Who can flash 4.01 on an Emag?

[Phobos]

Its winter up here in MN so that means upgrade time! Anyone know where I can get 4.01 for my E-mag?

[personman]

No where. :)
Only 3.2

[evildead420]

yep, no one, not AGD certified

[Banshee23]

The 4.x software is not publically available. Only way to get it is to buy a marker that has it installed already. They had some random full auto issues crop up which killed the chance of a public release :(

[yakitori]

I can do it. Send her to me. ;)


j/k.

Ive asked that before too. Miscue was supposedly working on it a while back, but it is never going to be done. Unfortunate too, as loyal as maggers are, we e and x mag owners deserve it.

Maybe we can start a list of E and X mag owners that would like to get this software upgrade, and send it to someone at AGD who may listen to us. :cool:

Or, just get it predatored or morlocked.
:shooting:

[Bad_Dog]

you dont want it...

great fun and fast as heck but definatly not worth the trouble... how would you like to spend hours of tinkering with your setup to go to the field and only have a chance that its legal...? :)

[MindJob]

you dont want it...

great fun and fast as heck but definatly not worth the trouble... how would you like to spend hours of tinkering with your setup to go to the field and only have a chance that its legal...? :)

Yeah, we can fit right in with everyone else. :rofl:

[bunker17]

yeah and update for the emag would be nice

[mcdkid]

there are already MANY threads on this guys. someone was going to make an update, but no news lately. search if u want more info on it.

[Bulldog]

you dont want it...

great fun and fast as heck but definatly not worth the trouble... how would you like to spend hours of tinkering with your setup to go to the field and only have a chance that its legal...? :)

Wow. That bad, huh?

[stop whining buy a mag]

I remember someone previously say they are sick of having "such a capable marker that cannot perform to its fullest because of software."

As all other guns get faster, the E-mags and X-mags just bleed a little more because they can't keep up with the stock board. That's exactly why I ditched mine for a DM4.

[personman]

LOL! Emags cant keep up with the stock board? I think it's the other way around, buddy.

[yakitori]

you just had to rub it in didnt you titansu :p

[stop whining buy a mag]

I meant it as the Emag with just the stock board and 3.2 can't keep up with other high end guns out there.

[Titansu]

you just had to rub it in didnt you titansu :p

:D

[RRfireblade]

When you come to your senses and want 3.2, give me shout. ;)

[RogueFactoryKid]

This is the closest you're gonna get... unless you buy my Emag.

Click and have fun...

http://www.minneci.net/paintball/sale/images/images_tn/TN_EMAG21.jpg (http://www.minneci.net/paintball/sale/videos/AGD_4.01.avi)


GRRRRR, I want my Emag to say cool stuff when i turn it on. Like "i love it when you turn me on". Or "Shoot Me Faster" or maybe even "Cheater Board Activated" just to mess with the refs :p

[Titansu]

GRRRRR, I want my Emag to say cool stuff when i turn it on. Like "i love it when you turn me on". Or "Shoot Me Faster" or maybe even "Cheater Board Activated" just to mess with the refs :p

Yeah, I wanted "ANAL JUSTICE"....

[MindJob]

I remember someone previously say they are sick of having "such a capable marker that cannot perform to its fullest because of software."




WoooHOOOO!!! That was me that said that! Someone reads my posts!!! :wow: :wow:

[JRingold]

Its winter up here in MN so that means upgrade time! Anyone know where I can get 4.01 for my E-mag?

Tell me about it... The current Temperature = -11F. Expected high tomorrow = -5F. Chance that CO2 will work = 0. Indoor ball sucks here too.

Is there any chance that since eMags and xMags aren't in production anymore, that there wold be a release of an API for them for us geeks? Or does one already exist?

[Enemy]

misque made a post bout how to write your own or basicall he said that if you dont know how you would go about doing it then odds are you dont know how to write ie.. also he finished 4.01 and its now 4.2 problem is there is no plans on releasing this software so dont ask he wont even take bribes!! im sorry but this is what you get when you have a company that cares more about saftey then profit!!

[TheTramp]

im sorry but this is what you get when you have a company that cares more about saftey then profit!!

I think the lack of "4.whatever" software really has more to do with not spending $ on an out of production system than saftey.

[Enemy]

theres no money to spend miscue wrote the software thats the biggest cost that agd would have to occur.. 4.0, 4.01 both had f/a issues thats why we dont see them 4.2 was miscue finishing something he started!! agd messed up when they outsourced for 3.2 and then miscue came out with q1.1 which eclipsed 3.2 but agd didnt do the switch because they had just released 3.2!!!!!!!!!

[JRingold]

Since it may be expensive for one company to maintain it, why not open it up to the development community as open source? Then we can get some adidtional free programmers to take on the effort. There are many programmers out there that probably wouldn't have a problem with understanding the syntax, however I'd be willing to bet that they also don't have the necessary additional parts to use for test purposes. Knowing the right parts would make things a lot easier and faster. It really can't be that difficult of a system, if you have the right parts with which to interface to it.

[Muzikman]

The problem is with open source, AGD could still be liable if someone should get hurt. If people really want new software, get a new board. There are problems with the newer software. It has nothing to do with money persay, but the short coming and issues with the design. These were not known issues until the software got faster.

[evo.end3R]

you dont want it...

great fun and fast as heck but definatly not worth the trouble... how would you like to spend hours of tinkering with your setup to go to the field and only have a chance that its legal...? :)

just about every gun at the field now adays is illegal, except for cockers still. everything else- dm3/4/5, shocker, nerve, imp,timmies, all have either a team NXL board or cheater/ramping board here.

[Dayspring]

4.2 doesn't resolve stuff either. My gun will STILL go nuts on the lower DB settings. I have to run it on DB 10 which is the equivalent of 3.2.

And I've gone through EVERY incarnation of 4.x.

[phantomhitman]

um, cockers bounce a little....just a little..... ;)
there are also ways to cheat with eblades, and it is not through software either.

[Creative Mayhem]

4.2 doesn't resolve stuff either. My gun will STILL go nuts on the lower DB settings.

Suckah!!! Mine works fine ;) :headbang:

[skife]

misque made a post bout how to write your own or basicall he said that if you dont know how you would go about doing it then odds are you dont know how to write ie.. also he finished 4.01 and its now 4.2 problem is there is no plans on releasing this software so dont ask he wont even take bribes!! im sorry but this is what you get when you have a company that cares more about saftey then profit!!


anyone can be bought.... it just matters if the price is right.

[tyrion2323]

Just buy a Predator II board and have Logic install it.

[JRingold]

The problem is with open source, AGD could still be liable if someone should get hurt. If people really want new software, get a new board. There are problems with the newer software. It has nothing to do with money persay, but the short coming and issues with the design. These were not known issues until the software got faster.

So something in the 8-bit microprocessor wasn't able to handle the load that the firmware was running it... Hmmm... I guess I may have to study the three pdf's and break back into my former geek status... I guess AGD wouldn't necessarily be liable, but the persons responsible for the modification of the firmware. I guess I will have to wait until I can get my own eMag or xMag to play further...

[evo.end3R]

um, cockers bounce a little....just a little..... ;)
there are also ways to cheat with eblades, and it is not through software either.

notice how i said E2, e1's bounce like banshees, e2's take some damn good still to be good with.

[Muzikman]

So something in the 8-bit microprocessor wasn't able to handle the load that the firmware was running it... Hmmm... I guess I may have to study the three pdf's and break back into my former geek status... I guess AGD wouldn't necessarily be liable, but the persons responsible for the modification of the firmware. I guess I will have to wait until I can get my own eMag or xMag to play further...


Thje problem is not a software one, it's a hardware problem with the HES.

[phantomhitman]

just about every gun at the field now adays is illegal, except for cockers still.

um, wher edid you say e2? also, e2s can bounce if they want, and people like the play bouncy at rec fields unfortunately. that tt software takes a few minutes to setup to not bounce also. that is not the point here though.

the reason i never bought, or was interested in, the e or x mags was the trigger system. everyone complains that they are slow, clunky, and as people in this thread obviously know-unreliable at fast settings. i say predator it, and forget the software updates.

[GT]

The problem is with open source, AGD could still be liable if someone should get hurt.


Kinda skewed logic,
Who else is liable really? Maybe the company that makes the loader that feeds the gun paint or the comapny that supplies the gun with air? How would installing a board not make AGD liable yet someone who creates there own software, inturn, makes AGD liable.

AGD has used the safety issue to skirt the issue in the past. If it was that big of an issue Pride wouldn't be using it would they?


Thje problem is not a software one, it's a hardware problem with the HES.

If that were true then how come there isnt a problem with the morlock or pred'ed e/xmags?

No offense to Miscue, but I think this was his first big programming project. brians a great guy, I meet him a txball, but I am not sure if he was most qualified to write the code. Whether this is true or not, the biggest issue I see is that AGD farmed out 3.2, then 'scue (another out of house guy), wrote somemore code. Sounds like we need someone familiar with the HES switch to write a more comptent code, again if that is even the issue.

We will see as more e's are pred'ed out.

-gt

[evo.end3R]

also, e2s can bounce if they want, and people like the play bouncy at rec fields unfortunately.


i wouldnt know, i dont play at rec fields. the guys i play with (detroit strange, docs, avalanche, fem fetales, VL allstars, Treasure Coast Kids, Legit, list goes on) all have nxl boards or some type of cheater board, just suck it up, it makes you better in the long run to play agianst cheaters than to play against n9bs.

[Muzikman]

Kinda skewed logic,
Who else is liable really? Maybe the company that makes the loader that feeds the gun paint or the comapny that supplies the gun with air? How would installing a board not make AGD liable yet someone who creates there own software, inturn, makes AGD liable.

AGD has used the safety issue to skirt the issue in the past. If it was that big of an issue Pride wouldn't be using it would they?

If AGD was to release the code, that could make them liable. And sure, if someone really wanted to they could go after the tank mfg, loader mfg, etc. This happened years ago to Tippmann for their ASA necks. Someone got sued (was it AGD?) and they turned and sued Tippmann because without their tanks, the gun would not work.




If that were true then how come there isnt a problem with the morlock or pred'ed e/xmags?

No offense to Miscue, but I think this was his first big programming project. brians a great guy, I meet him a txball, but I am not sure if he was most qualified to write the code. Whether this is true or not, the biggest issue I see is that AGD farmed out 3.2, then 'scue (another out of house guy), wrote somemore code. Sounds like we need someone familiar with the HES switch to write a more comptent code, again if that is even the issue.

We will see as more e's are pred'ed out.

-gt

Well, that is not true. If you remember correctly, the 3.2 software had similar issues too. They just found some off the wall hack to make it work. The flaw is not software, it is the way the HES works, plain and simple. It might just be the way the HES works with the stock board, but it is still a HES issue.

[Vanced]

To Quote Miscue Talking about 4.x in a Video Zak did....


This vid is great for performance demo:

http://homepage.mac.com/zvetter/.Movies/SFL%204.0%20Testing.mov

I'm quite fond of it Zak... did a good job.

I suppose it's kinda cruel... to show hungry people the cake we're eating... and you can't have. :D Sorry!

Tastes like... honey.

And people wonder why we keep asking this question about wanting 4.2 or 4.X?

But we won't get it... Even though Miscue is for the most part satisfied with 4.2 but AGD is not and will not take the needed steps legally and finically to release it ... I guess we have to learn to accept it...


... The only ones with the ability to flash that are Tom Kaye, myself, Kayle, Rob, and Jason (Tato). If one of them has been distributing it, then it's a breech of trust issue- but I doubt that has happened...

Safety argument has little weight???? I wrote the freakin thing, what makes you think I don't understand the situation better than you? You have no idea what is going on....

....There's just endless... endless crap.

IF you want to know more... just do a search on 4.0 the information is out there... IN DETAIL... Oh looky here I did it for you, you are welcome... ;)

http://www.automags.org/forums/search.php?searchid=320105

If you want to do more... start raising money to donate to AGD... it was said everyone has a price... if you want to take on the finical responsiblity for it... I am sure it could probably be arranged... bring a lawyer and a checkbook...

Or just pray, get a lucky charm, and bring a case of booze to IAO and try to bribe the weak link....Miscue... :rolleyes:

http://www.automags.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=69221&stc=1

Sorry about that... just a little tired of seeing this thread AGAIN... with no new news... as much as I might want to see it...

[GT]

if you want to take on the finical responsiblity for it... I am sure it could probably be arranged... bring a lawyer and a checkbook...

This is so bogus,
Does Ao really buy into this crap? How about when the RT came out, shorten the on/off pin, increase the input and you have a gun that dam near goes full auto, and it does it very very well. You cant honestly tell me that the reason 4.X wasnt distrubted because of money or increased liability. This excuse is just utter trash.


If you want to do more... start raising money to donate to AGD... it was said everyone has a price...

This to is complete BS. How many mags are out there?


[QUOTE=AGD]We have produced over 100,000 guns in total. Mel you need to call me.

AGD has been making the same valve for about 15 years now, with minor changes. Lets say a truly conseravitive number of 150 profit per gun at whole sale, remeber how much mags cost at the height of thier popularity. Honestly I think the number is triple or quadriple that but whatever.....

150 profit per gun X 100,000= about 15 mill over the past 10~15 years. This is only guns and not all the other pb stuff they made or thier military contracts. To say AGD is hurting is an interpration at best.

[Muzikman]

I highly doubt AGD made $150 per gun sold. I would love to know where you got those numbers. Remember, R&D costs lots of money. The material they made mags out of are not cheap in raw state and are not cheap to machine. A mag cost $500 back in the mid 90's for a reason.

[GT]

I highly doubt AGD made $150 per gun sold. I would love to know where you got those numbers. Remember, R&D costs lots of money. The material they made mags out of are not cheap in raw state and are not cheap to machine. A mag cost $500 back in the mid 90's for a reason.

come on man,
how much do they sell Xvalves for at events? 180~225. And they sell them new in the store for 325 or 300 pbgear. I'd be hard pressed not to believe they dont make 100~150 per gun.

[Enemy]

well the biggest thing here is the fact that there is better out there!!! this endless endless crap is getting to be taxing why can we just get the best thats what agd had been about always having the best!! im sick of this crap!!!

[bunker17]

I just wish i had time to make this type of project of making a new software for current mags

[Muzikman]

You have that wrong. There is not "Better" there is just "Faster". In the minds of a lot of people the two are NOT the same.

[Miscue]

So something in the 8-bit microprocessor wasn't able to handle the load that the firmware was running it... Hmmm... I guess I may have to study the three pdf's and break back into my former geek status... I guess AGD wouldn't necessarily be liable, but the persons responsible for the modification of the firmware. I guess I will have to wait until I can get my own eMag or xMag to play further...

This is complete nonsense.

[Miscue]

Kinda skewed logic,
Who else is liable really? Maybe the company that makes the loader that feeds the gun paint or the comapny that supplies the gun with air? How would installing a board not make AGD liable yet someone who creates there own software, inturn, makes AGD liable.

AGD has used the safety issue to skirt the issue in the past. If it was that big of an issue Pride wouldn't be using it would they?



If that were true then how come there isnt a problem with the morlock or pred'ed e/xmags?

No offense to Miscue, but I think this was his first big programming project. brians a great guy, I meet him a txball, but I am not sure if he was most qualified to write the code. Whether this is true or not, the biggest issue I see is that AGD farmed out 3.2, then 'scue (another out of house guy), wrote somemore code. Sounds like we need someone familiar with the HES switch to write a more comptent code, again if that is even the issue.

We will see as more e's are pred'ed out.

-gt

You are not qualified to make judgements about my qualifications.

"More competent code." I cannot express how much this pisses me off. You are trashing my work that you know nothing about.

[Muzikman]

'que is as qualified to write code for an emag as a microsoft programmer is to write windows. Actually, probably more so.

[Miscue]

'que is as qualified to write code for an emag as a microsoft programmer is to write windows. Actually, probably more so.

I don't think I like that parallel at all! :p But thanks.

[GT]

You are not qualified to make judgements about my qualifications.

"More competent code." I cannot express how much this pisses me off. You are trashing my work that you know nothing about.


Dont take it that because that is not what I meant. I also think I am more than comptent to make comments about "your work." as I use a 3.2 emag often. If you havnt noticed so have others. Maybe I can drive a point that I dont want to make. If the largest complaint about the emag is its software, who's fault is that? I know you make some great software, 4.X, so the blame isnt yours rather AGD's reluctance to release it.

I have also read posts, that you posted, that working on the emag software was what intrested you in programming. What that tells me is the emag was one of the first pb related software projects you have worked on.

Lets go back to the issue at hand before people get their pride stepped on.

[Muzikman]

Dont take it that because that is not what I meant. I also think I am more than comptent to make comments about "your work." as I use a 3.2 emag often. If you havnt noticed so have others. Maybe I can drive a point that I dont want to make. If the largest complaint about the emag is its software, who's fault is that? I know you make some great software, 4.X, so the blame isnt yours rather AGD's reluctance to release it.

I have also read posts, that you posted, that working on the emag software was what intrested you in programming. What that tells me is the emag was one of the first pb related software projects you have worked on.

Lets go back to the issue at hand before people get their pride stepped on.


Umm...If I am not mistaken it was the other way around. He knew ASM and decided to try to write code for the gun to give hims something to do in his spare time. I could be wrong, but he did graduate in a Comp Sci degree.

[GT]

Umm...If I am not mistaken it was the other way around. He knew ASM and decided to try to write code for the gun to give hims something to do in his spare time. I could be wrong, but he did graduate in a Comp Sci degree.

this is going to turn into a miscue v gt thing which was not my intent. If there are any glaring issues that need to be resolved then the PM button should be used. Although this little bit of info you provided is kinda strange....

[Muzikman]

Well, you basically said publicly that Miscue has no clue what he is doing and should not be writing code for an emag (or any other software for that matter). I have no problems with you, but if you make statements like that, then you need to be rebutted. If this is not what you ment by what you said, maybe you should change your words as that is what it comes off as saying.

[Miscue]

Umm...If I am not mistaken it was the other way around. He knew ASM and decided to try to write code for the gun to give hims something to do in his spare time. I could be wrong, but he did graduate in a Comp Sci degree.

Correct. I learned almost nothing about programming from working on this - it truly is a trivial program in my opinion. The only thing remotely novel about it, is what it does in the amount of space.

Getting my CS degree took something I enjoyed, and made me hate it. I had nearly forgotten that I used to like doing it. The EMag software was the first "fun" software that I had made in a long time. That's what sparked the new interest that I mentioned.

[JRingold]

This is complete nonsense.

Yeah, I agree.

Here's my question; everyone says "we want 4.x". But really does anyone really know what that means? I guess my question is, what do you the user feel is "wrong" with 3.2? Or is it just that you know there is a non-released 4.x something out there so you want it?

[RRfireblade]

Yeah, I agree.

Here's my question; everyone says "we want 4.x". But really does anyone really know what that means? I guess my question is, what do you the user feel is "wrong" with 3.2? Or is it just that you know there is a non-released 4.x something out there so you want it?

IMO, there is absolutely nothing wrong with 3.2. I can easily take it right to the limits of my ability to pull trigger,just as on any other 'legally' set up marker I own...and I own ALOT of electronic markers. Most of which are very inclined to 'improve' on my ability if not carefully set up. ;)

Any software that would be considered 'faster' than 3.2, has to be either clearly illegal or possibly,as I suspect 4.xx is..and with NO disrespect to Miscue... just over the line. I've seen people who've never broken 15bps in their life on ANY other marker take 4.xx into areas they've only dreamed about. :D Both in person and in vids posted on the net. It's also apparent to me after analyzing some of those vids myself, that the ROF counter does 'not' represent actual fired shots...what ever that reason may be.Whether or not it has any relation to actual trigger pulls, I have no idea of knowing or any way of verifying so I'll just have to assume probably not.

But...as with everything else...many people want what they can't have. Even if that sometimes means a higher ROF. :p

[bunker17]

pretty much i think what most people find wrong about 3.2 its that it doesn't have adebounce levels and 3.2 can only do like 20 in the electric mode or something like that. Icould be wrong

[GT]

Well, you basically said publicly that Miscue has no clue what he is doing and should not be writing code for an emag (or any other software for that matter). I have no problems with you, but if you make statements like that, then you need to be rebutted. If this is not what you ment by what you said, maybe you should change your words as that is what it comes off as saying.

If 3.2 is fine then why develop a new version? How many people are happy with thier 3.2? How many people have bought an emag and bought something else because it was faster?

[Muzikman]

First off what does that have to do with what you quoted me on. My feeling is that 3.2 is good enough, but for many of the people out there that need faster to keep up with the Jones, then they will go buy the gun that ramps and shoots 30bps when you pull the trigger 10.

And people do not understand "debounce" they think debounce is ramping, and it is not. Debounce is designed to take away (or allow) trigger bounce.

Debounce != shot buffering

[hitech]

I've used both, 3.2 and 4.x. Both had the bounce issue with the HES. This issue showed up in 3.2 because of shot buffering. It was possibly more pronounced in 4.x because the code was tighter (taking less time between detecting a trigger pull and firing. Maybe not. I have seen either source, so I'm guessing. However, I did converse with Miscue about the code and as a software engineer I am confident that he was very capable. It's pretty simple code, but even simple code can be done poorly. ;)

Muz, yeah, it's amazing how little most people understand about how an electronic marker works. They need to read Bill's article! ;)

[REDRT]

If 3.2 is fine then why develop a new version? How many people are happy with thier 3.2? How many people have bought an emag and bought something else because it was faster?

I agree. The only thing wrong with my Emag is 3.2 software. Quicker and more consistant would make the Emag supreme once again. Lets skip 4.whatever and go to 5.0. No use even releasing the 4.0 cause it is so far out of date it isn't funny. R&D time around here is putting money in the compatitions pockets.

[GT]

R&D time around here is putting money in the compatitions pockets.


Dam good quote!