Are these firearms legal in California?

[magmanl337]

Below is a list of firearms that i want to own once i am 21 and have a firearms owners liscence. My question is, are they legal in california?

Heckler & Koch MP5a3
Heckler & Koch USP
Glock 18 or 17
Colt M4a1
Colt 1911 Semi Auto Pistol
Steyr TMP
Beretta 92F
Desert Eagle with .50 and .45 caliber barrels
Ak-47
Bushmaster AR-15 Competition Edition
Remington 700PSS .308

Does anyone know where i can get a list of all the illegal firearms in California? i might even consider moving to a state with less strict gun laws if CA is prohibiting me form leally getting most of these guns.

[Blennidae]

http://caag.state.ca.us/firearms/

All your answers can be found there. I think most of the pistols you listed are available, but the magazines will be limited to 10rds, regardless of how many the standard capacity magazines can hold. The bolt action M700 you can get. I wasn't aware of a Desert Eagle in .45, but I have seen them in .357, .44. and .50AE. If you want to own your choice of firearms, DO NOT live in California. The bottom line is it sucks to be a gun owner in CA. :cuss:

[magmanl337]

[url] I wasn't aware of a Desert Eagle in .45, but I have seen them in .357, .44. and .50AE.

slip of the finger, i meant .44

[magmanl337]

i just looked at the list of legal firearms in california - ALL handguns. I'm definately moving once i am 21.

[TransMan]

they have them in .45acp too my uncle used to have one I shot it :)

*EDIT* Whoops just remembered it wasnt a .45 it was a .44 i thot it was a .45 at first cuz i shot a .50 once before it . :tard:

[Steelrat]

Heckler & Koch MP5a3-good gun, but the 10 round carbine version is kind of pointless
Heckler & Koch USP-Not bad, sig is better
Glock 18 or 17-not bad, sig is better ;)
Colt M4a1-good gun
Colt 1911 Semi Auto Pistol-Mmm, wilson combat 1911, mmmmm
Steyr TMP
Beretta 92F -complete junk
Desert Eagle with .50 and .45 caliber barrels-junk, but show up a lot in movies, good for novelty
Ak-47-better off with the m4 or ar-15
Bushmaster AR-15 Competition Edition-good gun, bushmaster lowers are good
Remington 700PSS .308-excellent rifle

If you want to buy a lot of firearms, california is not the best bet.

[Blennidae]

I agree with Steelrat, Sig is better. :cool:

[LittlePaintballBoy]

I Like my 1022.

Think an MP5 is over-kill for varmint hunting? :p

[magmanl337]

i forgot the sig sauer =P hehe

[Destructo6]

The following are all CA "Assault Weapons" and must have been possessed and registered prior to Jan 01, 2001 to now legally own:
Colt M4a1
Ak-47 (all variants)
Bushmaster AR-15 Competition Edition
HK-94/93/91/41/43 ("clip-on" gripframe, making them semiautomatic in the BATFE's eyes)
CA approved pistols:
Heckler & Koch USP: Most varients are CA approved and legal.
Colt 1911 Semi Auto Pistol (there are many makes approved: kimber, colt, springfield, etc)
Glock 17
Desert Eagle in 44mag only.
Beretta 92F
NFA weapons, which are generally not legal in CA:
Heckler & Koch MP5a3 (this is a push-pin receiver, which is considered automatic by the BATFE)
Glock model 18 is a fully automatic NFA weapon.
Steyr TMP
Remington 700PSS .308 is a run of the mill rifle. IIRC, Remington doesn't like these being sold to non-LEO types, but there is no law prohibiting doing so.

[magmanl337]

Whats the criminal sentence for illegally owning these weapons? Also, i thought that the law passed on Setp 10 1994 making all fully automatic guns illegal, was removed ten years later, on sept 10 2004?

[Southpaw]

NO NO NO NO NO!!!!!! Fully automatic guns are still BANNED/very regulated!!!!! The assualt weaopn ban was lifted though witch has no real connection with full auto guns other than looks.

[Destructo6]

Whats the criminal sentence for illegally owning these weapons? Also, i thought that the law passed on Setp 10 1994 making all fully automatic guns illegal, was removed ten years later, on sept 10 2004?
Welcome to the exciting and convoluted world of US gun ownership.

The 1994 ban had nothing to do with automatic weapons. The 94 "assault weapons" ban prohibited some cosmetic features (more than 2 of the following: pistol grip, flash hider, detachable magazine, bayonet lug, etc). This ban expired a couple months ago.

The 1934 National Firearm Act (NFA) sought to prohibit fully automatic weapons (more than one shot per 1 pull of the trigger) by levying a $200 tax on the manufacture and transfer of ownership. This law is still in effect.

The 1968 Gun Control Act (GCA) established a licensing scheme for dealers (FFLs) who would be allowed to engage in interstate commerce of guns. If you don't have an FFL, you can't ship a gun across state lines for sale or transfer of ownership. It also prohibited the import of NFA weapons, except for military or law enforcement, making only domestic versions available to the eligible public. This law is still in effect.

The 1986 Fiream Owners Protection Act (FOPA) prohibited the establishment of a registry of gun ownership by the Federal government. This is the bit of legislation cited curing the Clinton administration when they wanted the FBI to hold onto "Instant Check" information longer than the required time period. Also, there was a rider on this bill that prohibited the registration of new NFA weapons.

There are a host of other federal laws that govern firearms, but those are the big ones. There are many more state and local laws.

The penalty for possessing an unregistered NFA weapon is 10 years and/or $250,000 fine. If you don't have the legal version, it's not worth it as you have something that can garner you some serious trouble, but can't use (where are you going to shoot it without raising questions?).

There is a legal challenge to some of the NFA restrictions. It has been that any automatic weapon is a NFA weapon, but the NFA gets its authority from the "Commerce Clause" of the US Constitution. So the question is, "Does the NFA apply to an automatic firearm that was built by the owner for his/her personal use only and is not likely to leave the state?" Not long ago (this year, iirc) a judge said, "no," and the NFA guys got all weak in the knees.

[Eagle]

I don't know specific laws fro California, but last I checked, it is Federal Law that any full auto weapon requires a class3 firearms licence. To get one of those you usually, but not always, need to be Active Duty military, Federal Law Enforcement, or a firearms dealer. Now thats not to say that you can't buy a semi-auto weapon, such as an SKS, and install a spring kit to make it full auto (in this case, into an AK47). As for the Glock 18, I looked into it myself. If you aren't Military or Law Enforcement, they are illiegal.

[PyRo]

Just because you are military or law enforcement doesn't mean you can get a license. Why would you need a full automatic weapon because you are military or law enforcement; I could see an argument (although a weak one) for law enforcement, but none for military. The only thing I know for sure is if you manage to get a dealers license you can buy just about anything you want, but a dealers license is very hard to get now, the average person cannot just buy one like you could 20 years ago in some states.

[Destructo6]

if you manage to get a dealers license you can buy just about anything you want,
That's really not true, although it has been seen that way. The C3 license is for folks who are running a business. To buy post-1986 dealer's sample weapons, you need a letter from a Law Enforcement Agency that asks your business for a demonstration or purchase. The BATF is starting to crack down on folks who are using their C2/C3 license to expand their collections (ie a STEn is probably not a valid dealer sample).

For the most part, a 100% civillian is just as likely to get his forms signed off as not. That assumes that NFA weapons are not prohibited and the local Sheriff doesn't object. No C2 or C3 licensing required.

[lather]

I agree with Steelrat, Sig is better. :cool:

I have a Sig and a Glock 31...Both are great pieces but the Glock is a bit more reliable and has better "pointability" imo..Stock the trigger on the Glock is lighter too..Glock is also less expensive.. Ive shot about 6500 rounds plus in my G31 with no jams at all so far. Shot about 2000 in my Sig and got 1 jam and a couple stovepipes. (Both were bought new and are well taken care of).


HK handguns are overrated imo.


You really cant go wrong with either but I feel if I ever get forced in a home defense situation, I feel a LOT more confident with the GLOCK.

[Blennidae]

I bought my 226 new in '87. I can't remember how many rounds I have put thru it. It has never failed to feed or fire any ammo I have tried. I don't own a Glock, but have fired my buddies G20C. It has proven to be less than reliable when it comes to feeding.

Both are fine, but its a matter of preference. I don't like the way a Glock feels in my hands. I don't care for the Safe Action Trigger.

Everyone I have ever let shoot my 226 has been very happy with its ergonomics, and accuracy. As you mentioned, they are not the most affordable pistols out there. I have NEVER regretted having purchased my Sig. I would have no worrys about using my Sig in a home defense situation, but I have a Mossberg 500 for that. :D

If the Glock works for you, fine. I still feel the Sig is better. ;)

[Steelrat]

I have a Sig and a Glock 31...Both are great pieces but the Glock is a bit more reliable and has better "pointability" imo..Stock the trigger on the Glock is lighter too..Glock is also less expensive.. Ive shot about 6500 rounds plus in my G31 with no jams at all so far. Shot about 2000 in my Sig and got 1 jam and a couple stovepipes. (Both were bought new and are well taken care of).


HK handguns are overrated imo.


You really cant go wrong with either but I feel if I ever get forced in a home defense situation, I feel a LOT more confident with the GLOCK.

Ever run a double feed drill in a glock? You can't use a brass cartridge, because it will become horribly jammed. You have to use a special plastic round. Unfortunately, guess what will be in your breech when you have a double feed? Thats right, the brass cartridge. Ooops.

Glocks are having problems with the extractors bending and breaking on their guns. I have also seen problems when foreign substances enter the whole firing mechanism, that "do not oil EVER" area at the back of the slide. Even a few grains of sand will screw it up.

I have NEVER had a failure to feed, extract, or eject with my sig 228. Sure, my trigger is heavier than a glock, but thats actually better. When the crap hits the fan, and the adrenaline starts pumping, a too-light trigger is more of a liability than a benefit.

Not to say glocks arent good guns. They are. But when agencies have a choice of weapons, most are going with the sig.

[CaliMagFan]

i'll be in austria in a few weeks and am hoping to part with a few dollars for the chance to get a glock with the auto built on the back of the slide.... shipping it home is the hard part.... but i think i can clear it...

[lather]

Ever run a double feed drill in a glock? You can't use a brass cartridge, because it will become horribly jammed. You have to use a special plastic round. Unfortunately, guess what will be in your breech when you have a double feed? Thats right, the brass cartridge. Ooops.

Glocks are having problems with the extractors bending and breaking on their guns. I have also seen problems when foreign substances enter the whole firing mechanism, that "do not oil EVER" area at the back of the slide. Even a few grains of sand will screw it up.

I have NEVER had a failure to feed, extract, or eject with my sig 228. Sure, my trigger is heavier than a glock, but thats actually better. When the crap hits the fan, and the adrenaline starts pumping, a too-light trigger is more of a liability than a benefit.

Not to say glocks arent good guns. They are. But when agencies have a choice of weapons, most are going with the sig.



Never had a misfeed or heard of a problem with Glocks. But Ive only been shooting mine for 6 years. Only thing I heard was the early .40's were having problems.


I like both the Glock and the Sig but the Glock has fewer parts, which means less chance of malfunction due to a simpler design. (Its one reason I love my Automag) :)
I dont care for the DA to SA action on the Sig too.


Also Sigs rust :(

But yes you cant go wrong with either. I'd go with whatever fits your hand and whatever you are most comfortable shooting.
I love my Sig, it just comes down to if the SHTF I'd trust my Glock over my Sig.

A too-light trigger is not an issue as your finger shouldnt even be on the trigger unless you intend on firing the weapon. The best safety device is your brain.

Never put your finger on the trigger unless you are ready to shoot! :shooting:

[Blennidae]

Here is one serious problem I have heard about with Glocks.

http://www.thegunzone.com/glock/glock-kb.html

[Destructo6]

The infamous Glock ka-boom for .40S&W chamberings. It's pretty well documented.

About the only thing I don't like about Glocks is the grip angle. It doesn't point naturally for me (points high).

SIGs, HKs, 1911s, CZ (not the 52), all point about as naturally for me as my index finger.

I've never had a malfunction with my SIG P226, which is K-Koted so it doesn't rust. Never had any problems with the Makarov, now that I think about it.

[Eatem Alive]

Also Sigs rust :(
wouldn't just about any gun that you didn't take care of? the navy seals don't seem to be concerned as the 226 is their handgun of choice...stainless with nitron finish.

[Steelrat]

wouldn't just about any gun that you didn't take care of? the navy seals don't seem to be concerned as the 226 is their handgun of choice...stainless with nitron finish.

The other, older finish for the sigs did have a tendedncy to rust. The nitron is much better.

[cphilip]

So tell me you Law Enforcement types.... which Glock models are most of the agencies using now a days... in 9 mm?

[Bulldog]

Not a lot of guys carry the 9mm models anymore as a primary, the couple I know who do, carry the 17. It's mostly the smaller models for backups/off duty.



About the only thing I don't like about Glocks is the grip angle. It doesn't point naturally for me (points high).

Ya, me too. I can't shoot them comfortably. I like my overated USP. :)

[cphilip]

what are they carrying? the .40's?

Ah back up like the 19 model?

[Bulldog]

Ya, mostly the .40s around here. Not sure on the model numbers though of the smaller glocks, I've seen some that are pretty dang small. I can't even get my pinky on the grip, though I think I've seen some sorta extension that fixes that.

Edit: I think it's the 26 model for backup/offduty. Though I've known see the 19 carried as a primary. Mostly by women with smaller hands. That's not a slam, even though it sounds like one. Honest. :D

[cphilip]

Ah.... well. I can make a pretty sweet deal on a 17 is why I was asking. Was thinking about my kid and getting him one. He has been practicing with a Glock but I failed to ask him what Caliber they were using...

[lather]

Anyone own a pm7m8? (I think its an HK has the decocker/cocker on the grip) A friend of mine at our local range let me shoot a few rounds a couple a weekends ago and I really was impressed.

I liked it so much I was considering getting one, but from the impression I got from the owner is that they are no longer being produced.

If anyone owns one let me know what they like/dislike about it. It was just starting to get to be a must-have handgun for me, but my buddy didnt want me shooting all of his 9mm :)

[Blennidae]

I don't own one, but I have always wanted to try one. Its still listed on the HK website. so its still being produced. http://www.hecklerkoch-usa.com/le/p7m8.html I have heard they are very expensive, new or used.

[Firedude]

Ya, mostly the .40s around here. Not sure on the model numbers though of the smaller glocks, I've seen some that are pretty dang small. I can't even get my pinky on the grip, though I think I've seen some sorta extension that fixes that.

Edit: I think it's the 26 model for backup/offduty. Though I've known see the 19 carried as a primary. Mostly by women with smaller hands. That's not a slam, even though it sounds like one. Honest. :D

Model 22's are what most departments carry in a Glock 40. I really like mine that has been issued to me. I also have a HK USP 45 acp(among other guns), which is also a sweet pistol. Have shot a few Sigs, and have even thought of buying a 226, but I don't really care for the decocking lever. Just my .02.

[magmanl337]

Whats the average price of a box of 9mm? (50 in a box i think)

[Steelrat]

Anyone own a pm7m8? (I think its an HK has the decocker/cocker on the grip) A friend of mine at our local range let me shoot a few rounds a couple a weekends ago and I really was impressed.

I liked it so much I was considering getting one, but from the impression I got from the owner is that they are no longer being produced.

If anyone owns one let me know what they like/dislike about it. It was just starting to get to be a must-have handgun for me, but my buddy didnt want me shooting all of his 9mm :)

I've shot em. US Park police carry them. They are good shooting guns, but a bit complex, and the gun vents its gas by the trigger, which gets rather hot during extended shooting. Judging by the lack of similar designs, I would say that it was a developmental dead-end.

[cphilip]

Ah.... good old South Carolina!!

SOUTH CAROLINA--South Carolina allows a loaded handgun to be secured in a closed glove compartment, closed console or closed trunk.


Note--most other states consider a loaded gun in a glove box or console to be concealed and therefore possibly illegal.

Whats the point of having one if it ain't loaded we figure? Common ya'll.... get with it! :p

[Blennidae]

Whats the average price of a box of 9mm? (50 in a box i think)

Most 9mm comes 50 to a box. Price depends on what type you are buying. Cheap plinking ammo can be had for under $10. The more specialized defense/LE type ammo is more expensive.

[Destructo6]

Wallyworld (Walmart) sells Winchester White box in 100rnd boxes for just over $10. Kinda smelly/dirty, but it's cheap.

Turner's Outdoorsman (local SoCal chain) has PMC 9mm for $7/50.

IIRC, Speer Lawman fmj is about $11/50.

[Aegis]

Ever run a double feed drill in a glock? You can't use a brass cartridge, because it will become horribly jammed. You have to use a special plastic round. Unfortunately, guess what will be in your breech when you have a double feed? Thats right, the brass cartridge. Ooops.


Gotta agree with Steelrat on this. IMHO, the Glock is more likely to stovepipe than the others you mention and you will have a similar situation.

Before anyone gets excited about that statement: I used a 17L & 22 in IPSC stock class competition. Never had a problem in normal positions, but when shooting weak hand or in some funky position where you are not as well braced they had a tendency to partially extract the case. If you didn't have a good braced position the mass of the slide would push the frame back as well and you don't get a good kick off the ejector.

That was a while back, might have been cured by now. Won't ever happen when it doesn't matter, by the way.

[whymillywhy]

You need to move to South Dakota, There aren't barely any gun laws, my dad is an avid gun collector with many guns, on the top of my head I can think of:
4 .22's
2 SKS's
2 MAC-90is (AK-47 Variants)
3-4 AR-15's
5-6+ Shotguns of various kinds, one custom fit for me to use when I was 12
1 Colt 1911
1 Desert Eagle
Police 6-shooter, a couple
2-3 .22 pistols
1-2 Mini 14's
1 Hunting Rifle of some kind
1 Japanese 6-7mm Rifle, maybe 2, one of them was my g'pa's war trophy
1-2 9mm Pistols
1 M-1903
Few other Hunting Rifles

As you can see, it isn't a person you want to run into, he lives in a remote area, he has almost had to use them a few times, I have taken the MAC-90 Deer Hunting before, didn't get anything, just buck-fever :P

He prolly has more or less, he is quite a collector, they are fun to shoot tho.

Most of those gun are illegal in Cali btw.