Why AGD?

[RoamingStorm]

well i go to my local paintball field today (blackrain paintball) and with my mag incapacitated i decided to use a friends priahna with cp barrel. im shooting air. well im pretty accurate, ive hit targets from 75 feet clearly (with classicmag), and as i am shooting the bunker 12 feet in front of me, the first one is a solid hit, a foot off from where i aimed, the next lands 4 feet to the right of the bunker which i was aiming at. now that is why i shoot mags instead of anything else, would i shoot anything else...... no would you?

[Glickman]

its a piranha... what the hell DID you expect?

try a matrix with a sized boomy, youll crap ur pants

[RoamingStorm]

ive used it before very accurate but way to much

edit: and when you say matrix are you talking dye or proto?

[Glickman]

ive used it before very accurate but way to much

edit: and when you say matrix are you talking dye or proto?

proto is dye :D

i was specifically talking about '03 dye matricies, build like rocks, and with a boomy, shoot very nicely, very nicely

[magman007]

you do realize that no marker is more accurate than another right?


it was probabally the fact that you arent used tot he pirahana and werent used to sighting down a tsller msrker

[gc82000]

I will stick with an angel, with SM-1, thank you.

[Glickman]

you do realize that no marker is more accurate than another right?


it was probabally the fact that you arent used tot he pirahana and werent used to sighting down a tsller msrker

ok, take a mech spyder and a matrix, same psi, same barrel.

your saying they will shoot the same?

:p

[RoamingStorm]

you do realize that no marker is more accurate than another right?


it was probabally the fact that you arent used tot he pirahana and werent used to sighting down a tsller msrker

false, the way a bolt acts and distributes the pressure can change the direction area of the ball, this can be easily seen by a stream of paint, if you shoot a stream with a dye or naughty dogs, the balls usually land in the exact same place, however with a pirahna or spyder they will not be as consistent, i have tried this using bipods so its not the trigger pull changing the location of the shot

[Kevmaster]

false, the way a bolt acts and distributes the pressure can change the direction area of the ball, this can be easily seen by a stream of paint, if you shoot a stream with a dye or naughty dogs, the balls usually land in the exact same place, however with a pirahna or spyder they will not be as consistent, i have tried this using bipods so its not the trigger pull changing the location of the shot

so much to learn....

[Kevmaster]

ok, take a mech spyder and a matrix, same psi, same barrel.

your saying they will shoot the same?

:p

we're (he's) saying that if you take a spyder and a matrix, bench mount them to a table, put the same barrel on both and use the same paint and shoot em both at 275fps, you'll get identical results.

[RoamingStorm]

well would you like to teach me what i need to learn

[Chronobreak]

yes i love my mag and i could have any gun i want and thers a reason i shoot mags still;)

as for the consitent gun/s i think a trix is MUCH mroe consistent shot to shot than a pirhana..but i dont think anyones arguing that.. :rolleyes:

[gc82000]

as for the consitent gun/s i think a trix is MUCH mroe consistent shot to shot than a pirhana..but i dont think anyones arguing that.. :rolleyes:

Because that is not some thing that is arguable.

[AGD202]

we're (he's) saying that if you take a spyder and a matrix, bench mount them to a table, put the same barrel on both and use the same paint and shoot em both at 275fps, you'll get identical results.


But thats not true, like said before.... it all depends on the setup also. if u got a bolt with just a straight up hole in the middle vs. a bolt that distributes the air evenly across the ball... u will get better shots/results with the bolt that distributes over the one with just a hole in it. And if u wanna know what i mean by just a hole... look at an old stock cocker bolt and ull see.

[shartley]

I hope folks realize that Spyders and Piranhas can be just as accurate as any other marker. Consistency is one of the biggest factors affecting accuracy in markers, next to the actual quality of the paintballs. And it is possible to have a relatively constant “low end” marker, just as it is possible to have an inconsistent “high end” marker.

And you can take any marker on any give day and shoot crappy paint and watch your balls fly all over the place. So any “I can usually shoot great with X marker and today I borrowed a friend’s Y marker and it SUCKED” are not even worth the time to read. Sorry. Were you using the same batch of paint? Were the velocities the same? Well in this case the answer would be NO since his Mag was “incapacitated”.

So which marker was better today anyways? The “incapacitated” Mag, or the Piranha that got used on the field? Interesting question….

And this is also coming from someone who OWNS both a Mag and a PPS Short Barrel Piranha Stroker….. they BOTH are accurate, and have BOTH had days where the balls were screwy. And my Wife has a Spyder TL Plus (which my son has used for the past few years) and it too shoots darts when the paint is good.

Consistency (as well as accuracy in general) has more to do with than just what name is on the marker, or how much you paid for it…….

[RoamingStorm]

i always aim for the same velocity indoors out of any marker i shoot today i mean it wa inconsistent, it was around 230 today
i usually shoot around 245, but it was same brand of paint

[shartley]

i always aim for the same velocity indoors out of any marker i shoot today i mean it wa inconsistent, it was around 230 today
i usually shoot around 245, but it was same brand of paint
You will note that I didn’t say “same brand of paint” I said “same batch”…. It makes a difference.

Also, you may want to consider that the setup and quality of the marker in question is not fully based on what type it is. In fact often it has nothing to do with it. Are all Fords good, or bad? Your experience today was not a reflection of anything other than the particular marker you were using along with the paint and other factors. It didn’t reflect one way or another on whether all markers made by that company are better or worse than any other marker, or that Mags are better than any other marker.

What I am saying is that if you had simply said that the marker you used today didn’t work as well as your Mag usually did and left it at that it would have been fine. But to try to say that today’s experience proved how much better Mags are than other markers would be far from accurate.

Without a doubt Mags are fantastic markers. But you can still find folks with horror stories about them. And you can find folks who have had good as well as bad experiences with every type/brand of marker out there.

[RoamingStorm]

well thanks, i didnt know that, there is one thing im glad i learned, but i wouldnt say each batch differs on consistency, i mean im sure it changes a little, but not 4 feet from 12 feet away

[bleachit]

when I shoot my spyder with a palmers and co2 it shoots consistent and accurately...

if the pirahna you were shooting was reged ( assuming it wasnt) you would probably see better results.

then again, I do get a decent paint to barrel match along with decent quality paint...

[mark_1791]

Silly extraneous variables....

[JimmyBeam]

yea barrels make alot of diference. that and cleaning after you chop or break

[OneEyedPimp]

I think there is also an argument to be made here for the simple difference in the way the guns feel when they shoot.
For example:

I got really used to my A-5. I could hit anything, within a reasonable range with my aftermarket barrel. Someone let me shoot a mag for a day. All day, I was off my game. I am not blaming the gun, but I am blaming the fact that it was hard to get used to from shooting an A-5.

Just my 2 cents on marker consistency.

[magman007]

you do realize that the venturi bolt is the biggest crock ever brought to paintball?

open face bolts are used on every high end marker, you know why? higher flow.

air being distrubuted around the ball? thats all a crock as well, all the air is distrubuted through the barrel, thats where the acceleration takes place, air flows evenly, it isnt a liquid like you are thinking of it as, higher pressure moves to the lower pressure area, it will flow behind the ball evenly.


and glickman, i love trixes, so dont go there, im one of the biggest matrix proponents you will find, i find them to be the best markers on the market today.

[tyrion2323]

false, the way a bolt acts and distributes the pressure can change the direction area of the ball, this can be easily seen by a stream of paint, if you shoot a stream with a dye or naughty dogs, the balls usually land in the exact same place, however with a pirahna or spyder they will not be as consistent, i have tried this using bipods so its not the trigger pull changing the location of the shot

No marker design is inherently more accurate than another. There are many factors to accuracy:

- Size, Shape and quality of paint being shot
- Barrel size and quality
- Consistency of regulator
- Weather (out of your control)

Because of the qualities of a paintball (imperfect, round, soft, filled with liquid), we can't apply the same set of physics that we do to firearms.

Secondly, since you don't provide any evidence of a well controlled or regulated experiment into accuracy, your claim that 'mags are more accurate than Pirahnas is unbased.

Not trying to get you down, but it's still all too common that people think X Gun is more accurate or has better range than Y Gun.

[TheTramp]

false, the way a bolt acts and distributes the pressure can change the direction area of the ball, this can be easily seen by a stream of paint, if you shoot a stream with a dye or naughty dogs, the balls usually land in the exact same place, however with a pirahna or spyder they will not be as consistent, i have tried this using bipods so its not the trigger pull changing the location of the shot

Tom proved in his lab a long time ago that this it incorrect. He used considerably more than a bipod "test."

While a high end gun like a matrix will be more consistent than the average Spyder clone, the bolt face effects nothing but efficiency (open face = better flow = better efficiency).

[Glickman]

Tom proved in his lab a long time ago that this it incorrect. He used considerably more than a bipod "test."

While a high end gun like a matrix will be more consistent than the average Spyder clone, the bolt face effects nothing but efficiency (open face = better flow = better efficiency).

BAM!


cause kaye's word is law :D

[RoamingStorm]

i think this may have gotten out of hand, i am just explaining why i love and prefer to use only mags

[OneEyedPimp]

i think this may have gotten out of hand, i am just explaining why i love and prefer to use only mags

But don't you love hijacked threads?

[onedude36]

we are educating you :D

[bleachit]

i think this may have gotten out of hand, i am just explaining why i love and prefer to use only mags


Welcome to AO.. where you always get more than you ask for.

[SpitFire1299]

Mags are very accurate. The tend to evenly put pressure onto the ball in one direction, unlike a spyder which comes up the bottom, then through the bolt, giving the ball uneven pressure. Simple little things change accuracy very easily, but an automag, or matrix IS better than a spyder + calones. Spyder + calones i beilieve were generally made as cheap reck ball guns. Automags, Matrix's, Timmy's.. etc etc. are very good guns, because they are made good, instead of in mass productions to make a ton of money. In paintball, you pay for what you get. So get an automag.. :rolleyes:

RoamingStorm.. have you ever been to BFG?

[Lohman446]

Mags are very accurate. The tend to evenly put pressure onto the ball in one direction, unlike a spyder which comes up the bottom, then through the bolt, giving the ball uneven pressure. Simple little things change accuracy very easily, but an automag, or matrix IS better than a spyder + calones. Spyder + calones i beilieve were generally made as cheap reck ball guns. Automags, Matrix's, Timmy's.. etc etc. are very good guns, because they are made good, instead of in mass productions to make a ton of money. In paintball, you pay for what you get. So get an automag.. :rolleyes:

RoamingStorm.. have you ever been to BFG?

? So this blast of air is not corrected in the direction of the breech and barrel - it is still going in unpredictable directions when it exits the barrel ?

[thomcad]

I believe all paintball guns are capable of very similar side to side accuracy given similar paint to barrel match and paint quality, but I believe they will differ greatly in their up and down accuracy. There is a dramatic differance between the shot to shot velocities in differant guns, especially if you fire the shots in your test groups right after one another, allowing the gun to shoot down. A gun with a top of the line regulator will be far more consistant than one that shoots down or spikes. Come to think of it, if the peaks and valleys are differant enough, that might give you some side to side flyers, and Air vs co2 would also make a differance, but that is not exactly apples to apples.

[bleachit]

Mags are very accurate. The tend to evenly put pressure onto the ball in one direction, unlike a spyder which comes up the bottom, then through the bolt, giving the ball uneven pressure.


umm what?

how is the pressure "uneven"? :confused:

[TheDuelist]

I've always noticed that the BIGGEST factor when it comes to the accuracy of any marker is the person pulling the trigger. But thats just me.

[sbpyro]

I've always noticed that the BIGGEST factor when it comes to the accuracy of any marker is the person pulling the trigger. But thats just me.


EBTAG :)
Error between Trigger and ground