renegade paintball

[baller489]

what is renegade paintball i have heard of it but i have no idea what it is

[JoshK]

If you are not talking about some team/store i havnt heard of...its basically playing at your friends house, or some other place thats not at a real field.

[alooney11]

I think it is when you play with a couple people in the woods or anywhere, just not at a paintball park.

[JoshK]

I BEAT YOU!!! :p LOL.

[MonsterMag]

you learn something every day :rolleyes:

[xXHavokXx]

.... is hurting the paintball industry.

[MonsterMag]

.... is hurting the paintball industry.

Should we riot? :confused:

[Halliday]

Should we riot? :confused:
The unbeatable high.

[MonsterMag]

fellow balla's unite :hail:

[Creative Mayhem]

Although I will go with what everyone above has said, Smart Parts used to sell paintball colthing under the name Renegade. Some people used to refer to it as Renegade paintball.

[Pacifist_Farmer]

I need to disagree completely...

Renegade...or Rogue Ball, as we always called it...is where Paintabll came from

Saying it hurts the Paintball industry is like saying that people who play basketball in their driveways hurts the NBA, and all of their multimillion dollar athletic merchandizers

[Conversekidz]

But how does it hurt the sport? If you are going to claim that people are injured while playing renegadeball that would be completely assinine of you to say. People get injured at fields all the time, its no different, you still have idiots that take off their mask in the middle of a fire fight, you still have people shooting off their guns in areas that are "no-fire" zones.

If anything "renegade" paintball is better in my opinion. Its hard to find a good place to play woodball, but if you own 200 acres of land then its nice to play on.

There is one thing that I think renegade could harm the sport in, and that is when people go and play in PUBLIC areas, such a public forests and things of that nature. That is just asking for trouble.


I just want to know why it is so wrong to play on your own property if you have it? I know the group that I play with went out and bought a chrono station just so they could make sure they were not shooting hot while they played.

[xXHavokXx]

Renegade hurts the industry as a legitimate industry, here is how:


1. It drives up insurance rates for fields. The owners of two local fields have mentioned this and have been paying costly rate hikes due to it. The reason? Accidents due to renegade paintball are more likely as renegade players often don't use chronos, often have easier mask rules and often play in public areas where spectators can get shot. The more people who can get hurt the higher insurance rates are. The more bad press the sports get the higher inurance gets.

2. Alot of renegade play is played on public land such as parks, forrests, lake areas, creeks, rivers. Here in my area the police have caught onto this area kids play because it has a creek bed hills, lots of cover and now man made bunkers. They got wind because hikers who frequent the area ended up in the crossfire and got shot. They take the kids guns, and take names. If they catch them there again they will arrest them. The fact they don't arrest them on the spot shows their willingness to say " Hey we've been lax on this in the past but now you can't do this."

3. Horrible PR. Working at a store we get semi regular police visits as our customers buy stuff from us then go play on a farmers land or in public property. Sometimes they shoot up signs on the way or do drivebys on other peoples cars. The cops want to know who it was to talk to them and we have to say "Sorry but we cannot be sure of who it was." Besides leaving paintmarkings everywhere renegade players often leave boxes plastic and other mess around. Sometimes farmers don't want kids trampling around in their property. Here most people don't have 300 acre ranches, so they find the next best thing: a farm. recently some of our renegade kids reported hearing shotgun blasts while they were playing around dusk.

4. Relaxed rules, lead to accidents. Often with a group of buddys you aren't as strict as you would be with refs at the field yelling at you about safety. We see kids coming in with welts on their faces, with welts that look like they were were shot with a real gun and by some miracle it magically deflected.Why? They can't afford a chrono. As an example we had a group of guys who decided that snipers should be able to shoot up to 350 FPS to give them extra range. What happens when someone gets close? One of them came in with a massive welt that had torn the skin off his arm.

5. Fields, despite still having safety lapses are a safer environment. Netting, chronos, refs eager to keep their jobs, and owners not wanting to get shut down all work together to make it a safe place to take your kids, and loved ones. While they are flawed they are a safer and more legal way to play.


As a store we have worked to get people out of renegade play y working with local fields to get group rates and have them try the field way. Some catch on and like it better, alot more parents do.

[adt501]

^^^ has a point

an accident will happen eventually, whether at a tournament with an out of control 30 bps electro or in Joe Somebodie's back yard with brass eagle guns and no masks. some horrible accident is bound to happen, only a matter of time

[Conversekidz]

I think another reason why renegade is "taking off" is that it gets expensive playing on fields around here. For Example:

One field near my house, $30 to play for the day. You have to use field paint, which is either $45 or $75 a case. That is a lot of money when you think about it. For rec players who don't care if they have tourny quality paint, they could go down to the local paintball store and get 2000 rounds for $30 or less.

The $30 to play for the day does include unlimited CO2 which is all well and good when you are playing with a gun that can use it, but for guys like me that only run on compressed air its costing us that much more toplay onthe field.


I am just wondering about your first reason listed, it raises rates for fields? why is that? I work in the insurance industry and have no idea why it would raise the rates? Injuries that are not related to the regulated play on a approved field should not dictate the increase of insurance. Using logic like that, it would be like if a race car driver crashed his car on a race track, and because of the accidents that are cause on race tracks it causes everyone that drives a car on the streets insurance to increase.

[Conversekidz]

"3. Horrible PR. Working at a store we get semi regular police visits as our customers buy stuff from us then go play on a farmers land or in public property. Sometimes they shoot up signs on the way or do drivebys on other peoples cars. The cops want to know who it was to talk to them and we have to say "Sorry but we cannot be sure of who it was." Besides leaving paintmarkings everywhere renegade players often leave boxes plastic and other mess around. Sometimes farmers don't want kids trampling around in their property. Here most people don't have 300 acre ranches, so they find the next best thing: a farm. recently some of our renegade kids reported hearing shotgun blasts while they were playing around dusk."

People do this stupid stuff going to approved fields, why do you think its only renegade players that are shooting signs?



Just out of curiousity, have you ever shot your paintball gun off, while not on an approved field?

[xXHavokXx]

On the first reason I listed I got the infor from two separate field owners who said the exact same thing. That is wht they heard from their respective companies or company, I'm not sure if they use the same company or what.

And I have shot my gun off at a place other than the field. Always with a barrel condom. No hopper or no paint unless at the chrono range in the back of the shop with a mask on.


What field do you play at that charges that? So many options here in Nor Cal.

[alooney11]

Speedball is one reason giants like automag and autococker are going to hell. People see electros and have to have them, rather than just playing. Oh by the way renegade paintball started the whole thing, people arent playing for fun anymore.

[zeroack]

Havok lists some very valid points. It's over an hours drive to the nearest field. My "Rogue" fiield dosen't charge, but I make sure everyone is chronoed and everyone knows when and where the fire zones and mask off and barrel condom zones are. Saftey first fun second.

Rogue ball around here has grown 10x what it was. All those new players are buying gear and upgrading markers and shooting paintballs.

That has to be good for the sport.

Zero

[Conversekidz]

Sorry if I came off as trying to knock down what havok was saying, I wasn't intending on doing that. I think I am feeling that "renegade" paintball is getting a bad wrap, its the same thing that happens to any sport, throw in a couple of bad players and then the whole sport is label as a negative. Look at basketball, everyone thinks basketball is full of convics and attackers now because of all the on court fist fights.


I know for my group that plays renegade, we play on private land, that we are allowed to be playing on. We all have our guns cronoed (we play at 280) and there are set rules oh fire zones and things like that.

I actually feel that renegade games with my friends are safer than games that I have played with at local fields
1: Everyone follows the rules to a T, because its a group of friends playing together.
2: Barrel plugs are used at all times when gun is not in play, If i got a dollar for every time I heard a ref yell plug check in the staging area I could have my new angel right now.
3: Lots of noobs play at the local fields, so we have people taking off their masks while they are play, and other things like that. One case in point someone started talking to me, I turned around and there is an unplugged barrel pointing up my mask cause the kid at the field didn't understand the whole concept of barrel plug in the staging area, and point your barrel at the ground.

[MayAMonkeyBeYourPinata]

The fact is if you are playing on your own property, away from any people who might come by its fine.

But most will be playing in some forest preserve, or other enviroment.

And this can lead to accidental shooting of people just walking by, and these shooting go very well lead to serious injury if they shot hit someone in the face.

[Conversekidz]

The fact is if you are playing on your own property, away from any people who might come by its fine.

But most will be playing in some forest preserve, or other enviroment.

And this can lead to accidental shooting of people just walking by, and these shooting go very well lead to serious injury if they shot hit someone in the face.

thats just dumb....playing on property that is not your own.

[xXHavokXx]

thats just dumb....playing on property that is not your own.

I concur.

Where in NorCal do you play CK?

[Conversekidz]

When I played actively, that was in 99 (i've been out of the sport for a while ;) ) I played at Bearcreek paintball, and TAG before it moved. I played from time to time up at Maire sp? Island up in Valleo, but I don't think they are around anymore. Use to play a lot of indoor ball at ActionZone (which is no longer around).

Right now I am playing at RAP, which is close combat indoor ball. You can rent the new Rap4 guns there.

Renegade ball is played in Lodi, or Santa Cruz, but it hasn't happened for a while due to a number of reasons.

[xXHavokXx]

Yeah tiems have changed. Most fields are BYOP and pretty decent prices. If you have a scuba you can get away with 15 bucks for a day of play.

[Conversekidz]

Yea I looked around, It looks like I could play for cheaper. RAP requires you to use their paint, which is lame, but a case is 45, which isn't to bad. once I get use to playing more i will start going out to other fields, I just need to get use to playing again and not getting shot so much :clap:

[SCpoloRicker]

Welcome to AO!

We have a pretty solid group of guys that play together here in Nor-Cal. I'm sure you can find some nice fields to play at. For example, TAGs Hollster field Sunday next week?? I'm half planning, look for a G2G post soon.

By the by, whereabouts in Nor-Cal do you live?

/End hijack

Renegade: I play on private land occasionaly in the Fremont Hills and also * in South S.J.. Fun, but lacking in chrono safety often, and mask/barrel plug standards.

One Exception is pump day at WharfRat and FirePro's hosting. Netting, chronos and plug/mask enforcement.

I'd love to play with players wiling to follow safety rules. In renegade situations, all too often, peoples standards drop.

Ricker

[NewMagMan21]

Well renegade paintball in my opinion great fun and for me a much better way to play. In the 3 yrs I've played paintball (I must confess) I have never played at an actual course. For the first year we played at friends houses and totally unregulated. Then I bought a chrono with my Christmas money and we played at safe speeds but mask rules weren't enforced enough and then I joined a team with some friends and then were taught how to play with a lot more safely. Then our coach had to go to Iraq so we just crack down on our friends for safety.
I live near Portland, Oregon and there are no BYOP courses until you want to drive 200 miles. But the prices are &*%$# insane the cheapest price is $80-90 a case and a $15 feild fee. So for me "Rogue paintball is a much better way to go.

[Rokudon]

you know i swear its called outlaw ball... but i could be wrong... but anyways, i guess if enough safeties were impllemented, it would be somewhat OK, but you'd need some serious safety cover for everyone in the neightborhood that passes by. eventuallly some kids are going to do this and shoot someone's eye out... so if you do play, i'd say, do the best you can to protect the innocent peopel walking by, or this sport's gonna nosedive....

[NewMagMan21]

you know i swear its called outlaw ball... but i could be wrong... but anyways, i guess if enough safeties were impllemented, it would be somewhat OK, but you'd need some serious safety cover for everyone in the neightborhood that passes by. eventuallly some kids are going to do this and shoot someone's eye out... so if you do play, i'd say, do the best you can to protect the innocent peopel walking by, or this sport's gonna nosedive....

I've heard it outlaw ball also.
But we play in a secluded place out in a cleared out patch of wooded area which has been turned into a speedball course. We also have a deadbox which doubles as a safe zone. And we dont tolerate masks off during a time when markers are hot so its pretty well run for an outlaw/ rogue/ renagade paintball ;)

[Conversekidz]

Welcome to AO!

We have a pretty solid group of guys that play together here in Nor-Cal. I'm sure you can find some nice fields to play at. For example, TAGs Hollster field Sunday next week?? I'm half planning, look for a G2G post soon.

By the by, whereabouts in Nor-Cal do you live?

/End hijack

Renegade: I play on private land occasionaly in the Fremont Hills and also * in South S.J.. Fun, but lacking in chrono safety often, and mask/barrel plug standards.

One Exception is pump day at WharfRat and FirePro's hosting. Netting, chronos and plug/mask enforcement.

I'd love to play with players wiling to follow safety rules. In renegade situations, all too often, peoples standards drop.

Ricker

Well if you live in downtown san jose, I pretty much live 5-10 minutes away from you. I am from san jose as well. Actually next sunday we were planning to have an evening game at RAP from 6-10pm, 15 dollars to get in doors, unlimited CO2 and you can bring your own HP fill station. Paint is $45 for house, $75 for tourney level. The games are quick, 5 minutes tops, lost of different senario games played. Its all close combat, so figure 4000sq of play area if that.

[Conversekidz]

Oh and because its close combat, 250 FPS max.

[SCpoloRicker]

RAP website? I'm googling at work, so I'll post it up if I find it...

Your not Adam H by any chance?? This is Rick from Bellarmine.

edit: Real Action Paintball (http://www.rap4.com) No pics of the playing field, though. I may try to drop by sometime after work...

[Conversekidz]

Nope, but I do live near Bellarmine

[SCpoloRicker]

damn CK, you do live right next to me... On Sunol, going towards the arena on Alameda it'd be on your right. Have you played at RAP before? I saw their booth at Night of the Catman, seemed pretty into mil-sim and room-clearing exercises.

You should come over and have a beer sometime :cool:

[Conversekidz]

Damn you are close, I live right next to Bellarmine on Elm St.

[Recon by Fire]

I play both at the fields and outlaw, here are a few comments:

The group that I play outlaw with started playing the fields and have since moved to private outlaw games because the safety is BETTER. Not to mention the poor quality of refs they had the misfortune to encounter. I have personally been shot at the field by a player shooting almost 400 FPS, that has never happened playing outlaw!

Outlaw ball does NOT hurt the industry, that is a crock. If anything it is a strong financial influence in paintball. If the consumer buys paintball products, it helps, period. Store owners benefit from outlaw players while field owners lose. If you are a field owner and local players prefer to play outlaw rather than at your field, better ask yourself what you are doing wrong and fix it :)

Outlaw play does not raise field insurance. Outlaw play is not insured or covered in any way by the insurance companies that insure the fields. Insurance rate increases are caused by policy holder claims and the simple fact that the insurance companies will bleed you dry at any chance given (like just the story of a paintball injury that cost them $0 in claims).

Both places; fields and outlaw, have their places in paintball. Just as woodsball and speedball have their places. It does not matter which you play, just that you do play :)