That's it, I've had enough!

[Wheelman]

Maybe it's lack of sleep, could be new meds I'm on I don't know, but if I have to hear one more person around here piss and moan about different aspects of an Automag I swear to god I'm gonna nut right out. I am tired of hearing people whine that Mags are inefficient, that AGD needs to redesign the valve wha wha wha :cry: Well guess what, THE AUTOMAG HAS BEEN THE AUTOMAG FOR 15 SOME ODD YEARS!!! What refinments that have been made are what can be made, I think people look for reasons to ***** about it. Christ people *****ed about the chopping, tom fixed the chopping, people whined because they were heavy, Tom made them lighter, you wanted it faster Tom made it faster, then you griped about a big battery on the front. Theres always gonna be a dark side no matter what you do, you can't piss into Mr. Coffee and expect to get Tasters Choice because it just isn't going to happen. Like anything in this world can't we take it for what it is, not what it isn't.

I feel if you don't like it you have more than 100 other guns out there to choose from, look around till you find one you can't complain about and call it good DAMMMIT!!!!!!!

ARGHHHHHHHHGGGHHGHGH! :wow:

[Target Practice]

Maybe it's lack of sleep, could be new meds I'm on I don't know, but if I have to hear one more person around here piss and moan about different aspects of an Automag I swear to god I'm gonna nut right out. I am tired of hearing people whine that Mags are inefficient, that AGD needs to redesign the valve wha wha wha :cry: Well guess what, THE AUTOMAG HAS BEEN THE AUTOMAG FOR 15 SOME ODD YEARS!!! What refinments that have been made are what can be made, I think people look for reasons to ***** about it. Christ people *****ed about the chopping, tom fixed the chopping, people whined because they were heavy, Tom made them lighter, you wanted it faster Tom made it faster, then you griped about a big battery on the front. Theres always gonna be a dark side no matter what you do, you can't piss into Mr. Coffee and expect to get Tasters Choice because it just isn't going to happen. Like anything in this world can't we take it for what it is, not what it isn't.

I feel if you don't like it you have more than 100 other guns out there to choose from, look around till you find one you can't complain about and call it good DAMMMIT!!!!!!!

ARGHHHHHHHHGGGHHGHGH! :wow:

Preach on, brother.

[Lohman446]

:rolleyes:

Alright.. lets talk about something on the automag that hasn't already been discussed...

The newest ummm... hmm... yeh, ok nevermind

:cheers:

[Soopa Villain17]

edit: GO STEVE :dance:

[Target Practice]

:tard:

:tard:, yourself. He's right, you know.

[yakitori]

Im w/ lohman here. Other gun companies make new guns w/ differnt changes based on what the player requests or demands. So, if it werent for us griping about lighter, faster, chopping, and the battery packs, would the mag have EVER changed? That seems to be what you are saying.

I like mags for what they are. Same as w/ any other gun. Just like it for what it is.

Im sick of ppl retaliating against ppl who say one negative thing about a mag. ALL GUNS have a negative aspect.

[JimmyBeam]

someone needs a hug

[Wheelman]

Im sick of ppl retaliating against ppl who say one negative thing about a mag. ALL GUNS have a negative aspect.


Okay maybe I should clarify, Yeah I've heard years of mag bashing on the field. I have only recently noticed it in abundance around here. I am sick to death of every post I see say something along the lines of a Mag efficientcy, oh there gas hogs boo hoo. I'm starting to see them in threads that are in no way related to the topic. I've had several mags, and I never noticed a problem with my efficentcy. People don't like it try this, find a field that has all day air, or buy something that you feel is a little better on gas. Your choice really, go out and buy a Truck and know it's gonna suck up the gas or your little honda and go a little farther. C'mon just seems like people are nitpicking now simply because they have to hate something and they have run out of ideas.



:tard:
stfu


I like mags for what they are. Same as w/ any other gun. Just like it for what it is.

It feels good doesn't it, liking something for what it is if everybody could do that I wouldn't be typing right now.

[Soopa Villain17]

did u not see that i edited :( , btw i like my mag how it is also

[Aslan]

:bounce: I disagree that griping isn't helpful. Like another poster said, if it weren't for griping, alot of the really cool changes of the past may never have happened. If AGD ignored griping, they would end up with products like Brass Eagle who have been hearing for years from users that their guns and paint are horrible...but they actually not only ignore them, but make them worse (i.e. Talon to Blade, Stingray 1 to Stingray II, the "Ice" line, etc...) :shooting:

:wow: On the other hand, what annoys me is when an Angel lover or Ion lover starts talking about how the mag should be changed to look and act exactly like their Angel or Ion. That annoys me. :headbang:

[Kevmaster]

If AGD ignored griping, they would end up with products like Brass Eagle who have been hearing for years from users that their guns and paint are horrible...but they actually not only ignore them, but make them worse (i.e. Talon to Blade, Stingray 1 to Stingray II, the "Ice" line, etc...)

another difference between AGD and BE is that BE makes money...by the millions

[Target Practice]

another difference between AGD and BE is that BE makes money...by the millions

Yeah, but you can't compare AGD to BE. It's like apples to zebras; that's two completely different markets.

[Kevmaster]

Yeah, but you can't compare AGD to BE. It's like apples to zebras; that's two completely different markets.

then he shouldn't be posting about how be doesnt listen (tri-pod, evlution, revvie shells) when their R&D department is very well run

[Target Practice]

then he shouldn't be posting about how be doesnt listen (tri-pod, evlution, revvie shells) when their R&D department is very well run

True 'nuf.

I do think, however, that even here on AO, Mags get crapped on more then they should. They're sweet little guns for the most part, but for some reason people are determined to focus on the negative.

Any young padawan worth his midiclorians should know that's the wrong thing to do.

[SlartyBartFast]

you can't piss into Mr. Coffee and expect to get Tasters Choice

Ugh. Tasters Choice IS piss and Mr.Coffee couldn't produce a decent cup of warm swill.

:spit_take

[Lohman446]

True 'nuf.

I do think, however, that even here on AO, Mags get crapped on more then they should. They're sweet little guns for the most part, but for some reason people are determined to focus on the negative.

Any young padawan worth his midiclorians should know that's the wrong thing to do.


To some degree... but many of us, when considering the negative and comparisons to other things where the mag is not the greatest, are not discounting what the mag is...

[Chronobreak]

i dont see much of ths here, as i don on pbn from certain individuals(possibly banned from AO :ninja: ) that just troll and rag on mags.

even when its not asked for or necesary.

most of the people that say mags are "inneficent" etc dont know what they are talking about

it just so happens the mag is about THE MOST efficent gun made. except for the minor fact its HP operation so you lose 500-700 psi in the tank depending on your setup.

the mag really should be taken for what it is.

a great pice of machinery that requires little to no maintenance and is built like a tank.
always fires straight, however it isnt the fastest little gimmick gun on the market impressing newbs with high bps claims and false advertising/hype

but yeah i agree :cheers:

[Lohman446]

it just so happens the mag is about THE MOST efficent gun made. except for the minor fact its HP operation so you lose 500-700 psi in the tank depending on your setup.

This is not a personal attack.

I recently stated the mag was inefficient, when asked for numbers the fact of the matter was I could not provide them...

I disagree wtih you, but admit to the possibility that my perceptions are just wrong. What does a mag get in shots out of a 68/45... and what amount of air per 100 shots (or whatever) does it use? How does this compare to other guns? I am seriously curious on this one, and would like to see an agreement made on the numbers as to whether or not mag efficiency, or lack there of, is a myth.

[Chronobreak]

i agree...maybe we can get one of the elders to chime in on this

this was just a general oberservation i noticed, as well as shot to shot how much psi me and the other guns friends use are using per pod or hopper/game

ive been pushing around 975 out of my gun with 600 psi left in the tank

still maybe not the greatest efficeny of anygun but darn good and better than most.

[thecavemankevin]

I swear to god I'm gonna nut



you can't piss into Mr. Coffee and expect to get Tasters Choice

god, if only we could still have sigs :)

[Will Wood]

Nothing like a good rant... :)


Yea, some people suck, they just complain and whine and all that. They expect everyone to kowtow to them and do whatever they say.
Considering what they have at the current level is a privilage, demanding more is stupid, yea.

Sometimes it's for the good - as mentioned with some AGD developements. But yea it's annoying most of the time, and won't lead to anything practicle/worth it.

[SummaryJudgement]

:hail: :hail: :hail:

[deathstalker]

It feels good doesn't it, liking something for what it is if everybody could do that I wouldn't be typing right now.
It's been pointed out before, but it needs to be stated again. If people had not complained, we wouldn't have the lvl 10, ULE bodies and rails, ULT kits, etc. They way you complain, I'll be mad at you if you use anything but a Splatmaster or Nel-Spot. ;)

To side with you on the efficiency issue, I don't think people understand the concept of relativity (no, not the theory). Just because another marker is more efficient does not mean a Mag is inefficient. If your car gets 25 mpg and I get 27, this does not make your car inefficient simply because mine is more efficient.

Every time I step on the field, no matter what marker I'm using and how much paint I carry, I am confident I can shoot every single ball I take out there. It doesn't matter to me that there is more air left in my tank if I'm using one of my 'cockers. It doesn't matter that even if the tanks are at the same pressure, I know I can shoot deeper into the tank with a 'cocker than I can with my E-Mag. What matters to me is getting through a whole game without having to worry about having enough air to shoot all my paint.

Even my old Mini was great on air. I could bring a full Revy and 5X140 pods, and could shoot them all with a 45/45. Last 50 or so shots did have noticeable dropoff, but I never had to leave a game because my marker wouldn't cycle.

[peewee]

WOW!!!! :headbang: Thanks for the rant at least I'm not the only one feeling that way. Very, very tired of the whining. Seems that alot of the people crying dont own mags any more. Personally I dont frequent forums for markers that I dont use. Kind of like being a honda owner belonging to a vett club. If I do buy chance ghost a site that I use to frequent for a while I dont sit & P!$$ & moan about the product.

[master_alexander]

i dont notice mags being inefficent, the 3 that i shoot, but then again i get all day air...

[Jaan]

I'm pretty new here, but I've had a 'Mag for 10 years now and I've keep up with what was going on in paintball the whole time, even though I haven't played much in recent years. All I can tell you is how it's felt being a fan of AGD and seeing what's happened over the years.

First, I think the 'Mag (or at least the valve) is a bit like the venerable small block Chevy engine. There used to be a bunch out there, and they're very reliable and there have been some changes but after a while what can you talk about? How many times do you have to discuss the soft camshafts from the 70's and how the "henco en Mexico" blocks suffer from bad core shift. That's why I stopped reading hot rod magazines years ago, there was nothing new to learn, they were just covering the same old ground over and over. Maybe that's what the forum population is suffering from ... a general lack of nothing new to talk about.

Second, I think a lot of what is being said might be coming from a feeling of frustration and stagnation. I remember when there used be be a lot of Automags on the wall of my local paintball store, now there are none. As everyone else kept moving along AGD didn't really keep up (for whatever reason). I know how this makes *me* feel. I would LOVE a nice new flashy 'Mag but I can't justify the cost. I have an old 1970 Cutlass S out back I would love to fix up too, but as a practical matter I can't spend $20k to do that (even if the results would be spectacular), I have to spend $13k on a brand new Toyota instead. When I think of the cost to build a nice new(ish) 'Mag, I can't help but consider getting an Ion for less money.

OKay, I've got to admit, it's annoying hearing people complaing about air. Air is cheap. Get a fill station already jesh (c:

People around here (for the most part) love thier 'Mags. It reminds me of how people feel about thier kids ... overly critical sometimes. Because you love your kids so much thier shortcomings hurt you a lot more. You also love them so much you want to see them become very successful ... you want to see them cure cancer or become the first really cool president. Perhaps people complain about thier 'Mags for the same reason the women in our lives nag and nag nad nag and nag and nag endlessly. It's done out of love :rolleyes:

[Target Practice]

It's been pointed out before, but it needs to be stated again. If people had not complained, we wouldn't have the lvl 10, ULE bodies and rails, ULT kits, etc. They way you complain, I'll be mad at you if you use anything but a Splatmaster or Nel-Spot. ;)

I'd call that progress, rather then a stream of complaints.

I think what he's saying is that even with all the improvements, people still find stuff to complain about.

Take LX. When I first got LX, I was impressed. Very impressed, actually. Sure it cut down on "efficiency", but what the hell, I could stick my thumb in the breech, and let me tell you, that is one hell of a party trick. Also, a perfectly tuned ULT is a neat little piece of equipment. So we got ULT, but that also cuts down on "efficiency", IIRC. So we got these two improvements, and what do people say?


WAH WAH I ONLY GET X AMOUNT OF SHOTS OF MY 45/3000 WAH WAH WHY CAN'T I SHOOT MORE WAH WAH

I'm not saying the AGD design is perfect. No design is. But goddamn it, if you're going to play/buy/use one accept the bad with the good. We don't need to be reminded every damn thread about it.

Fake Edit: I put efficiency in quotation marks because people don't seem to know what it means. But, since we're using the incorrect definition, I figured it would be better to just go with continuity rather than correctness.

[yakitori]

Ive seen ppl put their fingers in angel breechs and I can do it w/ my viking too. Although the lvl 10 is a lot softer if caught at the first stage of forward movement.

[Eric Of Extreme Measures]

Hey Our Team is all Woods ball, we use speed ball for warm up and practice. I shoot a MAG and will only shoot a MAG. a teammate shoots a DM4 with the whatchcallit boardbounceathingy addon.

well he thought he was the sickest thing on the planet. well Marko and I with our Mags, His X and MY TUNA tuned, can rip him up. we can squash an ion and send them crying.

now we play in the woods, so more air means more paint, more play, more punishment. we dont foolaround. 114/4500 let-m-rip...

come try us on for size spart parts...

AGD all the way, thats it, always and forever. we can build them and fix them in seconds. they never fail. in the rain, the snow, sleet, like a mailman.

Tom is KING, Tuna is the Prince...

if you can carry your gun, you have little arms, thats what im always saying!
Eric

[sanity]

Every gun has its high points and its low points - and this includes mags.

Personally i just left an ebladed cocker that could push 1500 shots per fill on my 68/4500 maxflo to rejoin the mag family, and i am well aware that i will probably be lucky to get 65% of that, but i am still happy with what i have. This is because all of the other features that make a mag a mag outweighed this issue in my personal situation.

Prioritize what you are looking for in a gun and go buy whatever makes you the happiest and fits your playing style.

out.

[RoadDawg]

This is not a personal attack.

I recently stated the mag was inefficient, when asked for numbers the fact of the matter was I could not provide them...

I disagree wtih you, but admit to the possibility that my perceptions are just wrong. What does a mag get in shots out of a 68/45... and what amount of air per 100 shots (or whatever) does it use? How does this compare to other guns? I am seriously curious on this one, and would like to see an agreement made on the numbers as to whether or not mag efficiency, or lack there of, is a myth.

Well it wasn't a 68/45 but with my 45/45 flatline on a 4.0 ULE'd Emag I got on average 800 shots with the occasional 900+. I would purposely turn down my output pressure (700-750)because reactivity was not a necessity with the electronic trigger. So in my case it wasn't terribly inefficent but if I were to use a preset... you better believe it would waste air on reactivity the trigger didn't need (I removed the trigger rod to prevent bounce).

I've also used a 48/3k on a Retro Micromag & minimag. I got on average 500 shots per fill. Overall I prefer adjustables if I'm using a mag of any kind so that way I can control the output and save a few "extra" shots here and there.

Now to the original post. The mag gets flack because compared to some "better" guns the areas it lacks is a major problem. It used to be too heavy, a blender or just plain looking and not customizable. Now for the most parts those areas are fixed. BUT... the negative aspects are still there, i.e. shots per tank. Only way to get people to stop the complaints... is too... FIX those problem areas. (goes for all markers not just mags)

To a person who is comparing between say a Emag and a Viking. What is a big difference between the two? Efficency and or possibly rof (depending on software etc). Is it bad to say that mags should improve of their supposed inefficency? Not at all. Compared to those two the mag is inefficent. Which gives the Viking an advantage in that area. Does that mean the Viking is the better marker? NOPE.

Drink a cold one and relax... it's nothing to raise your blood pressure over. :cheers:

[tyrion2323]

I think that a big reason for the anti-mag movement on AO has been to repudiate the "Mags only" mentality that a lot of people have here. How many threads have you seen that go like this:

USER1: Hey AO! Just got my new Intimidator/Omen/Bushmaster/Whatever. Whaddya think?

USER2: Sell it and get a mag. Magz rule!!!


I know I see them all too often. There's a big gripe about 'hype' on AO, and how so many electro-guns are hyped up...yet AGD uses just as much hype. How can it be that Spyders have been using aluminum bodies for 10 years, but the minute AGD starts using aluminum bodies, it's a miracle! ULE!

You state that we need to appreciate things for what they are, yet everytime a new invention comes out, they get insulted and degraded and called all sorts of names. Huge discussions break out, and people get into screaming matches over things neither party influenced or enacted. For the longest time, anything but a mag was deemed hype...finally it became okay to say that other markers than mags were not only not hype, but were superior in many ways to automags.

[SlartyBartFast]

you better believe it would waste air on reactivity the trigger didn't need (I removed the trigger rod to prevent bounce).

The reactivity in a Mag trigger does not use any extra air. No air is vented and no pressure is vented. No energy is wasted.

What you experience is the pressure from the tank trying to open the on/off. Nothing more.

Final charged dump chamber pressure is the same regardless of input pressure, and it's the balance between charged pressure and residual pressure after firing than determines efficiency.

Unless someone has data to prove me wrong...

[GT]

another difference between AGD and BE is that BE makes money...by the millions


AGD doesnt or didnt make money by the millions? That would be impossible and really really hard to believe!

[GT]

This is a mag forum, if you dont like it LOG THE HELL OUT!!!!

[yakitori]

This is a general paintball talk forum. It just so happens that a lot of AOers think ALL paintball talk here should pertain to mags only. :rolleyes:

So a question for you?

Say, Ive owned plenty of mags before. Yet, Ive ended up selling them. Lets say that while I owned mags I visited this site and grew fond of it. So, now that I dont own mags anymore, Im not allowed to talk about positive OR negative aspects of the guns design. Cannot I not do that w/ ANY gun. ALL guns have a positive and negative, thats a fact. Are you implying that I should no longer visit this site cause I dont own mags anymore. Thats seems to be the general attitude I have been getting lately here on AO. Used to not be that way. Used to, mag owners and AO was an open minded group of individuals w/ more knowledge of other guns. Lately they have been acting like a bunch of self righteous narrowminded know it alls. Chill out and stop acting like ppl dont belong here. This is the internet.

[SlartyBartFast]

This is a general paintball talk forum. It just so happens that a lot of AOers think ALL paintball talk here should pertain to mags only. :rolleyes:

I've seen far more non-mag threads start with a putdown of the (non-existent) orthodox mag-fanboys and demanding that they stay out of the thread. Or, whining, moaning, and pissing when seen by others as pure complaining dismissed as "mag lovers who can't handle the truth".

Then, the thread continues with every pro-mag statement regardless of how level headed being attacked.

So who's fault is the attitude?

Everyone just shut up about it already.

AO is owned and operated by AGD and it's PRIMARY draw is to Mag past, present, and future owners. That brings with it a certain pro-mag attitude. Get over it already.

As for the fanboys, well could those complaining about too much promag sentiment please point one thread out.

[yakitori]

I've seen far more non-mag threads start with a putdown of the (non-existent) orthodox mag-fanboys and demanding that they stay out of the thread. Or, whining, moaning, and pissing when seen by others as pure complaining dismissed as "mag lovers who can't handle the truth".

Then, the thread continues with every pro-mag statement regardless of how level headed being attacked.

So who's fault is the attitude?

Everyone just shut up about it already.

AO is owned and operated by AGD and it's PRIMARY draw is to Mag past, present, and future owners. That brings with it a certain pro-mag attitude. Get over it already.

As for the fanboys, well could those complaining about too much promag sentiment please point one thread out.

how about you post some links of the threads that you have seen as stated above?

You know that TONS of threads that arent about mags have someone butting in and breaking the topic, w/ something along the lines of "this is a mag forum, stay out" "go to xxxxowners.com" yada yada yada.

you are exemplifying my point. please keep replying. :cheers:

[atm743]

ya know i have been talking to lots of people on pbnation cuse im selling my back up mag

( i jest sold it on e-bay though)

and i was asking some people for trades and they said

I dont like mags

and i said why they are fast and never break


and guess what this frut said


cuz they are old skool

i was going to flip cuse my e-mag dose not look old school

and also not to get off topic

but im getting sick of my team mates and others online saying that buying an other gun thats not a mag is bad

one of my team mates (dj89) is calling me a trator cuse i bought a ion for a back up. Really i dont care if they are smart parts or not. really i dont like them but dose it really matter if i buy an gun from an other company i cant stand it. cant stand this people acting like 5 years old saying that this company is the best why would you get an other gun. really i LOVE agd dont get me wong. but i think its cool to try out different guns. if you go on with your life sticking with one brand of food or one brand of cloths or whatever you are not getting anywhere.

well thats my input for now :D

and yes i cant spell. right now i dont care cuse im sick and dont feed good soo im to lazy to check over my spelling.

[JimmyBeam]

This is a mag forum, if you dont like it LOG THE HELL OUT!!!!

hey i got a couple Ion questions..........




























jk

[Aslan]

then he shouldn't be posting about how be doesnt listen (tri-pod, evlution, revvie shells) when their R&D department is very well run

I wasn't talking about how good of hoppers they make or whether or not they have sweet a$s squeegies. If I need to do a poll to find out that BE markers are the worst on the market, I will, but I think even a newb knows that. I didn't mean to piss off the captain of Team BE. :hail:

BE makes money because they sell junk at Wal-Mart and Wal-Mart shoppers will buy whatever junk happens to be there. You can fill a shelf with turd bologna and some numnut will buy it because it's at Walmart, the American experience. That doesn't mean it's quality just because it "makes millions." Their quality stinks, which is proven by the fact that very few people use BE products and continue to use them all throught their paintball "careers". Usually, they use them when they don't know any better...keep them awhile as a back-up...then eventually sell them or give them away or throw them away. I know it's like comparing "apples to zebras", but saying that BE makes quality markers and have great R&D because their hoppers are good is far more ignorant (in my opinion) than me posting about how they don't listen. :headbang:

If they listened, they'd hear what people say about their product and they'd try to improve it...not just say "look over there!", then kick the marker under a rug and pull out a hopper and say "look how sweet this X-Board is!" :bounce:

[the_lane]

well to start off good rant :cheers: and to agree with the people who talked about how if ppl wouldnt hav complained we wouldnt hav had all the greatthings ADG has made but you know what its how you complain you know what im saying? like instead of OMFG MAGS ARE SO HEAVY AND INNEFICIENT MY ANGEL IS SO MUCH BETTER111111111 or my mags to heavy :cry: my mags a gas hog :cry: yada yada yada but lets say constructive complaining:
lets try to make a new mod for tha batt pack on the E-MAG i dont like it DONE,to whom it may concern: my mag chops can you do somthing about this? now that is done(i hope it made sense!)PARAFRASING SOMEONE i think a company has done this and there are three letters in the name the first letter is A you figure out the rest


-lane the flying skwril
:shooting: :dance:

[Aslan]

I dont like mags

cuz they are old skool

i was going to flip cuse my e-mag dose not look old school

Alot of people talk about what newbs do that bother experienced players...well here's my gripe about what experienced players do that bothers newbs. They go out and buy some crazy looking goofy marker because it's the "next big thing", then they spend $1200 buying a bunch of stupid junk for it and getting it painted to match their friends. Then they dress up in stupid jerseys and pants that match their gun and buy colored helmets to match their guns and then they go on every website in the world and talk about how they have the sickest set-up in the world. Usually they love speedball...and stink at woodsball and scenario because they can't figure out that their XL Red Dye jersey doesn't help them hide in the woods nor does the sun bouncing off their all chrome annodized super marker nor does it help that their cool looking thermal mirror goggles make great targets. The only reason this rant pertains to the above post is it's people like that who will buy a marker because it's "Cool looking" or it matches their pants...and those people are more annoying than anything else I can think of and huge turnoffs to potential paintball players that see those guys and think, "dang, I guess if I want to play paintball I have to dress like a bungwad and pay $1200 for a space-aged marker signed by God. :rolleyes: :shooting: :rolleyes: :cool:

However...I am jealous that their $100 thermal goggles don't fog up while I'm playing paintball in a fog after 5 minutes...so go them on that point. :hail:

[hipster]

I have been playing paintball Since pumps ruled and airball didnt exist
i was one of the first to buy the mag when it came out with a power feed and have owned many since, and I dissagree about the stop complaining, and a agree that the only way to make a good thing better is keep trying. I wish AGD would have finished the small round battery for the e/x mag they were working on( I would buy one)
and hope they keep pushing forward and make a rail system thats compatable with the eclipse , either that or make there own full elec trigger system with 9 volt , they have proven that the mag is fast real fast ,the have proven they can make it light, now they need to put it all together and make a gat that belongs on the air ball fields of the world , the x and e mags were just or should have been just the begining, ( and a little better on the air use would never hurt) as for all you that disagree -you all know you would be the first in line for the new small light full elec mag or the rail that would let you use the e2 just admit it

[RoadDawg]

The reactivity in a Mag trigger does not use any extra air. No air is vented and no pressure is vented. No energy is wasted.

What you experience is the pressure from the tank trying to open the on/off. Nothing more.

Final charged dump chamber pressure is the same regardless of input pressure, and it's the balance between charged pressure and residual pressure after firing than determines efficiency.

Unless someone has data to prove me wrong...

So your saying that no matter what pressure I use to move the on/off won't affect my efficency? I mean higher input pressure leads to more reactivity does it not?

Example if I use less pressure to move the on/off I should get less reactivity in the "bounce". If I was to turn up the pressure it can and will run away (one pull sets off several shots above 1000 usually), which from my experience of messing with it, sucked my tank dry faster with fewer shots being fired. So in other words what I'm saying is that by using more air to open the on/off should in turn makes your shots per tank go down. Which is why I got a great deal more shots then someone else with a 45/45 preset. Tank was filled about the same, I turned my output down (his was 900 and mine was 700) I got more shots per fill then the other guy did. It might be a difference of 50+ balls but still those extra 50 shots can come in handy. Was this a fluke or what? Or maybe I don't know enough about mags anymore to understand how they operate. :confused:

[sanity]

you all know you would be the first in line for the new small light full elec mag or the rail that would let you use the e2 just admit it

:cool: devilmag...lots of people waiting in line for months

[GT]

hey i got a couple Ion questions..........
jk


If you feel that AO is a better place to get that kind of ION than the "ion" boards. I find alot of irony in the fact that AO knows more about mags and other guns than anyother board out there.

[SpitFire1299]

Nice. :)

[sanity]

think JB's ion comment was a joke GT...

[GT]

think JB's ion comment was a joke GT...


I know,
but you do have to find it ironic that AO knows more about everyother gun out there besides mags.

[MicroMiniMe]

Must be that 'elitist attitude' we've been branded with, for:
doing research on marker capabilities
not blindly buying what tourney player X shoots
not always believing something to be truth after X opinions are made as such

Oh, yeah. Not everyone here owns a mag currently.
:bounce:

[GT]

Oh, yeah. Not everyone here owns a mag currently.



I think the question should be, Who still owns a mag? In that question contains the answer to why so many old school users have left.

[Lohman446]

I think the question should be, Who still owns a mag? In that question contains the answer to why so many old school users have left.


Like this http://www.automags.org/forums/showthread.php?t=173794

I was really surprised by the results of that informal poll... it indicates a large majority of people on AO not only own, but regularly use an Automag. I didn't expect that to have been true when I posted the poll.

[tyrion2323]

Like this http://www.automags.org/forums/showthread.php?t=173794

I was really surprised by the results of that informal poll... it indicates a large majority of people on AO not only own, but regularly use an Automag. I didn't expect that to have been true when I posted the poll.

It indicates that a large portion of people who responded to your poll own a mag. Whether that is an adequate representative population remains to be seen.

[shartley]

It indicates that a large portion of people who responded to your poll own a mag. Whether that is an adequate representative population remains to be seen.
Quite correct.

[Lohman446]

It indicates that a large portion of people who responded to your poll own a mag. Whether that is an adequate representative population remains to be seen.

THats why I used the words informal and indicates rather than simply poll and show.

[GT]

It indicates that a large portion of people who responded to your poll own a mag. Whether that is an adequate representative population remains to be seen.


or that there is a very vocal minority on AO, which is likley

[shartley]

or that there is a very vocal minority on AO, which is likley
And that is VERY true.

[mags247]

Nice Rant....

Mags are what they are.....mags. They are the battle tank of the field. Used properly they will last forever. They are not the most efficient, neither is my shocker. They aren'd that fast... So i use it as my practice snap shooting gun.

My only problem with AGD is there lack of willingness to take the mag in a new direction. Maybe the should start making Eframes like the Dmags that run off 9 volts. This would appeal to the people who already like mag (cept those with e/x mags, probably,= break their hearts because they don't have the top mag anymore) and those who are considering a mag. I spend 460 on my Rogue mag and loved it. I would have spent more if there was more options. But there wasn't so I bought a Shocker as my tourney gun. I like the DMag an all but I just don't have 6 months to wait for it. And PTP's new frame............................................. .................................................. .................................................. ............................................Just keep on waiting.

If AGD put some extra money into R&D and read the boards to see what there customers wanted they could surely come out with something new. But they wont, and AGD will keep heading int the direction they are in. Replacement parts for pre-existing guns, or the re-release of the 68 classic.

If anyone one from AGD is reading this ( I seriously doubt it ) buy the patent for the E frame and get that thing out to the loyal Mag owners who have bought your guns, still use your guns, defend your guns from bashing and reward them for all of their years of loyalty and patience. Maybe they will when they run out of replacement battery packs for the E/X mags.

Who knows? I just wanted to rant to.

[Demonio]

Damn - 5 Months later I see this rant.... :cry:

I would have loved to :cuss: my mind about everything that's here. But looks like it's already been said... nothing wrong with pssng and moaning, it's the bashing that hurts most.

:headbang: To my fellow Mag owners and supporters :headbang:

I've owned mags for 12 sum odd years now - Never had any major problems that couldn't be taken care of.

Always have loved my mags and always will -

Some folks want the best and end up getting what they can afford - Some folks can afford the best and end up getting unessessary options. I my friends insist on a Mag :cool:




-couldn't help but step on the soap box even for an instant, this rant was to good :clap:

[WARPED1]

:rolleyes:

Alright.. lets talk about something on the automag that hasn't already been discussed...

The newest ummm... hmm... yeh, ok nevermind

:cheers:
:p :p ROFLMAO Preach on brother.

[kman]

Good rant, but i've never been much for ranting. Out of all the guns i've ever owned, all i can think about is upgrading the 'ole mag. About the only product nowadays that interests me for it as far as upgrades is the pneu frame. Electro like speed is all it needs to be the perfect gun for me. Hopefully it will happen.

[Jerhew]

So your saying that no matter what pressure I use to move the on/off won't affect my efficency? I mean higher input pressure leads to more reactivity does it not?

Example if I use less pressure to move the on/off I should get less reactivity in the "bounce". If I was to turn up the pressure it can and will run away (one pull sets off several shots above 1000 usually), which from my experience of messing with it, sucked my tank dry faster with fewer shots being fired. So in other words what I'm saying is that by using more air to open the on/off should in turn makes your shots per tank go down. Which is why I got a great deal more shots then someone else with a 45/45 preset. Tank was filled about the same, I turned my output down (his was 900 and mine was 700) I got more shots per fill then the other guy did. It might be a difference of 50+ balls but still those extra 50 shots can come in handy. Was this a fluke or what? Or maybe I don't know enough about mags anymore to understand how they operate. :confused:

there are far too many variables for that to even be a valid experiment...
either way, i assure you that you're missing a lot, and it's definitely not air leaking out of the trigger thats affecting your efficiency, as you apparently believe.
ill elaborate if i have to.

[Meph]

Ugh. Tasters Choice IS piss and Mr.Coffee couldn't produce a decent cup of warm swill.

:spit_take

I just switched to Sanka.

Have a heart.

[Rudz]

r we too bored that we have to drag up months old threads? damn u demonio, let this die

[mobsterboy]

ALL GUNS have a negative aspect.

As much as it pains me to say this, the automag is the problem with the gun. Sure it is supanice, can be tuned and chrono +-2 fps, but its limitation is its design. Its about 5 years away from a spool valve and its pretty much outdated. Now the real problem is will ppl still love it even though its still based on a design 15 years ago. Sure they will, just like ppl love the design of the fuel injection system, a design made 17+years ago (care to argue with me? Ive got an '88 BMW that has fuel injection sitting in my driveway, so i know its gotta be an old system).

Face it guys, no one likes to call the home team losers, but we definitely need new players. I mean, mickey mantle(automag) and babe ruth(emag) might be hall of famers, but they are definitely too old to keep up with todays age

[dahoeb]

i like your comparisons mobsterboy.
but i don't believe any mid/high end marker is any better or any worse than the next, nowadays. (there are exceptions....)

with good quality markers, like dm's, angels, mags, etc; i believe the user is the person that decides whether the marker is good or not. its all perception and preference.

if player "A" hates a mag, but loves a matrix, while player "B" hates the matrix but loves the mag, which marker is better? simple, for player "A" its the matrix and for player "B" its the mag. thats all there is to it. preference.
if the marker you shoot isn't the one you prefer, it'll suck to you no matter what it says on paper.

i know a lot of maggers (myself included) who've never felt outgunned on the field. because we know we're holding the best marker in our hands.

[DaveSM]

Efficiency is simply over-hyped. I don't care if I can get 1200 shots on a marker X out of a 68/3k instead of 1150 on a marker Y. I simply don't care when it get past the amount of balls that I carry one the field. When I play speedball I play front and I don't carry that much paint. When I play outdoor I never carry over 1k paintball. When I play with my phantom I only carry 40-50 rounds so I could last many rounds before getting back to get some paint. Efficiency only really care when you play stock-class paintball and you want to get more shots out of a 12 grams.

[-=Squid=-]

What the hell is 'efficentcy?'

[Vex]

What the hell is 'efficentcy?'
C'mon Squid...you were schooled in Arkansas, you should know how to spell words phonetically.

[phantomhitman]

Efficiency is simply over-hyped. I don't care if I can get 1200 shots on a marker X out of a 68/3k instead of 1150 on a marker Y. I simply don't care when it get past the amount of balls that I carry one the field. When I play speedball I play front and I don't carry that much paint. When I play outdoor I never carry over 1k paintball. When I play with my phantom I only carry 40-50 rounds so I could last many rounds before getting back to get some paint. Efficiency only really care when you play stock-class paintball and you want to get more shots out of a 12 grams.

If you play at a field where the fill station is a long walk from the area you play it might matter. If you get tired of filling up after every game it could matter. It is not that big of a deal for me either (i get all day air) but I would like better effeciency if possible. It cannot hurt anything, so why not? However, I am not going to solely buy a gun because it is effecient.

[UTDragun]

If you play at a field where the fill station is a long walk from the area you play it might matter. If you get tired of filling up after every game it could matter. It is not that big of a deal for me either (i get all day air) but I would like better effeciency if possible. It cannot hurt anything, so why not? However, I am not going to solely buy a gun because it is effecient.
the reason why Ilike guns that are effiecient is that I love playing tournaments with 45/45's with no drops for good weight distribution, being able to stay close to the gun, and comfort. If I try playing with my xmag, Id run out of air before the game was over so Id ahve to move up a tank size which could unbalance everything.

[Torbo]

"Maybe it's lack of sleep, could be new meds I'm on I don't know,"

but all i hear is one more person complaining about how no one likes mags, and how they are just as good as everything else, and everyone should shoot one beacuse agd is a good company, and 15 year old guns shoot better than new guns.

heres the thing tho: NO ONE CARES. If you wanna shot a mag, do it. no one is stopping you from shooting whatever you want. you complaining isnt going to make people like mags more. And, it doesnt matter if people like mags, you can still shoot one even if no one else does. STFU and play paintball.

[P8ntBallBoom]

Opinions are like a**holes, everybody has one. That in mind let me state mine.

Sure, there are cons of the mag. But hey guess what, most of those things have been fixed by TK's brilliant mind. Of course as of late it's been a little on the slow side but regardless, if we've wanted it, he's brought it to us. What we have to realize is that complaining leads to better products. However, its when the complaining gets to the point where that's all you do, that's when you just need to shut up and play paintball as was said before.

My 2 cents