Cocker Users

[Carbon Blue]

Ive got a question. My friend recently acquired a nightkast and had a shop install a nexus ram with 2 eclipse qevs.It seemed that the back block was scratching up the anno towards the part where the back block and body meet. So he brought it back and the guy working at the shop messed around with the pump rod (rod that connects to the ram) and now the back block has no play at all. Before we brought the marker in the ram had about 3 threads showing and the back block had about 2 threads showing. After picking up the gun the ram has 0 threads showing and about 4 threads showing in the back block. The back block has no play at all. Is this okay for the ram because when we tried returning the ram to its original specs ( 3 threads showing in the ram and 2 threads in the back block) and aired up the gun for some reason it went back to 0 threads in the ram and 4 threads in the back. Its as if the pump rod was forced into a few more grooves? Should their be play in the back block? should it be scratching up the body? the worker said everything was fine.

[Igotu]

there supposed to be small amount of space between the backblock and body and if their isnt its been know to strip the rams or cocking arms threads. I hope thats not what happened to your's.

[PBX Ronin 23]

From the sounds of it, the pump rod wasn't adequate secure on the ram. The ram shaft has to be screwed all the way in on the pump rod. I usually put a little bit of blue loctite on the last 2 threads for additional security.

The ideal position of the back block is for it to literally just touch the back of the body. Unfortunately, things just don't line up that perfectly most of the time. The next best thing is for back block to be turned into the proper position with just a tad after it touches the body. There should be no noticeable gap between the body and the back block.

The relative positioning of the threads is inconsequential since it sounds like he screwed the ram shaft onto the pump rod all the way in. Which is the proper way to do it.

BTW, where was the body being scratched? Is it on the back end of the groove where the pump rod resides in right next to the back block? If that was the case, the thread on the back end of the pump rod might be the culprit which means that your front block and you back block are misaligned.

[Kullervo]

I disagree with the backblock placement.
not only will having the back block touching the back of the body cause exess wear but also unessisary noise when that back block keeps slamming the body.
Ideal placment of the back block is just a hair off the body.
screw the pump arm in till the back block touches the body then back off one turn.

[Carbon Blue]

thanks for all the replies. Have any of you guys tried the CCM straight pump arm? did it make that much of a difference?

Do any of you guys know if this slik edge bolt will work with my dye reflex?
http://www.autocockerhq.com/store/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=13&products_id=217

[Kullervo]

Note: This bolt is only for "P" block, Evolution and Free Flow Lotus Cockers.

seems to imply it

[Carbon Blue]

ya i saw that but i was just thinking that since the reflex is a pblock that maybe it just might work thanks! :)

[phantomhitman]

cockers are born evil, they will never work and will break down on you when you need them the most ;)
i bless your cocker and hope it works for you or your friend. make sure the back block is not slamming into the back of the body, i seen someone adjust the backblock too tight which ended up stripping out the the hole on the backblock because it kept slamming into the body and eventually the cocking rod pulled through the backblock.

[RRfireblade]

I disagree with the backblock placement.
not only will having the back block touching the back of the body cause exess wear but also unessisary noise when that back block keeps slamming the body.
Ideal placment of the back block is just a hair off the body.
screw the pump arm in till the back block touches the body then back off one turn.


Sorry Ronin but....

This is the correct back block set up. You do NOT want the back block hitting the body be what acts as the 'stop' for the Ram.There must be a approximately enough space to slide a peice of paper between the back block and the body when the Ram is gased and under pressure.

[PBX Ronin 23]

One thing about Cockers is that there are so many different ways to approach it. In some regards, you're right because by giving that tiny bit of slack in the back block placement, you lessen the stress on your Ram internals.

On the other hand, the bolt's input hole alignment to the air passage port from the valve is based on the bolt positioned with the back block that's flush to the body. Hence moving it back even by just a little bit will restrict the flow by decreasing the internal diameter that the transiting air must pass through. This becomes critical if the inlet hole is the same diameter as the air passage port.

If you're timing your Cocker aggressively, then you really should maximize the size of the orifice by ensuring that it is at it's most opened position when the gun is fired.

Keith Belsy does it this way in the Evolution except that the ram isn't stressed because of it's perfect placement. Doing this and burning incense while chanting some Tibetan meditational stuff gives his cockers that magical feel and performance...... ;)

[tippmannsniper-]

dont take it to your shop next time

just take out the bolt and cocking rod and hold on to the the ram rod and just twist your back block counterclockwise and put the bolt and cocking rod back in

just read the manual

[RRfireblade]

.

On the other hand, the bolt's input hole alignment to the air passage port from the valve is based on the bolt positioned with the back block that's flush to the body. Hence moving it back even by just a little bit will restrict the flow by decreasing the internal diameter that the transiting air must pass through. This becomes critical if the inlet hole is the same diameter as the air passage port.



Speaking only of WGP Cockers, I can say that that is not an issue. The valve exhaust port is smaller than the transfer port in the bolt. IIRC, the exhaust port on the stock valve is right around .250 +/- and the stock bolt's transfer port is like .300,.310 or so. Plenty of room to allow for the proper back block set up. :) And purposely done so.

:)