Would a Cheaper Tournament be A Good Thing?

[SlartyBartFast]

Well, there will supposedly be Skyball next year.

I’ve asked this question before on AO and I'm asking PBN (http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.php?t=1093566) but thought it would be good to ask it here again:

Would enough teams be interested in an event that was run for fun, honour, and reasonable entrance fees instead of humongous prize packages?
You know, payback and appreciation to all the little teams that make the league possible instead of lining the pockets of organisers, distributors, and the “top’ teams.

Skyball organisers certainly don’t seem to think so....
http://www.skyball8.com/news/index.asp

Think about it: if the 100,000$ prize in the Open Class was divided between all the participating teams (minimum 40) then the event would be $2500 cheaper per team to participate. Wow.

http://www.skyball8.com/prizes/index.asp
Looking at all the prizes, you could do the same calculation for each division and eliminate the prize money and reduce the entrance fee.

Then, if you add up the skids and cases of paint being given away, paint should be free for everyone. Or at least certainly not 90$ US a case.

Considering how difficult it is for a team to get good enough to get sponsors, shouldn’t some of the sponsorship money thrown at the events be directed towards making participation less expensive?

At those prices and at those levels of prizes, I certainly hope the referees and officials are getting well paid.

[Lohman446]

Yes...

A) I think it would get rid of the "incentive" to cheat, at least for some people
B) I'm all for admitting when going to tournaments making finals is an iffy thing. I go to play, I enjoy the format.
C) Lower entrance fees would be less that I am paying the teams that are better than me. Lets just play, play fair, have fun, go to dinner, and call it a day. I have no reason for $2000 + prize packages (often seen at the local level where I am) that I have no chance of seeing. I would much rather just have fun

[Muzikman]

Interesting concepts. Divide the winnings between all the teams entered and give them out before the event.

The problem would be, what is the incentive to play then?

I like the way Kevin has arranged the IAO Owners Group Division.

The big prizes go for the sportsmanship and not the event winner. If prizes are what you play for, then it would not pay to cheat. If you play for the title of "First Place" then it doesn't matter and you get your name on a trophy and a jersey (or something) for your troubles.

[shartley]

I think tournaments should be paid primarily by the Vendors who attend them, not the teams playing. Sure a nominal fee is fine, but not like what we see.

And I think the higher level (or greater exposure) tournaments should only be played by teams who have gone through the local or regional tournaments and gathered enough points to be there. This would take care of over attendance by teams as well as help support lower level tournaments. It will also eliminate buying your way into a tournament.

[68magOwner]

if prizes are enough to make back what i put into the tournament in entry/paint, then, im fine with it

[SlartyBartFast]

I think tournaments should be paid primarily by the Vendors who attend them, not the teams playing. Sure a nominal fee is fine, but not like what we see.

And that's my main point/gripe. Where exactly are the profiteers trying to make a buck? I don't mind paying for the experience/services. But it seems that your soaked every which way. The event is sponsoered and retail which means your sold to, you pay for registration, you pay for paint, you pay for air/CO2, you pay concession prices for food and liquids.......

With all the cash and product flowing from sponsors to the event organisers, why should a team pay (all prices from skyball8):

Young Guns: $450.00
Rookie: $850.00
Novice: $900.00
Open Class Division: $2000.00

Then, pay 90$ a case for paint?!?

Consider the big tournaments for a moment: Why is it PSP and NPPL charge so much for virtually EVERYTHING? I suppose like other sports, they'll soon poison the well that they're drinking from. Why should lower teams fund the travel expenses of league officials and the cheating ways of the perennial winners? But, I suppose THAT'S another rant. :p

Small tournaments are often worse. :tard: Each event seems to be priced in order for the field owner to be able to sponsor their team in all the other events for the season. So, you either have to be on the nepotistic field teams or be independantly wealthy.

But perhaps I phrased my questions/poll wrong. I didn't mean to get into tournaments and series. I was thinking more along the lines of unaffiliated events. Say a big Open.

[SlartyBartFast]

Interesting concepts. Divide the winnings between all the teams entered and give them out before the event.

The problem would be, what is the incentive to play then?

Good clean competition and your name on a trophy.

If I stick with picking on Skyball, there would still be all that merchandise left in the prize packages......

[A.T.S]

I have never played in a tournament because I cannot afford it. I do not go to fields that often because it costs to much. I can spend $25 buying air and 500 paintballs for myself and 3 other friends, go to the woods and have a blast all day! I would have to sell my condo and live in a van by the river in order to afford to play in any real competition. (But that is no way to find a Wife.... at least not an attractive one!)

[SlartyBartFast]

It's quite amusing the difference between the responses on AO and PBN. :p

The poll results are very similar...

[Lohman446]

It's quite amusing the difference between the responses on AO and PBN. :p

The poll results are very similar...


LOL... how can someone not understand if you have 100K less in expense, you can have 100K less in income and have the exact same profit

[SlartyBartFast]

LOL... how can someone not understand if you have 100K less in expense, you can have 100K less in income and have the exact same profit

Somebody failed grade school mathematics and has complete lack of basic reasoning. :rofl:

But, that'll teach me for taking discussion off topic and making the glib comment/observation that the basic economics show that the prize money could be eliminated and teams could be PAID to attend.

And isn't that disgusting? If those economics could work, where's the organisation that's there for the players, the love of the game, AND a good profit?

If the leagues were truly well organised, as Shartley pointed out, with local events producing winners that could then attend regional and national events, the top teams that SHOULD be participating in the open classes at the regional and national could be doing so with decent flight and room subsidies provided by the event.

Wouldn't that be an interesting series/league....

To get to regional, you have to place in local.
To get to national, you have to place in regional.
To get to international, you have to place in national.

Depending on how you place could determine whether you stay at a given level or need to work your way back up.

Each level would be affordable for ALL teams. Not just factory teams, those with sponsors, and the independently wealthy. Less money spent on lodging, travel, and registration/participation by the sponsored teams would result in either more sponsorship money available for the events and teams in lower level tournament series and/or create money available to pay more proffessional players who could be paid to play full time.

The step up to tournament play would far less grusome finacially. Unsponsored teams would only lose time and travel and be able to attend more events.

After cost of paint, travel, and tournament participation (which is ALL just money related) being on a super sponsored team wouldn't be that much of a competitive edge. The technology and equipment count for far less many players give credit IF the equipment works within the rules.....

[BuyMyMag]

I think a cheaper tournament that deals less with prizes, and more with fun would be a great thing. We play paintball as to have fun, not to win $1,0000,000 prize packages (Well, atleast I play to have fun...)... I think you would have more of the smaller teams sign up, the ones who don't have a sponsor, and are self funded. I think you would have a freakin' blast... :shooting: