Mags Banned from NJ Tournaments?

[shartley]

This was posted on another forum, and I find it odd at best.

the saint wrote:
Its funny how mags are not alowed in tornys.mhmmmm gee!!!!

but some how electros made it . if i had my way all speed ball would be pump and know one could cry about fast markers and settings.

No big deal Mags will always have a place in woods and recball.

If I get any classic people I will send them your way.
So I replied with:


shartley wrote:
I think you need to rethink your statement about Mags not being allowed in tournaments, it is not accurate. Not accurate at all.

AGD has had Tournament teams for years, and they have always shot MAGS. And they were not simply “photo op” teams, they actually played in the tournaments.

And he responded with:


the saint wrote:
Wait your right what I should have said was X valves. and R/T's.

Most of those teams used classics or x or e mags. that limmit you to one pull one ball.

I think the X valve is a Great for Woods ball.

So I responded with:


shartley wrote:
I hate to do this again (lol) but I have to….. X valves and R/T’s were never banned from tournament play. In fact, all of AGD’s Tournament teams used X Valves or LX (same thing) in their markers.

I think you are confusing “some” markers with RetroValves and X-Valves being disqualified for tournament play at events because they broke the rules. There are many reasons why any given marker will be turned away at tournaments, and this was not only AGD markers. And some small tournaments which didn’t know what they were talking about have refused AGD RT’s because they thought RT meant Reactive Trigger, which it does not. RT stands for RetroValve.

Can an RT go “reactive”? Sure. If you put in too much pressure it will bounce for you. But that is a setup issue and not a marker issue. And ANY AGD marker with a L7 bolt or newer can be setup to do that, to include E-Mags in manual, X valves, etc.

So I think it is easy to see now that the individual marker which did not meet the tournament requirements/restrictions were not permitted to be used, not the entire series of markers. And again, at the very same tournaments other brands of markers have been turned away for the very same reasons.

I know, it is easy to get confused and get terms and situations mixed up. I hope this clears it up better though.

But he came back with:


the saint wrote:
NO YOU can not use a X valve or r/t in our area for any type of speed ball torny. they dont allow it I dont know what the deal is in other places. but in nj every thing I ever Entered I was Told I could Not Use It the only way was with my Emag that only allowas One shot.
I know How to set them up I am a bio enginer and also a tech.
I dont know what your deal is all of a sudden I have 36 guns and the x valve mag was the only marker I could not use in a torny. I dont know what to tell you?
I realy dont care if you belive me or not Im simply telling you what I have Been Told. I personaly HATE SPEED ball its Not what the sport started as. ONE REASON TOM HAS LEFT.

LONG LIVE THE MAG!!!!!!!!
Now this has been flamed sorry.
So……… Is this true? Do tournaments in NJ ban manual mags without even seeing if they violate the rules? Do they simply look at what type of VALVE you have and disqualify your marker? And are the tournament folks in NJ so ignorant as to not realize that even on an E-Mag you can fire it in 3 different modes and one of them can be made to have bounce?

Any input from NJ players would be appreciated……

[hardr0ck68]

i know he is full of crap....i was for a time sponcered by the nicest field i ever say in NJ (or much else where) PBX and Mel (Ronin on the forums). I was on what started out as an all mag tourny team (we played alot in nj and pa). I can say for sure our markers were more legal than 90% of the timmys we ran into....and never did i see a field try to stop us or them....

[Dayspring]

Your guy is an idiot Sam. Plain and simple.

[Muzikman]

My guess is that this person plays in a local tourney circuit run by one person or field and that this person or field does not understand the difference between Mag RT and Tippmann RT. I have heard about this happening at quite a few different fields and not just in NJ.

[Wc Keep]

never experienced this. the only place i can think of that might be that ignorant might be a demonic run tournament but they are all the way in the boondocks far from civilization.

[Twitch04]

Im a ref at a local field and so i run into a lot of both versions of rt. a lot of rec ball players love to set there trigger to bounce cause they like to use a lot of paint. from what ive been told the former rec ball going tourny players werent changing back to a one full trigger pull per shot and the refs kept have prob's with bounceing so they tried to ban them but when they realized the difference they just got a little stricter on gun checks to make sure that player werent useing an illeagal mode/setting int here tourny's. But it is a common misconception that all mags are banned and they are truly not. also in some of the national circuits they are changeing to a 3 pull full auto mode with a 15 bps limit.

[MonsterMag]

They cant bann emags if you take of the mode selector :D

[Wc Keep]

They cant bann emags if you take of the mode selector :D

yes they can because an emag can still have mechanical bounce.
plus a tourney organizer can ban whatever gun he so feels like.

[MonsterMag]

yes they can because an emag can still have mechanical bounce.
plus a tourney organizer can ban whatever gun he so feels like.

if you take of the sear thingy , and just leave the pluger on it , it cant be put in mech, and if you adjust it , it wont be recative ;)

True they can ban any marker they want , but that would me (Anti Mag) :(

[Wc Keep]

no if a gun can have enough vibration to make the gun fire again when pulled gently its called bounce. nothing you can do can prevent that.except down your bps to 8.

[WenULiVeUdiE]

Never heard of it at any fields I go to. Probably the hicks down in south jersey.

[Muzikman]

The way the HES works it's kinda hard to get bounce. What I noticed with my emag is that if you adjust the trigger that close, the HES get's flacky. It can be done I am sure, but it would take work to do it.

[Wc Keep]

The way the HES works it's kinda hard to get bounce. What I noticed with my emag is that if you adjust the trigger that close, the HES get's flacky. It can be done I am sure, but it would take work to do it.

it was the only way i could shoot my emag fast. and even when it was fast it wasnt reliable.

[punkncat]

There are a few fields here that won't allow the use of an X valve , or RT in tournies. I don't know where the thought comes from , but they say there is an unfair advantage.......HA!

[rabidchihauhau]

maybe its a legacy of the fact that multiple years ago, the NPPL briefly 'banned' the RT valve because of the trigger return. Tom quickly sorted it out with the rules committee - probably by using 'gentle' persuasion.

[shartley]

Thank you all for your input. It verified what I though. This must have been a VERY small tournament at best and not representative of all tournaments in NJ.

But I have now been insulted by this “gentleman” on the other forum for questioning what he said. I should not have expected anything less, if you can’t back up what you say and anyone questions it, insult them….. we all know THAT makes you correct.

Again, thank you for your posts.

[rabidchihauhau]

Shartley,

little ponds, little frogs.

Ever hear how much noise some of those little frogs can make when they're in heat?

[Alpha]

Sounds like a 15 year old fool by his grammar. I've never played tourneys, but I will now with my mag that I just got. Just as soon as I find a team...

I am calling shenanigans on that one.

[Mr. Mouse]

i live in south jersey, any of the places i go to allow mags because im usally the only one on the field with one but i go to the speedball fields and they allow me with mag's, but yea mags can be banned if the guy hosting the tourny doesnt want them but most the time i think there allowed

[billmi]

So……… Is this true? Do tournaments in NJ ban manual mags without even seeing if they violate the rules? Do they simply look at what type of VALVE you have and disqualify your marker? And are the tournament folks in NJ so ignorant as to not realize that even on an E-Mag you can fire it in 3 different modes and one of them can be made to have bounce?

Any input from NJ players would be appreciated……

I've only played in one tournament in NJ, and I used an e-mag. For that matter, almost everyone had 'mags since it was during an AO day event, but regardless, it was a 'mag used in a tournament in NJ.

[Albinonewt]

I haven't seen mags banned in NJ.

I have sometimes seen additional scrutiny, but that's not THAT unusual...

[REDRT]

My Emag almost got it for bounce here in Wisconsin. They said it shoots too fast due to the bounce. I was in mechanical mode chronoing it in. I sweet talked them not to DQ it for the bounce and I assured them it would be in e-mode during the game. Which it was. They did however DQ it because they said it was shooting at 450fps. Pretty absurd, but what ever. So we subbed in a trix with a ramping board that shoots twice as fast with no problems.

[Enemy]

lmao! i love how rts have gotten the knife edge but timmys, dm4s and all those others that bounce like mad get no attention cuz their bounce happens when the play gets fast on the trigger and our bounce is just a sweet spot!! freaking hipocrits!

[White_Noise]

My Emag almost got it for bounce here in Wisconsin. They said it shoots too fast due to the bounce. I was in mechanical mode chronoing it in. I sweet talked them not to DQ it for the bounce and I assured them it would be in e-mode during the game. Which it was. They did however DQ it because they said it was shooting at 450fps. Pretty absurd, but what ever. So we subbed in a trix with a ramping board that shoots twice as fast with no problems.


had pretty much the same thing happen to my emag. they got scared when i chronoed in mech, then swithced to E. then the one ref takes it and checks for bounce, but vibrates his finger on the trigger(moving magnet past HES, hence pulling the trigger) so of course it "bounces". ended up taking 94 points from us in a game we had just won for it, yet it wasnt even the chrono ref nor the head ref that found it, and no other ref could find it. needless to say, i was furious, and then to top it all off, a few of the refs had the nerve to tell me that in order to decrease the bounce i should(and i quote) "file down the on/off pin".....wow, just wow. they claimed that they have owned emags too.....

[Magaman]

Some dude that makes the rules in the area that "Saint" plays in probably got schooled by an AO guy or some other mag owner one day... The Tourney Rule maker guy was probably talking smack and the Mag guy stepped up to the plate and covered the Tourney, "Now Crying Guy," with paint. So now the Tourney Guy blames the Mag for being set up to cheat, because that’s the only way he could have been beat since he had all Dye gear on with his Dye gun...

Just my Psycho-Kinetic-Energy-Brain rambling sporadic thoughts again... :ninja: Don't mind me...

P.S. I “do” like Dye gear...

[Pyrate Jim]

the saint wrote:
Its funny how mags are not alowed in tornys.mhmmmm gee!!!!

the saint wrote:
Most of those teams used classics or x or e mags. that limmit you to one pull one ball.

the saint wrote:
the only way was with my Emag that only allowas One shot.
I know How to set them up I am a bio enginer and also a tech.

Funny how a "bio engineer" can't even spell his own profession....

But it sounds like his complaint is being limited to one-pull-one-ball, not really the fact that it's a 'Mag.

[Adrenaline_Junkie]

I want the link to this convo :D

[shartley]

I want the link to this convo :D
No need…. What there was (aside from his parting post and comments he sent me via e-mail) is already posted here to read.

[50 cal]

I played in a 3 man league. The league director said Mags weren't allowed because of the Reactive trigger. I tried to tell them it wasn't reactive. He stood his ground and said I couldn't use it. I asked him to at least try to get mine to do what he said it did do. He messed with it in the chrono station for half an hour trying to get it to go reactive.
In the end I got to use my RT. :p
He just handed it back and apologized. He said he was given the wrong info by someone else.
At least he admitted it and allowed it. Some people won't even give Mags a chance.

[awwdavy]

I played at Pevs in Leesburg a couple times and ALL THE PLAYERS i asked said that rt/xvalve/retro valves could not be used in tourneys. Even the refs confirmed that. Then I asked the guys at the pro shops and they said it was ok as long as it didnt go reactive. But if i did not look furthur into the matter I would have just thought that all rt mags were not allowed and probably would have spread that incorrect information to other players. Perhaps that is what happened with this guy.

[Twitch04]

lmao! i love how rts have gotten the knife edge but timmys, dm4s and all those others that bounce like mad get no attention cuz their bounce happens when the play gets fast on the trigger and our bounce is just a sweet spot!! freaking hipocrits!

i love how those guns have more ramping boards in them and coming out and yet mags are still on the chopping block for a sweet spot at enemy said here. make them turn there guns down to 15 bps or lower and see how they like it.