Warning: Xtreme Paintball - False Guarantees

[MILKMAN]

This is just a warning to any of the forumers that shop or buy from "Xtreme Paintball," or "Anything Xtreme Paintball." (www.xtremepaintball.com, www.xtremepaintball.biz, or www.anythingxtreme.com)

Xtreme Paintball (XPaintball) has an in-stock guarantee; meaning they guarantee to have all of the products on their web site in stock. Their guarantee states they will do "Whatever it takes" including an upgrade to your order to keep the customer happy if the product he/she orders is on backorder and not available. They say they will also contact you "ASAP" if your order is unavailable and will not be shipped. This said, they also do not include with any products description on their website an in stock or out of stock check for the customer, making him/her believe they have all items in stock and ready to be shipped.

After reading all of this, I figured it would be the best company to buy my new black Halo B with Rip Drive from. I ordered the hopper on a Thursday afternoon. On Monday morning I received an e-mail from one Ken Raber of X-Paintball's customer service stating that my order was unavailable and the only alternative he could offer was a different color hopper. I ordered a black hopper due to the fact that I have an all black marker, why I would want a red or green hopper has yet to make sense to me. Another thing I don't understand is why a company with their so called "excellent customer service" would have waited 3 days to contact me about the unavailability of the product (they are operational through the weekend). I then attempted to contact Xtreme Paintball by phone, but after listening to countless answering machine recordings, I decided to e-mail them. Putting all negative thoughts aside, I e-mailed Ken back telling him I would accept an upgrade to a Black Empire Reloader B for my order. He replied stating that it was out of the question; a red or green Halo B is all he could offer. After I expressed how I believed and trusted in their guarantee, he refused to honor it and succumbed to refunding the money to my credit card, thus wasting my time. After the countless phone calls I made and Xtreme Paintball's failure to communicate with the customer, I am shafted with no hopper for this weekend's tournament.

My new impression of Xtreme Paintball is the following: They label their web-site with a guarantee that is designed to make the customer feel secure in ordering the products they need from them. If the customer's product just so happens to be one of the products on the hundreds of backorders, they will delay contacting the customer just in case a shipment of the needed products arrives at their warehouse. If the product does not arrive after a few days, they will contact the customer in this late fashion. If the customer inquires about their "stock guarantee" they will not honor it and devise to you an excuse enabling them to pass the blame elsewhere; thus attempting to sell the customer with a color that is undesirable and undoubtedly unpopular, or return the money to the customer.

Xtreme Paintball Problems Overview:
1. Extremely poor customer service.
- 3-Day delay to receive information of a backorder.
- Out of 24 phone calls made to their customer service, only once did I not get an answering machine.

2. False Guarantees.
- They do not honor their stock guarantee in contacting the customer immediately regarding backorders and they do not back up their promise to upgrade from an unavailable item.
- Over 5 Days were wasted of my time. If I would have ordered from a different company, I would already have the product in hand with no hassle.

[Vex]

I feel for you man.
I ordered a case of paint from them, no problems. I did, however, have a question that I emailed to customer service, and I still haven't gotten a reply. That sort of pisses me off, but since my order came on time, I figured maybe it didn't get through. It probably did go through, but since they shipped my order, they figured they didn't have to answer the email.

I'll think twice before I order from them again, I suppose...

[cdacda13]

I said it on the tippmann forum.
Should have ordered from county. It would have been there already

[yakitori]

so you purchased the halo on thursday evening, then got a reply monday morning? That doesnt sound all tha bad as far as replying to you. It sucks for you that they didnt provide you with a reloader B, but dude, thats asking a bit much. I mean, I can understand them making a customer happy by giving you a battle swab or something when your backorder is filled, but you went so far to ask for a reloader B instead? Thats a bit much. No company would do that. I agree that they shouldnt advertise it, but they are not obligated to do that. They say they will make the customer happy, some customers are harder to make happy than others. It seems that you are one of those ones that is difficult to please. Esp. since you went so far as to post a thread discrediting a companies name for it. It happens man. Ive had probs w/ other companies. At least you got a refund.

[MILKMAN]

so you purchased the halo on thursday evening, then got a reply monday morning? That doesnt sound all tha bad as far as replying to you. It sucks for you that they didnt provide you with a reloader B, but dude, thats asking a bit much. I mean, I can understand them making a customer happy by giving you a battle swab or something when your backorder is filled, but you went so far to ask for a reloader B instead? Thats a bit much. No company would do that. I agree that they shouldnt advertise it, but they are not obligated to do that. They say they will make the customer happy, some customers are harder to make happy than others. It seems that you are one of those ones that is difficult to please. Esp. since you went so far as to post a thread discrediting a companies name for it. It happens man. Ive had probs w/ other companies. At least you got a refund.

You are missing the principle of the situation. It does not matter, if a company guarantees something, they should always come through no matter what. If they aren't prepared to do it, don't put the guarantee, IT'S AS SIMPLE AS THAT.

And besides, what one of you on this forum wouldn't have suggested a Reloader B? :p

(edit: spelling)

[Lohman446]

You are missing the principle of the situation. It does not matter, if a company guarantees something, they should always come through no matter what. If they aren't prepared to do it, don't put the guarantee, IT'S AS SIMPLE AS THAT.

And besides, what one of you on this forum wouldn't have suggested a Reloader B? :p

(edit: spelling)


Suggesting and expecting are far different. The thing is, I would have gotten a Reloader B because the person I order from is a good friend. And I would have paid the difference, for the same reason

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[MILKMAN]

Suggesting and expecting are far different. The thing is, I would have gotten a Reloader B because the person I order from is a good friend. And I would have paid the difference, for the same reason

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I did not expect a Reloader B, I did however, suggest it. Yes this is true, like you say two different things. I did expect to be happy with an alternative suggested by the company. The customer, in this case me, is nowhere near happy with the alternatives offered. This goes against the companies guarantee, "The bottom line: We'll make it happen for you!."

[WARPED1]

Everything else you say I agree with. But the phone thing, they need those automated hoppers, it's usually 2 or 3 keystrokes to get where you need to go. Imagine if they just answered the phone by hand. The business would have to hire extra operators which would drive thier prices up. Also, when you call, you would most likely be on hold for a very long time, in fact, you would still be on hold from whenever you called. But the guarentee thing they failed to honor sucks butt.

[Brophog]

You need to understand some things:

First, that's Thursday to Monday. They probably don't get the order till Friday, and then called you on Monday. That's 1 business day. Chill out.

Secondly, Halo's are notorious for being backordered. I've never had an item that would simply go out of stock EVERYWHERE like a Halo will. I'm not entirely sure why, but it seems to happen quite frequently. Knowing this, it's likely a manufacturer problem and not a website issue.

I've never dealt with this company in question, but you are seriously taking this 'guarantee' to it's limits. Sounds like your idea of customer service is the 'gimme gimme' kind.

[Asym]

Agreed with a few that you were pushing a little far with their gaurantee, but do agree with you their system sucks. They should have let you know the following day it wasn't in stock so you could have made other arangments if you did have a situation like a tourny coming up.

That being said, I feel almost the same as you about them since I've dealt with them several times. I live about 10-15 minutes from them and would rather order from or buy from anywhere else.

[TheTramp]

Sounds like your idea of customer service is the 'gimme gimme' kind.

Which I've learned is standard for a good portion of the Paint Ball community.

I've never seen so many people trying to get so much for so little as I have with Paintballers. It's embarrassing to be at the proshop sometimes and listen to the kids beg and the older people demand free/discounted crap.

Believe me, I understand the value of a dollar but damm, some people are CHEAP. It reminds me unpleasantly of going to Dead shows and watching the followers desperately trying to score/con whatever they could as cheaply as possible.

[Jakedubbleya]

Xpaintball is my fav company to order from... never had a prob, sorry u feel u got jipped here bro..

[hitech]

If that is their guarantee, they should have honored it. I had a similar situation with the mother's ring I ordered for my wife. On their web site it claimed that the item would ARRIVE in 5 to 8 days. I held them to the eight days. It did take talking to a supervisor, but I did get it, and in 5 days (shipped Fed-ex next day air). They kept trying to tell me that "fast ship" meant that it would ship by 2nd day air. I kept asking if they meant what they said on their web site. ;)

[Brophog]

I think in this case, that's two diffferent guarantees. Saying something is going to arrive by a specified date and having something in stock is two different measures of control. Especially when your guarantee is 8 days on jewelry. Anywhere in the world you can get something there in 8 days pretty easily, particularly on something as small as jewelry.

If Odyssey doesn't ship you a Halo though, which as I said they are VERY prone to doing, then it's pretty hard to satisfy a customer the next day, especially when he orders on Thursday.

[Automaggot68]

A LONG time Ago i ordered a barrel from them.
It came, and somehow the inside was scratched up.
REALLY bad.


They refused to replace it.

[RusskiX]

A LONG time Ago i ordered a barrel from them.
It came, and somehow the inside was scratched up.
REALLY bad.

That's strange...I ordered a pipe kit from them becuase at the time they were the only ones with a 12" green fade tip available. It came promptly, in mint condition with reasonable shipping charges.


Sounds like your idea of customer service is the 'gimme gimme' kind.

Sounds the same to me.

"Three days" to notify of a backorder item, including a Saturday and Sunday, sounds pretty reasonable. And when you could not agree on a suitable replacement, your money was promptly refunded. You could have done a lot worse!

Did you read their guarantee? "If for some unforseeable reason we are unable to ship your item immediately we will contact you as soon as possible with the next available ship date, possible upgrades or substitutions."

It states "possible" upgrades, not giving you the moon. It states they will offer substitutions which are up to you to accept or decline. Sounds like they didn't break their guarantee. The only gripe I would have had is they could answer their phone more often.

[shartley]

"Three days" to notify of a backorder item, including a Saturday and Sunday, sounds pretty reasonable. And when you could not agree on a suitable replacement, your money was promptly refunded. You could have done a lot worse!

Did you read their guarantee? "If for some unforseeable reason we are unable to ship your item immediately we will contact you as soon as possible with the next available ship date, possible upgrades or substitutions."

It states "possible" upgrades, not giving you the moon. It states they will offer substitutions which are up to you to accept or decline. Sounds like they didn't break their guarantee. The only gripe I would have had is they could answer their phone more often.
I agree.

That store did not break any guarantee that I saw. Their guarantee was not even confusing or misleading.

What I see here is someone reading what they wanted to read, even if that is not what was said. And then more folks jumping on the bandwagon without actually seeing if what was being claimed was correct. In this case MILKMAN was simply wrong in his reading and understanding of their guarantee, he tried to make it cover things it clearly did not cover, and say something it simply did not say. Now he comes to AO (and who knows where else) and talks bad about the Store?

I personally would think an apology would be in order. The only one who did something wrong in this case, IMHO, would be MILKMAN. That does not make him a bad person though.

[SlartyBartFast]

This is one of the reasons I'm glad I no longer serve the public.

Talk about impatient and impossible to please. The only way you'd be happy is if they worked 24-hrs a day 7 days a week.

Even if they processed your order Thursday, that would only give them two days to contact their supplers to see how quickly they could get the product and one day to contact you.

Seems to me their performance was stellar.

I suggest that from now on you shop only where items are guaranteed in-stock.

[Automaggot68]

That's strange...I ordered a pipe kit from them becuase at the time they were the only ones with a 12" green fade tip available. It came promptly, in mint condition with reasonable shipping charges.



This was phew.....Years ago. When the 98 custom was first released

Yeah, I was pissed. I've order things from them before that, and everythign was fine. Took a while as I paid by check but other than that-- that was my only gripe.

It was a 13inch ARMSON Stealth barrel. It'd kills all the paint I bought....
BUt man, it would shoot BE paint like a pro, Lol.

[MedicDVG]

I doubt you would have gotten any different customer service from any other online store.

1) they did contact you asap (1 buisness day) about the backorder.
2) they did offer you an alternative, which you didn't take.
3) NO store is going to let you substitute a Reloader B for a Halo, not without you adding some bling.

What did you expect, that they would kiss your feet and just give you whatever the hell you want?

Perhaps it is your expectations, and not the gaurentee, that is faulty.

[buzzboy]

Man I really like xpb. When I ordered my stuff(Pro/Carbine, mask, hopper, tank and paintballs) everything turned out perfectly.When I saw that the ball I wanted I looked at them and it said that they were out of stock. So I got the next best thing. Also soon after I made my purchase I recieved an email saying that the mask that came in the beginner kit was out of stock. They said that they would upgrade me to a nicer mask for no extra charge. And they did. Also I was expecting to get the package in a little over a week. I placed my order on a sunday(when they are closed) and the UPS man delivered my gun to my door on that thursday. I was stoked. I really like xpb.

[hitech]

I think in this case, that's two different guarantees. Saying something is going to arrive by a specified date and having something in stock is two different measures of control.

Well, since it was custom jewelry I'd say it's more difficult, but that is not the point. They need to live up to WHATEVER guarantee they have. After all, they came up with it, not the customer. If they didn't want to live up to it they didn't have to make it (the guarantee) in the first place.

[shartley]

Well, since it was custom jewelry I'd say it's more difficult, but that is not the point. They need to live up to WHATEVER guarantee they have. After all, they came up with it, not the customer. If they didn't want to live up to it they didn't have to make it (the guarantee) in the first place.
And in this case, they did indeed live up to their guarantee. ;)

[Baby Huey]

Punisherspb.com They will match any price and they will work with you. I have shipped stuff back (trying to match colors and stuff) a few times and they are always honest and great. Ask for Rich or Jerry. They do not have mag upgrades but for the other stuff (tanks, hopper, etc.). Good luck and God Bless.

[Lohman446]

Punisherspb.com They will match any price and they will work with you. I have shipped stuff back (trying to match colors and stuff) a few times and they are always honest and great. Ask for Rich or Jerry. They do not have mag upgrades but for the other stuff (tanks, hopper, etc.). Good luck and God Bless.


I second that one.. if its not a specialty manufacturer direct item, and I can't get it through the field I normally play at Punisher's has always treated me very well.


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[CKY_Alliance]

Well heres how i comprehend their policy in your sitiuation.

They say if the product you ordered is not in stock then they will upgrade your order...that said the product you ordered technically was in stock even though it wasnt the color you wanted..so yea thats how i see it.

still sucks for you though.


~Somone may have already said this ... i didnt feel like reading whole thread.~

[RusskiX]

They say if the product you ordered is not in stock then they will upgrade your order.

No, thats not what they say. They will offer the next available ship date, possible upgrades, or substitutions.


i didnt feel like reading whole thread

You may want to try that next time. ;)

[Jonno06]

guarantee or not if they say its in stock, it should be in stock.

thats like a bank saying that they have $5,000 dollars in their vault for you to spend, you write $5,000 worth of checks, then 3 days later the bank says that they didn't really have the 5,000.

[WARPED1]

Ship dates are business days. Saturday and sunday are not business days, even if the store is open. Business days are mon-fri as set by post office or some other government thing. So, they contacted you in plenty of time. Sorry you're so impatient. Who remembers the old days of "please allow 4-6 weeks for delivery."










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[yakitori]

Well, since it was custom jewelry I'd say it's more difficult, but that is not the point. They need to live up to WHATEVER guarantee they have. After all, they came up with it, not the customer. If they didn't want to live up to it they didn't have to make it (the guarantee) in the first place.

ya, quoted from russix.

Did you read their guarantee? "If for some unforseeable reason we are unable to ship your item immediately we will contact you as soon as possible with the next available ship date, possible upgrades or substitutions."

I dont see how they didnt live up to their garuntee. They offered a substitution. It just wasnt black, so he didnt want it. They returned the money, and apologized.

And also, why would he have waited after they notified him of the backorder to decide he wanted a refund. If I need something urgently, I dont buy from the first place. I look somewhere to find someone who has it IN STOCK. If they dont answer emails, I look elsewhere. Its not my loss of business by not answering emails about stock. There are hundreds of online shops, you dont have to buy from one particular one.

And if you "needed" to be sure to get it before the tourney, you shoulda made sure you could get it by checking stock. (note: you is used subjectively here, not meaning you as in hitech)

[yakitori]

guarantee or not if they say its in stock, it should be in stock.

thats like a bank saying that they have $5,000 dollars in their vault for you to spend, you write $5,000 worth of checks, then 3 days later the bank says that they didn't really have the 5,000.

they didnt say it was instock. They have an instock garuntee. That is stated in the post above. He didnt check to see of the "actually" had one on hand and ready to ship. They never garunteed EVERYTHING to be in stock and ready to ship. They just garuntee that if they dont have it, they will offer a substitution or an upgrade w/in reason. A reloader B for a Halo B is not w/in reason. There is about 40-50 bucks retail value between them, so the guy offered a different color other than black. That was the deal.

If you write a check for 5000 bucks w/o checking to see if it is actually in the bank, then its your fault, not the banks. You are supposed to keep up w/ your own balance. Bank statements are accurate to the hour. More like 24-48 hrs.

[hitech]

I didn't take the time to read the guarantte. My only point was that they needed to live up to it. If they did, great. However, that seemed in question when I wrote my post. Others were questioning whether they should live up to it. I said they should, and that's it. :D

[MILKMAN]

I didn't take the time to read the guarantte. My only point was that they needed to live up to it. If they did, great. However, that seemed in question when I wrote my post. Others were questioning whether they should live up to it. I said they should, and that's it. :D

Heh, just FYI, that guarantee was changed from substitutions to "possible substitutions" as I was notified via e-mail. They reserve the right to change without notice any information in the fine print.

[Pacifist_Farmer]

Welcome to corporate america, surrender your soul.

[SlartyBartFast]

Welcome to corporate america, surrender your soul.

Why should they sell their soul to the customer?

People really are immoral hypocrites.

If a customer is short changed or if someone were to take advantage of their lack of attention ot detail, they want the rest of their money or their item. But if a store makes a mistake, too low a price advertised (say .99 instead of 99.) or an unbilled item placed in the bag, and they are all joyed about receiving something for nothing. :tard:

[SlartyBartFast]

I didn't take the time to read the guarantte. My only point was that they needed to live up to it. If they did, great. However, that seemed in question when I wrote my post. Others were questioning whether they should live up to it. I said they should, and that's it. :D

:rolleyes:
And that's what's common to both opinions and sphyncters. Everyone's got one.

Don't let the facts or a little active though get in the way of putting in an opinion.

[SlartyBartFast]

Heh, just FYI, that guarantee was changed from substitutions to "possible substitutions" as I was notified via e-mail. They reserve the right to change without notice any information in the fine print.

Wouldn't that be a GOOD thing? I'd rather a substitution be "possible" than be forced to take something I didn't order.

[legion_02]

I've actually had very good experiances with xpaintball. I when i ordered my Dye Attack Pack from them they wound up being out of stock of the size I wanted (4+5) and offered the next size up at the same cost (about $5-$10 difference). I opted to wait because I wanted the 4+5, but you see my point. They'll upgrade your order, just not $50 worth. They called my house the next day too.

[WARPED1]

Xtreme did the right thing in this case.

[hitech]

:rolleyes:
And that's what's common to both opinions and sphyncters. Everyone's got one.

Don't let the facts or a little active though get in the way of putting in an opinion.

I didn't read the actual guarantee because it DID NOT MATTER in regards to the point I was making. The ONLY point I made was that they should live up to their guarantee, period. Others in this thread were attempting to justify not doing so. I disagreed. That's it. I put plenty of thought into my post, thank-you-very-much.

And AO is a place for opinions...

[-=Squid=-]

Typical attitude of a person who has no idea what it takes to please so many customers.

I'm sure he knew what color your fantastic 'all black' marker was, but let's cast that aside for now. He did contact you, only 1 day later. Pretty good. Although it is operational through the weekend, I very highly doubt all of their office positions are opened. That would mean 7 days a week for most people. I doubt it.

Try calling before you order something next time. It sounds to me like they did all they needed to to do make you happy.

[MILKMAN]

Typical attitude of a person who has no idea what it takes to please so many customers.

I'm sure he knew what color your fantastic 'all black' marker was, but let's cast that aside for now. He did contact you, only 1 day later. Pretty good. Although it is operational through the weekend, I very highly doubt all of their office positions are opened. That would mean 7 days a week for most people. I doubt it.

Try calling before you order something next time. It sounds to me like they did all they needed to to do make you happy.

Oh yes, it made me very very happy. False guarantees are BS end of story. Not going to honor a guarantee, don't advertise it. There customer service and pro shop are operational thru the weekend thank you.

[-=Squid=-]

Oh yes, it made me very very happy. False guarantees are BS end of story. Not going to honor a guarantee, don't advertise it. There customer service and pro shop are operational thru the weekend thank you.
They did honor their guarantee.

[tony3]

Agree with starter of the thread. If you are going to put something, you better damn well stick with it. Contacting him 1 day later is acceptable, but it says "upgrade order" which isn't a red halo, its the same price. It get it exact it would have to be a black empire reloader B. How is that against their guarentee? It isn't. I don't shop online at websites that don't have an instock indicator. Saves lots of headaches. Then again, I shop used or at the local shop most of the time.

[LGND]

In this case they made a resonable offer for substitution, you didn't like the offer and got a refund. Was the reloader a reasonable request? Not really... If I ordered a 'cocker from them and they were out of stock should I expect a Karni in substitution? No way! Should I expect them to offer a different color or the next model up? Sure, that's reasonable. Do you have any idea how much business they have? If they started upgrading every HALO order they got to Reloaders they'd lose their shirts.

Maybe they used to offer that upgrade, but word got out that if you ordered a HALO from them they'd upgrade it to a reloader for free. If I had heard that about them I'd be ordering a HALO too, and be pissed if they wouldn't give me the deal. Does that make them bad? No way, it makes me greedy, and throwing a tantrum because I couldn't **** them over for my personal benefit.

[Personally I think this is the case -not that you ordered a HALO expecting the free upgrade, but that others were so they had to stop doing that- I had a friend order a HALO with the ION he bought from them... he got a ReloaderB with RIP instead... we were kinda confused for a while till we figured out they had upgraded it, without notifying him either]

Unless you added it to your order "I want a black one to match my all black marker" he has no way of knowing that a reg or green on would be totally unacceptable to you, other people might not have a problem with it. Some people might not want a reloader, ever think of that? They are different (but similar) products sold by two different companies. A Harley is not an upgrade of a Suzuki, they are different.

Did you offer to pay part of the difference in cost to upgrade to a reloader? (knock $20 off of a reloader, and I'll pay the difference in cost)

The order was probably placed in a notify stack as soon as it was found they didn't have HALOs in stock (you can't be the only one who needed to be contacted regarding an order, possibly hundreds of others who have either screwed up an order, or ordered somthing that is out of stock) The response time was very reasonable.

"If the customer's product just so happens to be one of the products on the hundreds of backorders, they will delay contacting the customer just in case a shipment of the needed products arrives at their warehouse." Would you rather they bounce the order back to you immediately, or wait till the UPS truck shows up with an expected shipment?

Believe it or not most "automated" systems aren't. The website likely prints out an order that goes to a guy in shipping, and my guess is he isn't waiting anxiously for your order, on a whim I'd say he has a hundred more orders ahead of yours, and when he sees the isssue he passes it on to customer service, who contacts you.

[yakitori]

I didn't read the actual guarantee because it DID NOT MATTER in regards to the point I was making. The ONLY point I made was that they should live up to their guarantee, period. Others in this thread were attempting to justify not doing so. I disagreed. That's it. I put plenty of thought into my post, thank-you-very-much.

And AO is a place for opinions...

They DID live up to their garuntee. They offered an alternative, a different color halo. He couldve gotten smoke or clear, or any other color. Instead he suggests that they should give him a reloader B. They dont have to agree. The proper action would be to just simply point out their garuntee on their site and leave it upon them to make a choice of an upgrade to give him. Instead he say hey, how about you give me a reloader B. They said no. If he needed the loader that bad, he couldve said, "what if I pay for half of the price difference, and the upgrade for your garuntee covers the other half"? Did he, no. He shouldve thought of more to say instead of getting argumentative about their garuntee.

Its like the Mens Warehouse. Their garuntee is to do what it takes to make sure you look good in a suit. You hear comercials about they close at 9, and they stayed open to help a guy until 930 cause he had an interview. That doesnt mean that they should remain open past closing hours to help everyone that needs help. It doesnt mean that you are going to look good in the suit either. What if you are just a naturally ugly mofo? They cant promise you that you will look good right?

[yakitori]

In this case they made a resonable offer for substitution, you didn't like the offer and got a refund. Was the reloader a reasonable request? Not really... If I ordered a 'cocker from them and they were out of stock should I expect a Karni in substitution? No way! Should I expect them to offer a different color or the next model up? Sure, that's reasonable. Do you have any idea how much business they have? If they started upgrading every HALO order they got to Reloaders they'd lose their shirts.

Maybe they used to offer that upgrade, but word got out that if you ordered a HALO from them they'd upgrade it to a reloader for free. If I had heard that about them I'd be ordering a HALO too, and be pissed if they wouldn't give me the deal. Does that make them bad? No way, it makes me greedy, and throwing a tantrum because I couldn't **** them over for my personal benefit.

[Personally I think this is the case -not that you ordered a HALO expecting the free upgrade, but that others were so they had to stop doing that- I had a friend order a HALO with the ION he bought from them... he got a ReloaderB with RIP instead... we were kinda confused for a while till we figured out they had upgraded it, without notifying him either]

Unless you added it to your order "I want a black one to match my all black marker" he has no way of knowing that a reg or green on would be totally unacceptable to you, other people might not have a problem with it. Some people might not want a reloader, ever think of that? They are different (but similar) products sold by two different companies. A Harley is not an upgrade of a Suzuki, they are different.

Did you offer to pay part of the difference in cost to upgrade to a reloader? (knock $20 off of a reloader, and I'll pay the difference in cost)

The order was probably placed in a notify stack as soon as it was found they didn't have HALOs in stock (you can't be the only one who needed to be contacted regarding an order, possibly hundreds of others who have either screwed up an order, or ordered somthing that is out of stock) The response time was very reasonable.

"If the customer's product just so happens to be one of the products on the hundreds of backorders, they will delay contacting the customer just in case a shipment of the needed products arrives at their warehouse." Would you rather they bounce the order back to you immediately, or wait till the UPS truck shows up with an expected shipment?

Believe it or not most "automated" systems aren't. The website likely prints out an order that goes to a guy in shipping, and my guess is he isn't waiting anxiously for your order, on a whim I'd say he has a hundred more orders ahead of yours, and when he sees the isssue he passes it on to customer service, who contacts you.

agreed. that basically sums up the whole argument.

[MILKMAN]

In this case they made a resonable offer for substitution, you didn't like the offer and got a refund. Was the reloader a reasonable request? Not really... If I ordered a 'cocker from them and they were out of stock should I expect a Karni in substitution? No way! Should I expect them to offer a different color or the next model up? Sure, that's reasonable. Do you have any idea how much business they have? If they started upgrading every HALO order they got to Reloaders they'd lose their shirts.

Maybe they used to offer that upgrade, but word got out that if you ordered a HALO from them they'd upgrade it to a reloader for free. If I had heard that about them I'd be ordering a HALO too, and be pissed if they wouldn't give me the deal. Does that make them bad? No way, it makes me greedy, and throwing a tantrum because I couldn't **** them over for my personal benefit.

[Personally I think this is the case -not that you ordered a HALO expecting the free upgrade, but that others were so they had to stop doing that- I had a friend order a HALO with the ION he bought from them... he got a ReloaderB with RIP instead... we were kinda confused for a while till we figured out they had upgraded it, without notifying him either]

Unless you added it to your order "I want a black one to match my all black marker" he has no way of knowing that a reg or green on would be totally unacceptable to you, other people might not have a problem with it. Some people might not want a reloader, ever think of that? They are different (but similar) products sold by two different companies. A Harley is not an upgrade of a Suzuki, they are different.

Did you offer to pay part of the difference in cost to upgrade to a reloader? (knock $20 off of a reloader, and I'll pay the difference in cost)

The order was probably placed in a notify stack as soon as it was found they didn't have HALOs in stock (you can't be the only one who needed to be contacted regarding an order, possibly hundreds of others who have either screwed up an order, or ordered somthing that is out of stock) The response time was very reasonable.

"If the customer's product just so happens to be one of the products on the hundreds of backorders, they will delay contacting the customer just in case a shipment of the needed products arrives at their warehouse." Would you rather they bounce the order back to you immediately, or wait till the UPS truck shows up with an expected shipment?

Believe it or not most "automated" systems aren't. The website likely prints out an order that goes to a guy in shipping, and my guess is he isn't waiting anxiously for your order, on a whim I'd say he has a hundred more orders ahead of yours, and when he sees the isssue he passes it on to customer service, who contacts you.

Lets start at the top.

#1 Reg cocker = $350+/- Karni =$800+/-...difference...$450
#2 Halo w/ rip = $120 Reloader = $150....difference...$30
A reasonable comparison by you....NO Way!

#3...if the word got out that they upgraded from a Halo to a Reloader...so what...big deal...that would be because of their guarantee correct? If they couldn't keep the Halo's in stock, don't put that stock guarantee up. It's not rocket science.

#4...I'm not mad because I couldn't, how do you put it "**** them over," I'm mad because they did not honor their guarantee and I was not satisfied in the least with their service. Hell maybe you would be satisfied if you might miss a tournament this saturday because of all this, but thats I'm not happy about it.

#5...congratulations to your friend.

#6...All the customer service reps that I e-mailed, called and talked to, or left a message on their phone I explained my situation thoroughly to stating: I would like an all black hopper because my marker is all black. Will a Reloader B be a possible subsitution. The reply...no...the ONLY substitutions we can offer are a red or green HALO.

#7...UPS shipments are daily, sometimes twice daily. I work in a warehouse...I know these things champ. Their customer service is fully functional through the weekend. I definitely expect a call since their "guarantee" stated that all customers with products that are back ordered are notified ASAP!

[shartley]

#7...UPS shipments are daily, sometimes twice daily. I work in a warehouse...I know these things champ. Their customer service is fully functional through the weekend. I definitely expect a call since their "guarantee" stated that all customers with products that are back ordered are notified ASAP!
As does the USPS Monday through Saturday, but there are days I don’t get ANY mail. ;)

And ASAP means AS SOON AS POSSIBLE. It does not mean in a minute, 10 minutes, 6 hours, 24 hours, or anything other than AS SOON AS POSSIBLE. And while their customer service may be functional throughout the entire weekend, their ordering and sales department may not be. I don’t know for sure one way or the other, but just because one department is running does not mean they all are.

From what I read (your own words) they indeed lived up to their guarantee. It may not be how you want it, but that is far from saying they fell short of what they promised. And I think their turn around time was actually pretty darn good.

[Target Practice]

I ordered a fiberwrapped, adjustable tank, and they sent me a steel, set-pressure one. They wouldn't let me return it, either.

Bastards.

[Lohman446]

#7...UPS shipments are daily, sometimes twice daily. I work in a warehouse...I know these things champ. Their customer service is fully functional through the weekend. I definitely expect a call since their "guarantee" stated that all customers with products that are back ordered are notified ASAP!

Just because their customer service is there does not mean there shipping department is. Well I understand your issue it is not their fault you waited that close to tournament to order a Halo. I'm sorry, but if I have an unestablished customer who demands a 25% upgrade I may just decide I really don't need that customer :)

[yakitori]

ya, you should procrastinate if you need a loader for a tourney. Bottomline.

Also, you come here moaning that you didnt get an upgrade and slander a companies name. Excuse me ...libel since its writing. And bash thier customer service (which did a good job IMO, the CS did). What was the purpose of the thread? to get venegance? To hopefully hurt their sales? To make someone reconsider when buying from them? Or all of the above?

You are the type of customer that give good companies a bad name cause you are so dang difficult to please.

Like I said three times already. YOU SHOULVE EMAILED THEM, ASKING IF THEY HAD IT ON HAND BEFORE YOU BOUGHT IT. Its your fault. If I need a halo for a tourney and need it to be in stock, I take the initiative myself and find out if I give them my money, will they have a halo on hand ready to ship. If not, go somewhere else.

If anything, this makes me want to do business w/ xtremepaintball. Just cause They have good customer service. And they offered an alternative as opposed to waiting and shipping it when they got it. They contacted you in one business day and offered a different color halo. I wouldve taken a clear one, or a smoke one, instead of whining like a tittybaby.

[MILKMAN]

ya, you should procrastinate if you need a loader for a tourney. Bottomline.

Also, you come here moaning that you didnt get an upgrade and slander a companies name. Excuse me ...libel since its writing. And bash thier customer service (which did a good job IMO, the CS did). What was the purpose of the thread? to get venegance? To hopefully hurt their sales? To make someone reconsider when buying from them? Or all of the above?

You are the type of customer that give good companies a bad name cause you are so dang difficult to please.

Like I said three times already. YOU SHOULVE EMAILED THEM, ASKING IF THEY HAD IT ON HAND BEFORE YOU BOUGHT IT. Its your fault. If I need a halo for a tourney and need it to be in stock, I take the initiative myself and find out if I give them my money, will they have a halo on hand ready to ship. If not, go somewhere else.

If anything, this makes me want to do business w/ xtremepaintball. Just cause They have good customer service. And they offered an alternative as opposed to waiting and shipping it when they got it. They contacted you in one business day and offered a different color halo. I wouldve taken a clear one, or a smoke one, instead of whining like a tittybaby.

As far as notification goes, I really can not believe many of you do not see Friday as the day to contact a consumer whose order was placed the afternoon of the next day. It does not take very long to process an order...I know this. I work at a warehouse that ships thousands of orders daily and I know how they are run so don't get high and mighty when you have no clue. ASAP is as soon as possible. Orders taken Thursday are filled the next day...which means FRIDAY. This is how almost every warehouse works, including XPaintball. The soonest possiblity when they could have contacted me...FRIDAY.

As far as contacting them before I bought the Halo from them to see if it was available, the whole reason I bought it from them was because of their stock guarantee!!!! lol. This means guaranteed to be in stock. They DO NOT have a ticker that says that their products are in or out of stock, thats what that little stock guarantee is for.

Why did I post this? To tell of an experience. Am I trying to sway others opinions? NO. I'm presenting information of my situation. A bad experience. If you had a bad experience, I would reply and give you my input on your situation if posted on a public forum. Freedom of speech. I am not going to change what many of you see as good customer service, and you are definitely not going to change what I see as good customer service. This is a presentation of information and personal opinions.

If you must resort to elementary name calling. Go for it, calling me a tittybaby. I'm sure you are right around that age. If you would have read however, all they had were RED and GREEN. Let me type that again for you...RED and GREEN. This is going on an ALL BLACK MARKER. Have a Nice Day

Edit: added more

[SlartyBartFast]

If you would have read however, all they had were RED and GREEN. Let me type that again for you...RED and GREEN. This is going on an ALL BLACK MARKER. Have a Nice Day

:tard:

Does anybody care anymore? Who cares about the colour of your marker?

Did you need the hopper for a trounament or not? A what kind of :tard: leaves things till the last minute without making it personal and calling?

That you work somewhere huge is inconsequential. Not all businesses are huge, and not all have automatic order processing. Get over it already.

They lived up to their end of the deal as far as any reasonable customer is concerned.

You have an expectation of speed of response and freebie upgrades taht falls outside what the company can deliver. So what.

I'm unsubbing from this sad thread so I can effectively ignore it.

[MILKMAN]

:tard:

Does anybody care anymore? Who cares about the colour of your marker?

Did you need the hopper for a trounament or not? A what kind of :tard: leaves things till the last minute without making it personal and calling?

That you work somewhere huge is inconsequential. Not all businesses are huge, and not all have automatic order processing. Get over it already.

They lived up to their end of the deal as far as any reasonable customer is concerned.

You have an expectation of speed of response and freebie upgrades taht falls outside what the company can deliver. So what.

I'm unsubbing from this sad thread so I can effectively ignore it.

Hehe, whatever you need to do or say to feel good about yourself and how you feel bud ;).

[Lohman446]

So, how many customer's do you think this thread has gotten them?

[MILKMAN]

So, how many customer's do you think this thread has gotten them?

Ask me if I care how many customers it has gotten them...

[68AutoMoose]

In 2000 I ordered a Spyder TL from them. Well, apparently they were out of stock because when it arrived it was a TL Plus...which amounted to a $15 dollar upgrade at no extra charge. It wasn't the gun I ordered, and I was not notified ahead of time. The only explaination was a brief description on the invoice.

In this case the substitution they made was completely satisfactory, and I would order from them again.

Just my experience, take it for what it's worth.

[CKY_Alliance]

Ask me if I care how many customers it has gotten them...


DO you care?


Yea uhh wow i read one of your above post it said something about you wanted peoples opinions..or if one of us posted you would give input....i believe everyone gave input..so chill out man no need to get all hostile...have a nice day, :cheers:

[MILKMAN]

DO you care?


Yea uhh wow i read one of your above post it said something about you wanted peoples opinions..or if one of us posted you would give input....i believe everyone gave input..so chill out man no need to get all hostile...have a nice day, :cheers:

It was not meant to be taken as hostile. I take some of the above "opinions" expressed in a hostile type tone.

Everyone gave input, I gave my input right back, problems?

[yakitori]

just drop it. this thread us useless. Obviously the guy is never gonna get it. The only thing that has been proven by this thread is that milkman is not a good person to do business with, and that Xpb has great customer service.

[MILKMAN]

just drop it. this thread us useless. Obviously the guy is never gonna get it. The only thing that has been proven by this thread is that milkman is not a good person to do business with, and that Xpb has great customer service.

Hehe, whatever you need to say to feel good about yourself big guy :D.

[-=Squid=-]

Hehe, whatever you need to say to feel good about yourself big guy :D.
Leave it be, enough name calling has gone on in this thread as it is............MarkM

[yakitori]

wanna see something funny. http://www.automags.org/forums/search.php?searchid=457597

hes got 20 posts. 11 of them in this thread, and the other 9 elsewhere. More than 50% of your posts have accomplished nothing.

There, I feel better about myself now. :D.

[MarkM]

Milkman drop it! You don't feel that you got a deal so live with it, you got your money back and you don't wish to deal with this company anymore this is your right but causing arguements online is not a good thing.
There are more than enough positive dealings with this company that have been posted and a couple of negatives but they are all outweighed by the positives.

[MILKMAN]

Milkman drop it! You don't feel that you got a deal so live with it, you got your money back and you don't wish to deal with this company anymore this is your right but causing arguements online is not a good thing.
There are more than enough positive dealings with this company that have been posted and a couple of negatives but they are all outweighed by the positives.

I'm expressing my opinion big guy. They don't want to argue, don't come to my post...seems simple enough.

[shartley]

I think this thread is a great candidate for a thread lock. Who seconds that? ;)

[Automaggot68]

I think this thread is a great candidate for a thread lock. Who seconds that? ;)


I second that motion.
I'm a Sheep!

/Targetpractice

[MarkM]

I'm expressing my opinion big guy. They don't want to argue, don't come to my post...seems simple enough.

Ok I am expressing mine too....thread closed ;)