New Warpig loader test

[mixwell2]

I think they just recently put this up. You guys can check out the results here'

http://www.warpig.com/paintball/technical/loaders/lineup2/teststand.shtml

The Q'loader kills all except on a ULE with xvalve. The HALO B comes out on top

[Skywalker]

That's wierd, I wonder why the Q-Loader doesn't work well with the ULE

[Adrenaline_Junkie]

Thats really wierd, theres no reason that it would feed faster on all the others than all the sudden go slower on a RTP. I think they may have made a mistake there but w/e.

[LittlePaintballBoy]

Maybe they didn't make a mistake, and the gun just didn't work as well with that loader. Hey, there's a possibility!

[Adrenaline_Junkie]

Why though? What would make it work any better on any of the others better than the mag?

[batteryfree]

i wanna see what happens when they intelliifeed the evo2 with z.

[LittlePaintballBoy]

I bet it will go faster. But still not as fast as the HALO or QLoader.

[Adrenaline_Junkie]

Just a guess, but maybe itll agitate the loader when the trigger is pulled??? ;) Im just messin with ya.

[Evil Bob]

Here's the full link http://www.warpig.com/paintball/technical/loaders/lineup2/index.shtml

I'm wondering if the mag with lvl 10 was having problems with the higher pressure against the bolt from the q-loader causing excess friction to lower it's cycling speed? I know it has a bit higher pressure on the ball stack then a halo sitting at rest under spring pressure. The other bolt systems are not as sensitive to ball pressure by design.

-Evil Bob

[Empyreal Rogue]

That is very odd, there's no reason why the Q-Loader would load slower on the ULE 'Mag than all the others. The way it's designed it should load the same universally, the only difference is ROF.

[ghideon]

Z-Man hit 30bps IIRC correctly with his SFL EMag hooked up to SCUBA, with paint and with the QLoader.

He also figured out that the shorter the tubing using, the faster it would feed. For testing purposes, he mounted directly on to the feed neck of the Mag (and Steelrat's marker, too).

[can'tthink of1]

I really wish they would have done the empire reloader B, and a relaoder, and a revvy just for all the info.

This doesn't help with my Halo B vs Reloader B debate, arg....

[toymyster]

Just shows: advertised feed rate and how well it works are two diferrent animals!! Looks like Q-loader still has some bugs to work out!!!

[AGD]

I can't believe that no one is commenting on the fact that the RT-ULE is out performing all the other guns with a HALO. The HALO is the same, its the GUNS that are different.

I agree that its strange that the Q is slower than it should be.

Bravo Bill another excellent test!!

AGD

[p8ntball72]

could that be because the halo was designed or proforms better with a no-rise?
that may be the problem with the Qloader..

[Z-man]

I might suggst that the length of the feed tube going from the Qloader to the breech greatly affected the responsivnes of the Q. The more balls the Q had to push (especially around a curved hoseline) the more sluggish it was in starting up. Now another thing that I would like to know about is:

1- Did they leave the Q Pods at their stock wind or did they increase the winds to say 15-16?

2- was the length of hose the same and the curve of the hose the same (within reason of course)?

You may all remember that in my videos I did not use a hose at all and the Q gets VERY fast with little resistance. Still, I like the data.

[gc82000]

Well at least I have the halo b. Now when I finish my RT( all that is needednow is Xvalve and hair), I know that I will have the best loader for it.

Oh yeah what is an OGI 03?

[mixwell2]

I can't believe that no one is commenting on the fact that the RT-ULE is out performing all the other guns with a HALO. The HALO is the same, its the GUNS that are different. AGD

I was waiting for someone to point that out.

[SlartyBartFast]

I can't believe that no one is commenting on the fact that the RT-ULE is out performing all the other guns with a HALO. The HALO is the same, its the GUNS that are different.

I agree that its strange that the Q is slower than it should be.


The data is interesting, and apart from the Matrix/Qloader test, the ULE certainly seemed to own.


Bravo Bill another excellent test!!

AGD

Too true. Can't be said enough.

I just wish there were pictures of each set-up.

[BradAGD]

Did you see how fast the RT is with the Halo???? OMG!!!! :wow:

there you go Tom, just a bit late.

[FragTek]

That test seems a tad sketchy... We've all seen Z-Man rock the Qloader at 30+bps w/ no misfeeds.

Very strange.

[manike]

Always great to see Bill do a genuine test and cut through the BS. :hail:

Loveya Bill and hoping the hurricanes aren't getting to you guys.

[GotMag?]

Why though? What would make it work any better on any of the others better than the mag?

Cause mags are piece of crap noob guns

[warbeak2099]

Yea, mags are outdated and no one uses them anymore. So AIC probably didn't even care about testing it on a crappy mag... lol.

I've had some problems with the Q on my ULE. It's strange, sometimes the Q just stops unwinding/feeding. When I shake the setup around a bit it gets back on track. Z-Man help me out? You can see how long and bent my hose is in the pictures in my sig. Click the link. Should I try a shorter hose setup?

[Empyreal Rogue]

Oh, I see how it is. Ignore the Q-Loader guru. -_-

Where you have the Q-Loader mounted on the Foregrip and barrel the hose is most certainly too long. I personally have never had any problems with my Q-Loader and ULE. *shrugs*

[ilikePB]

That test seems a tad sketchy... We've all seen Z-Man rock the Qloader at 30+bps w/ no misfeeds.

Very strange.
Yeah, Steelrat made a vid of him shooting his WAS'd Viking at 31bps with the Q Loader and around 26bps(can't remember the exact number, but 26 is close) with a V35 Halo...

[warbeak2099]

Sorry heh heh. What about my setup where the Q is mounted off of the gripframe like a Warpfeed. Is that too long?

[Z-man]

Z-Man help me out? You can see how long and bent my hose is in the pictures in my sig. Click the link. Should I try a shorter hose setup?

Well Looking at your pictures it looks ok. I do see that you have the hose a bit kinked at the QLoader end but do you see where it gets stuck? I mean is it up near the elbow or what? Have you tried adding a turn or 2 to each Q pod?


Yeah, Steelrat made a vid of him shooting his WAS'd Viking at 31bps with the Q Loader and around 26bps(can't remember the exact number, but 26 is close) with a V35 Halo...

hey look Ryan! some one does give you credit for MY videos :p (j/k) here is the page that has the Q videos and all my old ones allong with it.

http://www.zakvetter.com/Pages/Paintball/Z-mans_AO_Corner/Z-mans_corner_main.html

[chaunce]

I think that it is also weird that warpig did not do a drop test with the q-loader. I think that his test suck. I don't think that he did a verry good job taking time to do the test.


We all know that the q-loader will feed over 40 balls a second even if the feed tube is really long.

Personally I think that bill just did not want to do a complete test on the q-loader. If you are doing drop test on all of the loaders, why would you leav out the loader that is the fastest in the drop test? :shooting:

[Koosh]

Chaunce, I take it you didn't read the entire test...

They did drop test the q-loader. It overloaded his counting mechanism because it fed so fast, so it wasn't counted in that....

[mixwell2]

I think that it is also weird that warpig did not do a drop test with the q-loader. I think that his test suck. I don't think that he did a verry good job taking time to do the test.


We all know that the q-loader will feed over 40 balls a second even if the feed tube is really long.

Personally I think that bill just did not want to do a complete test on the q-loader. If you are doing drop test on all of the loaders, why would you leav out the loader that is the fastest in the drop test? :shooting:

The Q-loader was tested. The chart show it going past 25+.BPS. There are about three places where it states that the Q was feeding faster than the test equipment could register.

[chaunce]

Yea,

He could have at least gave a good estimate of how fast it was feeding.

[manike]

Yea,

He could have at least gave a good estimate of how fast it was feeding.

That wasn't the point of his tests. He wanted to provide real facts and numbers not 'estimates'.

He said it was greater than a certain value. That is a factual description of how fast it was without estimating a number which may have been incorrect.

Great numbers and testing. :hail:

[billmi]

I'm wondering if the mag with lvl 10 was having problems with the higher pressure against the bolt from the q-loader causing excess friction to lower it's cycling speed? I know it has a bit higher pressure on the ball stack then a halo sitting at rest under spring pressure. The other bolt systems are not as sensitive to ball pressure by design.


Without more detailed testing, it would be difficult to figure out why for sure, but that explanation seems very plausible to me.



That is very odd, there's no reason why the Q-Loader would load slower on the ULE 'Mag than all the others. The way it's designed it should load the same universally, the only difference is ROF.


I think, since it performed differently on different paintguns, it's easy to deduce that there is at least one reason why. Finding those reasons in a whole other story, though.



I can't believe that no one is commenting on the fact that the RT-ULE is out performing all the other guns with a HALO. The HALO is the same, its the GUNS that are different.

I agree that its strange that the Q is slower than it should be.


Yes, it really surprised my how much difference there was between different guns. I'd planned to use two additional guns - one is a popular electro - but when I pulled the trigger 10 times at 10 bps, it wouldn't stop firing after I stopped pulling the trigger, even holding the trigger still by hand, until I turned off its power. I plan to investigate further if that was a software deal or internal switch components bouncing because at a perfect rythm of 10 bps they resonated. The other I'd planned was a Tippmann 98c, but found that I'll need to go two finger trigger to do that, as on the single finger trigger the pneumatic finger was a tad wide and was binding on the trigger guard.



Bravo Bill another excellent test!!


Thanks :-)



I might suggst that the length of the feed tube going from the Qloader to the breech greatly affected the responsivnes of the Q. The more balls the Q had to push (especially around a curved hoseline) the more sluggish it was in starting up. Now another thing that I would like to know about is:


That certainly makes sense. For the test, I mounted the Q on the stand, with the same length of hose used when I reviewed it, testing on the Matrix LCD. It was going through a rather wide and smooth curve to get to the gun. In general it was pretty typical of the length and curve seen when the Q is mounted on a lot of guns - sometimes on center-feed guns the hose has to bend even tighter.

It's key to remember the test wasn't designed to show the fastest a particular loader can possibly go under the best of all possible circumstances, but how it can perform in a typical end user setup.



1- Did they leave the Q Pods at their stock wind or did they increase the winds to say 15-16?


Stock winds - going for typical end-user setup.



2- was the length of hose the same and the curve of the hose the same (within reason of course)?


Yep, see above.



You may all remember that in my videos I did not use a hose at all and the Q gets VERY fast with little resistance. Still, I like the data.


Last week I talked to Chris Goddard, the original HALO designer. Chris mentioned that he can't achieve nearly as high of average feed rates in full auto (consistent rate between every shot) as he can in enhanced semi-auto like (turbo, ramped, added shots, etc.) modes. On some of his higher test strings (over 20 bps) he's looked at the timer values and found some much slower shots, but they are balanced out by some much faster shots, and the overal average is higher.



Always great to see Bill do a genuine test and cut through the BS.

Loveya Bill and hoping the hurricanes aren't getting to you guys.


Thanks :-)

Charley missed us, but Frances kicked some major butt around here. We were without power for about a week, but the house made it through 100%. Neighbors next door lost enough of their roof that water damage ruined all of their interior walls. With no power there was no water (can't run the well pump) but we could run computers off the Jeep. FEMA kept us hooked up with ice and water through that time. Traffic lights and trees were down all over, making travel tough and it was 3 or 4 days before gasoline was readily available, so cars were dead on the road side from people leaving or coming back (they didn't listen to the governor who implored people not to leave the county, if they had to evacuate, go to a shelter.) It was definitely an adventure. By the 18th of the month, 90% of our city should have power again.



I've had some problems with the Q on my ULE. It's strange, sometimes the Q just stops unwinding/feeding. When I shake the setup around a bit it gets back on track. Z-Man help me out? You can see how long and bent my hose is in the pictures in my sig. Click the link. Should I try a shorter hose setup?


I've only had that happen with paint that was softened by heat. If the balls get soft enough that they can deform, they can smush out in the tube or pod and jam.



Personally I think that bill just did not want to do a complete test on the q-loader. If you are doing drop test on all of the loaders, why would you leav out the loader that is the fastest in the drop test?


As pointed out above, you'd know what went on if you actually read the article before posting your cirticism, but nice job anyway at making a completely baseless guess at my motivations for something that didn't happen.



That wasn't the point of his tests. He wanted to provide real facts and numbers not 'estimates'.

He said it was greater than a certain value. That is a factual description of how fast it was without estimating a number which may have been incorrect.

Great numbers and testing.


Well, I could just make up numbers, or just re-hash a manufacturer's press release instead of really reviewing or testing. It would be a whole lot easier, faster and less expensive to do, but heck, if I did that I might as well add a "buy here" button linking to an online store where I'd sell the product too, like some other paintball web sites do. But if that were the case I wouldn't find the reviews really worth reading.

[BradAGD]

Good to hear you and Dawn survived the hurricane well as can be expected.

Thanks for doing all these tests!!

[nate2k191]

all i know is that the X-valve owns like crazy. good job creating a beast of a product AGD