalate to the ultimate heights.

We must just target the terrorists and supporters while doing everything possible to keep the normal civilians on side, if we alienate the islam people this situation will never end.

manike

Amen Brother! Amen! Seems to be the plan. And a good one at that. We must not stoop to thier level. The Muslim people do not deserve that. They need our help too. We must be compasionate towords them and not judge them for what a few misguded individuals might do in their name.

And by the way Manike, On behalf of America...Thanks for your help and support.

manike

10-07-2001, 12:03 PM

Yeah just watched Bush's address and then Blair's, looks like at the moment it's just the US and the UK invloved although 'supported' by 38 other countries... apparently the action is using British resources, although it's not clear if that means one of our air bases in India (a British colony there on an Island) or if it means our subs with cruise missiles.

I agree with this action, but I also have a huge sense of foreboding. Terrorists and extremists have no rule book or sense of ethics on their side, there is no 'Geneva rules' governing their actions. It may (and I suspect will) get nasty.

We must not let it become a war which alienates the Muslim people or Islam faith. That's why I think our humanitarian effort is the most important weapon we have towards 'winning' this conflict. And obviously so do our leaders judging from the speeches they are giving.

My thoughts are for all our military and the people's of our countries. I don't think it will just be our military who will be affected by this conflict. I've been subjected to the impact of terrorism before (IRA) and so we as people at home also need to take greater care and to ensure we know our enemy and do not allow race or hate to affect how we deal with Islam and Muslim people.

Islam and Muslims are not our enemy, terrorists are.

manike

(who is not afraid to say that this conflict scares him)

** edited to make my point about terrorists clearer :) **

jas142

10-07-2001, 12:06 PM

They say that if they strike back it will most likely be with Biological weapons (Anthrax, small pox, plague, or ebola...) :( I really hope not.

I'm very happy to see us taking some action though! I wish all of the pilots and soldiers of the allied forces good luck!

manike

10-07-2001, 12:18 PM

UPDATE.

Apparently British Planes, survellaince craft, submarines and our air base at a small British Territory Island in India in the gulf, are all being used in this action.

Sounds like just US and UK forces involved so far, although there are rumours of Canada and the French being involved also...

Temo Vryce

10-07-2001, 12:27 PM

You it's a real shame that it has come to this, but you know who I really feel sorry for, other than those who lost someone on Sept 11, are the Islamic people here in Canada and in the US. These people are being shunned and avoided when possible. It is very hard for them right now. I work with a gentleman who is Islamic and he is a very nice guy, but this whole or deal has him very worried and scared. These are people too and they deserve our help. I am gla to see that we are going to be trying to help out the refugies through out this conflict. It really doesn't matter if will help to purseude (sp?) them to support us or not it's the right thing to do.

Manike there are Geneva Rules of war governing this fight because if we ignore those rules we are no better than those that we are fighting. War is a terrible and horrible thing, and those rules and guildlines are there so that the impact of war will be as contained as it possiblely can be. We are not monsters, we do not kill for the pleasure of killing, we take prisoners of war and treat them fairly. To do otherwise would make us the monsters they make us out to be. The allied forces will obey the Geneva Convetion even if only to maintain the UN's support.

Pray to what ever God or greater power you worship that is fight is over quickly so that it doesn't spark WW III.

May the Paintball Gods protect our boys while they are way from friends and family.

manike

10-07-2001, 12:32 PM

Originally posted by Temo Vryce
You it's a real shame that it has come to this, but you know who I really feel sorry for, other than those who lost someone on Sept 11, are the Islamic people here in Canada and in the US. These people are being shunned and avoided when possible. It is very hard for them right now. I work with a gentleman who is Islamic and he is a very nice guy, but this whole or deal has him very worried and scared. These are people too and they deserve our help. I am gla to see that we are going to be trying to help out the refugies through out this conflict. It really doesn't matter if will help to purseude (sp?) them to support us or not it's the right thing to do.

Very well said, and something we can all do to help this situation is to make sure we DO NOT alienate such people.

When I said this conflict will not be governed by the Geneva Convention I meant the terrorists and extremists, not ourselves, They obviously do not and will not care about the convention. We must not let ourselves stoop to their level.

manike

cphilip

10-07-2001, 12:38 PM

Just watching Bin ladens pretaped address. The usual stuff. Only mentioning the wish to remove US troops from islamic nations soil. No mention of his bigger goal to unseat existing Arabic Governments and create a Militant Islamic country and his involvment in terrorism which he views as just means to acheive his goals. Obviously pretaped and predelivered in order to release after the attacks begin. Photo's in broad daylight and its night time over there now. Very much Propaganda continues to come from the Taliban. No damage my behind! You will hear much junk from them now.

Scary stuff but its begun. We have no choice now but to continue until we win. We have to win. The free world, of all religeons, is now at stake.

FeelTheRT

10-07-2001, 12:39 PM

umm . . exacly where are they attacking ....?

cphilip

10-07-2001, 12:43 PM

Afganistan. Predominantly Infrastructures. Power Grids, Air bases, Radar, Anti Aircraft installations, Old Terrorist training camps that showed recent activity and supply bases. Anything that would hinder a ground and air support mission to come later. Softening up the area for incursion missions.

mitch

10-07-2001, 12:55 PM

america is fighting.
and are going to murder al the afganies.
yeah go americans.
i hope you guys get the ***** that did all the stuff to you people.

canada stands behind you..

Arturus

10-07-2001, 01:00 PM

Wonderful.. Undermines everything the coalition, including our own Secretary of Def. and the Prime Minister Blair have been trying to accomplish. In that we are not in a war against 'towel' heads, nor the people of Afghan.

Guys, let's keep our facts straight and refrain from stereotypical name callings. It's not about being politicaly correct. It's about being right and wrong; having your facts straight. It's about being correct.

That said, I hope we do some major damage and send a simple message across. You're either with us, or against us.

shartley

10-07-2001, 01:11 PM

ahhh war between americans and the towel heads.
A bit inappropriate in a public forum, as well as being a bit off base.

america is fighting.
and are going to murder al the afganies.
Well, since murder is a crime, please do not say we are going to “murder” anyone. Killing in a war, as part of normal warfare, is far from being considered “murder”. And the last I knew we were not going to fight ALL Afganistan people. The Taliban(sp?) is not even the recognized Government of the country. Looks like you need to do some more research into this topic before posting about it.

yeah go americans.
i hope you guys get the ***** that did all the stuff to you people.
I agree!

canada stands behind you..
We thank any and all nations that stand behind us in this time of great need and do so for the RIGHT reasons (and I am sure most know exactly what I am talking about on this one).

But please next time, could you post with a bit more thought and appropriateness? Thanks.

cphilip

10-07-2001, 01:16 PM

Good response guys. Merged to this location.

Mr. -RushY-

10-07-2001, 02:19 PM

Don't mess with the US! I'm very happy about this bombing campaign but we have to watch if the Taleban defect to Pakistan, Pakistan is in control of some very powerful nuclear weapons, due to the race between India and Pakistan to build nukes.

Another point I wanted to touch on is Bin Laden's speech, in his speech he said the world is divided into 2 parts: the hyprocritical part and the Muslims. Rage is the first word that comes to mind after hearing that. I hope this also angers the Jews, Christians, Hindus, Buddists and various other religions to campaign against the Taleban and Terrorism.

Trunnion

10-07-2001, 02:44 PM

i hope it angers moderate muslims as well. not all middle eastern muslims are extremists. much like not all people in the USSR were communist

i_luv_talons

10-07-2001, 02:46 PM

Manike there are Geneva Rules of war

I don't think the Geneva Convention related to warfare - it was about POW's. But you're point is well-taken.

Plastic_Mercenarie_39

10-07-2001, 04:33 PM

Tear Them out of their tents and beat them with their own arms!!!!! We arent taken no stinkin Crap From Nobody anymore man!!!!!!! Listen to the awosme song i have attched i thought it went well with this whole subject i hope you all like it!!!!!!

Flamebo

10-07-2001, 04:49 PM

Umm... No song man...

Coulda saved yourself 4 posts if you read the text first. It doesn't allow sound files to be attached.

Snappy

10-07-2001, 05:22 PM

Action was called for. I don't think that we can end all terrorist activity in the world, but we can show that we won't tolerate it. I hope we make sure we know who we're shooting at. We can't tolerate civilian casualties, and should try not to disrupt everyday life in Afghanistan unless it's militant forces. There's a thin line between making new enemies and necessary retaliation. We're risking the lives of Americans and our allies for this fight. My cousin is an F-16 pilot who will most likely be sent overseas. My sister's boyfriend will soon begin training as an F-15E weapon's officer. I'm a contracted Army cadet. This military action will be fought by people who volunteered to do so. There's not going to be a draft, so please remember those who are putting their lives on the line. As far as how effective we can be from the air, just look at what we did in Desert Storm. Our Air Force makes it much safer to be on the ground, with precision bombing and special warheads that detonate beneath the surface to destroy reinforced buildings and bunkers. The ground war will be fought by Special Forces, like Seals, Rangers, Para Jumpers, and a Delta. These are very well trained soldiers who are the best on earth. Read Black Hawk Down and you'll know what they are capable of. All in all, I think we need to know that we are right every step of the way. We cannot cross into vengeance or racist assault. We oppose the minority, not the majority. I think it's great that we're trying to give aid to the civilian's there. It shows that our heart is in the right place. I think the best thing I can say is:

God Bless America.

blnk162

10-07-2001, 05:54 PM

Wow guys, this really makes me feel good....im not a real muslim but my dad is, I was baptised catholic because my mom is caucasian and from the U.S. while my dad is from palestine....the attitude on here is what the world needs, people that understand that theres like a .1% of terrorist muslims out there and that islam means peace....no where in the Koran will u find the word jihad(holy war) it was brought up by extremeists...thanks guys, im happy to see you guys are educated on thsi matter...

Thanks

LittMag

10-07-2001, 07:28 PM

Ok, I don't know how appropriate this is, but I found it kinda amusing.

>>
Killing Osama Bin Ladin will only create a martyr. Holding him prisoner will inspire his comrades to take hostages to demand his release. Therefore, I suggest we do neither. Let the Special Forces, Seals or whatever covertly capture him, fly him to an undisclosed hospital and have surgeons quickly perform a complete sex change operation. Then we return her to Afghanistan to live as a woman under the Taliban<<

HAHAHAHAhahhaha! Oh yeah, sweet justice:D

cphilip

10-07-2001, 07:46 PM

Originally posted by blnk162
Wow guys, this really makes me feel good....im not a real muslim but my dad is, the attitude on here is what the world needs, people that understand that theres like a .1% of terrorist muslims out there and that islam means peace....no where in the Koran will u find the word jihad(holy war) it was brought up by extremeists...thanks guys, im happy to see you guys are educated on thsi matter...

Thanks

Good stuff! Nor will you hear in the Koran the condoning of killing innocent people nor Suicide. So this is a misinterpretation of the Koran and a criminal one at that. So even Muslims are suffering from this misinterpretation and may I say Bastardization of this very nobile and kind religion. Unfair to all. Keep us informed and tell your Dad we understand and hope he speaks out aginst this Terrorist usurping of his faith.

Shart: nice touch on the change of the respect graphic.

Deadeye

10-07-2001, 09:15 PM

According to the news, the targets were in the southern Afghan city of Kandahar, where the Taliban regime headquarters many operations, reportedly destroyed the airport and much of their central command structures. An airbase in the northwestern city of Herat was also reportedly destroyed.

Specific types of targets included: early warning radars, airfields with aircraft, a single tank formation with troops, command and control facilities, training camps, and fixed surface-to-air missile sites.

I think the cave targets will be the responsibility of Special Operations. IMHO.

Deadeye

10-07-2001, 09:21 PM

Hey all,

This might have been posted before, but I think it's appropriate now, with the first retaliatory strikes beginning.

http://wsphotofews.excite.com/034/Yb/UC/t0/dv55469.jpg

FeelTheRT

10-07-2001, 10:11 PM

wow, very. Thats a great picture.

SIGSays

10-08-2001, 05:59 AM

very nice

cphilip

10-08-2001, 07:47 AM

Putting in the link to Shartleys respect graphic here.

http://www.automags.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=12092

Also a thread Q&A about the change in the graphics colors:

http://www.automags.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=13764

Also I am merging any threads related in to this one as they come up. So if you see them dissapear they will be here. As long as they were apropriate that is. ;)

Eagle

10-08-2001, 08:16 AM

The only part of that pic that is wrong is that it should have been a sailor and not a soldier for that flag is now flying over the Roosevelt Battlegroop.

shartley

10-08-2001, 08:38 AM

Eagle,
Actually it is still correct. The US Special Forces (Part of the ARMY) have been over there since shortly after the Terrorist Attack. And I have not verified this (because I have just been too busy), but I heard that Rangers (also ARMY) were put in support of the operations being conducted by the SF.

This does not take away from the dedication and service being performed by the Navy (and other services at this time) but does indicate that the picture is not wrong…. And add to that the fact that the uniforms used by Combat troops on the ground (not still on ships or in aircraft) are pretty much the same. It would be hard pressed to distinguish a Marine from a Soldier, from an Airman, etc. just by glancing at them while in full combat gear. And if you look at the picture again, you will see that NO service distinction is made.

I just wanted to point these things out so that others would not get the wrong impression as well. The person is Service Neutral. And of course the US Flag would be flying over the Roosevelt Battle Group… that is floating US Soil (in essence), and an extension of our great Nation, as well as the platform to launch our military objectives from. And oh what a platform it is!

God Bless America.. and may God have mercy on their souls… because WE will not.

Mr. -RushY-

10-08-2001, 08:50 AM

Still nothing...I copied exactly from you code b4 n that didn't work. So i just took height and legnth out and that didn't work.

Jeb_Hoge

10-08-2001, 08:50 AM

Originally posted by Temo Vryce
You it's a real shame that it has come to this, but you know who I really feel sorry for, other than those who lost someone on Sept 11, are the Islamic people here in Canada and in the US. These people are being shunned and avoided when possible. It is very hard for them right now. I work with a gentleman who is Islamic and he is a very nice guy, but this whole or deal has him very worried and scared. These are people too and they deserve our help.

Other than a couple of unfortunate incidents (broken windows and spraypaint) right after the attacks, the sense I've gotten here in DC is that the Islamic community is not only not being shunned, but seems to be getting a much wider sense of acceptance and support. The Islamic bookstore that had its window broken was fixed up for free (IIRC) and the owner has said he's had a lot of new and non-Muslim visitors expressing their support. Of course, our area is VERY multicultural, which I'm sure makes a difference.

Jeb_Hoge

10-08-2001, 08:56 AM

Originally posted by cphilip

Good stuff! Nor will you hear in the Koran the condoning of killing innocent people nor Suicide. So this is a misinterpretation of the Koran and a criminal one at that. So even Muslims are suffering from this misinterpretation and may I say Bastardization of this very nobile and kind religion. Unfair to all. Keep us informed and tell your Dad we understand and hope he speaks out aginst this Terrorist usurping of his faith.

Shart: nice touch on the change of the respect graphic.

I do wonder this...why don't the large majority of nonextremist Muslims take care of their "problem children"?

shartley

10-08-2001, 09:09 AM

Jeb_Hoge,

I do wonder this...why don't the large majority of nonextremist Muslims take care of their "problem children"?
GOOD QUESTION! I often find myself asking that.

Saying Bin Jerkin is a true Muslim, is like saying the White Knights are true Christians. No other Religion puts up with extremists (or WOULD put up with) the way Muslims seem to do in this situation. And I am not talking about those Muslims in the US or other places than in the Middle East…. That is all fine and well from a distance, but they should take care of the problem AT HOME.

Just my thoughts.

Mr. -RushY-

10-08-2001, 09:22 AM

bah no matter what i do i just can't get it to work...guess i'll have to take it out

(All I did was do what I told you to do.. and now it works. :) Like I said, this board system does funny things some times. All better now! Added by SHartley)

shartley

10-08-2001, 09:32 AM

i_luv_talons,
You said the following:

I don't think the Geneva Convention related to warfare - it was about POW's. But you're point is well-taken
Interesting, but WRONG. To think the Geneva Convention only deals with POW’s is like thinking the Constitution of the United States only deals with the Freedom of Speech. You may want to visit your local library and look it up.. OR do so online.

And speaking of Freedom of Speach… Your signature has the following:

BTW -- I hate Shartley... He makes these big speeches and acts like he knows everything.

I am all for expressing your opinions, but I would consider this a FLAME. You do not know me, nor even have a valid point. My role here on AO goes WAY farther than you may think, and I was ASKED to resume posting. I for one find your signature offencive.

And it is interesting that you showed so much about yourself in your FIRST post here. You could read for days what you left between the lines. You may be more comfortable at PBD.

cphilip

10-08-2001, 09:32 AM

Originally posted by Jeb_Hoge

I do wonder this...why don't the large majority of nonextremist Muslims take care of their "problem children"?

To echo..good question. Lack of opportunity and means? Fear?

Seems some did try and ended up dead. Here we have a man posing as a messenger from God. With no clerical credentials but wealthy and very charismatic. Surrounded by henchmen who worship him. Very hard to penitrate.

I ask all of you what right does this man have to claim he knows what God wants? And by what laws does he use to make his judgements? No known laws on this earth call for the types of things he proposes are Gods will. The Muslims have a very well developed set of Civil Laws (in fact the most developed historicaly) but they have no Criminal Law for him to quote. So he makes them up as he goes along. And because none existed before it is hard for the youth of his following to dispute them with historic references. Typical false DemiGod.

Another thing that irritates me is he stated he wanted all Muslim States "reunited" to what they were 80 years ago. They were never united. Ever. Always Chiefdoms, Shiekdoms and Regionally governed and criminal Laws were imposed, at will by the local governments, irrespective of Islamic Law. He needs to study History a bit more. His ignorance of his own world is astounding. Or perhaps he wishes to dismiss it as it doesn't serve his purpose. I hope the Islamic people put him in his proper place for us. he is making a shambles out of their region and starving the very people he is purporting to champion.

One good thing that I hope comes out of this. The people of the western world and the eastern world could come together and understand each other better after this is all over. I know I am learning a lot I would never have tried to learn if this had not happened.

cphilip

10-08-2001, 10:48 AM

Reportedly... Arafat has spoken to the Palestinian people in an address this Morning telling them not to support Bin Laden and that Palestine does not need nor want to be associated with him or what he is doing. Cool huh?

Snappy

10-08-2001, 01:09 PM

Originally posted by Eagle
The only part of that pic that is wrong is that it should have been a sailor and not a soldier for that flag is now flying over the Roosevelt Battlegroop.

Seals - Navy, Green Beret - Army, Para Jumpers - Air Force, and Recondo - Marines (Special Force) along with the Rangers (Elite Force) all use the same BDUs and are trained with the SAW. As it was said, it's service neutral and a tribute to things we'll most likely never hear about.

BUT, they do their jobs much more effectively when supported by the Navy and Air Force attacks.

jas142

10-08-2001, 02:32 PM

:( I'm getting scared here. I live in Boca Raton, and they are finding anthrax. One person already dead, another just got sick. they found traces for the airborne form in a local office building.... The building is closed, everyone is panicking.... :(

Arturus

10-08-2001, 02:59 PM

http://www.cnn.com/2001/HEALTH/10/08/florida.anthrax.case/index.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/health/newsid_1586000/1586881.stm

DarkPhoenix

10-08-2001, 04:02 PM

Here I am stuck stateside, while my friends are out doing our job. I really want to deploy, but I must also think of those of my friends who have families. We, completed our deployment. I want to volunteer to go to a deployed ship, though.

PowerFedMag

10-09-2001, 12:30 PM

I think all this attacking Afghan and the terrorist attacks on the USA is a bunch of snott...
Well, I don't care about attacking Afghan, those Taliban ppl are stubborn.

But seriously, we are spending millions (which we can afford, since we're the US, but still.), on a god awful place filled with *some* of the most stubborn, un-informed, un-intelligent, hateful ppl in the world. By attacking them they think we're on some anti-Islam crusade, when I am sure most US citizens could give a darn what religion these crazies are.

And someone tell me what the people who burn US flags are trying to prove? That they can knit US flags, or buy them, and we can't (its hard enough to find here now)?
That they are like little 8 year olds trying to anger us by running around stopping and wiping feet on our red white and blue?
Heck, at least the idiots know how to dispose of the flag correctly (burning it).

I think that this really can only stop if we pull all resources away from that mid-east bunch, cuz there are too many radicals and too long of a history is involved in the area. Educate the ppl. Get those Northern rebels to take over Afghan and leave em alone (or else another Bin Laden wanna be will appear).
And the whole Palestine thing needs to be settled...luckily, a lot of that won't be happening any time soon...
:mad:
Man, those ppl have alot of spare time on their hands, maybe if we let them live here and gave them jobs they'd stop hating and flag burning, and start being PRODUCTIVE in the name of ALLAH...
:mad:

EDITED

Here, I'll throw in a 3rd cent to my already given 2.

If biological weapons are used, What will happen then!:confused: ?
I hope our Spec. Forces just start assassinating anyone connected w\terrorists, ethics not included. Sorry, but bio-war is bull, and we need to start killing terrorist related ppl if that starts happening, and if that escalates things even more, we escalate with them, etc...then, apparently my idea is a bad one.
Heck get an all american Mercenary company to terrorize the terrorists..only prob is finding em, dang it.

ahhhhh! ok I am done, I'm just to pissed now to make sense, so if I dont make sense dont wonder why.:mad:

(EDIT COMMENT BY MOD: feel better now? I cleaned your post up but sheesh! it was a bit full of cursing wasn't it? We will let it go this time cause I know how you feel. And, by the way, burning the Flag is only proper if done with respect. These folks are not respecting it. - cphilip)

Anti-Cave attack: We are using 5000lbs bombs, armor piercing, laser guided, targeting Talliban members. Also released a list to public of top terrorists so anyone and everyone can catch those feller's...

yea sorry bout the language, I guess.