The game if: There were no semis [Archive] - Automags.Org Online Forums

Lohman446

06-21-2005, 09:02 AM

Skoad

06-21-2005, 09:15 AM

i thought of it just for a project. there are a few out there. Believe all of them are custom jobs.

cdacda13

06-21-2005, 09:29 AM

There would be woodsball, and only woodsball.
Lots of long range shooting, people would be to scared to move up.

It would suck

Thordic

06-21-2005, 09:36 AM

There would be woodsball, and only woodsball.
Lots of long range shooting, people would be to scared to move up.

It would suck

You're an idiot.

There is WAY more movement in pump games than in semi games. The fact ropes of paint aren't flying all over the place makes people way more likely to move and make crazy moves.

Pump speedball is ridiculous fun because you have people trying all sorts of crazy moves off the break. You can't lane with a pump.

I think if we were still on pump/bolt-action whatever the game wouldn't have gotten as popular, unfortunately. The game would have stayed in the woods. It would still be a wargame.

If by some miracle speedball managed to evolve without semi though, I think we'd be better off as a sport.

Dend78

06-21-2005, 09:38 AM

i think ppl would be more skilled in military style play then for sure, there would be no more sprinting to the 50 lol, ppl wouldnt be scared to move up you would have to learn how to move up, actually it would be a lot eaiser to move up instead of ducking a rope of paint u would have to get away from one or 2 well placed balls, ppl would actually learn how to shoot rather than laying a case out a game thats just what i think

frontrunner

06-21-2005, 09:39 AM

^^^^^^ have you ever played pump its anything but a long range game with little movement. last month at a pump event the speed ball was a balst since movement is much easyier but you had to watch home much hung out some of those guys could hit almost anything it was fun and some of the cleanest hype free paintball i've ever played

cdacda13

06-21-2005, 09:48 AM

You're an idiot.

There is WAY more movement in pump games than in semi games. The fact ropes of paint aren't flying all over the place makes people way more likely to move and make crazy moves.

Pump speedball is ridiculous fun because you have people trying all sorts of crazy moves off the break. You can't lane with a pump.

I think if we were still on pump/bolt-action whatever the game wouldn't have gotten as popular, unfortunately. The game would have stayed in the woods. It would still be a wargame.

If by some miracle speedball managed to evolve without semi though, I think we'd be better off as a sport.
Maybe I am.

With a pump, you dont have to take your hand off the gun.
If it was a bolt action sort of thing, you would have to take your hand off teh trigger, the gun would dip backwards, and you would have to catch the bolt and cock it. You might be able to take out one person, but someone else would get you before you are able to re cock it.

And pump speedball is the most fun to watch and play, I agree with you there.

Jeffy-CanCon

06-21-2005, 09:49 AM

I don't think the development of "pump" class play could have been avoided, since it is only a gravity-feed. Once people started adding angled stick feeders to their PGPs and 007's, we were on the road. Semi-auto's might have been avioided if the manufacturers and insurers agreed upon it, I guess.

I think the others are right to say that paintball would not be as big or popular as it is now. Pump play requires a steeper learning curve, which discourages people who aren't really in love with it. One of the main differences would be that everything would be more expensive since there would not be the same economies of scale.

I think we'd still have HPA, and we'd still have speedball. HPA, pressure regulators and aftermarket barrels are even more useful on a pump when you really need every shot to be as accurate as possible. Speedball was a move to encourage spectators, and make the game more public friendly. It has nothing to do with ROF. In fact, I'd have to agree with Thor and some others who have pointed out that speedball works better with pumps, if anything.

Thordic

06-21-2005, 10:00 AM

Maybe I am.

With a pump, you dont have to take your hand off the gun.
If it was a bolt action sort of thing, you would have to take your hand off teh trigger, the gun would dip backwards, and you would have to catch the bolt and cock it. You might be able to take out one person, but someone else would get you before you are able to re cock it.

And pump speedball is the most fun to watch and play, I agree with you there.

Not so. A nelspot is a bolt-action, and you don't have to take your hand of the trigger to cock it. You put the bolt on the left side. Hold the gun with your right hand, and cock with your left hand. Its slower than a pump, but not by a huge amount.

rkjunior303

06-21-2005, 10:03 AM

Not so. A nelspot is a bolt-action, and you don't have to take your hand of the trigger to cock it. You put the bolt on the left side. Hold the gun with your right hand, and cock with your left hand. Its slower than a pump, but not by a huge amount.

Bri should know :) He's been known to bunker a viking shooter or two with his OWN Nelspot...

sbpyro

06-21-2005, 10:05 AM

I will agree that speed ball works a lot better with pumps.
Heck even now when I go out on the field with a pump (woodsball)
I am not gonna let some one with an electro know where I am by firing a long range shot that may or may not hit. I close the gap until he is within what I feel comfortable that one shot will get the other player out.

MarkM

06-21-2005, 10:11 AM

Whilst there can be some agreement about Speedball being there for spectators now it's primary use when used at paintball sites was to encourage a higher volume of paint as when in the woods you couldn't always see the other players but on a Speedball arena you can so you were tempted (very successfully) to try a shot or two at that player way at the back. Paintball tournaments were all held at existing paintball woods site some were lucky enough to have an area that was open enough to place either tyres or strawbales and they called it Speedball. I very often would refuse to play the Speedball field when playing as a walk-on as the paint prices were silly high back then and even with a pump I was firing a case a day...if I got real lucky maybe half a case. The lowest I ever shot and it was in a tournament was 400 rounds, we won as well but the paint was the original Nelson and it went pretty much exactly were we wanted it to and so we as a team used way less than normally. These were the days of cases of 2500 or the mini boxes of Cal-mag but we were paying around 6-8p (11-14c) a ball.
Movement with a pump on a Speedball field is immense I think it would be fair to say that two pumps teams on a Speedball field would find at least 2 v 2 on the 50 after the start whistle. People talk about how it is possibe to run through a lane of semi fire well given that a pump is going to be at least half if not more than that per second slower running down the field is a lot easier.

firebanex

06-21-2005, 11:43 AM

pump games are so much faster paced than the current run of electro speedball games. just go to the www.blowfishpaintball.com site a watch a few of the pump only videos. so much more movement.

I would perfer to be playing other pump players, I think that for the most part pump players are better than the semi players. I'm not afraid to play against semis w/ my phantom but if I ever where to play against another pump player it would be more of a chalenge.

ehh... what can we do besides talk about it, semis are here to stay, but pump play is on the rise. viva la pump revelution!

Raven001

06-21-2005, 12:41 PM

For one, I think it would be much easier to ref the game.

second, over shooting would be "ref he hit me twice" :shooting:

Jeffy-CanCon

06-21-2005, 02:00 PM

For one, I think it would be much easier to ref the game.

second, over shooting would be "ref he hit me twice" :shooting:

:( Worst I ever lit someone up with a pump was eight shots. A big guys who stood up right away, but whose buddies continued to use him for cover for another 2-3 seconds. Autotriggers put out a lot of paint if you know how to use them.

68magOwner

06-21-2005, 02:35 PM

whenever i play against pumps (weither i am using one at the time or not) i usually just run through a tapeline early in the game, when your used to avoiding 15+ bps lanes, getting out of the way of 1 ball isnt to tricky, so, really not as challenging IMO

CrimsonGhost

06-21-2005, 02:45 PM

It would be fun THATS FOR SURE!!!

I think paint would be expensive still and we wouldnt have all the different companys in this sport.
Not much choice.

But it would be fun .
:cheers:

Jaan

06-21-2005, 03:02 PM

I was thinking about this, how much different would the game be today if the semi had never evolved, or for that matter the pump. I was just thinking last night about making a "bolt action" marker... and how much it would influence how I played. Just curious what everyone thinks.
Bolt Action: Nelspot 007, Sheridan KP-1 rifle

I like semi, just not mad crazy electronic bouncy semi. I played back in the mid 80's and it was really fun but it didn't capture me like later on when semis appeared in the 90's. I guess sometimes I want to feel like I'm Rambo (c:

Jeffy-CanCon

06-22-2005, 11:02 AM

Aslan

06-23-2005, 12:03 AM

Bolt Action: Nelspot 007, Sheridan KP-1 rifle

I like semi, just not mad crazy electronic bouncy semi. I played back in the mid 80's and it was really fun but it didn't capture me like later on when semis appeared in the 90's. I guess sometimes I want to feel like I'm Rambo (c:

Well put.
:clap: :clap: :clap:

I loved the game most when both sides are on an even footing and the game was cheap to play. Back when we had a field full of Talons, Tiger Sharks, Raptors, and Stingrays...ya went through about a half a case of paint tops...it was alot of fun and depended more on strategy and a little luck. :clap: :headbang:

What ruined it is the first time the "one guy" showed up with Spyder...or a Tippmann 98...not that those guns are overpowering...but they open the door...and soon the field is all Tippmanns and Spyders...then the one guy shows up with a mag...and a couple guys show up with autocockers... :shooting: :shooting:

I used to go to the field with my Spyder and feel like I had a 50/50 chance. Now, I see guys that show up with electronic guns and $450 A5 flatlines...and I have to rely more on the refs ability to pick fair teams...and I hate to rely on that. :ninja:

68magOwner

06-23-2005, 12:21 AM

You need to play against people who can hit a moving target!

You need to learn to make yourself not get hit by those who think they can hit a moving target!

honestly, if you can only shoot 1 ball, i could stand there and dodge it, much less have you hit me while im running

Jaan

06-23-2005, 01:00 AM

What ruined it is the first time the "one guy" showed up with Spyder...or a Tippmann 98...not that those guns are overpowering...but they open the door...and soon the field is all Tippmanns and Spyders...then the one guy shows up with a mag...and a couple guys show up with autocockers... :shooting: :shooting:
LOL, yeah, I was that "one guy". When all my friends had VM-68's and Pro-Lite's, I got a 'Mag. In all fairness though, I let my friends play with my 'Mag as much as I did so there's some good karma in that gun. It's a little disquieting spending all that time making a kick @$$ market and then being on the recieving end of it though (c:

SpecialBlend2786

06-23-2005, 01:59 AM

well, it would be alot more fun to watch that's for sure

Jeffy-CanCon

06-23-2005, 09:52 AM

You need to learn to make yourself not get hit by those who think they can hit a moving target!

honestly, if you can only shoot 1 ball, i could stand there and dodge it, much less have you hit me while im running

I don't say that "I" can reliably hit a moving target with a single shot, but I know more than a couple who can. If you can dodge a paintball at 280fps, maybe you are :ninja: .

bound for glory

06-23-2005, 10:33 AM

the game without semi's? a much better place :cheers:

Paintchucker

06-23-2005, 10:58 AM

You need to learn to make yourself not get hit by those who think they can hit a moving target!

honestly, if you can only shoot 1 ball, i could stand there and dodge it, much less have you hit me while im running

You actually have to practice both skills... Sure at a distance it is easy to sidestep a paintball, but up close and while you are on the run, not so easy.

I remember back when I started, we played pumps on Sat. Semis on Sunday. I took a vertical pump from a Mossberg Shotgun and modified it to fit on my Bushmaster Pump, complete with brass/bronze rails. One time after a game, I had a guy come up to me *****ing like hell "What are you doing, don't you know that Semis are only allowed on Sundays?"... I looked at him and smiled... "But it is a pump!" :) Shoots 3-4 shots a second, but still just a pump!

Another time, we were playing in the sleet. There were a couple tourny players, that they had divided evenly between the two teams. One of the guys had on an Airforce Parka, with the fur lined hood. He came running across the field at a diagonal. I hit him 3 times center of the chest. His coat was too thick, so the balls bounced, but it kinda freaked him that I hit him dead center on the run, so he called himself out... LOL

I have a couple trophys from when me and two buds started playing tourny. My favorite is the 1st place in the 3 man pump !!! We don't have the signatures anymore, but mine used to say: "Don't tell me bout your fancy gun. Tell me about pump guns and 1on1..."

hitech

06-23-2005, 12:04 PM

You can't lane with a pump.

You might be surprised what you can do with a pump. I've played speedball with a pump (albeit against old single trigger semis and pumps) and it's not as hard as it sounds. Especially when the ROF of most everyone else is on the lower side.

I think if we were still on pump/bolt-action whatever the game wouldn't have gotten as popular, unfortunately.

I agree with this. It takes a lot of practice to fire fast with a pump. And it's one of those skills that you loose if you don't constantly practice. So, if we only had pumps there would be an even bigger skills gap between beginning players and those with experience. And the learning curve for the pump is MUCH higher than an electro-semi. The longer it takes to learn the necessary skills to be completive enough to get "hooked", the less people will.

:cheers:

CrimsonTurkey

06-23-2005, 03:04 PM

Bolt action is great fun! My friend has a custom bolt action phantom. If you anchor the stock in your shoulder and support the gun with your left hand you can easily get a shot of every second nce you get a rhythm to it. The right hand just needs to keep moving.

Thordic

06-23-2005, 03:59 PM

hitech, you can try to lane, but the vast majority of pumpers (and pumps) won't be able to put out enough paint to lane with the same effect you get today.

Aslan

06-23-2005, 04:13 PM

Every gun can be converted to bolt action by simply not using hoppers or tubes... :cheers:

Some friends of mine and I were thinking of trying that...it's called "Civil War". You can use any gun you want...but you can only load paintballs by hand, no hoppers. We usually end up playing pump with 45 round hoppers because we don't feel like carrying a bag of paintballs with us while we're running around...but we'll probably try it eventually. The reason we end up playing pump is because it's just a small vacant field across from his house and semis end up being overkill. When we go to a "real field", we don't play pump unless our semi guns break. I don't want to start a "pump debate"...and in woodsball the ROF isn't as important anyway...but with everybody shooting 7-12bps...it's just too easy to get pinned down with a pump. If everyone used pumps...I'd love it! I'd probably play twice a month minimum because suddenly I'm not using 3/4 to a full case of paint per afternoon. But with guys coming out with Shockers and A5s and DM5s and trying to pelt some rec players...the pump "accuracy advantage" starts to deteriorate and the it comes down to simple math or superior tactics...or you buy a $650 "pump" that shoots 6-7bps and probably isn't a "pump" anymore if you're realistic. :bounce: :shooting: :bounce:

hitech

06-23-2005, 05:00 PM

hitech, you can try to lane, but the vast majority of pumpers (and pumps) won't be able to put out enough paint to lane with the same effect you get today.

No argument there. However, had semis never came about there would be quite a few fast pumpers. While you still couldn't get even close to today's ROF, I don't think you'd find everyone at the fifty. ;) Laneing isn't the only way to keep someone from advancing. ;)

:cheers: