Cocker questions....

[dyeguy65]

I got a few questions dealin with cockers. I recently have found an insane deal on a cocker body kit and i decided to build a 2nd cocker from scratch. My current free flow suits me fine, but i just want something to do.

first I'd like to know what the advantages/disadvantages to having a LP cocker and what steps to take to make it LP and keep it LP.

second, I'd like to know about milling. I know there are extensive milling options available for a cocker. I want a place to do it for a good price and still tell me when ill have it back (unlike WWA, tho they have the best milling IMO). In particular im looking for a cheap half block(turtle) conversion. Any suggestions?

thats all i could think of for now. On the business side of things im looking for high end internals (hint hint). dont post here PM me about that.

but all i want now is input on the first 2 things. thanks!

DG

[WenULiVeUdiE]

LP with cockers will allow you to shoot farthur into your tank and will allow you to pinch paint rather than chop.

So you want a to get yoru body kit turtled. Maybe you should just buy Doc's body. It's basically a body kit and a turtle, all in one! Here (http://www.electrococker.com/fastback/index.html) is the link to his body kit.

[dyeguy65]

ya i saw docs. but i dont have 375 layin around :argh:

[LeatherPants]

Actually the LPR affects the bolt pressure not the inline reg.

Running low pressure doesn't really matter. It's all about matching the correct inline pressure to the spring/valve combo you run in the cocker.

Some people can get great efficiency off of 250 psi while some need to be at 320 psi. It all depends on what parts are in it.

Also as far as LPR settings go if you are going to use an eblade or race you don't want the LPR too low since it will affect cycling speed.

[Muzikman]

Actually the LPR affects the bolt pressure not the inline reg.

Running low pressure doesn't really matter. It's all about matching the correct inline pressure to the spring/valve combo you run in the cocker.

Some people can get great efficiency off of 250 psi while some need to be at 320 psi. It all depends on what parts are in it.

Also as far as LPR settings go if you are going to use an eblade or race you don't want the LPR too low since it will affect cycling speed.


You are part right, but with a higher pressure you need a heavier spring to reach the correct velocity. Because of this, the LPR has to be set higher so that the ram can pull back this heavier spring. With a lower pressure gun, you can use a lighter spring, there for the LPR can be turned down.

[RusskiX]

I got my ripper milling from here:

http://www.cnc-machining.com/ripper/

Jim Eaton does the work and is slightly more affordable than WW. Turn around for mine was 3 months including anno and I'm very satisfied with the work.

Good luck!

[dyeguy65]

i love ripper milling. however, its very pricey. im looking for something more like this...

http://www.whitewolfairsmithing.com/images/Web%20gallery%20Autococker/images/pewtertidal3web.jpg

its the most sexy milling ive ever seen on a cocker. but, that is from WWA. its insane to know he charges only $75 for that milling, but im not a fan of not knowing when im gonna get my stuff back. i need a set date. if anyone knows where can get that milling, or something similar, let me know! thanks!

DG

[G3PB]

You are part right, but with a higher pressure you need a heavier spring to reach the correct velocity. Because of this, the LPR has to be set higher so that the ram can pull back this heavier spring. With a lower pressure gun, you can use a lighter spring, there for the LPR can be turned down.


Not so. Years ago, when I was a tourney player, the Cocker I used back then ran at 425 psi input to shoot at 300 fps. I also used a custom main spring that was lighter than a Nelson yellow and it used a Nelson blue valve spring. As with anything, it depends on the combination of parts. If I had attempted to run a Tornado valve or other with a huge hole in the thing, then it would never have worked. It's all in matching flow...it was also the most efficient gun I ever used, never chopped, never broke paint. No matter what the gun runs at, what reaches the ball is all that counts. Paintball guns today remind me alot of my old hot hot days. Just hard to get across to some that in many cases, the lower lift cam or the smaller carb would actually let the car run faster. Installing Tornado valves in many of these guns is akin to trying to run a 1050 Holley on a stock small-block chevy....sluggish at best.
With the speeds of Ebladed guns, we need to get it both in and out as quickly as possible. We can no longer crank the LPR pressure low enough to pinch a ball or the cycle speeds are greatly reduced....

[RusskiX]

i love ripper milling. however, its very pricey. im looking for something more like this...

http://www.whitewolfairsmithing.com/images/Web%20gallery%20Autococker/images/pewtertidal3web.jpg

its the most sexy milling ive ever seen on a cocker. but, that is from WWA. its insane to know he charges only $75 for that milling, but im not a fan of not knowing when im gonna get my stuff back. i need a set date. if anyone knows where can get that milling, or something similar, let me know! thanks!

DG

check www.kpcustoms.com

Ken runs a reputable shop with decent prices.

[dyeguy65]

hmm. he sounds good, good prices. but, i read he only has a manual mill. im almost positive that milling requires a CnC machine. i may end up going with WWA in the end, ill just have to wait 3 months :argh:

DG

[Spaceman613]

Email Ken and see if he can do what you are looking for. Ive had plenty of stuff from him, and I always feel comfortable that he tells me what he can and cannot do.

And youd be surprized what can be done on a manual mill.

[dyeguy65]

We can no longer crank the LPR pressure low enough to pinch a ball or the cycle speeds are greatly reduced....

i am planning on picking up an eggy or if money allows, a halo. i havent had much trouble with choppage anyway, as im not using and e-frame. ive used the gun in one game since i got it, using close to 1500 balls that day. i maybe chopped 2, 3 at most. as far as i know, my LPR is cranked extremely low right now. i have a palmers micro rock, and the knob i have is about a half turn away from being all the way in. i have no way to measure what its at. i know my inline pressure (using a genx 2k2 i beleive) is at 300 psi.

i currently have free flow lower internals. but i am planning on selling my body with internals in there and picking up a set of full jackal internals (bolt and lower internals) for the body on the way, as well as the ultralight back block. im looking for lowest possible cocking mass, because i am planning on one day getting an e-frame. for right now though, im sticking to mechanical specs.

DG

[G3PB]

Dyeguy, If that is the style of milling you want, there is nothing on that that would require CNC, not even close actually. That's all straight-forward milling.

[Destructo6]

Martin's Machine can do a miniblock conversion for about $250. I believe he does give a fairly accurate ETA.

http://www.martinpaintball.com/products/prod_details.php?prod_id=MBAC001a

On a mech Autococker, lower pressure, lighter springs, lighter trigger.

[dyeguy65]

$250 is a little tight for my wallet...i dont think the half block conversion is gonna be the best thing for me right now. im still very interested in the uppertube milling and mini conversion though. i sent an email to ken yesterday and havent heard back yet. anymore suggestions on where to get the tidal milling done, dont hesitate to tell me :D

DG