Problem with RT Firing While On Safe

[Phelps]

I bought an RT on eBay -- my first Mag. Either something happened to it in shipping, or it wasn't working like the seller said it was. Here is the situation.

It (appears) to be a stock RT Mag (not RT Pro) and I am running with with a preset tank (new). When I got it, I tightened a grip screw that was visably loose. I found out when I gassed it up that this was keeping the trigger from functioning, so I loosened it back up.

At that point, it will sometimes charge and fire, while sometimes it will go for a few seconds, and then charge and cock. When it is doing this, it won't fire no matter how much I pull the trigger. (I'm not sure if cocking is the right term, but it is the best descriptor I have.)

Here is what REALLY concerns me. When I thought it wouldn't recock because the pressure on the tank was too low, I put the gun on safe and went to put the barrel sock back on. I'm glad that I did this while it was still pointed in a safe direction, because it went off while the safety was on, and no pressure on the trigger and shot me right in my #$*& palm.

Is there something I can do that is fairly simple to try and fix it, or do I need to just leave it alone and take it to an airsmith? I take direction well, and I'll fill in any questions you need answered to give me a solution. One thing that I considered was that I still haven't loosened the problem grip screw up enough and it is still binding on the trigger rod, but I don't know if that would cause it to fire on safe. (If there is a way that it could, I'll accept that.) Right now, I'm going back to my Spyder until I know that this thing isn't going to fire until I pull the trigger, and then will fire every time I pull the trigger.

[mobius]

It's an original RT if it has an external hard line running from the ASA to the rail, and routes the gas to the valve internally, instead of via an exterior line plumbed directly into the side of the valve.

By "grip screw", are you referring to one of the screws that holds the grip panel to the grip frame?

If it's the upper grip screw, it could definitely interfere with the proper operation of the sear. Check the screws on both sides (remove them if necessary). If they are too long, they could cause the sear to bind.

As for the gun firing whlie on safe, I'm guessing that the screw was interfering with the sear, holding it back a bit. If this was the case, jarring it could have caused it to move the rest of the distance needed to fire, since the safety only blocks the trigger, and not the sear itself.

Is it leaking from anywhere when you gas it up? Most 'Mag problems can be solved by changing various o-rings, depending on the location of the leak.

[Phelps]

It's an original RT if it has an external hard line running from the ASA to the rail, and routes the gas to the valve internally, instead of via an exterior line plumbed directly into the side of the valve.

That's it. When I said appears, I just mean that I don't know if the previous owner modified anything. A microguage was added to one of the accessory holes under the sight rail, but other than that it looks to me to be all original.



By "grip screw", are you referring to one of the screws that holds the grip panel to the grip frame?

If it's the upper grip screw, it could definitely interfere with the proper operation of the sear. Check the screws on both sides (remove them if necessary). If they are too long, they could cause the sear to bind.

That's the screw, and that is what it was doing. The best theory I can come up with is that I just didn't back it off far enough. I am going to pick up some shorter screws.


As for the gun firing whlie on safe, I'm guessing that the screw was interfering with the sear, holding it back a bit. If this was the case, jarring it could have caused it to move the rest of the distance needed to fire, since the safety only blocks the trigger, and not the sear itself.

Is it leaking from anywhere when you gas it up? Most 'Mag problems can be solved by changing various o-rings, depending on the location of the leak.

It leaked a little bit from the back of the valve; I put a couple more drops of oil in the ASA, dry fired it a couple of times and it stopped. (I tried to educate myself here before I bought it.) :)

[mobius]

If it starts leaking from the back of the valve again (ie the velocity adjuster), you either need to turn down the velocity or (if you're running HPA, instead of CO2), you may need to replace the regulator piston, which is available from AGD's online store for less than $20, I beleive. The older reg pistons where designed for CO2, not HPA, and vent at too low a pressure. I know this was the case with Classic valves, someone can correct me if it wasn't an issue on the original RT.

For your other issue with it not firing, it sounds like you're getting bolt stick. If it has had a Level 10 bolt kit installed, you may need a larger carrier. If not, I'm having a brain fart at the moment, and I can't remember what to do. It's been awhile since I've dealt with a 'Mag that didn't have Level 10 installed.

[mobius]

I just checked, and the Reg piston for an RT valve is $20 plus shipping, and does have the higher pressure rating for HPA and Level 10 use. So if it continues to vent out the back at or near your desired velocity setting, start by replacing this part.

[Phelps]

If it starts leaking from the back of the valve again (ie the velocity adjuster), you either need to turn down the velocity or (if you're running HPA, instead of CO2), you may need to replace the regulator piston, which is available from AGD's online store for less than $20, I beleive. The older reg pistons where designed for CO2, not HPA, and vent at too low a pressure. I know this was the case with Classic valves, someone can correct me if it wasn't an issue on the original RT.

The RT is always HPA only. Won't fire on CO2. (Freezes up.)

[Tim Taylor]

Phelps is right! RT already has correct reg piston. Velocity could still be too high if it is still leaking. Mobius brought up a good question is it Level X? If so Change carrier (and velocity) if not could be too short of a power tube spacer or old power tube spring. Let us know if it is Level X of Level 7 (or earlier, hopefully not).

[Phelps]

Phelps is right! RT already has correct reg piston. Velocity could still be too high if it is still leaking. Mobius brought up a good question is it Level X? If so Change carrier (and velocity) if not could be too short of a power tube spacer or old power tube spring. Let us know if it is Level X of Level 7 (or earlier, hopefully not).

It is the original valve, I think. The logo on the side of the valve is simply "RT". I'm using a Qloader on it, so I wasn't too worried about chopping. I figured that after a while, I would send it in to AGD for the ULE/LvlX upgrade.

[kdawg]

More info would probably help.....

*Does it have level 10? Probably a carrier issue.
*What trigger frame? I know on the benchmark double trigger frames some people disabled the safety to use it as a trigger stop.
*What velocity are you firing at? The reg will vent if it is turned up too high.
*Make sure it's lubed well and all the orings are good.

[Tim Taylor]

Since it is not Level X check to see which power tube spacer, if any, is installed. If you have a spring in there get a power tube spacer kit or save your money and buy a Level X. From what you describe it sounds like an old RT to make sure does it have a banjo bolt (allows air to pass as well as hold the valve to the rail) at the back to hold the valve to the rail?

As far as the firing on 'safe' I am not sure. Let us know what type of frame you have on there.

Are the problems continuing or have they reduced after you lubed (and I mean LUBE, 6-8 drops of lube in the ASA shot thru) the gun?

[Phelps]

As far as the firing on 'safe' I am not sure. Let us know what type of frame you have on there.

Are the problems continuing or have they reduced after you lubed (and I mean LUBE, 6-8 drops of lube in the ASA shot thru) the gun?

It is a black double trigger. The safety button does prevent the trigger from moving when it is pressed in. I'm going to replace the grip screws to make sure they aren't still binding on the trigger rod before I do anything else to it. (One solution at a time.)

When I first got it, I put 4 drops of oil in the ASA and dry fired it. It fired fine (once I worked out the binding grip screw) for 40-50 shots. When I stopped, It started to slighty hiss from the velocity adjuster. I took the bottle off, put 4 more drops of oil in the ASA, gassed it back up and fired it about five times, and the hissing stopped completely.