Gas Raped

[M-a-s-sDriver]

:cry: Welcome to San Francisco.

Corner of 19th and Junipero Serra.
Brent.

[dj89]

Just put 20 in my truck and almost got a 1/2 tank :(

[BD_Paintball]

wow thats bad, its 2.20 here in IL

[Alley]

I just paid 2.09 in PA...it jumped to 2.15 on Friday..... 25 to fill up my tank ...but, I only have a cavalier :)! Glad I dont live in CA with good ole' gov schwarzenegger (sp) :clap:

[Teamslayer76]

HOLY :cuss: :cuss: :cuss:

Thats alot!

Here in Engelwood [SW Florida] gas is around $2.40 a gallon. I might have to sell some guns to do this. My $9.60 hour wage isnt cutting it here.

[-=Squid=-]

$1.69 at the place here.

Owned.

[CaptaiN_JacK]

That's what you get for having such a high minimum wage you bastards!

I almost pissed my pants when I saw how much I spent on gas last month. I honestly considered riding the hour long bus ride to and from school from now on, but decided against it when i realized how early it would pick me up.

[gamarada717]

Yeah, it's like 1.80 something here last time I checked. Living in Arkansas rules.

[M-a-s-sDriver]

My beast. One 15 gallon tank, One 17gallon.
Cost me 80 bucks in diesel the other day.
20 bucks gets me 1/2 a tank.
Brent.

[Maggot6]

My 75 cent gas here in canada is being considered expensive (of course, not measured the same) :ninja:

[JoeyBear]

Was in Milwaukee today and gas was $2.31 a gallon. :tard: I'm getting tired of this crap :cuss:

[master_alexander]

i am in texas, 14 and will be driving next year and want a truck... i hope i can still play paintball... poop...

then again the high school is right across the street :)

[tony3]

wow thats bad, its 2.20 here in IL

Where the hell are you buying gas, its like 2.30-2.40 atleast by me.

[BD_Paintball]

Where the hell are you buying gas, its like 2.30-2.40 atleast by me.
on the corner of 45 and Gages lake road

[ojhspyro89]

Wed it was 1.99. I was freaking out. But then 2 days later it surprisingly was up to 2.33 or something. i dont drive yet but i still know the gas prices today. 3 dolalrs is the most ive seen for a long time.

[billybob_81067]

My beast. One 15 gallon tank, One 17gallon.
Cost me 80 bucks in diesel the other day.
20 bucks gets me 1/2 a tank.
Brent.

Heck yeah!!! I've got a 95 powerstroke. At least they're pretty good on fuel eh? And actually if you fill them both up completely full they'll hold a little over 40 gallons total. :)

WOOT... I'm glad I don't pay for my fuel! :cool: :ninja: :D

[Ov3rmind]

I don't think gas prices are nearly high enough.

[undescriptive]

instead of complaining about the high prices, get a smaller engined and lighter Vehicle!

who in their right mind needs a V8 4+ L block that can move the 2.5 ton truck, when you could get a 2L,1 ton truck that will do JUST THE SAME!

Buy a mini or something....

260 miles to a tank... $10 to fill it...(if that)

[Bear_Claw]

Well see some of us USE these kinda trucks. I doquite a bit of sidee work and some coustomizing and am working on starting like a weekend coustom shop. Current projects on the go are:

Mini Motorcycle for a Compition next month (race)
Coustom Bike For my mother (yeah she rides)
Diesel motorcycle building with my bro
and Eventually Build myself a bike.

So i do ALOT of parts runs and alot of the stuff i geting is HEAVY (the diesel engine and trans for my bros bike weeighs in at 800+ pounds) A smaller truck would have had some troubles with that let alone all the other stuff in the truck (tools other parts and soo on).

So when Fuel prices starts takeing a LARG chunck out of my profits from the way i make my LIVING i gona complain.

For a dail driver I DO own a car a 1987 VW Golf Diesel but it just cant suffice what i NEED the truck for.

My trucks a early 1994 F250 XLT 2wd Ex Cab Diesel (7.3 IDI TURBO Ie non powerstroke). Gets me 17-18mpg and cost me around $90cdn to fill it. Diesel here is 83.9/liter

Heres a pic of mine together
http://www.hunt101.com/img/273615.jpg

P.S. Lets see a 2.0L ANYTHING huall 3000lbs up a 6% grade. The f250 does this with out even breaking a weat. a 2.0L Minipickup would DIE trying as this hill in mention is 3kms LONG. Heck the trucks temp gauge dont even get past the N for normal lol.

[Lohman446]

instead of complaining about the high prices, get a smaller engined and lighter Vehicle!

who in their right mind needs a V8 4+ L block that can move the 2.5 ton truck, when you could get a 2L,1 ton truck that will do JUST THE SAME!

Buy a mini or something....

260 miles to a tank... $10 to fill it...(if that)


Curious.. what 2L mini truck gets 40+ MPG? Or are we talking a Cooper Mini - which I still don't think gets 40+ MPG

[Lohman446]

Living in Arkansas rules.


Except for the living in Arkansas part :D

[M-a-s-sDriver]

I would love to see 2 liters and 2000 lbs pull my 3-horse Logan over Donner summit without turning to molten slag.
Diesel is your best alternative for power and mileage available.
I've put a high-flow exhaust, larger garret turbo and Superchip program in this one, makes about 320 horses and over 600 lb. ft. of torque, AND gets 17 mpg.
NOTHING small or midsize comes close. Those trucks work well for people like my carpenters who commute a ways, carry a few things like their tools and thier dog, but they still only get about 20 mpg. Try and tow anything with it and the wind knocks them around like a paper cup.
Brent.

[SlipknotX556]

Cost me 20 bucks to fill my tank from 3/4 empty. A full tank will last me a week and a half. Love my neon :).

[dj89]

Wish I got a bigger truck but they just cost to much, when i'm pulling 4 + tons up a hill its not a nice thing to see.

[bam wannabe]

Except for the living in Arkansas part :D


:rofl:

[Bear_Claw]

I think i got every one beat milage wise here with my Daily Driver.

The volkswagen goes for 650kms (403miles) on only 40l (10 gallons) of fuel. It averages me 2 weeks at 45mpg all city driving. :bounce: Gotta love a TINY diesel engine in a small car. Heck my cars ANCIET too boot 1987 VW Golf Diesel

But as i said i NEED my truck on the weekends and it gets expensive to run it. :mad:

[billybob_81067]

I would love to see 2 liters and 2000 lbs pull my 3-horse Logan over Donner summit without turning to molten slag.
Diesel is your best alternative for power and mileage available.
I've put a high-flow exhaust, larger garret turbo and Superchip program in this one, makes about 320 horses and over 600 lb. ft. of torque, AND gets 17 mpg.
NOTHING small or midsize comes close. Those trucks work well for people like my carpenters who commute a ways, carry a few things like their tools and thier dog, but they still only get about 20 mpg. Try and tow anything with it and the wind knocks them around like a paper cup.
Brent.

Hey Brent... are you on thedieselstop.com ? If not you should check it out! :cool:

[AGD202]

this gas price stuff does suck..... its 2.05 here... and i never thought i would see the day saying 2.05 was really cheap

[Maggot6]

Whenever I buy a car, I am probably going to get the smallest car that runs on desiel(sp)...
I wont complain :p

[grw4w34]

Im probably going to trade my truck in for a small car. Gas is up in the $2.70s here but seems to have gone down a little bit over the past couple weeks. Im not going to be surprised to see $3.00 here though.

[warpspyder]

Well you all know who you can thank for this problem. Let's think... What's changed in the last 5 years roughly. Hmmm. Now of those things that have changed which one of them have Saudi oil money to thank for every one of their successful business ventures? Do I need to spell this out? :mad:

Sorry I just get mad sometimes.

[Igotu]

Siphon gas!!!! :spit_take

[toolfan62]

holy crap thats high..its about 2.55 here

[cockerkiller68]

Yeah forget that!! Last time I was in Frisco I almost ran out of gas!! I said forget them, I put like $5 in my tank...enough to get me back to Fremont and put in our cheap $2.79/gal gas. :mad:

I H8 CA!!!

[M-a-s-sDriver]

Let's see... In the last 5 years we were lucky enough to elect a president with the sand to attack and conquer several terrorists infested countries that threatened this country,
Also in the last 5 years we had over three thousand souls killed after attacking not only the very symbol of financial America but our FOREMOST MILITARY INSTALLATION.
Hopefully Saudi Arabia is next to get straitened out by the appropriate means.
Want lower gas? Start by removing liberal enviromentalists from power and allow us to build more refinaries, and drill for domestic oil.
That's a start.
By the way, I work in SF, but live in Yuba City, where Premium sits at about 2.50 right now.
SF has to have thier own special blend to meet air quality standards, and the summer blend is about to be mandated...get ready Frisco.
Brent.

[Vex]

Yeah, it's like 1.80 something here last time I checked. Living in Arkansas rules.
Where the HELL in Arkansas are you?? The cheapest I've seen it is $2.09 in Jacksonville.

Oh yeah, and living in Arkansas only rules if you're from Arkansas. If you've ever lived in a real state, you'd know how much living in Arkansas sucks!
And the Razorbacks suck! :headbang:

[txaggie08]

1.98 here, but then again i live thirty minutes from a plant that produces a percentage(i beleive in the double digits) of the nations gas....... it has hit like 2.30 something.


like i told a friend the other day, if we went to war for oil like everyone says, we got screwed.......

[txaggie08]

Well you all know who you can thank for this problem. Let's think... What's changed in the last 5 years roughly. Hmmm. Now of those things that have changed which one of them have Saudi oil money to thank for every one of their successful business ventures? Do I need to spell this out? :mad:

Sorry I just get mad sometimes.


who to blame? CLinton for letting the liberals shut oil refineries down and jack EPA requirments up to ungodly standards. want proof, ill introduce you to the THOUSANDS that got laid off in this part of texas thanks to that..........

[cockerkiller68]

Let's see... In the last 5 years we were lucky enough to elect a president with the sand to attack and conquer several terrorists infested countries that threatened this country,
Also in the last 5 years we had over three thousand souls killed after attacking not only the very symbol of financial America but our FOREMOST MILITARY INSTALLATION.
Hopefully Saudi Arabia is next to get straitened out by the appropriate means.
Want lower gas? Start by removing liberal enviromentalists from power and allow us to build more refinaries, and drill for domestic oil.
That's a start.
By the way, I work in SF, but live in Yuba City, where Premium sits at about 2.50 right now.
SF has to have thier own special blend to meet air quality standards, and the summer blend is about to be mandated...get ready Frisco.
Brent.


I THINK I LOVE YOU!! :clap:

[cockerkiller68]

who to blame? CLinton for letting the liberals shut oil refineries down and jack EPA requirments up to ungodly standards. want proof, ill introduce you to the THOUSANDS that got laid off in this part of texas thanks to that..........


I THINK I LOVE YOU TOO!! :clap:

[warpspyder]

Let's see... In the last 5 years we were lucky enough to elect a president with the sand to attack and conquer several terrorists infested countries that threatened this country,
Also in the last 5 years we had over three thousand souls killed after attacking not only the very symbol of financial America but our FOREMOST MILITARY INSTALLATION.
Hopefully Saudi Arabia is next to get straitened out by the appropriate means.
Want lower gas? Start by removing liberal enviromentalists from power and allow us to build more refinaries, and drill for domestic oil.



I'm gonna have to go ahead and disagree with you on many of those points (look for the ones in bold). Prove they were infested with terrorists. There is no reason to believe that Iraq was harboring terrorists nor any reason to believe they did not abandon their attempt to have "weapons of mass destruction". Bush has FAR too many Saudi buddies who have bailed him out of some tough times (ever hear of Arbusto and Harken??). That's a bit like saying you'll bomb your parents. No if you want lower gas prices you'll remove the guy who's buddies with the Saudis and allows them to drive up the prices like that. Oh and so we're all aware MOST of our oil imports come from our neighbors to the north. You may not agree but the sad thing is..... I'm right :eek: :tard: . I have no life so I make it a point to know things.

here (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/campaigns/wh2000/stories/bush073099.htm)

/tirade

[Lohman446]

Bush has FAR too many Saudi buddies who have bailed him out of some tough times (just look back into his history-trust me).

I'm lazy... elaborate this point and show me the facts that support it?

Thats an honest question, I'm open minded, but I just don't follow this line of reasoning.

[warpspyder]

Look into that article I posted. Then do some research into Harken and their investors. You will see in that article that they say something like "the main reson they were interested in the company was because of Bush". And if you look into their investors and trace the lines you will see Saudi oil money was involved (I am also too lazy but if this is still a controversy in the morning I'll go more in depth :sleeping: )

Oh yeah and look into Arbusto too. There is NO reason any normal human would WANT to buy a company as well..... "gifted" as they were. Let's just say Jed was better at finding oil then they were :p

[warpspyder]

I lied and did some of the research. This article traces his money lines. I think- I'm falling asleep and only read about half.

HERE (http://www.inthesetimes.com/issue/25/25/feature3.shtml)


In 1979, Bush’s first business, Arbusto Energy, obtained financing from James Bath, a Houstonian and close family friend. One of many investors, Bath gave Bush $50,000 for a 5 percent stake in Arbusto. At the time, Bath was the sole U.S. business representative for Salem bin Laden, head of the wealthy Saudi Arabian family and a brother (one of 17) to Osama bin Laden. It has long been suspected, but never proven, that the Arbusto money came directly from Salem bin Laden. In a statement issued shortly after the September 11 attacks, the White House vehemently denied the connection, insisting that Bath invested his own money, not Salem bin Laden’s, in Arbusto.

Better late then never?? I think not.


wow i made a really stupid comment in this spot (not up there)

[Lohman446]

Look into that article I posted. Then do some research into Harken and their investors. You will see in that article that they say something like "the main reson they were interested in the company was because of Bush". And if you look into their investors and trace the lines you will see Saudi oil money was involved (I am also too lazy but if this is still a controversy in the morning I'll go more in depth :sleeping: )

Oh yeah and look into Arbusto too. There is NO reason any normal human would WANT to buy a company as well..... "gifted" as they were. Let's just say Jed was better at finding oil then they were :p


Ehh.. I think your taking normal business ventures and investments and spinning them out of control. Did the Bush name help? Undoubtedly it did, but so did his own reputation. Life is not fair, some people get breaks others don't, and sometimes its as much about character as success or skill. I don't see this spinning into some big conspiracy, just as I failed to see "Whitewater" being some big conspiracy. Can it be made to look like one, especially to people unfamilar with large scale business? Sure it can.. easily, but the fact is a lot of things in large scale business confound those of us not in it.

[warpspyder]

Ehh.. I think your taking normal business ventures and investments and spinning them out of control. Did the Bush name help? Undoubtedly it did, but so did his own reputation. Life is not fair, some people get breaks others don't, and sometimes its as much about character as success or skill. I don't see this spinning into some big conspiracy, just as I failed to see "Whitewater" being some big conspiracy. Can it be made to look like one, especially to people unfamilar with large scale business? Sure it can.. easily, but the fact is a lot of things in large scale business confound those of us not in it.

Yes but his own reputation was getting sub-par grades (which he freely admits) and drilling dry holes. I may not know much about business, but that's not a person I would invest in :nono:

Oh and on a side note don't get me wrong I'm not saying liberals (democrats) are perfect. I'm just saying I have more left winged views than others. Just the way it is, and I don't mean to offend anyone. As far as I'm concerned you are all my friends. :D

[Lohman446]

Yes but his own reputation was getting sub-par grades (which he freely admits) and drilling dry holes. I may not know much about business, but that's not a person I would invest in :nono:

Oh and on a side note don't get me wrong I'm not saying liberals (democrats) are perfect. I'm just saying I have more left winged views than others. Just the way it is, and I don't mean to offend anyone. As far as I'm concerned you are all my friends. :D

His reputation for being a straight shooter was what I was referring to. I can stand loosing money, especially when the person loosing it stands up and says it was my fault... Sometimes failure can be turned into success. His failures built a reputation for honesty and accountability, something many people like to see. His Bush name saved those failures from dragging him into depths of failure he could not recover from.

[CaptaiN_JacK]

His failures are building a reputation for dishonesty and unaccountability, something many americans like to see.

i noticed some spelling errors and gladly fixed them

[warpspyder]

But that doesn't explain why all of a sudden Bush wouldn't want to be associated with James Bath. They even went as far as to censor his name out of some documents that were released. If it was just buisness as usual why the secrecy? And I don't buy the "I'm a stand-up guy who doesn't tell a lie" bull :cuss: . If he doesn't lie tell me, where are the weapons of mass destruction Iraq had? Come on I want pics! I also have a vid somewhere of Bush attempting to explain tribal sovereignty (sp?). Which I can't spell (cut me a break) but he has no idea what it is. If you want to see it I'll try to find it. It really has nothing to do with this it's just funny as heck.

EDIT:
Captain Jack, you are my new best friend. Glad to know I'm not here by myself. :D

Also, forgive me if I'm wrong, but do you normally invest in companies high in debt? And what did harken gain by buying Arbusto? Couldn't they have just taken Bush on if that's what they were after? Doesn't seem to add up really.

[Lohman446]

But that doesn't explain why all of a sudden Bush wouldn't want to be associated with James Bath. They even went as far as to censor his name out of some documents that were released. If it was just buisness as usual why the secrecy? And I don't buy the "I'm a stand-up guy who doesn't tell a lie" bull :cuss: . If he doesn't lie tell me, where are the weapons of mass destruction Iraq had? Come on I want pics! I also have a vid somewhere of Bush attempting to explain tribal sovereignty (sp?). Which I can't speel (cut me a break) but he has no idea what it is. If you want to see it I'll try to find it. It really has nothing to do with this it's just funny as heck.

EDIT:
Captain Jack, you are my new best friend. Glad to know I'm not here by myself. :D

I beleive, that honestly, the failure to find weapons of mass destruction in Iraq was a failure of the intelligence community. I beleive he is at fault for it for not having a better grasp and control over what he was being told, and the knowledge to discern if it was good information or not, but I do not beleive that he was looking for a lie to go into Iraq. I think he asked for information, and he may have desired to go into Iraq, and he was given the information that he needed. I do not beleive he was part of manufacturing information or the lies.

Don't think I'm trying to corner anyone. He built a reputation for honesty.. that does not mean he was honest. There is a difference.

I personally, don't like any of the politicians that run in the major parties. All the democrats had to do was not loose the last election, they managed to find a candidate who could loose. Seriously, it wasn't about winning, they had it... it was about not loosing. I hope you understand the difference. I watch passively, because I dont beleive that either of the parties offer a better vision of hte future than tomorrow, so I really don't care who wins. I think the Republican party has a more logically sound platform, but its so changing that it really doesn't matter. Besides, the two parties are so "centeric" that issues seldom really matter. Not to mention the limited power of the Executive branch...

PS and yes companies regularly invest in unprofitable companies high in debt, or those slipping. Mercedes buyout of Chrysler which was slipping. Its not uncommon to buy heavily debt laden companies that are in your area of expertise, in the hopes of cost cutting and combining to make them profitable. You can find conspiracy here, but you have to ignore some of the illogical things that happen in business to do so

[warpspyder]

I could not agree more with that actually. I hate all politicians and wouldn't trust them with my 35 cent pen. I do believe that Bush should have been more careful, and planned the war in Iraq better, and not tried to force feed bogus information to the American people. Frankly I think our electoral system is messed up, and in reality Bush hasn't run away with any election despite what people may think. My favorite quote of all time came after the election. It went something like this


America isn't red or blue, it's purple!

Referring to blue and red states they just mixed the color. Anyways it's been a long day and I'm ready for bed. Pleasuer talking with you.

[Jakedubbleya]

Earth to debaters! with the rise of china, use of oil will be restricited for commercial use in only 20-30 years anyway. So what are you all buggerin about? We pay more now or we pay more later, theres only so much fuel guys...

Obviously, limiting gas consumption now is the way to go so we have more time to develop alternative fuels, and ease into those alternatives more fluidly. The "lower prices by drilling more" conservative theory is somewhat idiotic by that logic. I mean, havent any of you republicans realized that right wing environmentalism AND tax policies are driven solely by their sponsors? Its sort of obvious i dont know why people still side with a party that quite frankly is screwing them on these issues.

Anyway, diesel is definitely the way to go from a lot of economical AND performance angles.

BTW saddamn was a jerk, and i think it was honorable for us to free his people from his jerkyness, but we did it in a rather dis-honorable way and i mean, there ARE bigger jerks in the world...

[tropical_fishy]

Earth to debaters! with the rise of china, use of oil will be restricited for commercial use in only 20-30 years anyway. So what are you all buggerin about? We pay more now or we pay more later, theres only so much fuel guys...

Obviously, limiting gas consumption now is the way to go so we have more time to develop alternative fuels, and ease into those alternatives more fluidly. The "lower prices by drilling more" conservative theory is somewhat idiotic by that logic. I mean, havent any of you republicans realized that right wing environmentalism AND tax policies are driven solely by their sponsors? Its sort of obvious i dont know why people still side with a party that quite frankly is screwing them on these issues.

Anyway, diesel is definitely the way to go from a lot of economical AND performance angles.

BTW saddamn was a jerk, and i think it was honorable for us to free his people from his jerkyness, but we did it in a rather dis-honorable way and i mean, there ARE bigger jerks in the world...

I think this is the first time that i;ve ever agreed with you. But I'll say it! I agree 100%. Especially about the bigger jerks in the world.

[Jakedubbleya]

I think this is the first time that i;ve ever agreed with you. But I'll say it! I agree 100%. Especially about the bigger jerks in the world.

Looks like that logic powder i mixed in with your fishy flakes is working...

*taps on aquarium glass*

[Lohman446]

Obviously, limiting gas consumption now is the way to go so we have more time to develop alternative fuels, and ease into those alternatives more fluidly.
I actually agree here. Why use a fuel that will not make us more of a world power? If we are developing a fuel (and it is our "brain trust" that will develop it) why not make it beneficial to us. The use of ethanol would revitalize America's farming economy, strengthen our world stance, and turn us from being dependent on foreign resources to foreign economies being dependent on our resources, which will be renewable


The "lower prices by drilling more" conservative theory is somewhat idiotic by that logic. I mean, havent any of you republicans realized that right wing environmentalism AND tax policies are driven solely by their sponsors? Its sort of obvious i dont know why people still side with a party that quite frankly is screwing them on these issues.
Although it may be politically driven the Alaskan governor and the majority of Alaska support drilling in Alaska. Well it is not an end all be all solution it does help short term, which is what we need to address. Ignoring short term solutions in favor of pursuing long term ones, or ignoring long term ones in favor of short term ones exclusively is "somewhat idiotic" and "sort of obvious " a poor course of action.


Anyway, diesel is definitely the way to go from a lot of economical AND performance angles.
Well I agree that diesel has some advantages, including the intriguing possibility of bio-diesel and the use of alternative fuels (as in used cooking oil) I think that there are other more viable solutions that depend on America's own renewable resources rather than foreign resources.


BTW saddamn was a jerk, and i think it was honorable for us to free his people from his jerkyness, but we did it in a rather dis-honorable way and i mean, there ARE bigger jerks in the world...
I unfortunately agree and disagree. Saddamn did commit heinous crimes against humanity. However, the dangers to America come not from government in itself, but from fundamental zealotism that portrays us, and our lifestyle, as inherently evil. Saddamn did not promote fundamentalism, in fact it is my understanding that Iraq was one of the most religiously tolerant countries in the area. History teaches us (both recent and ancient) that foreign conquest and "tinkering" in the middle east fails. We know this from the British occupation in the mid 1900s, from the US involvment in the late 70's and 80's in Iran, from the crusades themselves and countless other issues.

[txaggie08]

I'm gonna have to go ahead and disagree with you on many of those points (look for the ones in bold). Prove they were infested with terrorists. There is no reason to believe that Iraq was harboring terrorists nor any reason to believe they did not abandon their attempt to have "weapons of mass destruction".




right thats why hussein was paying reward money to familys of suicide bombers, and was purchasing labratory equipment used in the refinement of uranium 235- U238

[txaggie08]

I unfortunately agree and disagree. Saddamn did commit heinous crimes against humanity. However, the dangers to America come not from government in itself, but from fundamental zealotism that portrays us, and our lifestyle, as inherently evil. Saddamn did not promote fundamentalism, in fact it is my understanding that Iraq was one of the most religiously tolerant countries in the area. History teaches us (both recent and ancient) that foreign conquest and "tinkering" in the middle east fails. We know this from the British occupation in the mid 1900s, from the US involvment in the late 70's and 80's in Iran, from the crusades themselves and countless other issues.


no he just commited warcrimes against civilian populations by launching armed biological weapons(wich are illegal under international law) into curdish towns. no heinous crimes in that. i mean, there werent men hanged at nuremberg for just as bad............

if slaughtering civilian populations with nerve agents and bio weapons isnt heinous, you may want to reasses your moralistic outlook on life man.....

in reality, the UN and NATO violated there own laws and treatys by not arresting the man as soon as he did that. The man was just as bad as any other dictator in the world has ever been, he was just contained

[Jakedubbleya]

Although it may be politically driven the Alaskan governor and the majority of Alaska support drilling in Alaska. Well it is not an end all be all solution it does help short term, which is what we need to address. Ignoring short term solutions in favor of pursuing long term ones, or ignoring long term ones in favor of short term ones exclusively is "somewhat idiotic" and "sort of obvious " a poor course of action.

What are you trying to say? of course alaskans support it, it would mean A LOT of jobs and cash into the area.

BUUUT.... that short term solution GREATLY comprimises our long term ones.We need alaskan oil to hold our commercial economy together when all the other wells have run dry or begin restricting american access.

imo there are no short term solutions short of getting the producers to stop overcharging.
--
My diesel referance wasnt for the future but for the present.
--
I personally am partial to hydrogen fuel for the long term, if we could just get a better process to isolate hydrogen then wed be set.
--
We rescued saddams people, thats all i care about. Extremist anti-american views and cultures are another issue all together.
------------------------------------------


who to blame? CLinton for letting the liberals shut oil refineries down and jack EPA requirments up to ungodly standards. want proof, ill introduce you to the THOUSANDS that got laid off in this part of texas thanks to that..........

employment went up with clinton and down with bush. im sorry to hear about your isolated incident but people lose jobs when stuff closes, just the way things work.

[Lohman446]

no he just commited warcrimes against civilian populations by launching armed biological weapons(wich are illegal under international law) into curdish towns. no heinous crimes in that. i mean, there werent men hanged at nuremberg for just as bad............

if slaughtering civilian populations with nerve agents and bio weapons isnt heinous, you may want to reasses your moralistic outlook on life man.....

in reality, the UN and NATO violated there own laws and treatys by not arresting the man as soon as he did that. The man was just as bad as any other dictator in the world has ever been, he was just contained


I'm confused... what do you mean? Your first and second paragraphs seem to be insupportive of each other. I acknowledged those heinous crimes - reread what I wrote. I also acknowledged the reality of fundamentalism and the Iraqi government (under Saddam) religious tolerance - not great tolerance, but better than others like say Saudi.

Come one people.. evil people sometimes do things that are beneficial, that could be called good just as overall "good" people commit evil acts from time to time (or may). Lets not get so caught up in one side and agenda that we ignore reality and historical truths.

[Jakedubbleya]

I'm confused... what do you mean? Your first and second paragraphs seem to be insupportive of each other. I acknowledged those heinous crimes - reread what I wrote. I also acknowledged the reality of fundamentalism and the Iraqi government (under Saddam) religious tolerance - not great tolerance, but better than others like say Saudi.

Come one people.. evil people sometimes do things that are beneficial, that could be called good just as overall "good" people commit evil acts from time to time (or may). Lets not get so caught up in one side and agenda that we ignore reality and historical truths.

So his SLIGHT leniency to religions, basically because he wasnt religious himself, excuses the stuff he did?

Id have-to say HELL NO to that one. bad example bro.

(a good example might be something like the spainish conquering america)

[Lohman446]

So his SLIGHT leniency to religions, basically because he wasnt religious himself, excuses the stuff he did?

Id have-to say HELL NO to that one. bad example bro.

No... I did not say it excused what he did. If we took him out because of his actions that fine. If we took him out to protect ourselves from fundamental terrorists (as was claimed) than we made an error. Historically his discouragement (or lack of encouragement) of fundamentalism, even though he may have hated us, may have been as beneficial in the prevention of terrorist attacks as anything we have done. I say may because I do nto have the intellgence information to make a decision on this. I don't like radical views to either side that ignore anything that may not support them.

Did his actions, etc. excuse his other actions? No... But lets be realistic about why we have done what we have, and how we may have been wrong.

[Jakedubbleya]

No... I did not say it excused what he did. If we took him out because of his actions that fine. If we took him out to protect ourselves from fundamental terrorists (as was claimed) than we made an error. Historically his discouragement (or lack of encouragement) of fundamentalism, even though he may have hated us, may have been as beneficial in the prevention of terrorist attacks as anything we have done. I say may because I do nto have the intellgence information to make a decision on this. I don't like radical views to either side that ignore anything that may not support them.

Did his actions, etc. excuse his other actions? No... But lets be realistic about why we have done what we have, and how we may have been wrong.

My view has been: our intentions were a bit misguided. The result was rather pleasing.
---
But saddam had absolutely no saving graces man.

His slight lack of encouragement of fundamentalism would not have fruited the way we had him chained up...

I agree with you that evil results in greater good much of the time, but like i said, saddamn is a bad example of it.

[Lohman446]

My view has been: our intentions were a bit misguided. The result was rather pleasing.
---
But saddam had absolutely no saving graces man.

His slight lack of encouragement of fundamentalism would not have fruited the way we had him chained up...

I agree with you that evil results in greater good much of the time, but like i said, saddamn is a bad example of it.

He is an extreme example of it... Don't beleive that I am excusing what he did, I'm just pointing out that not everything was of no value.

[Jakedubbleya]

He is an extreme example of it... Don't beleive that I am excusing what he did, I'm just pointing out that not everything was of no value.

Sorry, i was mistaken then :(

thats just the drift i got from the way you patronized him.

[Wheelman]

Don't have the ambition to read the whole thread, I'll do it later. I remember about 5 or 6 years ago I was working out on one of the islands and thier one gas station it was like 1.65/gal. I was like holy :cuss: batman, I'll be damned if I ever pay that much for gas. I'd kill to pay that much for gas now :cry:

[txaggie08]

------------------------------------------


employment went up with clinton and down with bush. im sorry to hear about your isolated incident but people lose jobs when stuff closes, just the way things work.

im glad most of the gulf coast of texas is an isolaed incedent, since its an are larger than most of the states in the union

[txaggie08]

I'm confused... what do you mean? Your first and second paragraphs seem to be insupportive of each other. I acknowledged those heinous crimes - reread what I wrote. I also acknowledged the reality of fundamentalism and the Iraqi government (under Saddam) religious tolerance - not great tolerance, but better than others like say Saudi.

Come one people.. evil people sometimes do things that are beneficial, that could be called good just as overall "good" people commit evil acts from time to time (or may). Lets not get so caught up in one side and agenda that we ignore reality and historical truths.

ah excuse me i hadnt slept i misread did for did not

[SlartyBartFast]

My beast. One 15 gallon tank, One 17gallon.
Cost me 80 bucks in diesel the other day.
20 bucks gets me 1/2 a tank.
Brent.

Wow. Didn't this thread get all political. :p

Back to something less political:

Why don't you convert to a dual-fuel system and start burning used and/or new cooking oil?

You already have two tanks installed, a conversion kit with a tank heater and you'd be good to go. A co-worker runs his Mercedes diesel wagon on used oil and it's saving him a small fortune.

All you have to do is start using dino-diesel, switch to oil when the oil and engine are warm, then switch back to dino-diesel before shutting the engine off.

All you need is a single good fry restaurant in your area who'll let you take their oil for free instead of having to pay a disposal company. :)

[Jakedubbleya]

im glad most of the gulf coast of texas is an isolaed incedent, since its an are larger than most of the states in the union

thousands vs. millions

[warpspyder]

right thats why hussein was paying reward money to familys of suicide bombers, and was purchasing labratory equipment used in the refinement of uranium 235- U238


How current is your information? Proof??

[warpspyder]

My view has been: our intentions were a bit misguided. The result was rather pleasing.
---
But saddam had absolutely no saving graces man.

His slight lack of encouragement of fundamentalism would not have fruited the way we had him chained up...

I agree with you that evil results in greater good much of the time, but like i said, saddamn is a bad example of it.


I hope you didn't mean the results were rather pleasing. If so let's do a test, how would you feel if I told you I was going to take some of your family members for a few months, then kept them for over a year then killed or perhaps only wounded them? No you wouldn't like that. The RESULT may have been pleasing but the way we achieved that result was repulsive. I do agree that Saddam had to go, and had really nothing to offer the world, but come on. Guys Clinton lost 11 men on a raid in Mogadishu, and Bush has lost how many in Iraq? Clinton lost just shy of a dozen and people went wild, calling for resignations, and an immediate withdrawal from Somalia. I see some people who are looking at things from a strange view point. As I said in an earlier post I don't like politicians, or politics for that matter, but it just seems that right winged thinkers seem to see themselves as the all knowing powers who never make a mistake.

[Jakedubbleya]

i meant what i said.

please read the whole thread.

now i am tired and im going to bed.

:rofl:

[Lohman446]

I hope you didn't mean the results were rather pleasing. If so let's do a test, how would you feel if I told you I was going to take some of your family members for a few months, then kept them for over a year then killed or perhaps only wounded them? No you wouldn't like that. The RESULT may have been pleasing but the way we achieved that result was repulsive. I do agree that Saddam had to go, and had really nothing to offer the world, but come on. Guys Clinton lost 11 men on a raid in Mogadishu, and Bush has lost how many in Iraq? Clinton lost just shy of a dozen and people went wild, calling for resignations, and an immediate withdrawal from Somalia. I see some people who are looking at things from a strange view point. As I said in an earlier post I don't like politicians, or politics for that matter, but it just seems that right winged thinkers seem to see themselves as the all knowing powers who never make a mistake.

The complaint most people had about that incident is we lost 11 guys and then withdrew. We did not care about what we were trying to do enough to accomplish the goal we had set out. There lives were wasted because we did not carry through.

[warpspyder]

The complaint most people had about that incident is we lost 11 guys and then withdrew. We did not care about what we were trying to do enough to accomplish the goal we had set out. There lives were wasted because we did not carry through.


You are partially right in thinking that. Many EDUCATED (when i say educated i mean people who understand what was behind the missions) knew that the ultimate failure in that area was to pull out before we had accomplished our goals. However to a person the american people wanted an immediate withdrawal from the area (if I had the book here i'd give some references pages). I do agree in the sense that we should have stayed, done the deed THEN pulled out. Also people/politicians were trying to decrease the military presence in that area of the world. They had axed requests for bradley armored vehicles and the AC-130 gunship (of course how helpfule the spectre would have proven in the urban environment is a large question and the helocopters did an adequate job). Now I'm off on a tangent again. Maybe I should just impose a self ban for this thread. :cry:

[awilli234life]

My 75 cent gas here in canada is being considered expensive (of course, not measured the same) :ninja:
how is it mesured by litres or decileiters somthing like that
p.s what is the exchange rate rt now?

[warpspyder]

I think right now it's roughly 80 cents canadian to every dollar. Correct me if I'm wrong (which I probably am. I checked a site a while ago and not sure if I interpreted it right).

Try this (http://www.x-rates.com/)

[txaggie08]

How current is your information? Proof??

that had been reported on well before any real talk of war began. Im not shure how you would like me to prove it besides pointing at news reports, simply because US and other intelligence agency(oxymorons in other terms)dont generaly release there reports.

As to the uranium refinment equipment, i saw video from iraq showing what they were refering to. huge centerfuge cylinders(along with a centerfuge i beleive, along with chemicals necessary in the refinment process.

[SlartyBartFast]

I think right now it's roughly 80 cents canadian to every dollar. Correct me if I'm wrong (which I probably am. I checked a site a while ago and not sure if I interpreted it right).

Try this (http://www.x-rates.com/)


Other way round.

1$can = .80$us

Today gas prices are 99.4c/l in Montreal.

That's 3.79l/gal so, it's about 3.77$can/gal or about 3$us/gal.

[warpspyder]

Ah I was close... Yeah and as far as intelligence goes, and those videos. Unless you saw the stuff in there they could be feeding you B.S. Actually what's been going on the last couple of years really almost calls to mind Nazi Germany. Hmm.....