All this talk about SP, but what would u do if....

[jayloo]

They offered to sponsor your team and/or give you discounts on markers and clothing.

You just had to promote SP and wear their logos.

What would you do?

[tony3]

Take it, duh. Then again, I have nothing against them.

[ted.c0bb1es]

that is a toughy. but, honestly, i would do it. I would, however, only do the bare minimum and tell other people what I truely thought about SP stuff behind SP' back. I might get caught and lose the sponsorship, but, that is what I would most likely do. :eek:

[Chronobreak]

im with ted 100%

[Steelrat]

I wouldn't take it, but I despise them.

[Eatem Alive]

discounts...wouldn't do it. full sponsorship...hell yes i would.

[LittlePaintballBoy]

I don't care how much I hate a company, if they make decent guns they are willing to give to me free i'd shoot them.

[punkncat]

I think I would take the sponsorship and see how well I liked the products they provided me with as a "team" player. I would guess that they would want to keep you hooked up as (one of) a spokesman for their product.

You might more easily find yourself in a position to offer feedback and input on the products development and design. That could be handy.

I haven't owned a SP marker to this point , at least not until my Shocker gets here (thanks Ryan) , so I guess I will get to see.....

[FSU_Paintball]

I'd take a full or very large sponsorship. My team needs something like that. It would be worth biting the bullet.

[VFX_Fenix]

If it meant that my team were to recieve a load of free gear, sure. The worst that can happen is SP will yank their support and leave us with a load of free stuff... which we could turn around and sell and buy more new stuff ;)

In the event of discounted gear, most likely not, I dunno about you guys but I'm in college and $$ doesn't exactly come in copious ammounts while having your nose stuck in a book.

[JimInVA]

"I don't care for what you're doing... your business practices are distasteful and disconcerting... BUT IF YOU'RE GONNA SAVE ME A BUCK... who cares... I can look the other way?!"

Is this really where we've come as a society - for a bit of pampering here and a dollar there we'd jump at the opportunity to ignore the "principle of the thing"?

Personally, I am grateful for our right of "choice"... even if dismayed at the choice selected. :confused:

Jim

[LittlePaintballBoy]

Jim, I think it has come to more of a "We need money as a tournament team to BE a tournament team, i'll take whatever you got." kinda thing.

[JimInVA]

Pay me no mind... I still remember when a man's word was his bond and when a handshake held more certainty than ink on paper.

Jim

[punkncat]

Pay me no mind... I still remember when a man's word was his bond and when a handshake held more certainty than ink on paper.

Jim

You must be pretty old......... :D

[JimInVA]

LOL... old enough to know that I want to see it in writing!!! :hail:

[Glickman]

erm... i tihnk the major hype died, but although i dont do tourny's anymore, sure whynot, i love my shocker, and while their tech support and whatnot isnt that great, whynot?

saying no just to be the "john procter" in paintball's "the crucible" for this situation is just feeding yourself into whatever ur closed mind is set on :rolleyes:

well, there goes my psycho analysis for the da-.... er... wee-... er... year..

[SuiciDal Sn Y p ER]

money is money, if anyone gives me money i'd take it
same applies to paintball, if a company gives me discounts, free gear, etc. i'd take it

[68magOwner]

id do it

[evan123]

Take it, duh. Then again, I have nothing against them.
same here

[LaW]

They offered to sponsor your team and/or give you discounts on markers and clothing.

You just had to promote SP and wear their logos.

What would you do?


Honestly I have never had much against what they were doing because I knew it wouldnt change the sport all that much as some people have argued the "Doom of paintball as we know it " :)

I do like the shocker and I do like the nerve although overpriced I would definately accept a sponsorship and promote their products.

[personman]

To tell you the truth, I wouldnt use their guns if I was paid for it. I'd rather play with a quality gun and have fun with it :)

[VFX_Fenix]

Personally I don't really like or dislike SP. I don't agree with what they've tried to do with their touch trigger patent, but that's the way industry moves. SP tried to corner the market and they've since been tossed out of court by a justice who had some clue as to what was going on. The NAVY has had patents on eletro/pneumatic guns from an age before paintball was even an inkling in people's heads.

If SP cornered the market on Electros here in the states, Electro production would move to areas where US Patents mean nothing and we'd still have choices out there. SP would eventually have to start cometing with the competition again and we'll all be in just dandy shape. Or we could see a mechanical revolution, anything's really possible if one avenue of evolution is cut-off, another will form if the need is there.

[Hey Its Vo]

If you like the products a company has to offer, then take it. And if they OFFER you a discount for you without having to bust you *** for it, then they must like you. You can expect to get e free ride from the start, you have to work for it. If your not willing to work the improve the sponsorship(which you become a free ride someday) then stick to playing recball and 3man.


In my opinion, Smart Parts puts out some nice stuff, I own a shocker and never had an issue with it( except the vert max-flo(but was replace for free))

[ProX9]

I would never submit myself to a sponsorship by SP, I would rather buy my own stuff like I have been doing. Plus I dont think they could convince me to drop my viking with any of the guns they put out anyways.

[RTDynaflow]

To tell you the truth, I wouldnt use their guns if I was paid for it. I'd rather play with a quality gun and have fun with it :)

^^^^^^^

Unless they just gave me money, of course I'de take that :rolleyes:

[Creative Mayhem]

That's a tough one. I would have to say no, simply because I have played with quality products my whole paintball career. To go to a product with a lackluster performance and constant upgrades, isn't something that appeals to me. I'm not saying SP product are all bad, just that there has been and continue to be some bad performance issues with thier stuff, and I would be lying if I said that the SP patent thing didn't leave a bad taste in my mouth. Just my take on things.

[White_Noise]

id go to other companys seeing what theyd give me, telling them that this is what sp is offering me, what can you do? then take the best option other than sp.

[SlipknotX556]

I do it. But heres what I do, get everything I could out of them, then drop them.

[xXHavokXx]

As long as i could still rock my angel.

[justjoshin590]

id go to other companys seeing what theyd give me, telling them that this is what sp is offering me, what can you do? then take the best option other than sp.
now theres a good idea, even if the other company didnt give me quite as stuff or money or w/e id still have to go the anti sp way, im just not one of spart parts bitc*es

[Lohman446]

I would never submit myself to a sponsorship by SP, I would rather buy my own stuff like I have been doing. Plus I dont think they could convince me to drop my viking with any of the guns they put out anyways.


... but what if the offered you a deal involving your own designed Shocker/Impulse/Nerve, all the paint you needed, entrance fees, plus royalties off teh sale of "your" gun.

[Pump Scout]

Personally, there's no way in Hades I'd promote SP. I've found them distasteful for a long time, and hold them responsible for some of the worst trends, hype, and so-called "advances" in paintball. Paying my own way is a small price for being able to enjoy this sport with a clean conscience.

[gc82000]

I dont think for a partial sponsorship. I already got that. For a half or full sponsorship more then likely not. I dont see thier guns as top level guns as such as a timmy, trixie, X/emag, viking, excalibur, cyborg, DM4 or any where near an angel, yeah I am really biased here. I would not mind any other brand, Evil, Empire, Dye, *AGD ;) *. :D

[Mosfet]

I'd take it. I have no team and never played tourney, but if I had the chance I would.
I personally don't like their business tactics, especially after they went for my favorite company AKA, but I like their products... ok some of their products.... ok the Shocker is nice....

Business is business. Yeah its a sucky world, and it isn't all peaches and cream like we'd like it to be. And yeah that "Rebound" thing was the stupidest "Feature" to have ever come out in the world, but that can be replaced with a non-rebound board.

I don't like everything our government does either, but I served in the Army reserves and did my part.

Nothing is really ever how we truely like it to be. SP did some stupid stuff, and I'm getting a shocker. Apple did a similar thing when they pulled back all licenses to make Apple clones, but I'm typing this on a Powerbook. M$..... don't need to go there, but I have a Windows PC at home.

Just condemn the action as a bad business action. Voice your opinion, and maybe they'll listen.
maybe not. At least their not paying you to wear "anti-Paintball- It should be banned and we should all play Lazertag or Tiddly Winks gear"

If it were truely an ideal world, there'd be no sueing of fellow companies, and Angels would cost $500 for the top line model, but its not.

I guess what I'm saying is I like some of the products but not all of the practices, much like about every other large company/organization on the face of the earth.

[Jeffy-CanCon]

I don't think it's right to enter a sponsorship deal where you are not happy with the company's products or policies. If you can't honestly promote and represent them, the deal is no good. My friends have been offered deals, and turned them down for those reasons. I admire that sort of integrity.

If you tell lies to promote a company you don't believe in, you're a hypocrite.

If you take their sponsorship and don't promote them, you're a fraud & a thief.

[Mosfet]

is it right to live in a country if you're not happy with all of its policies?
Is it right to work for a company if you're not happy with all of its policies, and this includes ALL of them down to layoffs.
Will you be the first to quit your job because your company lays off a developer to save money?

So.. Are you happy with your Microsoft Windows? or your Apple OS?
Both companies have done things far worse than SP?
Like Goodyear, or any of the top car manufacturers? I won't even go into that.

[Hey Its Vo]

I don't think it's right to enter a sponsorship deal where you are not happy with the company's products or policies. If you can't honestly promote and represent them, the deal is no good. My friends have been offered deals, and turned them down for those reasons. I admire that sort of integrity.

If you tell lies to promote a company you don't believe in, you're a hypocrite.

If you take their sponsorship and don't promote them, you're a fraud & a thief.

PLus if others companies see you screwing over another, then noone else will ever want to sponsor you.

[Mosfet]

I'd be able to take a sponsership from SP because I can with good conscience promote their good hardware and "software"
If they force us to use cheater boards in tourney's than, NO, but I'm pretty sure they don't.
As far as their tactics go, I think they've backed off quite a bit havn't they? Or will they always now and forever be the spawn of evil, and never deserve a second chance?

Looking at their products and news about the company, I think I can say that maybe now I can take a sponsership from them. A few months ago, probably not. Bounce is all right for recballers, and non tourney players, but as long as they don't push that stuff into tourneys that don't allow it, I'm fine.

Am I making sense?
summary = they seemed to have calmed down. They have resonably good products. Why not give them a chance? Take the sponsership. If they end up being big butts again, just don't renew the contract. Don't go and break it. No company looks down at people who don't renew a contract. Its why they exist. breaking them is bad. renewing or not renewing is just a part of the biz.

[vonort]

I would look at them spit in their face and say no thanks. I don't use c * r * a * p to play PB. :clap: :dance:

[Mosfet]

HAH! I would love to be there to se that! ^^^ :rofl:

[xXHavokXx]

Have a meeting with my two good buddies, Jim Beam and Jack Daniels so hopefully I wont remember the pain of them stealing my soul???

[Meph]

They offered to sponsor your team and/or give you discounts on markers and clothing.

You just had to promote SP and wear their logos.

What would you do?


Sorry but I know their quality. Their reliability.

I'd chose to use something I know wouldn't break down mid-game.

Be surprised to hear but some people actually are picky about their sponsors. Not all but enough.

[Thordic]

The hypocrisy of AO abounds in this thread.

[Jeffy-CanCon]

is it right to live in a country if you're not happy with all of its policies?
Is it right to work for a company if you're not happy with all of its policies, and this includes ALL of them down to layoffs.
Will you be the first to quit your job because your company lays off a developer to save money?

So.. Are you happy with your Microsoft Windows? or your Apple OS?
Both companies have done things far worse than SP?
Like Goodyear, or any of the top car manufacturers? I won't even go into that.


There are real differences between one set of choices and another.

I work for my government, though I disagree with a lot of their policies. But I'm free to publicly state my private opinions, and to work to change those policies through the poltical system. I'm not being asked to lie about my opinions, or to promote something I don't believe in. They pay me to churn out data, and that's what I do.

There is no hypocrisy or fraud in working hard for an employer you don't particularly like. Except in particular cases like an environmentalist building SUVs for GM, or a vegan working in a slaughterhouse. ;)

I'm not saying anything against SP. Or Microsoft or Apple or Goodyear or Big Oil. I can use their products without agreeing with their policies, and without promoting them.

[Jeffy-CanCon]

The hypocrisy of AO abounds in this thread.

depressing, eh?

[coyote]

I don't think it's hypocrisy, I think it's misunderstanding....

It's obvious that most posters here don't understand what a sponsorship entails.

It is a job. you are there to wear the logo, use the gear, and sell the gear. Were the AA jersey, shoot the Nerve, and talk the world into doing the same.

Most people thinks it means Santa Clause drops gear off at their door. Nope. I have one player that I sponsor through my shop. He gets gear and paint at cost because he brings me business. Whenever a player brings up that they need gear he is steering them my way.

If you can't do that you don't have anything to offer a sponsor. You may get a deal, but you will eventually lose it.

BTW, I have never carried Smart Parts gear. The Gardeners made an impression on me long before their patent nonsense. It was a poor impression. I don't like their outfit or their products. As a player my sense of integrity dictates that I refuse sponsorships from companies that I can't offer 100% of my effort and loyalty.

[RTDynaflow]

I don't think it's hypocrisy, I think it's misunderstanding....

It's obvious that most posters here don't understand what a sponsorship entails.

It is a job. you are there to wear the logo, use the gear, and sell the gear. Were the AA jersey, shoot the Nerve, and talk the world into doing the same.

Most people thinks it means Santa Clause drops gear off at their door. Nope. I have one player that I sponsor through my shop. He gets gear and paint at cost because he brings me business. Whenever a player brings up that they need gear he is steering them my way.

If you can't do that you don't have anything to offer a sponsor. You may get a deal, but you will eventually lose it.

BTW, I have never carried Smart Parts gear. The Gardeners made an impression on me long before their patent nonsense. It was a poor impression. I don't like their outfit or their products. As a player my sense of integrity dictates that I refuse sponsorships from companies that I can't offer 100% of my effort and loyalty.

^^^^^^^^
:clap: :clap:

Very well said.

RTD

[Jeffy-CanCon]

I don't think it's hypocrisy, I think it's misunderstanding....

It's obvious that most posters here don't understand what a sponsorship entails.
...

I don't see the evidence of that. Jayloo's question was pretty clear, and just about every player here who posted something beyond "I agree with ____" seemed to understand that sponsorship was a trade of their goods for your promotion.

[steveo356]

Well if they offered, before id accept it wether it woudl be partial or full. id call up the guys at WDP and dye first cuz they're my faves. And if they even came near it I would take them. but the gun with the royaltys i mean that supreme thats like big money there. specialy considering a paintball carreer doesnt exactly mean multi millions a year unless maybe your dynasty( whom i dont realy liek ne ways}

[jayloo]

I don't see the evidence of that. Jayloo's question was pretty clear, and just about every player here who posted something beyond "I agree with ____" seemed to understand that sponsorship was a trade of their goods for your promotion.

I tried to keep it short and clear. If you accepted a sponsorship you must promote that company at any and all oportunities. Saying anything bad about your sponsor could cause you to loose your sponsorship QUICKLY.

I appriciate everyones replies. Keep em coming.

[Athius]

I dont mind being sponsored by them but preferably i would like if WDP and Draxxus sponsored my team.

[REDRT]

NO to SP!!! Unless say 5 years go by, the rest of the industry is pumping out super guns that are 2x as fast than now and AGD is unwilling to back us with something quicker than 3.2 . Only then if I was offered a sponsorship would I consider it.

[Glickman]

i know something about their quality too.

my dad/me have a backup imp that always works, and well for that matter.
and i have a primary shocker '03 that shoots faster then my matrix, and more reliable then any gun that ive ever own.

[coyote]

I don't see the evidence of that. Jayloo's question was pretty clear, and just about every player here who posted something beyond "I agree with ____" seemed to understand that sponsorship was a trade of their goods for your promotion.

You getb it JeffCan-Con but some don't.

Some ( not all by any means) poster have written things to the effect of "I would say things off the record" or "I wouldn't try very hard". that indicates to me some misunderstanding. Player with that sort of attitude don't get, or keep sponsorships.

Jayloo's question was clear, and this is a great thread. It was some other posters that didn't seem to get it. They are the ones I was trying to reach.

[barrel break]

Jim, I think it has come to more of a "We need money as a tournament team to BE a tournament team, i'll take whatever you got." kinda thing.
the reason i would say yes^^
I'm a sellout kinda guy on some issues, sorry industry

[coyote]

Not eveyone is obligated to have a strong opinion on this issue.

[Digits]

Dicount = no.. I wouldn't really want to pay cash for smart parts stuff as I like alot of companies better (not because of patents, just from experience)

But full.. Hell yes I would.. And I would support them to the fullest

[Thordic]

Its hypocrisy because I can point out threads with TONS of replies with people saying they hate smart parts, smart parts is evil, smart parts sucks, no one is every buying smart parts again, etc, and yet, as soon as the money is waved in front of their face, SP is everyone's best friend.

Thats hypocrisy. Are you so easily bought? Is free SP gear worth selling your integrity for?

Apparently so.

[Digits]

Its hypocrisy because I can point out threads with TONS of replies with people saying they hate smart parts, smart parts is evil, smart parts sucks, no one is every buying smart parts again, etc, and yet, as soon as the money is waved in front of their face, SP is everyone's best friend.

Thats hypocrisy. Are you so easily bought? Is free SP gear worth selling your integrity for?

Apparently so.

ya ok.. I wouldn't buy anything smart parts.. But if there going to support my team then I would support them 100%.. Anybody whos not a complete moron would take a full sponsorship from them.. There guns arn't THAT bad

It's not hypocrisy.. It's comoon sense.. Do you think all the celebrities that endorse certain companies actually like them? No.. Todays world is based around money, if you don't got it, your nothing

[vonort]

I guess im a complet moron. But guess what at least i have morals. And I am able to sleep at night. I would never take anything from SP. I don't like their gear. And guess what I can afford to buy whatever I want. So I have no need for their freebies. Especially if it means I have to promote them.

Coyote I like you. :dance:

[ilikePB]

Its hypocrisy because I can point out threads with TONS of replies with people saying they hate smart parts, smart parts is evil, smart parts sucks, no one is every buying smart parts again, etc, and yet, as soon as the money is waved in front of their face, SP is everyone's best friend.

Thats hypocrisy. Are you so easily bought? Is free SP gear worth selling your integrity for?

Apparently so.

Luckily, I have never said anything like that, so I can say this:


Take it, duh. Then again, I have nothing against them.

[hardr0ck68]

i would tell then to stuff it up there arse...
and thats the friggin truth, i have been sopnsored before (by a great bunch of guys and Mel at PBX) and i also have worked for a couple stores/fields and gotten the "discount" sponsorships, first there often not worth the bull you hafta put up with (workin 30 hours for a $35 case of paint screw that, or a fugly jersey covered in there logos for free BUT you have to wear it when you play or ref or whatever....NOT WORTH IT)

and the stone cold truth is i would have bought a shocker by now if they hadent fired off that law suit, its a tight light gun....but i dont agree with their business pratices so they will not get my support. EVER....and i have sucessfuly steered 5 newbs/semi newbs away from shockers (onto timmys and dm4's, but away from shockers).

[Thordic]

ya ok.. I wouldn't buy anything smart parts.. But if there going to support my team then I would support them 100%.. Anybody whos not a complete moron would take a full sponsorship from them.. There guns arn't THAT bad

It's not hypocrisy.. It's comoon sense.. Do you think all the celebrities that endorse certain companies actually like them? No.. Todays world is based around money, if you don't got it, your nothing

That's just sad.

[Glickman]

once again, a bunch of (my favorite overused analogy) john proctors in paintballs "the crucible"

its like a kid noone likes giving a "good bye" post saying "o, well, i dont REALLY expect anyone to miss me.... cause noone likes me"

obviously, hes looking to get a reaction out of it, and to get responses "aww, ill miss you"
or "no kidding, ur a dumbass"

either way, he becomes the center of attention, even for those 15 minutes which is what he aimed for.

am i accusing those of that viewpoint of possibly having that reason explained in the analogy? yes. do i believe its everyone? of course not. your entitled to do what you want of course and i also believe a very large percent of this forum are very well educated, but i do believe that for some people, thats why they say "o, ill never buy smart parts, ill do my part against monopolies". i might be getting of subject, but im trying to address one viewpoint that maybe some people here, but tons of people elsewhere believe.

-One person not buying, nor 500 people not buying a companies product wont change anything
-Saying "atleast im able to sleep at night" is widely overused, and is focused on getting a reaction, more-so then displaying ones beliefs
-If you dont care what people say about you buying practices, whywanting do alot of people say things that are apparently controvercial, and seem to implicate to get a reaction out of people.
-"the cold steel truth is i wouldve bought one already" why is it cold steel? who is it hurting? maybe a fraction of a percent on smart parts' net , and maybe a few percent on the store you wouldve bought it from?


do you not wear nike because they are responsible for the exploition of 9 year olds. while nessities arent as much in afganistan, $5 a day is barely enough for water and food. horrible working conditions, beating, killings, and much more are pracitices of nike, and so, do you boycott nike (some might already, but it WAS a widely spoken "fashion" not too long ago) or do you boycott smart parts for their inducing of royalties, and whatnot?

critizism is very appreciated on this, while im sure few of you might be harsh :p i love debating, and find this very fun and brain-massaging.

[vonort]

I don't use SP products because personally I think they are junk. The icing on the cake is the lawsuit. I had a freak before having a freak was popular. I got rid of my freak becuase I found a better product for much less money. J&J ceramics. I will never buy another freak because they are not that good, not worth my hard earned money. I would never accept a sponsorship from SP because I disagree with their business policy. And I could not in all good conciousness promote thier product.


PS. I don't wear Nikes cause I think they are over priced and I can find just as good a shoe elsewhere.

[Glickman]

heh, payless all the way! any other paylessers?

[Leader of Men]

Take it, duh. Then again, I have nothing against them.
:)

[Lohman446]

TO those of you who have said no because of business practicies.. I don't agree with you but you have my respect for it, it is a well thought out opinion and hase a basis.

To those of you who have said no because there junk - well... just because you dont like a company doesnt mean its product is junk. Now some of you have better reasons, but the SP stuff I own is of higher quality than comparable equipment. Strange using Shockers tells me how good of a gun they can be.

I think that SP is very competetive in quality in the price ranges there products are in. The Freak I agree may be overpriced when compared to its comeptitors, but when I needed a barrel kit its still where I looked.

I dont like everything SP does as a company... I don't like everything AGD does as a company either. You can throw in K2, WDP and PMI also, along with Dye. The fact of the matter is, if I had to agree wtih every business decision made with teh limited knowledge I had from outside the company in order to support a company and buy its products, I would have a hard time playing paintball. I don't agree wtih them, but they are made from a business stand point and it is not my decision to make.

[Glickman]

very nice post :clap:

[jayloo]

PS. I don't wear Nikes cause I think they are over priced and I can find just as good a shoe elsewhere.

I agree but when u wear a size 13 you can not shop by brand and/style. Asking "What do you have in a size 13?" is a much shorter list than picking by style.

It sucks. Oh well.

[Teamslayer76]

My team is sponsored [minorly] by System X we took it. We didnt shoot cockers. We werent fans of them or anything they saw us play at Nppl Event 2 [Tampa last may] We were like 4th place in the Div III. And they gave us jeresys and shirts hats barrells and about 10 cases of paint. Right now they might send us a couple Xoniks. Hell I'd take SP Sponsorship. Even if i do hate them...which i do with all my heart. Long and short of this... Free stuff is defintly better, espcially if its expensive. Like chicken wings.