Smart Parts taken on;sued

[Prairie]

http://www.flagpull.com

SMART PARTS SUED

5 DISTRIBUTERS IN WISCONSIN ALSO CHARGED

NPF LIMITED, PARENT COMPANY OF WDP RESPONSIBLE FOR SUIT.

SMART PARTS IN VIOLATION OF PATENT;

CEASE AND DESIST;


http://www.flagpull.com for more info

[elpimpo]

so they are suing them because of grip frames, right?

[Skoad]

right arm!

[deadeye9]

They'll probably settle with some kind of cross licensing agreement, which won't do the rest of the paintball community any good.

[RenagadeOfFunk]

...Rage Against Smart Parts!!!...

they are sueing for...

What is claimed is:

1. A pneumatic paintball gun comprising:

means for electronically monitoring one or more parameters of the pneumatic paintball gun's operation;

a display for displaying the one or more parameters;

a timer; and

an alarm selected from the group consisting of audible devices and vibrators.

2. A pneumatic paintball gun as claimed in claim 1 wherein the one or more parameters of the pneumatic paintball gun's operation is selected from the group consisting of actual rate of fire and maximum rate of fire of the pneumatic paintball gun.

3. A pneumatic paintball gun as claimed in claim 1 wherein the means for monitoring one or more parameters of the pneumatic paintball gun's operation is selected from the group consisting of; temperature sensors, gas pressure sensors, means for detecting actual shots fired, battery charge sensors, dwell time controllers, rate of fire sensors, and combinations thereof.

4. The pneumatic paintball gun of claim 3 further comprising means for controlling the one or more parameters of the pnuematic paintball gun's operation.

5. The pneumatic paintball gun of claim 3 further comprising a microprocessor for controlling the one or more parameters of the pnuematic paintball gun's operation.

6. A pneumatic paintball gun as claimed in claim 1 including at least one input button.

7. A pneumatic paintball gun as claimed in claim 6 wherein the at least one button is located behind a plate which requires detaching to gain access to the button.

8. A pneumatic paintball gun as claimed in claim 7 wherein the plate is selected from the group consisting of anti-tamper and tamper-indicating plates.

9. A pneumatic paintball gun as claimed in claim 1 wherein the display is an LCD panel.

10. A pneumatic paintball gun comprising:

means for electronically monitoring one or more parameters of the pneumatic paintball gun's operation;

a display for displaying the one or more parameters; and

communication means for communication with an external unit.

11. A pneumatic paintball gun as claimed in claim 10 wherein the communication means is selected from the group consisting of infra-red transmitters and infra-red receivers.

Basically all electronic guns...(good thing its aimed at SP!)

[SpecialBlend2786]

What exactly is the patent for?

[Brophog]

I wondered when this was going to happen.

This is no better for the sport than when Smart Parts started their suits.

[penguinpunk555]

AWSOME!!


Pro WDP Anti-SP

[robertjuric]

It appears to be, basically, any gun that monitors, controls, and displays parameters of the gun.

Which basically covers every electronic gun.

Woohoo, all I can say is it's about damn time.

[spantol]

True. The drama will still be fun to watch, though. :)


I wondered when this was going to happen.

This is no better for the sport than when Smart Parts started their suits.

[ZapTheMad]

Nice to see SP getting a taste of thier own medicine. They asked for a fight and now they got one.

To bad for the industry that it has come to this. It only hurts the consumer in the end. All that can happen is paintball equipment gets more expensive as if it's not expensive enough.

[Chris42050]

I love it. Smart Parts gettin a taste of thier own medicine. I just hope they stop there and dont sue others.

[Ov3rmind]

I really don't know if WDP would go berserk on the industry like SP did. However, if worst came to worst, I'd rather have the market flooded with Angels than Imps/Shockers.

[ClouD]

ahahaha thats pretty cool.. SP is getting owned.. !!!

[Cobra_Clark]

our sport has gone gay :(

[Loud Tim]

hmm.. being from wisconsin i really wanna know what companys are being sued.

[1stdeadeye]

Who wants to bet on a settlement real fast ala SP/Dye or SP/NPS? :rolleyes:

[Dubstar112]

I quit.

:eek:

[logamus]

the lawyers are already drawing up a settlement agreement.

[Skoad]

now hopefully if they win, they let all other manufacturors use their patent for free except for SP.

[spadge67]

WDP dosent seem like the corporate monster like smart parts, they seem to actually care about the sports, now maybe the patent is in the right hands...

[WenULiVeUdiE]

Looks like the Nerve wont be coming out anytime soon...

[AutomagRT1483]

hmm.. being from wisconsin i really wanna know what companys are being sued.


apoc and stalker are two of them.

[NoFearPaintballer]

How is WDP being soo cool right now.... they are sueing 5 field/stores in wisconsin such as Apocalypse and stalker paintball for what you may ask. Just for distrubing SP stuff. THe reason WDP is doing this is not becuase oooo SMart parts is soo bad they sued companys for no reason. They are sueing mainly because they got slapped around by SP so WDP wants revenge. And another reason is because they want money.... thats what EVERY lawsuit is for. Now remember this before you Say something is cool for sueing other companys. And i say SCREW POLITICS IN PAINTBALL AND JUST PLAY ******!! Half of you dont even understand the severity of this you just follow what seems cool.

[AutomagRT1483]

Andrew,

Your missing the point here. This is AO. Anyhing against Smart Parts is going to be thought of as cool here (by a good portion of people I might add). Smart Parts had it coming.

[dansim]

sp smaking around wdp.... my,what and enchanted world you must live in

[coolcatpete]

I think that they were just trying to make a point by suing the field in WI, just to show SP that they will not get any bussiness because if they do WDP will take it away.
Pete

[penguinpunk555]

I am mad that Stalker and Apocolpsye are getting sued. When I played their tourney I fell in love with the place. They were by far the best field I have ever payed at. :(



I guess everything has a price.

[Thordic]

WDP is sueing the distrubuters as a scare tactic to get stores to drop SP guns so they don't get sued. Its pretty simple.

I definitely see WDP as more player-friendly than SP, but who knows what would happen if they got on top of electro patents.

Interesting to say the least.

[coolcatpete]

Exactly, this is just showing them who is boss. Hopefully they wont show anyone else.
Pete

[the larch]

Here's a link that Have Blue over on Doc's gave us that shows the Court Docket:
http://haveblue.org/04-c-0221.html

Sometimes you have to fight fire with fire. I applaud them for stepping up and going back after SP.
I would be curious to know weither they have the same history if cease and desist orders that SP has.

[MayAMonkeyBeYourPinata]

WDP is just doing what SP did to them and other companies. I just hope WDP doesn't go and sue other companies as well.

[alkafluence]

This could be both good and bad.

Good that SP will see the results of their own actions, and reap the whirlwind.

But bad if NPF pursues this to the extent that SP pursued their own patent.

On the other hand, as many people already mentioned, this is most likely NPF's means to strike a cross-licensing agreement. Take the computer industry for example. IBM maintains a huge portfolio of patents for issues just like this. So that when someone sues them over infringement, they take out their portfolio and fire back.


Why in Wisconsin of all places would you file this suit? In Western Wisconsin, no less? There's nothing in Western Wisconsin...

[Cyberious]

Based on the information we have now, I may go buy an A4 and put it on the shelf just to support WDP. Of course since Tom is a little closer to the industry I will be interested in knowing his take on this.

[steveo356]

well how i see it is mags and angels are the only guns to have there own forums on this place so tk and the wdp people must be on good terms so us mag lovers are gonne be safe hopefully.

as far as being a monster like sp has only time will tell, maybe they need money for a developing super gun and have had this trick play in there hands for awhile

I don't realy hate or like sp. but i will ssay it is rather bitter sweet to see another pb place get sued that means prices will jump, or drop depends on agnels decision.

I will stop now for i have no more to say

[Xyxyll]

Another thing I noticed that I liked was that NPF demands a jury case. This should make it easier to expose SP's unethical practices and illegal patents in court.

And of course... the best quote from the article:


NPF requests that this court orders SP and defendant dealers for destruction of all products infringing on both patents including incomplete guns (IE grip frames) and complete guns.

[penguinpunk555]

WDP is sueing the distrubuters as a scare tactic to get stores to drop SP guns so they don't get sued. Its pretty simple.

I definitely see WDP as more player-friendly than SP, but who knows what would happen if they got on top of electro patents.

Interesting to say the least.
Yes, they are definatley more player friendly, they give out weed and have chicks give oral and real sex out at their European events.

[Thermus]

Yes, they are definatley more player friendly, they give out weed and have chicks give oral and real sex out at their European events.



HORRAY FOR WDP!!! My new favorite PB company.

[127.0.0.1]

Yes, they are definatley more player friendly, they give out weed and have chicks give oral and real sex out at their European events.

WDP = We Do Porn ;)

Take a WDP Tech class and ask the instructor... :p

[Lohman446]

Yes, they are definatley more player friendly, they give out weed and have chicks give oral and real sex out at their European events.

Screw World Cup, Im going to Europe

[SuiciDal Sn Y p ER]

...does this mean bye bye shocker and impulse?

[dwab3000]

damn free weed

...too bad im clean, other wise i would be out there gettin some and gettin up in smoke....

least i still have my police records...ahhh :D

[sellout007]

Suing a field/distributor for selling a product because the manufacturers of the product violated a patent is from what I understand Illegal.

It is not the field/distributors fault that SP did something illegal. I would find out what exactly they are sueing the fields for.

[Linx]

I play for Stalker, and just got off the phone with Dianne. They did get served papers. It sounds like WDP is trying to get dealers to stop carrying/selling SP stuff. They may (Stalker) be able to get out off the suit if they sign off that they will not sell SP gear. Dianne will be looking in to it further.
They sell very little SP stuff anyway so I'm sure no locals will care. I find it ironic that Stalker is being named by WDP for selling SP, yet they sold very little SP and were huge supporters of AKA - a company that SP put out of the marker business.
I hope WDP realizes this and doesn't try to scare other small dealers by making an example of fields like Stalkers.

It sounds like WDP has a pretty strong case and intend to only go after SP. Dianne also talked to the guys at AKA. They made it sound like if WDP wins they (AKA) may be able to get back in the biz.

I for one, believe that SP will get what they deserve (Murphys Law).
Just don't step on the little guys. ;)

Jesse

[Lohman446]

Suing a field/distributor for selling a product because the manufacturers of the product violated a patent is from what I understand Illegal.

It is not the field/distributors fault that SP did something illegal. I would find out what exactly they are sueing the fields for.

Looks like above part of the suit is to require destruction of all infrining property not sold to the general public - still in dealers hands for isntance.

[sellout007]

Now THAT sounds much better! The fields themsevles arent necisarilly getting sued for carrying SP merchandise. They are being brought to court to be told to stop selling it.

Makes more sense, but still a little off. But much better. o)

Also, the comment about AKA comming back into the busniess is exactly how I initially looked at this whole lawsuit.

I wouldnt be surprised if WDP says "drop all your lawsuits and make your patent public for everyone and we will call it even"



Well.... one can hope cant he? o)

[Orion33]

I love it. Smart Parts gettin a taste of thier own medicine. I just hope they stop there and dont sue others.

amen to that

[GT]

I was wondering when this was goinng to happen. I think this is what they called the "LCD" patent?

[nicad]

down with electros-- go mechanical! ;)

[SanDiegoMag]

Im with nicad!!! hAir Trigger all the way!

PS im trying to make 1, but i have no clue where to put my LPR

[riooso]

Go WDP! I think that the reason that they picked a small dealer is because they knew that they did not sell much SP and it is a shot across the bow, as it were.
I think that WDP is going to use the hatred for SP to make cash. SP is being hurt by all the bashing and WDP sees that. Paintball is for the most part a game that friends play. Word of mouth in this industry is fierce!


Rio Oso

[White_Noise]

my thoughts exactly nicad....i really want one of those hAir trigers when they come out.....ill pay for a beta test one ;)

[pb4jc]

I too would much rather shoot the hair trigger. *cough*if they were available*cough* anyways this will be interesting to see what happens

[MaChu]

About damn time.

WDP won't go on a suing corporate rampage, they have always been part of the player oriented paintball community. WDP has always had a good reputation with the other companies and I applaud them for what they are doing. WDP, crazy brits show'em!

[Da1spaz247]

Damn, why did they choose WI fields to sue???? Thats gonna hurt business at WI fields in the end isnt it?

[White_Noise]

Da1spaz247: read above....its probably to show that they dont want sp products sold

[lamby]

Does anyone else find it a little strange that a patent issue has been brought up in a wisconsin district court? If it is a patent dispute, why is this not a federal issue? Something is not right here... I am not sure what is going on, but I think the fields are the target more than SP itself.

And if the fields are being sued only because of the fact they carry SP markers why are the other WI fields exempt? Something sounds very fishy to me.

I will ask my local field owner/sponsor, BFG paintball, If they know anything about this lawsuit. I will let ya'll know if there is not a cloak of secrecy surrounding this (which I am sure there will be)

Good Luck Stalker, Apoc, Tri-State, and Ace. I think you might need it.

[AGD]

My take on this is....... that Thordic is a pretty smart guy.

AGD

[cledford]

My take on this is that it has been in the works for a while - possibly as long as the SP suits - hence the Emags LED display. Frankly, I'm very happy to see SP get a dose of their own medicine, but hope this doesn't end up with WDP being just as bad.

The funny thing is that it looks like EVERY electro ever made is going to fall victim. Let's be for real, SP guns aren't much for a UI/Display - they only have (and only have ever had) a simple, single LED. How many electros don't have at least one of those?

-Calvin

[Lohman446]

Its not just the display though, thats an oversimplification

I see things in there about sensors - pressure sensors, shot sensors, etc. I imagine that a lot of electronic markers use these as well to regulate firing, though I have no idea if thats true or not.

[1stdeadeye]

Does anyone else find it a little strange that a patent issue has been brought up in a wisconsin district court? If it is a patent dispute, why is this not a federal issue? Something is not right here... I am not sure what is going on, but I think the fields are the target more than SP itself.

And if the fields are being sued only because of the fact they carry SP markers why are the other WI fields exempt? Something sounds very fishy to me..

Did you read the above link?

It was filed in THE US DISTRICT COURT IN THE Western District of Wisconsin ! There are plenty US District courts all accross America! :rolleyes:

[1stdeadeye]

My take on this is....... that Thordic is a pretty smart guy.

AGD

Don't say that too loud. Thordic might get a swollen head! :eek:
;)

[cledford]

Its not just the display though, thats an oversimplification

I see things in there about sensors - pressure sensors, shot sensors, etc. I imagine that a lot of electronic markers use these as well to regulate firing, though I have no idea if thats true or not.

Well,

The one constant I keep reading about in the WDP patent is a display to output changes made by pushing input (buttons). The Shocker (not sure about the imp) has got to be one of the simplest markers with regard to each - a single LED for output, and a single button on the new models. (POTS on the old) The only feedback you get from the new shocker is "on or off" and if it has "vision" a second blink to show that it is on. The older Shocker has a *slightly* more sophisticated UI in that when turning the timing POTs if you go out of range you'll get a certain flash pattern. Actually, I think it will also flash a different color for low battery. It is clearly within the WDP patent IF a "terminal" can be defined as anything that displays information electronically.


Here is the REAL KICKER - if you read SP's latest patent application, they patent a similar set of functions!!!! I remember reading that they wanted to put sensors in the gun, electrically control dwell, and do all other sorts of "on the fly" collection and processing of data. Now how's that going to affect the outcome? 2 different companies patenting similar sets of features...

-Calvin

[GT]

My take on this is....... that Thordic is a pretty smart guy.

AGD


yep,
although it would be nice if other compaines that hel simliar broad patents would do the same.... ;)

[Linx]

From what I was told the reason WDP is going after Wisconsin dealers is because their parent company has and office in or around Milwaukee.

Since we are talking about some local fields I will throw in a shameless plug for a tournament we are hosting at Stalker.

Team Fuzz Bomb will be hosting a 5 man "Open" event at Stalker Paintball in Lyndon Station, WI. (about 10 minutes north of WI Dells)

The date is May 23rd
Registration is $125 per team (advance registration required)
Free AIR with registration
Paint is $75 a case.

Prizes will be 100% Payback in cash and trophies - awarded to the top three finishing teams.

To register e-mail Stalker at: stalker@paintballwi.com

[notcreative]

I beilve that this will hurt wdp in long run more. Sp and wdp will more than likely come to an agreement. But with wdp's choice to sue the stores they will lose bussiness from retail stores across america. my expereince with pb store owners is that they are indepent minded and do not like to be told what to do and will simply stop ordering from wdp. which alot of stores in my region have already stopped doing. Mostly because they feel wdp is putting out overpriced markers and have had enough with dealing with poor service from them.

[TheTramp]

The reason the fields were added to the suit is that they "knowingly" distribute a product that violates a standing patent.

Now before anyone freaks out at the "knowingly" comment...

This is a standard legal practice. When you distribute a product you are held liable for what's called the "state of the art." This means that you should be just as knowledgeable as the manufacture as to the product and its hazardous nature or any other legal problem (ie. patent issues).

An analogy can be made with asbestos products my firm deals with:

Obviously the manufacture should be up to date with all the relevant scientific reports/medical journal information. As soon as a paper was published showing that asbestos is linked to cancer they should have stopped producing asbestos products. The companies that distributed the products are held to the same standard. That didn't happen so all companies involved are liable at least back to the first indication that asbestos is hazardous. The responsibility of the companies was to constantly be aware of the "state of the art" information.

The case here says that SP "knew" their guns violated the WDP patent (because the patent was a matter of public record) yet continued to produce them. The fields (really their pro-shops) which distributed the SP guns should have also known that those guns violated the WDP patent so they are just as liable.


I'm not saying all of this is "right" or "wrong" to go after the fields/pro-shops just that it's within the law.


I agree with Thordic that going after the fields is really just "kicking it up a notch." and they aren't the real target. If no one will sell SP guns for fear of getting sued then SP will be SOL.

[Andyman]

good thing somebody stepped in to halt SP

[No Excuse]

WDP hold many patents that are used by other paintball companies.

Its not going to kill the industry, look at electronics companies like Sony, they hold hundreds of patents but they lease them out, hell most of the components you can buy from various electronics companies are made in the same factory!

Unlike SP, WDP will look to the long term, they know the sport is too small to upset the apple cart, their business is not to *POOF* people over like SP.

Given WDP and SPs relationship a settlement couldn't happen between these two. I dont want to say too much here but look at what features are on many electo markers but not on even the newest Shockers or impulses, there is a reason for that.

Now this lawsuit concerns more than just a patent infringement.
SP have dropped a bollock here and they are going to pay, personally I hope they go out of business all together, thats no worse than what they have done to others.

[Evil Bob]

Its about time this finally hit the light of day, WDP has been working on this for quite some time now and it looks like their lawyers have put together a pretty solid case.

Whether they actually settle or not remains to be seen, but I highly doubt that WDP is interested in a monetary settlement, I believe they want to see the Gardners shut down and exposed for the scam artists they are, hence the request for a jury to hear the arguments and settle the case. This is a good thing as the Gardner's pre-existing history of prior patent fraud will be their own worst enemy as well all know, it will be brought up in court. I also believe that we will finally see the broad SP patents rendered null and void.

-Evil Bob

[jesseyo13]

all I have to say is "GOOOO WDP!"

[cledford]

Its about time this finally hit the light of day, WDP has been working on this for quite some time now and it looks like their lawyers have put together a pretty solid case.

Whether they actually settle or not remains to be seen, but I highly doubt that WDP is interested in a monetary settlement, I believe they want to see the Gardners shut down and exposed for the scam artists they are, hence the request for a jury to hear the arguments and settle the case. This is a good thing as the Gardner's pre-existing history of prior patent fraud will be their own worst enemy as well all know, it will be brought up in court. I also believe that we will finally see the broad SP patents rendered null and void.

-Evil Bob



I hope you are right! In my experience (and as illustrated by just the legal wrangling here in PB) it is almost ALWAYS about the money. I frankly don't get the vibe that WDP has anymore love and generosity towards the PB world then SP - but I could be wrong. I can't wait to see how this turns out!

-Calvin

[Thourne]

I don't want to see WDP go crazy on the patents anymore than anyone else, but even if they were to start enforcing their patents with every paintball company I wouldn't say one bad thing about them. Reason? Their patents were attained in a fair and legal way, and they were the ones who actually created the product that has been patented.

SP's patent that they have made such a stink about was retroactively granted after SP figured out it would be worth pursuing and this is the reason I was so upset with SP's lawsuit campaign. They didn't develop anything they are suing for and all the designs they sued are IMO far superior to their own. In the WDP C&D, everything they were suing for was something that is actually on some model of their gun. They spent the money on R&D and they actually created it, and didn't go about attaining the patent in an unethical underhanded way that screwed the rest of the industry. I would even bet that these other companies that have products using these WDP patents actually have some sort of an agreement. But Mr. Lawsuit Happy Gardner probably ignored WDP patents (which preceed his) when he applied for his patents and figured he could just sue his way out of it later.

IMO this is sweet honest justice. I'd just love to see a picture of the Gardner's having the crush, melt, or otherwise rend inoperable a batch of Shockers and Impulses. I really couldn't stand SP after all the stuff I've seen and heard about lately so this is good stuff.

[Crighton]

Well at least stalker was never a large distributer of SP markers. Mostly AKA, WGP, Tippmann and Kingsman markers there.

With the rare SP special order.

[1stdeadeye]

I have not seen SP's defender Warped1 post yet in this thread. Hmmmm.....

[xXHavokXx]

This news put me in such a good mood im pondering selling my DM4 to get a Joy Division to keep my other angel company.


Yeah, where is Warped1. I'm sure he'll be fine with it, after all WDP is just protecting what they "designed" much like SP.

[thecavemankevin]

I have not seen SP's defender Warped1 post yet in this thread. Hmmmm.....

i was wondering the exact same thing. each to their own, and via numerous coments he has made i feel that he thinks SP's law suits are B.S. too, but due to sposorships he would be stupid to speak negatively against them.


I rather doubt WDP will do any sort of simple settlement.....one of the things that i have not seen mentioned here is that WDP was either the first or second victem to SP's law suit binge. They certainly were never hit hard like ICD or AKA, but they were sued....in fact i don't know what the outcome of that ever was...???

[Furby]

http://www.paintballchannel.com/browse.php?mod=article&opt=view&id=435&style=details


This is just straight up tactical...I got a feeling alot of this stems from the case in Oregon...

[Smoke]

All I can say is:

about time.

[coolcatpete]

The date is May 23rd
Registration is $125 per team (advance registration required)
Free AIR with registration
Paint is $75 a case.

Prizes will be 100% Payback in cash and trophies - awarded to the top three finishing teams.

To register e-mail Stalker at: stalker@paintballwi.com
hip hip horray my birthday is then.
Pete

[spasticsquirrel]

All i can say is

Smart parts is getting Fed in the A!

[doc_Zox]

i heard a rumor there was some progress with the suit...

[sharpshooter1286]

how could smart parts claim they made the first electronic gun? couldnt someone fight that? im feeling like i missed something here?