Creed of the Good Paintballer

[MadPSIence]

Please add your own.

I am an athele, not a "balla",
I am not agg,
I own a paintball marker, not a "gat",
Louis Vuitton and Gucci were made for rich old people in bollywood,
Not paintball players,
I don't care for hype, I care for what works,
Pink is for ballerina's, not paintball guns or apparel,
My marker is not agg, sick, or l337,
I think it's clean, quick and effective,
For every one time I pull my trigger,
One time, a ball shall exit the breech,
I wipe the sweat off my brow, not the paint off my shirt,
I can't pull 20bps, and neither can you,
I play for fun, not for image,
I play by an honor system, not by a win system
All I've cheated on, was Doom for PC.

also posted on PBN by myself... but those idiots probably can't come up with anything that doesn't end in !!!111one"

[WingMan13]

Ah, those were the days. :cheers:

[Carbon]

its not what you wear and how you wear it....its how you play.

[CaptainNeeda]

Amen...

[teufelhunden]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA.

maybe that's your small-town-canada paintball creed, but that doesn't apply anywhere.

The only paintballers who are athletes are X-Ballers. The rest have as much claim to being athletes as olympic divers.. sure, both take skill, but neither require the wide expanse of skills and athleticism, as, say, a basketball player.

Agg is a part of paintball. Get over it or leave the game. If that's how people want to look and act, that's their business.

See above re: fashion designers.

Hyped products tend to work.. Ion works, Timmys work, DM5s work.. all very well.

Pink goes with agg.

Your gun is whatever you want it to be. If I shoot a sick gat, that's what I shoot.

If I'm going to ramp, I'm going to ramp. If I'm going to bounce, I'm going to bounce. It's up to me to do it where it's acceptable.

Wiping has become the same as pushing off in basketball-- against the rules, but a part of the game.

Who's to say I can't pull 20? Maybe the planets are aligned, I ate my wheaties, did my speed, and am ready to rock..

Fun, I concur with.

Winning-- that's why we play tournaments

Cheating is a viewpoint.

[MadPSIence]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA.

maybe that's your small-town-canada paintball creed, but that doesn't apply anywhere.

The only paintballers who are athletes are X-Ballers. The rest have as much claim to being athletes as olympic divers.. sure, both take skill, but neither require the wide expanse of skills and athleticism, as, say, a basketball player.

Agg is a part of paintball. Get over it or leave the game. If that's how people want to look and act, that's their business.

See above re: fashion designers.

Hyped products tend to work.. Ion works, Timmys work, DM5s work.. all very well.

Pink goes with agg.

Your gun is whatever you want it to be. If I shoot a sick gat, that's what I shoot.

If I'm going to ramp, I'm going to ramp. If I'm going to bounce, I'm going to bounce. It's up to me to do it where it's acceptable.

Wiping has become the same as pushing off in basketball-- against the rules, but a part of the game.

Who's to say I can't pull 20? Maybe the planets are aligned, I ate my wheaties, did my speed, and am ready to rock..

Fun, I concur with.

Winning-- that's why we play tournaments

Cheating is a viewpoint.

you sir are a product.

[mandatory]

teufelhunden, you are gravely misguided. I hope as you grow older you see the folly in your statement, and you feel imbarresed by having said it.

[mandatory]

also, respect should be on the list

also, community. Its no fun when everyone hates on eachother. leave the intensity on the field.

[ojhspyro89]

you sir are a product.

wurd.

[teufelhunden]

you sir are a product.

Rofl, ok. I'm a product because I don't buy into the 'omg guys, we have to play paintball like they did in 1992 because anything other than that is a corruption of the game!!!11!!". If anybody is a product, you are a product, of the anti-modern paintball rhetoric that is regularly slung on these boards. I'm sorry that you take offense to people who match their gear and use words that you don't like. I'm sorry that you don't like the new rules of some leagues. I'm sorry that you feel intimidated, shunned, or left behind.

For the record, I generally play as is listed above. Hell, I take it a step further by playing pump.. but that doesn't mean I'm going to look down on other ballers who want to shoot a hopper in 7 seconds and wear pink and orange.

[MadPSIence]

Rofl, ok. I'm a product because I don't buy into the 'omg guys, we have to play paintball like they did in 1992 because anything other than that is a corruption of the game!!!11!!". If anybody is a product, you are a product, of the anti-modern paintball rhetoric that is regularly slung on these boards. I'm sorry that you take offense to people who match their gear and use words that you don't like. I'm sorry that you don't like the new rules of some leagues. I'm sorry that you feel intimidated, shunned, or left behind.

For the record, I generally play as is listed above. Hell, I take it a step further by playing pump.. but that doesn't mean I'm going to look down on other ballers who want to shoot a hopper in 7 seconds and wear pink and orange.

When did I say you have to play pump to be a respectable paintballer.

If you think that clean honest gaming is "1992" and no longer "cool" then you seriously need to rethink some things.

I think you're a little out of place here. You can post a counter-argument without belittleing (sp?) someone and trying to make ridicule. Furthermore if you so completely disagree with my post I believe you'd fit in better with the aggro kiddies on pbn.

[yakitori]

Im w/ teuf on this one. You guys play paintball like old foggies. Not that I use any of the 'agg' terms as you describe, but I know what they mean, and I dont hate on ppl that use them. Look at all the slang in skateboarding and bmx, etc. Stoked. Right on. aaariaght. Get over it.

Get over the ramping rule. Its getting old. You guys are still whining about a rule established quite some time ago. wah wah wahhhhh :cry:

LOL, playing paintball likes its still 1992. Thats what everyone pretends paintball should be. Get passed it guys. Paintball is not the same as it used to be. Its like a bunch of old guys griping that motocross has turned into freestyle, and OMG, thats not what dirtbiking was meant to be. :rolleyes:

[Thermus]

The only paintballers who are athletes are X-Ballers. The rest have as much claim to being athletes as olympic divers.. sure, both take skill, but neither require the wide expanse of skills and athleticism, as, say, a basketball player.




I lost all respect for you right there. Saying being a basketball player is easier than being a basketballplayer is just plain ignorant; Divers have to be is as good shape as anyone. They have to be strong, and at the same time swift and fluid. It also requires getting over the fear of hitting the water at a pretty high speed, and no matter how you land it hurts.

Before you knock diving, I suggest you try it. Basketball is a freaking joke.

(I am not a diver, BTW)

[yakitori]

The only paintballers who are athletes are X-Ballers. The rest have as much claim to being athletes as olympic divers.. sure, both take skill, but neither require the wide expanse of skills and athleticism, as, say, a basketball player.




I lost all respect for you right there. Saying being a basketball player is easier than being a basketballplayer is just plain ignorant; Divers have to be is as good shape as anyone. They have to be strong, and at the same time swift and fluid. It also requires getting over the fear of hitting the water at a pretty high speed, and no matter how you land it hurts.

Before you knock diving, I suggest you try it. Basketball is a freaking joke.

(I am not a diver, BTW)

someone doesnt know what an analogy is. :D

[MadPSIence]

that diving example was kinda bad.

replace diver with 10th grade rubber band shooting student

[teufelhunden]

The only paintballers who are athletes are X-Ballers. The rest have as much claim to being athletes as olympic divers.. sure, both take skill, but neither require the wide expanse of skills and athleticism, as, say, a basketball player.




I lost all respect for you right there. Saying being a basketball player is easier than being a basketballplayer is just plain ignorant; Divers have to be is as good shape as anyone. They have to be strong, and at the same time swift and fluid. It also requires getting over the fear of hitting the water at a pretty high speed, and no matter how you land it hurts.

Before you knock diving, I suggest you try it. Basketball is a freaking joke.

(I am not a diver, BTW)


I'm not disputing that diving takes a certain level of skill, the same way paintball and basketball both take a certain level of skill. But to put divers, who jump off a platform and do a trick for 4 seconds, in the same category [athletes] of [to keep it aquatic] 2000m swimmers is a far cry. Both have their own skillset, but swimming requires more. The same way that playing ice hockey is considered a sport, as it takes a wide variety of skills and athletic traits, whereas paintball is not-- most paintballers walk thru the woods and then every few minutes shoot/duck/dive. Not athletics.

[MadPSIence]

i think there's some confusion here between the athletic requirement and abilities of paintball players; and the amout of respect the overall morale of the sport really has these days.

[RogueFactoryKid]

I am an athele, not a "balla"Nor are you a spelling bee champion.

I own a paintball marker, not a "gat"Ever call your automobile a car? It's a term people use because it doesnt sound lame.

Louis Vuitton and Gucci were made for rich old people in bollywood,
Not paintball playersWell Actually it is made for paintball players. Do you think every kid with a LV headband made it himself? If it looks good why not wear it?

Pink is for ballerina's, not paintball guns or apparel,
My marker is not agg, sick, or l337Somebody isn't comfortable with their sexuality if they can't shoot a pink gun. I'm sure you shoot the best most upgraded tippmann on the block.

I can't pull 20bps, and neither can youIt's not what you can pull, it's what you can shoot.

I play by an honor system, not by a win systemThen you aren't a good paintball player, name a pro team that doesnt or hasnt cheated.

[TAW]

My Three rules.

1) If you have nothing nice to say then SHUT THE :cuss: UP.

2) Play by the rules.

3) Reread rule 1 and 2.

[MadPSIence]

My Three rules.

1) If you have nothing nice to say then SHUT THE :cuss: UP.

2) Play by the rules.

3) Reread rule 1 and 2.


^ Good enough for me

[SCpoloRicker]

To the argument of "You're living in the past / the game has advanced / thats the way it is now" arguments:

AO is not the new, cutting edge of the sport. Its a forum, and a set of players, most of whom don't enjoy or cannot persue the bleeding edge of the sport.

A lot of us tend to view some (not all) of the outside influences of the cutting edge of tourney play as a detriment to the recreational style that the majority of us play.

So, we aren't all going to be into high-end status equipment, win-at-all-cost attitude towards games, and the negative attitude that has become associated with (fairly or not) the tournament scene.

Athletics: paintball can considered a sport in my book. But only if the commitment level is as high as in any other sport.

And, speaking as a former dual AA water polo player/swimmer; diving takes huge amounts of commitment and practice. Lets see you jump off a four story building and do some flips... ;)

[bound for glory]

remember when lohman asked "why paintball is in the toilet", or words to that effect? when idiots say things like " cheating is a viewpoint". without naming names( start from the beginning of the thread, you'll find him) , you sir, are a moron. heres an idea, go play airsoft. you can cheat all you want over there.

[Jaan]

The last time I played I saw a lot of these little children in their color coordinated super 1337 monkey clothes with their hella expensive gats that mommy and daddy bought for them as a substitute for real emotional connections wiping their hits constantly. It's nice to know that these cheating posers will pretend their way through life ... until they're expected to actually accomplish something to justify the paycheck they're getting from the job they lied on their resume to get hired for. Then life will smack them down hard, and they'll spend the rest of their miserable lives asking me "do you want fries with that?" (c:

[minimag03]

I think your creed should be...

Don't Cheat

The whole AGG thing is here to stay. I have never really wanted to be AGG, and I'm going to be. I would shoot a pink "gat", but it would be because I like pink. teufelhunden is right when he said paintball is more skill than anything (although diving is harder than it looks).

[MadPSIence]

The last time I played I saw a lot of these little children in their color coordinated super 1337 monkey clothes with their hella expensive gats that mommy and daddy bought for them as a substitute for real emotional connections wiping their hits constantly. It's nice to know that these cheating posers will pretend their way through life ... until they're expected to actually accomplish something to justify the paycheck they're getting from the job they lied on their resume to get hired for. Then life will smack them down hard, and they'll spend the rest of their miserable lives asking me "do you want fries with that?" (c:

that's kind of extreme as much as those type of players bother me. :tard:

[Codekevin0403]

i like this thread.

[Army]

Teuf, fantasize for a moment if you will::::

$1,000,000 on the line, winner take all. You shoot me and I wipe. I shoot you and you wipe. We both stand up and empty all our pods at each other, then wipe it all off at the same time.

Are you telling me that the winner of the million dollars should be the first to clean himself off? This is good? Why play if you don't follow the rules? Why have rules? If wiping is OK, then full auto at 400fps is OK, right? Where do you draw the line at NOT following the rules?

I'll bet it's when they cheat and win against you.

In your basketball, pushing off is "part of the game". But what about when you are going for the game winning 3 pointer at the buzzer for the world championship, and I push you...being "part of the game", you should accept that my cheating lost you the game...right?

Hey, why play in the first place! Let's all meet at the field, get our gear ready, then go home declaring each other the winner because you guys cheated...or we cheated...or what?

Are we still fantasizing, or is this the only way you have to win? I hate cheaters. When one cheats/wipes against me, then I have no problem bonus balling the hell out of them, since they apparantly prefer dishonest and poor sportsmanship. Heck, I'll shoot at them until they leave the tapeline.

Play honest, play straight, or why bother?


(Oh yeah...#2 CIF in Diving, '77-'78)

[CaptainNeeda]

WOOT, I love a good flame war... wait, no I dont...

[Duzzy]

Quote:
Originally Posted by MadPSIence
I play by an honor system, not by a win system

Then you aren't a good paintball player, name a pro team that doesnt or hasnt cheated.

Now I realize this is how you feel and I respect your right to feel this way so please don´t take this as a personal attack because it is a general rant but...

Disgusting.

That is the only word I can use and it doesn´t even convey the amount of negativity I have directed towards this type of attitude... At the very least making the assumption that he isn´t a good player was ignorant, but saying he isn´t good because he doesn´t cheat is so far out there I don´t think I will ever understand it.

And for the record I am not one of the Gun Toting Red-Neck Republicans of Paintball that lives in fear of anything new or technologically advanced. I am actually 19 so I am not an old-fogey either. I use pumps and electros equally and I suck equally with both. And I don´t suck because I don´t cheat I suck because paintball is a fun thing that I do monthly and sometimes less.

When I get my yearly elimination it is because I earned it not because I wiped off hits until I finally hit someone and then walked out bragging about my "mad skills".

I refuse to follow the mob mentality of "he did it so I can too...". The Pros can cheat until they turn blue in the face and I won´t care. And surprise surprise it doesn´t make it right.

"When the world is insane the sane go to the nut-house"-Unknown

Somehow that seems like an appropriate quote.


Quote:
Originally Posted by MadPSIence
Pink is for ballerina's, not paintball guns or apparel,
My marker is not agg, sick, or l337

Somebody isn't comfortable with their sexuality if they can't shoot a pink gun. I'm sure you shoot the best most upgraded tippmann on the block.


I highly doubt that the color pink and someone´s opinion of it has anything to do with their sexuality. Call me crazy but I doubt it. And I do agree that pink should be in paintball. My X-Mag is a black to claret (read purplish-pink) fade and it is very nice looking. It is in the April GOTM if anyone is interested.



I'm not disputing that diving takes a certain level of skill, the same way paintball and basketball both take a certain level of skill. But to put divers, who jump off a platform and do a trick for 4 seconds, in the same category [athletes] of [to keep it aquatic] 2000m swimmers is a far cry. Both have their own skillset, but swimming requires more. The same way that playing ice hockey is considered a sport, as it takes a wide variety of skills and athletic traits, whereas paintball is not-- most paintballers walk thru the woods and then every few minutes shoot/duck/dive. Not athletics.

For some odd reason I think that while something may look un-atheletic it actually might be... Tell me ballerinas are not atheletic. Please, someone tell me that. Then take an athelete and see if they can compete. Same with diving. I think it would be a lot easier to swim a little over a mile than to learn how to control my body the way they do with the level of control they do.

I am done for now, good night from Denmark.

In general most of the responses have not impressed me but make an intelligent unoffensive reply to this and I will be impressed.

[minimag03]

When one cheats/wipes against me, then I have no problem bonus balling the hell out of them, since they apparantly prefer dishonest and poor sportsmanship.

Shoot them faster than they can wipe, eventually they will get the idea ;) .

[Jaan]

that's kind of extreme as much as those type of players bother me. :tard:
That's reality. Cheating only gets you so far, at some point you have to develop actual skills, or you'll fail. If you cheat in life, no matter what it is, then you're only cheating yourself. Yeah, I know it's cliche', but it's true lol. Once you're in the real world nobody will pay you thousands and thousands of dollars a year for pretending to have skills.

[etjoyride]

Im w/ teuf on this one. You guys play paintball like old foggies. Not that I use any of the 'agg' terms as you describe, but I know what they mean, and I dont hate on ppl that use them. Look at all the slang in skateboarding and bmx, etc. Stoked. Right on. aaariaght. Get over it.

Get over the ramping rule. Its getting old. You guys are still whining about a rule established quite some time ago. wah wah wahhhhh :cry:

LOL, playing paintball likes its still 1992. Thats what everyone pretends paintball should be. Get passed it guys. Paintball is not the same as it used to be. Its like a bunch of old guys griping that motocross has turned into freestyle, and OMG, thats not what dirtbiking was meant to be. :rolleyes:

I agree with Yakitori on this one, just because i don't use all of the "cool" paintball terms doesn't mean i think everyone that does is ruining the sport. THere are still people that play the old school way, and then the rest play the way that is widely accepted today, if you don't like the way paintball is played now, find some people that agree with you and play by your own set of rules.
And just for the record, i agree with all of the stuff about playing honest and fair, but if some people don't then there the ones that have to live with themselves, knowing that they cheat to win.

[MadPSIence]

Once again if non-cheating is considered old-school then the sport is in a lot of trouble.

[bound for glory]

i don't cheat. and at 37, i doubt i'll start. but i have no problem empting on a wiper. you want to ruin my day, you'll remember it all week long. really, theres no point in posts like this. too many cheaters try to justify their scumbag mode of play.

[KRAKMT]

Exactly Army!

Why play if you are just going to cheat! Why spend a grand to travel to a tourney to play and then have it decided by he who cheats the best. It is cheating anyway you slice it, whether a ref caught you or not. You won nothing. You lost selfrespect and dignity. Everyone has a line at which they will cross. In my opinion if your line is that low- I don't trust you around my gear or my friends.





Teuf, fantasize for a moment if you will::::

$1,000,000 on the line, winner take all. You shoot me and I wipe. I shoot you and you wipe. We both stand up and empty all our pods at each other, then wipe it all off at the same time.

Are you telling me that the winner of the million dollars should be the first to clean himself off? This is good? Why play if you don't follow the rules? Why have rules? If wiping is OK, then full auto at 400fps is OK, right? Where do you draw the line at NOT following the rules?

I'll bet it's when they cheat and win against you.

In your basketball, pushing off is "part of the game". But what about when you are going for the game winning 3 pointer at the buzzer for the world championship, and I push you...being "part of the game", you should accept that my cheating lost you the game...right?

Hey, why play in the first place! Let's all meet at the field, get our gear ready, then go home declaring each other the winner because you guys cheated...or we cheated...or what?

Are we still fantasizing, or is this the only way you have to win? I hate cheaters. When one cheats/wipes against me, then I have no problem bonus balling the hell out of them, since they apparantly prefer dishonest and poor sportsmanship. Heck, I'll shoot at them until they leave the tapeline.

Play honest, play straight, or why bother?


(Oh yeah...#2 CIF in Diving, '77-'78)

[Chipper]

Teuf, fantasize for a moment if you will::::

$1,000,000 on the line, winner take all. You shoot me and I wipe. I shoot you and you wipe. We both stand up and empty all our pods at each other, then wipe it all off at the same time.

Are you telling me that the winner of the million dollars should be the first to clean himself off? This is good? Why play if you don't follow the rules? Why have rules? If wiping is OK, then full auto at 400fps is OK, right? Where do you draw the line at NOT following the rules?

I DELETED SOME BECAUSE IT IS RIGHT ABOVE MY POST
Now, I really don't want to take sides in this but......

How often are you going to play for that kind of prize? What are the chances of that situation? How would a ref not see you? To many what ifs.

Basketball, yes, pushing is part of the sport. I HAVE been in that kind of situation, and I was pushed. I didn't make it, I just got irritated. But, I realized that people don't always play by the rules and take way to much pride in winning, even if it is by cheating.

People love to win. It's natural. So we do anything in our power to win. Sure, I think cheating in paintball is immoral and wrong, but I know you have been hit by a paintball and you didn't notice, or a ref didn't notice. I know I have. Is that bad?

Cheating is part of any sport. Look at baseball, steroids are running rampant. Football, same issue. Basketball too, and the fact that they are always making fouls. Hell, in the business world, people WILL cheat you out of your money.

Cheating is wrong, but it is part of live because we are ignorant humans. We need to get over it.

[KRAKMT]

That is justifications and acceptance. People cheat everyday- I know I just left a prosecuting attorney job. Criminals are cheaters- don't want to follow the rules. Do we change the rules or the behavior? Society (and paintball) says its wrong to cheat. Can't rationalize it. No paintball permits wiping- just as speeding it is not but people do it and then cry about the consequences.
It's not a refs fault for not catching cheating- it is your fault for cheating. Psychology has a term for that- external locus of control and it is present more often in adolescence.







Cheating is part of any sport. Look at baseball, steroids are running rampant. Football, same issue. Basketball too, and the fact that they are always making fouls. Hell, in the business world, people WILL cheat you out of your money.

Cheating is wrong, but it is part of live because we are ignorant humans. We need to get over it.

[NoForts4Me]

Cheating is wrong, but it is part of live because we are ignorant humans. We need to get over it.No, we don't. More people need this:

in·teg·ri·ty n. 1. Steadfast adherence to a strict moral or ethical code.

I was playing in a tournament many years ago, and one of my teammates was shot on the bottom of his foot. He immediately stopped, and called a ref over to look at the sole of his shoe, and the ref called him out. Now that's playing the game right. I don't care if it was 1993, that is the way to play the game, even today.

Every time I step on the field, I play to win. If I don't, while I may be dissapointed, I am not going to stoop to cheating just to win. Cheating just makes victory hollow. Anyone who cheats playing rec-ball really has issues, in my book. People who criticize others who don't cheat (in Paintball or life) also needs to take a hard look at themselves.

I see many people equate wiping with holding in football, or a push off in basketball. But I tend to think of it as more of a taboo foul/cheat like corking a bat, or a crack-back block. Because of the nature of paintball, ONE person wiping can completely change a game, or determine the outcome, especially when you talking about teams that are 5v5 or 3v3. I just can't see how someone can do that and feel good about it after the game is over.

[Jonno06]

Shoot them faster than they can wipe, eventually they will get the idea ;) .



^^ :rofl:


and by the way, i have plenty of bonus balls for anyone who thinks cheating is part of the game. and oh yea, it'll be from my marker thats about 6 years old.

[barrel break]

What you got against pink?
Overall, I would keep maybe 1/3 of that list.

[A-5 outcast]

Please add your own.

I am an athele, not a "balla",
I am not agg,
I own a paintball marker, not a "gat",
Louis Vuitton and Gucci were made for rich old people in bollywood,
Not paintball players,
I don't care for hype, I care for what works,
Pink is for ballerina's, not paintball guns or apparel,
My marker is not agg, sick, or l337,
I think it's clean, quick and effective,
For every one time I pull my trigger,
One time, a ball shall exit the breech,
I wipe the sweat off my brow, not the paint off my shirt,
I can't pull 20bps, and neither can you,
I play for fun, not for image,
I play by an honor system, not by a win system
All I've cheated on, was Doom for PC.

also posted on PBN by myself... but those idiots probably can't come up with anything that doesn't end in !!!111one"


:cheers: i fully agree, its good to here that some ppl still play out of honor and for fun, not like those a-holes at tippmann forums............

[A-5 outcast]

i don't cheat. and at 37, i doubt i'll start. but i have no problem empting on a wiper. you want to ruin my day, you'll remember it all week long. really, theres no point in posts like this. too many cheaters try to justify their scumbag mode of play.


i hosed down a wiper with my a5(no insults please) i got "sniper" set up , flatline , stock , .....responsive trigger, i shot him 38 times

[Linkwarner]

I hate playing with cheaters, you earned your elimation, you should get it, not have someone who you just shot, turn around and shoot you. That takes away all the skill of the game. If you wipe you suck. period

[SCpoloRicker]

i hosed down a wiper with my a5(no insults please) i got "sniper" set up , flatline , stock , .....responsive trigger, i shot him 38 times

Oh fine. No insults.

/38?!?

[Slimm Jimm]

If playing ball in the Nineties is playing honest, (not wiping, playing on, appreciating the refs), then obviously i'm stuck in some kind of time warp. that is how paintball was introduced to me, and that is how i continue to play. I have played in tournaments where money is the prize, not much money, but it still takes some of the sting off of the expenses for entry, paint, and housing. I know the feeling and still played with integrity.

I have made it onto an excellent team without idolizing and imitating "pro" teams just because they are pro. I may play NPPL style ball only, but I still consider myself an athlete. I go about "training" different than most other serious teams do. The format of paintball does not dictate whether or not how athletic someone is, someone's athleticism is determined by their abilities and their willingness to learn.

One thing that i have loved about paintball from the outset is that, while we do have "Professional" Paintball Celebrities, we also have local paintball celebrities that are looked up to and are able to be reached talked to. I a couple of my first years playing tournaments in awe of a local team here. Granted that the team had been to some big events, but still was able to see and speak, and learn from them. I have also developed a love for the game that is solidly anchored in the fact that it is still rooted in honor, and here at my home field, i have no problem using a few extra balls to instill a sense of honor in a young up and coming gun.

I owe my current life to this game, and i play for the fun of the game.

[AzrealDarkmoonZ]

When one cheats/wipes against me, then I have no problem bonus balling the hell out of them, since they apparantly prefer dishonest and poor sportsmanship. Heck, I'll shoot at them until they leave the tapeline.

Have we got to the point where outlaw justice is the only way to go against cheating? What happened to informing the owner and using your dollars as a vote. I am sorry but overshooting is far far worse than wiping, especially in a recreational game. It is the fields and refs responsibility to dispense justice when it comes to cheating, not YOU.

I beleive RamboPreacher said it best when he said he plays to have fun.

Az

[gc82000]

Shoot them faster than they can wipe, eventually they will get the idea ;) .

you cant wipe welt now can you.

[tyrion2323]

I'm not disputing that diving takes a certain level of skill, the same way paintball and basketball both take a certain level of skill. But to put divers, who jump off a platform and do a trick for 4 seconds, in the same category [athletes] of [to keep it aquatic] 2000m swimmers is a far cry. Both have their own skillset, but swimming requires more. The same way that playing ice hockey is considered a sport, as it takes a wide variety of skills and athletic traits, whereas paintball is not-- most paintballers walk thru the woods and then every few minutes shoot/duck/dive. Not athletics.

You're generalizing way too much, and it ends up looking like you're talking out of your butt. It's easy to tear apart madPSI's list, but going ahead and doing it doesn't actually mean anything...it just makes you look bad, bro.

I'm saying this as someone who respects most of your ideas and posts, AND as someone who has been around to know both your newer and older psots - give up the 'volatile misunderstood tourney player' thing, it's just as bad as the 'jaded oldschool woodsplayer' thing. Again, I'm saying this as someone with a similar mindset towards paintball.

[yakitori]

I dont agree w/ wiping. Cheating has been around as long as the game. PPL have ALWAYS wiped. Dont act like its new and not oldschool. The oldschool way of ball that we are referring to is at your semi auto statement, and your appearal, color of guns, paintball terms that ppl use.

That was the majority of your argument, yet ppl pick a wedge issue like wiping and put it under a microscope. All he said was wiping is part of the game. And it is. PPl do it. PPL always have.

I know a lot of ppl that gripe about wiping, but Ive shot them on the foot cause it was sticking out, and they pull back in and tuck their feet under their but and clean it off on the ground. Im sure the ppl that whine about it here have done the same. Dont be a hipocrit.

Get over yourselves here. Being / looking cool is in the eye of the beholder. I dont think a lot of ppl look cool or shoot a gun that matches my taste, but I dont start a thread griping about it.

[A-5 outcast]

Oh fine. No insults.

/38?!?

thanks for not insulting me i was bombarded on the TIPPMANN forum if you can believe that one , they are all immature ppl i'd like to duel. and yes 38 times . i shot them they wiped and shot me , i got angry and proceeded to light em up a5 style

[Konigballer]

you have to fogive me, I live in Georgia, but what the hell is agg? From the connotations it sounds like flashy rich kids who paintball but clear it up for me will yah. :)

[MadPSIence]

agg is some word made up by the HK army followers who are essentially the largest group of posers in paintball who wear certain things and try to fit in and fill an image.

it's supposed to mean "cool" or whatever..

IMO it's stupid and the whole HK thing is a disgrace to the sport. Go to PBN and just look at the HK kiddies.. (actually don't, stay here)

[peewee]

YAK gotta ask how old are you?? I'm an old-timer 37 & played "back in the day." As far as cheating goes yes there are always cheaters & there was back then, but they weren't "hero's " to be looked up to. If someone was caught cheating there was usually sever repercussion's. My team flat out kicked you off the team no matter what you skill set might be. Our Captain got caught & was gone in a flash. Just so you understand he was blackballed from all the local paintball tournament teams. My team's motto was "Honor & Integrity" & we lived & died by it. My older brother forfeited a game when he found out that he had played thru a hit on his pack. By the position of the hit the last guy (it was 1 on 1) on the opposing team couldn't have hit him. I remember standing there with pride knowing that he had done the right thing. The other team captain couldn't believe that we forfeited "I'd never do that" was his comment. Hell! Dan Bonebrake was in shock because it dropped us out of 2nd overall. We still pulled third & got the sportsmanship award. The age old question comes to mind if everyone else is jumping off a cliff do you follow??

[teufelhunden]

Since only Army made an original point, aside from the OMG TEUF YOU'RE EVIL YOU COCK SMOKER GET OUT OF PAINTBALL! I'll address his post--

In every sport, in every game, there's a fudging of the rules. Basketball, there's pushing off , football [same as basketball], everybody holds just a little, or hits outside of the 5 yard buffer, pass interference, etc. If the refs wanted to call every technicality, then the games would never end. The same with paintball. If every gun that shot 101 shots on 100 trigger pulls was called for bouncing, if every smuge of a hit, if gun was chrono'd every shot to make sure it doesn't hit 285.001-- paintball would not be fun. Paintball would be just what you said-- well, since none of us can play completely legally and inside the rules, well, then, screw that. For the high-horsers out there-- ever touch a hit to see if it broke? Can be considered wiping, and if we're playing straight technical paintball, you and a teammate are watching. That said, I'm not a fan of blatant wiping, not a fan of every move resulting in a superman dive, etc. etc. However, I've accepted it as part of the game, the same way I accepted that I was gonna get pushed off of and elbowed under the rack, the same way I knew every offensive tackle I lined up against was going to hold me. I understand that when I step on the field, the rules are going to be stretched, twisted, torn, and broken. In doing so, I adapt the same way I do in other games. Anticipate the push off, be a step ahead. Break the hold. Shoot the wiper in the face, hit him twice, hit him 10 times. Call for a paint check every single time a shot goes near him.

Actually, [b]tyrion made a good post too, so he can get a response; I left tourney ball, wasn't into it anymore. I got tired of playing only to win, so I changed my own paintball creed and bought a phantom and some 10 rnders and played for fun. Stopped playing the "let's see who can dump more cases in a weekend" game, stopped playing the "if I wipe harder, i win" game. I'm not talking as a tourney baller [sorry, athlete :rolleyes:], I'm talking from my view of where paintball is today. I don't think the game is based on honesty-- if it was, we'd play airsoft because that's all you have. And it's cheaper. This game has become one of who pushes the rules the most, reffing consistency, and personal ethics. And I accept it-- I'd go so far as to say I embrace it. That's the game today, at least in the mainstream. I always have the option to play with honest people, play at my own field, yadda yadda-- but I don't, because I've accepted today's game.

Hm, someone else made a decent post.. finding: Ah, Ricker. I understand that most players on here are not the top end tourney ballers out there with the intention of winning every time. But that said, when someone generalizes what a 'good paintballer' should be, it encompasses those whom this board does not generally represent. A good paintballer, in the most basic sense, is the paintballer who wins. Chances are, that good paintballer may ramp his $1500 machine gun. He may even wear 219 layers to promote bounces, and superman when he feels a hit otb. Does this make him bad? Not in my book. It makes him doing everything he can to stay competitive. And even though this is not the image AO players want to portray, it's still who is on the fields today. Momma's boys with DM5s in C5 gear who never played before Angels and Shockers, who don't care about PSI's 'good paintballer.'

Here's my creed of the good paintballer:
-Plays in a manner appropriate to where he is
-Runs his mouth only when accepting of the consequences
-Plays his heart out every time he steps on the field
-Does not cry and moan about a missed call, call people cheaters, and does not moan about the type of paintball [not speed/woods..] being engaged in where he decided to play
-Doesn't try to force his views on others
-Accepts his decision to play on the airball field with the Dye-Babies or in the woods in camo, and accepts the quirks of each game

And you get the point.

[p u r e e v i l]

I am a"balla",
AGG is the way to be, (not really, though)
My gat's just as sick as your gun,
Louis Vuitton and Gucci were made for us to look sweet when we ball,
Hype's homosexual,
Pink is my favorite color, I'll sport it on my gear and my gat,
My marker is not agg, sick, or l337,
I think it's clean, quick and effective,
For every one time I pull my trigger 10 balls fly towards the emeny like a swarm of angry bees!
I wipe the sweat off my brow, not the paint off my shirt... until the other team cheats.
I can't pull 20bps, and neither can you,
I play for the ladies,
The shirts do say "Cheaters Live Longer"
All I've cheated on, was... nevermind.


I modified it to the standards that some of us play at these days, or see the sport as. I do not wipe, don't get that impression. It's just plain and simple, some do.

[usmc8892]

I'm sure it has been said too many times already, but i'm saying it again: If you are going to cheat, why bother to play in the first place? It's just a game! Amazingly enough, if you get eliminated, you get to play again the very next game! There's too much angst not enough fun, bring back the fun!!!

[Army]

In football, basketball, LaCross, field hockey etc. holding, pushing, tripping etc. can be an unconscious act due to the adrenaline running hard. Refs recognise most of those and do not call them.

But in paintball, a wipe begins with KNOWING that you are hit, and deliberately hiding the evidence. I'm not talking about the ones that you don't feel on your pods or gun, but chest/head/hand/leg/arm/gogg shots that get your attention with pain or a loud noise off your noggin.

Knowing you have been legally eliminated, and purposely breaking the rules in order to remain in the game to eliminate those on the other team that do NOT cheat....is wrong in so many ways.

Again, cheat against me, and suffer the consequences. You don't want to play by the rules, then don't complain to anyone when the rules are violated AGAINST you. Cheaters suck. Cheating should hurt.

[Target Practice]

Cheating should hurt.

Kinda like stupid?

[sanity]

well well teuf you've incited another riot. Remind me why I am not suprised...

My $.02:

I think that it is a difficult call to decided whether or not paintball is a sport. By definition a sport is "any game that requires physical activity and involves a degree of competition" - and this certainly includes paintball. However, i still do not personally consider pool, bowling, or even golf (which i love to play) a sport, though all of these would also fall into the aforementioned definition. To me a sport is something that requires physical feats above and beyond what an ordinary person could perform. This does not include skills, otherwise card tricks and spellin bees and artistry could be considered sports. To me a sport is a competitive environment that tests ones athleticism, and to be honest any regular joe could play woodsball or even a speedball backman. (NOTE: do not think that this discounts the skills that good backmen have, it looks simply from a physical standpoint)

As far as cheating goes - in any sport and / or competitive environment there has always been and will always be cheating. It is simply the competitive nature of man...boundaries will be pushed to win. Because of this rules change - in addition to accepted standards. The results of this are seen in paintball as clearly as anything else. Ramping is now legal in some leagues and wiping is a common practice. It is quite possible that the only way to compete in a modern tournament scene is to wipe. I think that a key point yet to be made is that you have to go to sleep with only yourself at night. If you find bending the rules to be an acceptable practice then so be it, I do not condemn you in any way. You doing what you have to in order to compete. However, if you do hold yourself to a higher standard and follow the rules with unwavering steadfastness, I salute you. Be comfortable with how you play, and dont judge others.

oh and people...there is a difference between what is said (opinions) and what is done (actions). I've played with some of the more villified posters on this thread (ok - just 1), and would do so again. 1337 |34114 ;)

peace fellas - sanity

[Jaan]

I've always looked at it as simple friendly competition between individuals ... one of many mock combat sports. It is a way to test yourself against an opponent and to be able to endulge in the thrill of victory without the disrespect of death to your enemy. If you cheat, you didn't really win. I suppose if you're shallow that is enough for you.

[fullofpaint]

[Somebody isn't comfortable with their sexuality if they can't shoot a pink gun. I'm sure you shoot the best most upgraded tippmann on the block.
[/QUOTE]


Wait......I do shoot the most upgraded tippmann on the block...... :dance: :dance:

[LudavicoSoldier]

I refuse to cheat. Plain and simple. I will not, nor have I ever cheated. If you cheat you don't deserve to walk off the field with anything but a ton of welts. I hear all these people justifying cheating, "its part of life" blah blah blah. Keep telling yourself that. Go on. its this kind of mentality that keeps cheating rampant. I hear you say "oh but the prizes, we MUST win". What a bunch of losers. Go shoot yourself out.

[yakitori]

YAK gotta ask how old are you?? I'm an old-timer 37 & played "back in the day." As far as cheating goes yes there are always cheaters & there was back then, but they weren't "hero's " to be looked up to. If someone was caught cheating there was usually sever repercussion's. My team flat out kicked you off the team no matter what you skill set might be. Our Captain got caught & was gone in a flash. Just so you understand he was blackballed from all the local paintball tournament teams. My team's motto was "Honor & Integrity" & we lived & died by it. My older brother forfeited a game when he found out that he had played thru a hit on his pack. By the position of the hit the last guy (it was 1 on 1) on the opposing team couldn't have hit him. I remember standing there with pride knowing that he had done the right thing. The other team captain couldn't believe that we forfeited "I'd never do that" was his comment. Hell! Dan Bonebrake was in shock because it dropped us out of 2nd overall. We still pulled third & got the sportsmanship award. The age old question comes to mind if everyone else is jumping off a cliff do you follow??

Thanks for your little analogy. I am old enough to have played in the 90s. What does it matter anyway, everyone here treats others like they are 12 yo and dont know anything. Its funny cause the ppl that do it are usually under 20 yo.

And Ill say it again. This site is reminding me of the Bush campaign. Pick a single wedge issue and put it under the microscope. That wasnt the main point of view of the thread. The point teuf made was that wiping is part of the game. Whether you do it or not, other ppl do and it still exists. Thatsthe poin that was made. NOw everyone turned this thread into a cheating discussion. :rolleyes:

[peewee]

Your welcome!!! I don't think that someone chose the specific issue of cheating to focus on, but with the general attitude of the afore mentioned type of player it is common place for them to cheat & makes itself the focal point. Which is a pain in the A$$. You know the type. Sadly those who run the fringes with appearance or playing style while not being cheaters or the freaks get bunched in with them. I honestly believe that +95% of players dont cheat, but I also believe that most people with a strong moral standing about game play have the right to complain. I went to a local tournament last month & was pleasantly surprised at how many were stand up players. I had all the horror stories online so I went in expecting the worse. One team got caught cheating in all three of their first games & were asked to leave. Couple of the guys were well known locals that lost a lot of face.

[ultralight]

"Ever call your automobile a car? It's a term people use because it doesnt sound lame. "

"gat " does sound lame. i'll call mine a marker.

"If it looks good why not wear it?"

if you think that louis vuitton (sp) crap looks good then by all means please do wear it. then i can laugh at you. i swear those designers are just trying to come up with the silliest looking fabrics so that they can make a killing and then laugh at the people who bought their ugly clothes. they've probably got a wager on who can sell the ugliest pattern.

people have singled out cheating because it is the one issue mentioned in the original post that actually matters.

wether or not you have an AGG pink LV gat has no real bearing on the game. cheating does.

as far as accepting cheating goes, if a speeding car ran over you most beloved pet would you just shrug it off as part of life because the driver obviously had somewhere important to be or would you be upset.

breaking the rules/laws is still illegal no matter what the prize at the end.

i find it interesting that the people defending cheating still call it cheating. i would have thought that they would come up with some PC term to villify it even less by now. come on people, it's cheating! would you accept it if one out of every three earned eliminations was stolen from you by a cheater? i know, you'd probably say that you just have to work harder next time or shoot more next time or whatever. NO, that is a defeatist attitude. grow a pair and fight for what is right. instead of bending over and becoming part of a corrupt system why not try to change the system from the inside? i'm not talking about going into a tournament and losing your butt while trying not to cheat, i'm talking about instilling a sense of integrity in tomorrows tourny players.

i think that it is unfair to say that just because someone decides that they don't like cheating and AGG kiddies that they deserve to be labeled honorary fogies.

i feel that he was trying to kill the disease by treating the symptoms.
who ends up being the most annoying person on/off the field any given weekend? the guy in the black shirt and cargos shooting an old spyder clone or the AGG 14 year old all decked out in dye and jt gear with a $1200 super marker with grips that say "contract killer" on them?
in my experience ten times out of ten it was the latter.

and on a related note, i thought that the tournament scene was created as an outsider friendly window into the sport that had shed the "paramilitary" references. and now we have the equally if not more offensive contract killers grips and the evil pimp marker. way to go guys, johnny's mom will love that.

[Lohman446]

if you think that louis vuitton (sp) crap looks good then by all means please do wear it. then i can laugh at you. i swear those designers are just trying to come up with the silliest looking fabrics so that they can make a killing and then laugh at the people who bought their ugly clothes. they've probably got a wager on who can sell the ugliest pattern.

Quoted for truth.

[AzrealDarkmoonZ]

I have seen plenty of people wearing black sweatshirt and having a spyder in hand tout there skills above all. On the other hand I don't mind having people in jerseys and pants with the newest marker and contract killer grips, as long as they are friendly and bring an atmosphere of fun. I know somebody that was always complaining about his marker from clad in cargos and shooting a spyder, to his now tricked out Lasoya Intimidator. If a person comes up clad in a bunch of gear with a nice outfit the only general thing I assume is they have played before, and that assumption is proved/disproved on the first game.

I don't promote overshooting as an answer to wiping, its in bad form and honestly sounds hypocritical from those saying Wiping is Bad, but overshooting in response is acceptable. I have never intentionally overshot someone.

Maybe I am a new school player who does not condone cheating, and who does not condone player justice.

Az

[yakitori]

laughing at ppl for what they wear is VERY mature. Good going guys. You really make ppl that shoot mags look really cool when you laugh cause others choose a certain type of dress or appearance. There is nothing wrong w/ the LV headbands. They arent that expensive. Dye costs just as much.

Ppl at my field do the stupidest things to their masks, like put gothic stuff like spikes, rings, and horns, etc on them. :cool: I personally dont like it, but I dont laugh at them. That is how they express themself. Whats so funny about it?

honestly. Humility is immature and ppl can wear what they want and shouldnt have to live w/ some idiot chuckling about it because its not thier personal taste.

Grow up.

[yakitori]

"Ever call your automobile a car? It's a term people use because it doesnt sound lame. "

"gat " does sound lame. i'll call mine a marker.

"If it looks good why not wear it?"

if you think that louis vuitton (sp) crap looks good then by all means please do wear it. then i can laugh at you. i swear those designers are just trying to come up with the silliest looking fabrics so that they can make a killing and then laugh at the people who bought their ugly clothes. they've probably got a wager on who can sell the ugliest pattern.

people have singled out cheating because it is the one issue mentioned in the original post that actually matters.

wether or not you have an AGG pink LV gat has no real bearing on the game. cheating does.

as far as accepting cheating goes, if a speeding car ran over you most beloved pet would you just shrug it off as part of life because the driver obviously had somewhere important to be or would you be upset.

breaking the rules/laws is still illegal no matter what the prize at the end.

i find it interesting that the people defending cheating still call it cheating. i would have thought that they would come up with some PC term to villify it even less by now. come on people, it's cheating! would you accept it if one out of every three earned eliminations was stolen from you by a cheater? i know, you'd probably say that you just have to work harder next time or shoot more next time or whatever. NO, that is a defeatist attitude. grow a pair and fight for what is right. instead of bending over and becoming part of a corrupt system why not try to change the system from the inside? i'm not talking about going into a tournament and losing your butt while trying not to cheat, i'm talking about instilling a sense of integrity in tomorrows tourny players.

i think that it is unfair to say that just because someone decides that they don't like cheating and AGG kiddies that they deserve to be labeled honorary fogies.

i feel that he was trying to kill the disease by treating the symptoms.
who ends up being the most annoying person on/off the field any given weekend? the guy in the black shirt and cargos shooting an old spyder clone or the AGG 14 year old all decked out in dye and jt gear with a $1200 super marker with grips that say "contract killer" on them?
in my experience ten times out of ten it was the latter.

and on a related note, i thought that the tournament scene was created as an outsider friendly window into the sport that had shed the "paramilitary" references. and now we have the equally if not more offensive contract killers grips and the evil pimp marker. way to go guys, johnny's mom will love that.

so you stereotype ppl for having those grips or that clothes? I dont find it annoying. I find it more annoying when ppl have nothing to do but look at others and snicker, giggle, or make sarcastic comments about their appearance. Its immature.

[Lohman446]

laughing at ppl for what they wear is VERY mature. Good going guys. You really make ppl that shoot mags look really cool when you laugh cause others choose a certain type of dress or appearance.
Grow up.

I shoot an Ion and laugh at people with LV stuff (not that I have ever seen one, but its kinda a conservative area) :D

[yakitori]

two words, immature behavior.

[Lohman446]

two words, immature behavior.

Two word reply

Don't care :D

[yakitori]

two more, both show. :p

[Lohman446]

two more, both show. :p


Don't care

Still...

Wonder how long I can keep this going :D

:rofl:

[mercury]

I guess I am also "old school" because I play with integrity. I absolutely refuse to wipe even if the other team does. Victory is much sweeter when you know you overcome someone on the other side cheating. If they do win, I don't bonus ball them, I simply shake hands and tell them, "Good game." Maybe that's not the cool thing to do but I do it anyways. I play without cheating (knowingly) and guess what, I still have fun. I've had my fair share of wins and losses against honorable people and cheaters alike. It's a shame to see that many find it necessary to cheat so they can keep up with the rest. It is possible to beat a cheater without cheating yourself and it may just make you a little bit better. I am not blind, though, as I do see cheating running rampant throughout the sport. It's just a shame that it's getting so bad. I even see it in rec ball where there is no real "need" to wipe because you'll be playing in another 5-10 minutes anyways if you get shot out. In any case, I deal with cheaters by simply trying a little bit harder the next time. That's all I can do because cheating is just wrong, no matter how you try to justify it. There simply is no way you can convince me that cheating is right. To any that think otherwise, perhaps your parents failed at teaching you the difference between right and wrong. I am by no means perfect, but I can tell right from wrong and do my best to stay on the right path.

As far as what you wear or what you shoot, I pay no mind to it or how you talk. It's how you act and play on that field as well as how you react afterwards, win or lose. I give everyone a chance despite their "image."

Lastly, for Teufelhunden...you have that name so I assume you have some connection to the Marine Corps (correct me if I'm wrong.) I would hope that you would try to uphold the idea of integrity.

[Jaan]

snip

The age old question comes to mind if everyone else is jumping off a cliff do you follow??
You bring up an interesting point. I've actually done that. Everyone else jumped off the cliff into the water at the local quarry and survived, so I followed them, and I survived lol

You've also reminded me of a quote I read recently in Wired magazine:

"There's upholding the principle. And there's being the only knucklehead left who's upholding the principle."

Bram Cohen - Creator: Bit Torrent :hail:

[yakitori]

I guess I am also "old school" because I play with integrity. I absolutely refuse to wipe even if the other team does. Victory is much sweeter when you know you overcome someone on the other side cheating. If they do win, I don't bonus ball them, I simply shake hands and tell them, "Good game." Maybe that's not the cool thing to do but I do it anyways. I play without cheating (knowingly) and guess what, I still have fun. I've had my fair share of wins and losses against honorable people and cheaters alike. It's a shame to see that many find it necessary to cheat so they can keep up with the rest. It is possible to beat a cheater without cheating yourself and it may just make you a little bit better. I am not blind, though, as I do see cheating running rampant throughout the sport. It's just a shame that it's getting so bad. I even see it in rec ball where there is no real "need" to wipe because you'll be playing in another 5-10 minutes anyways if you get shot out. In any case, I deal with cheaters by simply trying a little bit harder the next time. That's all I can do because cheating is just wrong, no matter how you try to justify it. There simply is no way you can convince me that cheating is right. To any that think otherwise, perhaps your parents failed at teaching you the difference between right and wrong. I am by no means perfect, but I can tell right from wrong and do my best to stay on the right path.

As far as what you wear or what you shoot, I pay no mind to it or how you talk. It's how you act and play on that field as well as how you react afterwards, win or lose. I give everyone a chance despite their "image."

Lastly, for Teufelhunden...you have that name so I assume you have some connection to the Marine Corps (correct me if I'm wrong.) I would hope that you would try to uphold the idea of integrity.

Oldschool was not referred to as "not cheating" New school was not referred to as "cheating" that was something that the dood took out of context. That was his only smart arse remark.

New school was referred to w/ the colors of guns, clothing, paintball terms, ramping board (where allowed), and other things. Like I said. It was taken out of context once again, by a fanboy. They sure know how to twist words. ;)

newschool players have integrity too. I dont consider myself oldschool cause to me oldschool is woodsballing w/ slow guns. And Ive even made the point that ppl cheated back then too.

[MadPSIence]

with the attitude of Tuef and Yak in this thread.. and the overall morale or pro-ball and even amateur that I can see even from being on PBN

V

V

Tell me just how I took anything out of context. You kids are a glowing example.. an absolute epitomy of how cheating IS new school. You both defend it and treat it just like ramping. Just because it exists and is widely practiced.. it's suddenly acceptable and something we need to do to adapt and win? So ramping becomes acceptable.. which I can't call cheating because you know.. it is in the rules. But when you embrace something wholly illegal and detrimental to the sport as if it was as necessary to accept as a controversial rule?

Back up

[hitech]

Agg is a part of paintball. Get over it or leave the game.


I will neither get over it nor leave the game.



If I'm going to ramp, I'm going to ramp. If I'm going to bounce, I'm going to bounce. It's up to me to do it where it's acceptable.


No, it's not. It is up to whom ever is in charge of the field you are playing at.



Wiping has become the same as pushing off in basketball-- against the rules, but a part of the game.


Only to those with no skills...




Who's to say I can't pull 20? Maybe the planets are aligned, I ate my wheaties, did my speed, and am ready to rock..


You do. To those who think they can see the contest at the top of this forumn.



Cheating is a viewpoint.


Why did I bother... :rolleyes:

_____________________________________________
<img src="http://www.synreal.net/sig/hitech.gif">

Hey Hitech your starting to sound like me! - AGD <img src=http://us.f2.yahoofs.com/bc/4161d9d6_207d/bc/Hosting/smiley_mini102.gif?CCCglmBB7Iu5tWX9>
Hitech is the man.... :eek: - Blennidae
The only Hitech Lubricant (http://www.kercon.com)

[MadPSIence]

lol.. sorry but I had to

"cheating is a viewpoint" just makes me giggle and think.. "statutory rape is a viewpoint"

gotta do both to adapt to your situations right Teuf?

:rofl:

[OneEyedPimp]

you have to fogive me, I live in Georgia, but what the hell is agg? From the connotations it sounds like flashy rich kids who paintball but clear it up for me will yah. :)

THANK YOU! I thought I was going to have to ask that.

[Lohman446]

two words, immature behavior.


And actually its not. Im mature enough to laugh at someone, not to there backs, and accept the consequences of doing it. Of course I'm the smallest person on my team @ 180lbs and a couple of my back players are around or over 300... Its funny, you hear about all the fistfights in paintball... noone ever offers to throwdown with us :cry:

Edit: and agg has something to do with being gay, apparently the in thing now. Some people disagree on that though.

[hitech]

Edit: and agg has something to do with being gay, apparently the in thing now...
:rofl:

[mercury]

:rofl:

It reminds me of the Southpark where they all suddenly think it's cool to dress as "gay" as possible and everybody does it. For those who may get their panties in a wad, that was my attempt at humor.
;)

[yakitori]

ok, just cause I disagree w/ you and dont go along w/ YOUR viewpoint means I have an attitude. I just said that cheating is PART OF THE GAME. IT HAPPENS. I DONT AGREE W/ IT. I DONT CHEAT. I DONT LIKE PPL THAT DO. That still doesnt excuse the fact that it is present in the sport. OR any sport.

You need to learn how to read ppl. And yes, if you laugh at ppl for their appearance, it IS immature behavior. Thats what teenagers do. Thing is, they dont realize that others are lauging at them for looking the way they do. Its immature, stupid, and not funny. You may think so, your click may think so, and ppl in your area may think so, but its not funny. Maybe in your group.

You freakin idiots argue w/ ANYTHING anyone says. Doesnt matter what it is. You are a bunch of know it all teenagers. If you arent a teenager, then you are just an overgrown immature adult that acts like a teenager. Or I like to say.....a Kidult.

You ppl need to get over yourselves. The world doesnt revovle around your style of paintball, or AO. There is nothing wrong with it.

You guys are a bunch of bigots. You make fun of ppls clothes, accuse everyone of cheating to be what YOU call "newschool". And then you start ragging on homosexuals. This site is starting to make me boil. Everyone is acting like a bunch of silly teenage girls.

[mercury]

Oldschool was not referred to as "not cheating" New school was not referred to as "cheating" that was something that the dood took out of context. That was his only smart arse remark.

New school was referred to w/ the colors of guns, clothing, paintball terms, ramping board (where allowed), and other things. Like I said. It was taken out of context once again, by a fanboy. They sure know how to twist words. ;)

newschool players have integrity too. I dont consider myself oldschool cause to me oldschool is woodsballing w/ slow guns. And Ive even made the point that ppl cheated back then too.

Disclaimer:

To be perfectly clear, I was not insinuating that nobody ever cheated before now but it is definitely more accepted now, no doubt about it. I am also not implying that every new player cheats or even the majority, but I do see it more frequently now than I used to.

[yakitori]

Disclaimer:

To be perfectly clear, I was not insinuating that nobody ever cheated before now but it is definitely more accepted now, no doubt about it. I am also not implying that every new player cheats or even the majority, but I do see it more frequently now than I used to.

I didnt insinuate that you insinuated that nobody cheated before. I just said that Newschool doesnt mean cheating. That was just made up in this thread. There is NO association.

I dont cheat, and dont like cheaters, but you have to play whatever team comes up on your bracket. If they are cheaters, you just know that you have to make sure they cant wipe by putting more than one ball on them, and making refs paintcheck quicker because they wipe.

The majority of NEWSCHOOL ballers dont wipe and cheat. Im sorry if you think they do, but you may just need to get out more if so. Or play more paintball. You are just repeating an echo chamber of ignorance that someone started on the internet. I dont see cheating all that much, and when ppl are caught they are penalized. How is that acceptance of cheating. That is penalizing ppl for doing it. You can be DQd if you keep cheating. How the hell is that acceptance.

[Eric Cartman]

I guess I'm almost as old school as it gets. I play rec ball in the forest. If you want to sport a pink marker in the forest, be my guest, I'll see it comin' a mile away. :)
I find that when there's nothing on the line (prizes etc), then people are much less inclined to cheat. Those that do cheat are recognized early in the day and then eliminated with extreme prejudice until they've had enough and leave.
Not that they're likely to care, but I can't take anyone seriously who says "AGG" or "gat". I try to make sure I'm on the opposite team from those guys. I enjoy shooting them and hearing them cry about getting wet /dirty.
I'll freely call out when I'm hit and congratulate whoever shot me if it was a difficult or particularly lucky shot. It just never even occurs to me to cheat.

[peewee]

You know Yak you keep throwing gas on the fire by calling names ... Maybe that's all you are doing for the fun of it. To Quote you...

You guys are a bunch of bigots. You make fun of ppls clothes, accuse everyone of cheating to be what YOU call "newschool". And then you start ragging on homosexuals. This site is starting to make me boil. Everyone is acting like a bunch of silly teenage girls.
Today 09:00 PM

You are generalizing everything into mass BS. How is anyone ragging on gays?? You better re-read the post on that. One or two people make a comment about laughing at people & we all do it????? No...... Yourself & teuf both generalized cheating as part of the game also. I believe that most everyone has agreed that cheating has always been part of the game , what most don't like is that it has essentially become a recognized skill!!!! We are supposed to get over that??? Never, shows a complete lack of character. Maybe you need to take a break from AO because it seems that most of your comments are inflammatory anymore....

[Chipper]

In football, basketball, LaCross, field hockey etc. holding, pushing, tripping etc. can be an unconscious act due to the adrenaline running hard. Refs recognise most of those and do not call them.

But in paintball, a wipe begins with KNOWING that you are hit, and deliberately hiding the evidence. I'm not talking about the ones that you don't feel on your pods or gun, but chest/head/hand/leg/arm/gogg shots that get your attention with pain or a loud noise off your noggin.

Knowing you have been legally eliminated, and purposely breaking the rules in order to remain in the game to eliminate those on the other team that do NOT cheat....is wrong in so many ways.

Again, cheat against me, and suffer the consequences. You don't want to play by the rules, then don't complain to anyone when the rules are violated AGAINST you. Cheaters suck. Cheating should hurt.
I am going to bring this up again because it was a good piont (at least the last one, I didn't really read alot of really good points since then.

Do you not think that a person has complete control over there bodies? Do you not think that if you push, tirp, hold, etc. a person you know it? If not, then maybe people wipe because of the adrenaline rush? Maybe they don't realize they are wiping? I know in basketball I have been called numerous times for things I knew I did, but also for things that I never new happened. Same in paintball, a few times I knew I was hit, but a couple times I never knew I was hit (even if it was in a obvious spot).

Yet again, I am not protecting cheaters. I do not condone it, and am ashamed of ever doing it. BUT, there is some reason and method to the madness.

[MadPSIence]

oh there's the X factor. Blame adrenaline for wiping.

come on.

Yak you're a pretty ill hypocrit. Tell me you've never made comments about how "stupid" rec and woods players look and dress.

you're just flaming and pissing now because people are talking the other way around and it doesn't agree with your agg style.

[yakitori]

I agree w/ cartman somewhat. Only I use the term gat and other pball terms as well as some pros I know, and I dont think you would want to play on the other team against these guys. they dont whine and cry about anything....they school ppl ;)

However, in rec fields, if you cheat, hes right. PPl will single you out and make you pay for it. I do the same, when I get shot. I tell the person nice shot, and ask them how it happened, so that if my pack or foot or something was sticking out, that is something I can work to improve on.

Im pissed that you guys consider me a cheater even after Ive stated my point of view on it repeatedly on numerous occasions. Just because I realize that cheating is part of any sport....you flame away. :mad: jerks. (only speaking to the ppl that said it, if you didnt then I aint talkin to you)

[yakitori]

oh there's the X factor. Blame adrenaline for wiping.

come on.

Yak you're a pretty ill hypocrit. Tell me you've never made comments about how "stupid" rec and woods players look and dress.

you're just flaming and pissing now because people are talking the other way around and it doesn't agree with your agg style.

up yours farthead. Ive said that I dont personally like the way it looks. Ive said that I am not into milsim, but I dont sit there and laugh at ppl.

There is no use trying to get a point across to a freaking teenager. Its helpless. :rolleyes:

[Eric Cartman]

OMG TEUF YOU'RE EVIL YOU COCK SMOKER GET OUT OF PAINTBALL!

:rofl:

[MadPSIence]

up yours farthead. Ive said that I dont personally like the way it looks. Ive said that I am not into milsim, but I dont sit there and laugh at ppl.

There is no use trying to get a point across to a freaking teenager. Its helpless. :rolleyes:


no, not "here" as in AO because you'd be hated to death.

"farthead" good one. Who are you calling a teenager with remarks like that.

Later cheater

[yakitori]

no, not "here" as in AO because you'd be hated to death.

"farthead" good one. Who are you calling a teenager with remarks like that.

Later cheater

I dont want to be banned by avioding swear filters. hence farthead. :D.

Honestly Im not a teenager or a cheater. If Im a cheater then you need ramping cause youre freakin slow in the fingers. :P.

Im done. I started another thread.

Im putting all my arguments to rest in ALL the threads that I am at a disagreement w/ ppl in.

Truce. Geez....freakin Truce. :cheers:

[MadPSIence]

sorry but as nice as it is to not have debate... you're a total cop-out and I have no respect for you because of what you support in terms of cheating.

[yakitori]

sorry but as nice as it is to not have debate... you're a total cop-out and I have no respect for you because of what you support in terms of cheating.

Then at least go read my posts a few posts up.

how many times to I have to say that I AM AGAINST CHEATING before you get it? EVERYONE ELSE PLEASE, at least go read above my posts so that you will know that this guy doesnt know how to read. Ill bet he doesnt even know my point of view.

Seriously. You call me three things Im not.....a cheater, hipcrit, and jane fonda.

[MadPSIence]

the difference between you and jane are about 40 years 2 tits and I'm done with you in this thread and the other.

[yakitori]

the difference between you and jane are about 40 years 2 tits and I'm done with you in this thread and the other.

you dont even know my point of view on cheating do you?

[judster]

And, speaking as a former dual AA water polo player/swimmer; diving takes huge amounts of commitment and practice. Lets see you jump off a four story building and do some flips... ;)
hey i was AA water polo player and swimmer as well..cool beans.

[RingOfScale]

i believe the only reason wiping is considered worse now then it was it because it is more obvious to spot, and became more apparant when the game turned towards speedball. it was easier to cheat without people noticeing when playing in the woods. cheating hasnt gone up, just catching it has.

[PsychoBaller]

"Simply enjoying paintball, should always be your #1 priority in the game."


to much political crap has driven me away from Tourny

[Jaan]

oh there's the X factor. Blame adrenaline for wiping.
Maybe not for wiping ... but not noticing you got hit. I was so hyped out once I broke two bones in my hand and didn't notice it right away.

[mercury]

I didnt insinuate that you insinuated that nobody cheated before. I just said that Newschool doesnt mean cheating. That was just made up in this thread. There is NO association.

I dont cheat, and dont like cheaters, but you have to play whatever team comes up on your bracket. If they are cheaters, you just know that you have to make sure they cant wipe by putting more than one ball on them, and making refs paintcheck quicker because they wipe.

The majority of NEWSCHOOL ballers dont wipe and cheat. Im sorry if you think they do, but you may just need to get out more if so. Or play more paintball. You are just repeating an echo chamber of ignorance that someone started on the internet. I dont see cheating all that much, and when ppl are caught they are penalized. How is that acceptance of cheating. That is penalizing ppl for doing it. You can be DQd if you keep cheating. How the hell is that acceptance.

Calm down man, I was not trying to attack you in ANY way or anything like that. I simply stated my views on cheating. If you read my post, I clearly stated "I am also not implying that every new player cheats or even the majority, but I do see it more frequently now than I used to." I've played enough paintball over the years to know when I can spot cheating getting more rampant. I am also not trying to categorize New School or Old School, that was simply a play on what someone said earlier. The fact remains that in the two different states I've played in over the past few years, I've seen more cheating than I used to. That is from my experience, not necessarily yours or anybody elses. I also think that cheating is more accepted, not necessarily by refs, but by some of the players. Sure you can be DQ'd if you are caught cheating, that is the job of the people who oversee the sport. That doesn't mean it's not more accepted by players. The proof is right here in this thread where some people basically say that you need to cheat to keep up. That, my friend, is acceptance as well as changing how you play to adapt. Some people believe that to adapt to cheaters is to cheat yourself and that is a shame. I'm sorry if you feel I'm echoing ignorance but the last time I checked, this was a forum open for discussion. Many times, during a normal discussion, people will have different views and this is what can be called a debate. You are entitled to your opinions as I am mine. I don't think that reiterating the fact that cheating is bad and that it shouldn't be so accepted by player is an ignorant thing to do. I also do understand that you don't condone cheating and that is a good thing. Hopefully, that carries over into how you play the game.

Cheers :cheers:

[Cameo]

From the first time I stepped foot on a paint ball field my team mates were very clear that sportsmanship was more important than anything. That is why I play with them and that is why I respect them. I personally see no need to bend the rules in order to have fun. Growing up I was not tuaght the "win at all cost" mentality that runs rampant now a days. When you go to those extreems it takes away from the enjoyment. Winning should come with time, practice, endurance; NOT MONEY.

Respect the Sport
Respect the founders of the sport we all love
Respect your gear (whatever it may be)
Respect your allies as well as your opposition
Respect the refs
But most of all Respect yourself so that you can hold your head high and play with pride.

:hail:
~steph

[Beemer]

You used the R word :bounce:

And wait the S word to, in BOLD to boot :eek:

If we keep telling them long enough they WILL get it wont they? :cheers:
But you forgot the H,P,I, words
Honor
Pride
Integrity

Beer miester here. Whats your flavor? :cheers:

to add.........Oops you did have the P word.

______________

http://home.comcast.net/~beemerone/AoIL.gif

[oldsoldier]

Hey AFTICA sucks...we just go to have fun. I think IAO is more fun when you're there having fun, as opposed to actually competing. I got heated last year...wont happen this year. I compete here locally, do the national stuff for fun.

[yakitori]

Calm down man, I was not trying to attack you in ANY way or anything like that. I simply stated my views on cheating. If you read my post, I clearly stated "I am also not implying that every new player cheats or even the majority, but I do see it more frequently now than I used to." I've played enough paintball over the years to know when I can spot cheating getting more rampant. I am also not trying to categorize New School or Old School, that was simply a play on what someone said earlier. The fact remains that in the two different states I've played in over the past few years, I've seen more cheating than I used to. That is from my experience, not necessarily yours or anybody elses. I also think that cheating is more accepted, not necessarily by refs, but by some of the players. Sure you can be DQ'd if you are caught cheating, that is the job of the people who oversee the sport. That doesn't mean it's not more accepted by players. The proof is right here in this thread where some people basically say that you need to cheat to keep up. That, my friend, is acceptance as well as changing how you play to adapt. Some people believe that to adapt to cheaters is to cheat yourself and that is a shame. I'm sorry if you feel I'm echoing ignorance but the last time I checked, this was a forum open for discussion. Many times, during a normal discussion, people will have different views and this is what can be called a debate. You are entitled to your opinions as I am mine. I don't think that reiterating the fact that cheating is bad and that it shouldn't be so accepted by player is an ignorant thing to do. I also do understand that you don't condone cheating and that is a good thing. Hopefully, that carries over into how you play the game.

Cheers :cheers:

my bad. I didnt mean to sound hostile toward you. I am really irritated w/ madpsi cause he keeps calling me a cheater when Ive stated over and over that I dont cheat, but it is part of the game. Maybe more ppl are accepting cheating, but its not a good thing. If someone couldve read my posts correctly (eh ehm psi) then I wouldnt have gotten :mad:

:cheers:

[MadPSIence]

*wakes up at 7:55am and scrolls through AO....*

Jesus TF Christ lucy are you still goin at me?

[Lohman446]

*wakes up at 7:55am and scrolls through AO....*

Jesus TF Christ lucy are you still goin at me?


Don't worry, he's going on Mark M too

[minimag03]

I'm starting to like this thread. It started off dumb and it is still going stong.

[yakitori]

Don't worry, he's going on Mark M too

I did not.

These two guys have made personal character comments about me in an obscene way because both of them dont know how to infer things from a post properly. The miscommunication is not my fault. I have handled it properly. I have not flammed anyone. You children are the ones that are continuing to flame. I am beggining to believe that is the way you like it.

[magmonkey]

why should we get used to people cheating?

why should we allow ramping?


who cares what people wear?, if they are a decent person who plays with honor I don't care if they wear their pajamas.

people don't really have to be a old fogey in the sport (although I probably qualify for that) in order to be pissed about the honor slipping away from paintball.

instead of arguing over this, do somthing constructive try to figgure out a way to change the sport in a positve way


PAINTBALL NEEDS A STRAIGHT EDGE MOVEMENT

[ultralight]

so you stereotype ppl for having those grips or that clothes? I dont find it annoying. I find it more annoying when ppl have nothing to do but look at others and snicker, giggle, or make sarcastic comments about their appearance. Its immature.

no, i let every player stand on his or her own merits. if the guy is a jerk then he is a jerk. it doesn't matter what he wears. but i have been noticing that the players who mouth off and act inappropriately are usually the kids who are decked out in the newest gear.
i didn't say that i found the clothing annoying, i find the individuals that i was talking about to be annoying. i realize that there are many players out there that wear name brand paintball clothing because it works. but i have also found that in my personal experience there are quite a few who wear said equipment for no other reason than that "the pros wear it". i may have just hit a bunch of bad apples.

i'm sorry if you find it immature and offensive that i laugh at people who i think look silly, that is your right. however i will continue to laugh at people that i think look silly. this includes people playing paintball and the people on America's funniest home videos and numerous other shows and just silly looking people in general. if i ever do something stupid i hope someone can laugh at that too.
i don't think that laughing at people who you think look silly is immature, i think that it is part of being human, and apparently those who control our TV programming agree with me and are making alot of money with the idea.

at least i'm not telling them to go kill themselves like some of the people i've seen on this forum. i'm not going to name names because i can't remember them.

whatever, i think that you misunderstood parts of my post. if you'd like to discuss it further then PM me and i'd be happy to talk about it.