Moral Dilema.

[southside_mag]

Ok so heres what happend, About 6 or 7 months ago I moved to missouri from florida with full intentions of returning but after I got up here i decided to stay.Before i left i borrowed some money from my mom and step dad under the conditions that i would leave all my paintball equipment down there with them for collateral, I had no problem with this becuase i had planned on returning.
So after i decided i was going to stay in missouri i called them up and told them that i would be sending the money back wich i did the following day, i told them that i would pay to have all of my equipment sent back up to me and all they had to do would be drop it off at ups and tell me how much it was going to cost and i would send the money, well if you knew my parents then you would know that asking them to do anything for someone else was asking to much. So they tell me it would be a while before they could go and do it (ups store was on there way home from work and in the same plaza as the supermarket they go shopping for groceries at) so I waited and waited for close to a month and finally on one of my chats with them i ask what was going on with my paintball markers and she tells me that about a week prior she tried to send them but the post office, ups, and fed ex would not ship them because they were considered guns and the tanks could explode, now having bought many paintball oreinted thigs off ebay i knew this was bull so i called ups for my self and they told me it was no problem at all as long as the tanks were empty, so i call her back up and tell her what they said and she said she would try again.
two months went by with me calling and asking about it and finally she tells that they can do it but it will cost 100.00 to 150.00 to ship it so once again i call ups and with an approximate size and weight they tell me it will be around 30.00 to 40.00 dollars so i western union the money down to her and ask if she needs a box too, she tells me no just send the money, well after two weeks of waiting she finnally answers my call and tells me that she will ship the stuff as soon as she gets a box, man i was mad!! anyway she completly stops talking to me for about a month, and when she finally does answer the phone she tells me that she didn't want to here my **** about the guns and she would send them when she sends them. :mad: so i'll admit it i went off on her :cuss: , how can somone tell you they don't want to here **** about some thing they owe you.
by now i'm starting to think that my step dad may have sold them and there trying to stall telling me (YES HE IS THAT TYPE OF PERSON AND IS CAPABLE OF DOING SOMETHING LIKE THAT) So fast forward to yesterday she calls and tells my grandmother that my stepdad dosn't want her talking to me anymore so if i call she's not going to answer but she will send the $40.00 back just to be done with it and to forget about the guns they caused to many problems and she dosn't want to deal with them anymore :eek: .
so heres my dilema i've tried sending friends by the house to get my stuff but they don't answer the door and i've tried to resolve this problem every way i can think of. so i'm thinking of contacting an attorney, i really didn't want it to come to this but i have over $1500.00 worth of stuff down there. so is it wrong to sue your parents and am i a bad guy?
also I apologize for the length of this but i just wanted to explain the whole situation so you guys would understand, and yes i know it was stupid to leave the stuff with them knowing how they are but i thought for sure i would be back.And work prevents me from going down there and personally :mad: getting my stuff back. So tell me what you think?

[lamingo]

Ouch that sucks as far as suing them i dont know but what about driving down there.

[JRingold]

What about heading back home for a visit and get the stuff while you are there?

Maybe, that's too easy??

[personman]

Give them a last warning, and if they ignore it, take legal action.

Seems kind of harsh but that's what I would do if I was in your situation.

[Alley]

While I'm sorry to hear that any family would be torn apart for such reasons. It seems that it goes deeper than that. While paintball equipment and such is expensive to replace ...family is impossible. I'd try and patch things up between you and your mother and then see if a calmer attitude will get to the bottom of things.

[Snyiper]

It would be cheaper and much better for relations for you to plan a weekend and go get your stuff. I know it is a inconvience but to get the deal done right this is what I would do unannounced so they can not leave. Face em face to face and thank them for all their help.
Glenn

[Aslan]

I listened to a radio show once talking about this type of issue. The lawyers started out with a warning...and that is that sueing family members often makes them not like you for a very long time...maybe forever.

If you can live with that and/or the relationship with them is already pretty bad...then you have to treat them like you would anyone else. Someone has something of yours and is refusing to give it to you. At a minimum, they owe you the items or compensation for the item's value. They also may owe you additional compensation. They also may be committing a crime, grand larceny and possibly the resale of stolen goods.

If I were you, I would find an honorable attorney and have them draft a letter on your behalf. In that letter, the attorney will state that if your items are not returned to you, you have the intention to sue. This lawyer probably should be based in Florida and you may very well have to go back there to get this resolved. Maybe the letter does the trick and they ship the items to you out of fear that you are serious. If it doesn't do the trick, then you'll have a rough road ahead...but a good lawyer will probably help you through it.

The sad thing is that you might end up deciding that it's cheaper to lose $1500 in paintball supplies rather than spend the money you probably don't have on plane tickets, court costs, and lawyer fees. It might be worthwhile to call the authorites in the town they live in...the authorities may be willing to accompany a friend of your's to retrieve the items.

[BD_Paintball]

i would take a trip down there and get all your stuff(if it is still there) and then ship it to your house. i bet you would save money to just go back home and see for your self if it's still there.

[southside_mag]

truthfully sueing them wasn't what i wanted to do, but i see no other way. I would definetly go and get the stuff myself but thats just not possible, I saved up for a long time to get all of these things and it's hard to just let them go. Unfotunatlly this is not the first instance that this type of thing has happend, this is more of a last straw type of thing. I think getting a lawyer to send them a letter requesting the items or compensation first might be a good way to go.

[buzzboy]

Yeah. That is the most sensible way to go about things. I hope you can get your stuff back. Good luck.

[Captain Canuck]

Basically, your only real choice is to go to your 'rents house(which you should have done in the first place) and get your stuff. At the very least you would be able to see firsthand whether or not they have sold your gear. If your gear is gone then I would reccommend asking them for the replacement value for the geaqr, and if thaqt fails tell them that you will take it to the next level if neccesary.

[Fred]

Where in FL?

I'm sorry you have such worthless parents, that's a real drag.

[southside_mag]

[QUOTE=Fred]Where in FL?

I'm sorry you have such worthless parents, that's a real drag.[/QUO

in bonita springs.

[hobbesTZ]

It pisses me off just reading about your situation...That's :mad: :shooting: :nono: :cuss: and I wouldn't put up with it. I don't know your history with your family, but I'd want nothing to do with people that like.

[Lenny]

Wow, I'm sorry man. I have a friend who's mom is like that. He also lives in FL (just outside of Orlando, not sure where though). He went on vacation with his friend and his family to Cali. It was only a week long trip, and might I add, think kid is a grade genuine geek (and he'll admit it!). He had a video game collection and some really rare consoles and all that. He said he collection was valued at something like 4 grand (i told you he's a geek!). So, while on vacation, his mom sells it ALL on ebay. He comes home, hands him $300 and says "It was all just a big distraction! Video games are evil!"

Sounds fair, eh? $300 for stuff you invested $4,000 in and your mom just sells it. He can't do anything, he's only 16, so technically she did have the ownership rights. He ended up moving out and in with his old man.

So I don't personally know how that is, but I've seen it first had. I'm sorry about your troubles. If things don't go over well, I'd be more than happy to ship you some of my gear that I don't use much (all in amazing shape) just to get you back in.

[southside_mag]

Wow, I'm sorry man. I have a friend who's mom is like that. He also lives in FL (just outside of Orlando, not sure where though). He went on vacation with his friend and his family to Cali. It was only a week long trip, and might I add, think kid is a grade genuine geek (and he'll admit it!). He had a video game collection and some really rare consoles and all that. He said he collection was valued at something like 4 grand (i told you he's a geek!). So, while on vacation, his mom sells it ALL on ebay. He comes home, hands him $300 and says "It was all just a big distraction! Video games are evil!"

Sounds fair, eh? $300 for stuff you invested $4,000 in and your mom just sells it. He can't do anything, he's only 16, so technically she did have the ownership rights. He ended up moving out and in with his old man.

So I don't personally know how that is, but I've seen it first had. I'm sorry about your troubles. If things don't go over well, I'd be more than happy to ship you some of my gear that I don't use much (all in amazing shape) just to get you back in.

Thats really cool of you to offer and i apreciate it :cheers: , but i'll probably just go to wal-mart and pick up a cheap set up to get me by until i get this worked out, man whats this world coming to when you can't even leave somthing at your own parents house without fear of it getting sold for quick cash.

[gortman44]

get your stuff by any means, or at least the money that is due to you. ...... what an *** hole. :cuss: , your step dad

[Lee]

sound like you don't come from a happy home in the first place.

been there and done that. if thats the case, i understand what you're going through.

just because they are your parents, that gives them no right to run over you and take your personal property. they're your parents! they should be happy to help you, which is what parents and people that love you really do.

do what you have to do to get your stuff or your money, fight B.S. w/ fire and at the least they'll think long and hard before treating you like that again. and after it's all done, stay in missouri, move on with your life and be happy.

anyone that wants to flame me for what i just said can take a flying leap. when you've been treated like this or worse by your parents or people that are supposed to watch out for you, then you can talk.

yeah i have issues, and seeing people treat thier children like this makes me sick and angry.

[CoolHand]

sound like you don't come from a happy home in the first place.

been there and done that. if thats the case, i understand what you're going through.

just because they are your parents, that gives them no right to run over you and take your personal property. they're your parents! they should be happy to help you, which is what parents and people that love you really do.

do what you have to do to get your stuff or your money, fight B.S. w/ fire and at the least they'll think long and hard before treating you like that again. and after it's all done, stay in missouri, move on with your life and be happy.

anyone that wants to flame me for what i just said can take a flying leap. when you've been treated like this or worse by your parents or people that are supposed to watch out for you, then you can talk.

yeah i have issues, and seeing people treat thier children like this makes me sick and angry.

Agreed.

Whenever a parent goes this far to be cruel to their kids (which is what this boils down to - "you're not here to defend yourself or your stuff, so we will do as we like, na na") then they sorta lose the right to be aghast when they get sued by said kid.

BTW, where in Missouri are you? Near the middle? :D

Shoot me an email with your # and I'll give you a ring next time we go play. I'll even loan you some gear (god knows everyone else uses my stuff, why not you too).

I swear, you have to have a license to drive a car, or even own a dog in most places, but they will let anybody be a parent. :rolleyes:

PLEASE NOTE: I do not think that you should have to buy a license to have a child. Nor do I think there should be mandatory training or anything of the sort. I just find it humorous (at best) that we as a society place so little importance on what is arguable the most important job in the world.

I do find it amazing that some folks manage to grow up normal, well adjusted, and responsible, even when their parents are gone or are complete tools. To those individuals, I tip my hat.

Instead of being a waste of space and blaming their folks (which could have easily happened), they sucked it up and became useful members of society (you know, law abiding, job having, rational people).

I had good parents, so I had it easy. However, I have had many friends that fell on both sides of the above statement. It is an all too common scene these days.

[Lohman446]

Let me say this - what is happening to you sucks, and I in no way mean to make it any different.

Let's use your figures of $1500. Is alienating your parents (even if they suck) from your life forever worth $1500 (or $500 after the lawyer fees). To me it would not be (though my parents are tremendous)... and sometimes in life you just have to swallow pride, and loss, and move forward. I can't judge your situation, I cannot imagine what it is like....

[CoolHand]

Let me say this - what is happening to you sucks, and I in no way mean to make it any different.

Let's use your figures of $1500. Is alienating your parents (even if they suck) from your life forever worth $1500 (or $500 after the lawyer fees). To me it would not be (though my parents are tremendous)... and sometimes in life you just have to swallow pride, and loss, and move forward. I can't judge your situation, I cannot imagine what it is like....

Well, I look at it a different way.

I think that by pulling a cheap stunt like this, that it is his parents that don't care if they alienate him (which may be the motive that his step dad has, as it seems they don't particularly care for one another), or they figure they can push as hard as they like, because he will always come back.

People like that need to know that you have the will to fight, rather than just bending over and taking it. They count on you not wanting to make them mad, or alienate them when in fact they likely don't care how much they hurt you, or alienate you.

Lohman - I know where you are coming from, I love my folks, and could never blatantly slap them in the face, but we both have to look at this from the perspective of someone who doesn't have folks like we do. He can't depend on them, he can't trust them, and he shouldn't have to feel bad about standing up for himself or taking care of what is his ('cause they sure as hell aren't).

[Jon594]

What about calling the police to confiscate the items? Maybe get one of your friends to pick them up at the station and mail them off.

[cdacda13]

Maybe your parents want you to come home, because they miss you. So, they are using the paintball gear as a way for you to come home,

[SpitFire1299]

There your parents, respect your elders. I know your probley mad, and yes it does suck.. but you would have nothing if it wasnt for them in the first place. I dont know what to suggest...

[southside_mag]

first off let me say that i appreciate all of you guys input and thanks for writing, I guess my real moral dilema in the situation was with my mom, now I don't think it's right that she's taking part in all of this, but I also don't want to blame her, see he has been the one with the problem with me from the start sort of counting the days till i turned 18 so he could say get out, I think she is more afraid of losing him thats why she lets him get away with stuff like this and with me moving out at seventeen he is all she got.
I understand where you guys are comming from by saying go down there and get the stuff ,even if i could, that would cause alot of problems between them,and i don't want to be the cause of marital problems for my mom, that also happens to be one of the reasons i moved to missouri,(the other is because my girlfriend wanted to move and i'm whipped :D ) now most of the people i've talked to about it have just told me look your young let it go and just learn from this and don't make the same mistake twice, but anybody who has worked and worked hard just so they could have somthing nice will tell you that letting someone just take it is not an option. this whole situation has got me completly confused,and i'm glad that there's a place like this were i can get some insight on my situation. thanks again!

also I live in licking so if anybody's in my area and plays let me know, paintball has always been just the thing to get my mind off problems! :D

[also i realize that sueing them will most likely cause problems between them too but me going down there would definetlly cuase alot more, somtimes i let my emotions get the best of me and it would most definetlly turn out very bad]

[sumorai]

Still got a key to the house? Still talk to your grandma? Still got friends in their area?


Here's the plan:

1. mail key to good friends in the area

2. keep in constant contact with your grandma

3. if she says they're taking a vacation or will be gone for a few hours, move on to step 4, otherwise repeat steps 2 & 3

4. call good friends, tell them to go to the house and get your stuff

[cioeboy]

have your friends check if the stuff is there and if it isnt have some one talk to your mom or dad and record it if she admits that she or your dad sold them it would be sale of stolen merchendise and you would have proof on tape

[southside_mag]

Still got a key to the house? Still talk to your grandma? Still got friends in their area?


Here's the plan:

1. mail key to good friends in the area

2. keep in constant contact with your grandma

3. if she says they're taking a vacation or will be gone for a few hours, move on to step 4, otherwise repeat steps 2 & 3

4. call good friends, tell them to go to the house and get your stuff

It's funny my girlfriend suggested that i do that same thing the other day except without the key.

[buzzboy]

have your friends check if the stuff is there and if it isnt have some one talk to your mom or dad and record it if she admits that she or your dad sold them it would be sale of stolen merchendise and you would have proof on tape
Now that would be a great idea. Perfectly legal and wouldn't cost as much as a lawyer.

[warbeak2099]

Before bringing the case to court and getting lawyers involved, I would seek mediation and/or arbitration. Find a company that does this in the area of your parents' home. Arbitration would be a better choice if you are confident you have been wronged. However, seeing as your parents probably wouldn't agree to this counseling, I would take them to small claims court.

[Lee]

Let me say this - what is happening to you sucks, and I in no way mean to make it any different.

Let's use your figures of $1500. Is alienating your parents (even if they suck) from your life forever worth $1500 (or $500 after the lawyer fees). To me it would not be (though my parents are tremendous)... and sometimes in life you just have to swallow pride, and loss, and move forward. I can't judge your situation, I cannot imagine what it is like....


Lohman446: your heart is in the right place, but, sometimes alienating people, even parents, is the right and neccessary thing to do. the ball is in the parents court right now they need to do whats right and just being parents does not give them the right to abuse, which is exactly what they are doing.
most people that have never been put in a situation like this don't understand and i know there is little that can be done to show them. they just don't get it and i hope there are fewer and fewer that do getv it because that will mean that fewer and fewer have experienced it.
try waking up hating yourself because thats what your were taught by action or in action of the two single most important people in your life. i hope to whatever god is there that southside_mag isn't in that situation and that it's simply about paintball guns and money. that would be a blessing.

how about your mother considering a person who is not your father as more important than you are and that man treats you bad as well as your mom too. i think it goes deeper than just his paintball stuff and sadly, i think his stuff is gone one way or another.

not flaming you Lohman. as i said, your hearts in the right place and thats a good thing. love, honor and take care of your parents always, they seem to deserve that from you.

southside_mag: i feel for you bro, i have been where you are. it sucks and it hurts, i'm very very sorry. you sound like you have it together and have a good gf. i hope things work out for you.

[the_lane]

wow that ROYALLY SUCKS(like that hasnt already been stated already :rolleyes: ) but i really dont know what your going thru and i hope you grt through it wo/losing any relationships,...or lacktherof but i do hope you get all your stuff/money back in a good manner but if you have to ..small claims court or the tape recorder idea i hope your stuff wasnt sold too but good luck from me. bless you and whoever is trying to help

-lane

[CoolHand]

. . . . also I live in licking so if anybody's in my area and plays let me know, paintball has always been just the thing to get my mind off problems! :D . . . . .

Yeah, Licking is only about 60 miles south of me on Hwy 63.

Not bad at all.

Email me your # and I will give you a ring when we go play PB next.

I would say it will be a week or two before we play again though.

[peewee]

Bottom line they don't deserve your respect. They have none for you & your things. I don't care if they are your parents or not. I had a father like yours. He was a taker, never had any remorse for all the screwing over he did to people. He took pride in it. Even on his death bed, he lied to all the people involved with handling his affairs after his death. No will etc. Made it very hard on my step Mom. Have a friend swing by daily to retrieve your stuff, give it two weeks. If not take them to court. I doubt that there will be any love lost due to the situation. They clearly don't care about your feeling etc. One note go high with your estimates on the price of your gear & sue for court cost/lawers fee's.

[CKY_Alliance]

well some people have mentioned having friends go to your mothers house but how about a aunt or uncle maybe cousin that your close with..or even grandma or grandpa..just have them go over there for a visit and have them check around for the stuff at least to let you know if its there or not.Then again you may not have any auint or uncles cousins or anyone willing to do this so yea....but just an idea.

[Vex]

southside_mag:

Send me a PM--I would like to talk to you a little more privately. I have had damn near the exact same thing happen to me (minus the paintball gear).

I know EXACTLY how you feel and what is going through your head. Some will say that they know how you feel, and they may be able to sympathize with you, but I can truly empathize with your feelings.
While my problem stems from a different cause--the overall outcome is virtually the same.

So send me a PM if you would like. I think it might be good for both of us!

[southside_mag]

my grandmother called me earlier and told me my mom was going to call her wednesday afternoon so i'm going to swing by her house and try to catch her while she's still on the phone hopefully I can at least figure out what i'm going to do after talking to her.

[warbeak2099]

Good, talk to her face to face. My gf's parents are almost exactly the same. I know what you're dealing with. Tell her that $1500 is a lot of money and if you don't get it or the equipment back from her you'll need to seek legal action. Tell her there's just no other way. If you do have to go that far, don't get a lawyer. Just bring your case in front of the local small claims court. Paying a $20-50 fee for that is better than an $1000 attorney fee. Good luck on wednesday.

[MoneyShot]

I live in Kansas, about an hour from kansas city missouri :D . I would have your grandma take a look in the house when your parents are gone, because if you have a friend do it, then i dont really know for sure about what the law is around there, but if they catch him they may be able to get him for breaking and entering even if he does have a key and has consent from your grandma. if he has consent from you it might not matter because you dont live there anymore. So i would have your grandma take a look and if it is sold then i would call your parents up and tell them to give you the $1500 you paid for the stuff or you going to take them to the small claims court. If the stuff is still there then have your grandma ship it to you. Just a suggestion.

[Aslan]

Let me say this - what is happening to you sucks, and I in no way mean to make it any different.

Let's use your figures of $1500. Is alienating your parents (even if they suck) from your life forever worth $1500 (or $500 after the lawyer fees). To me it would not be (though my parents are tremendous)... and sometimes in life you just have to swallow pride, and loss, and move forward. I can't judge your situation, I cannot imagine what it is like....

I see where you're coming from Lohman, I mentioned both the family alienation factor and the money factor in my response as well. :cheers:

However, I would also approach it from the angle that if his stepdad stole his property and sold it, he's a criminal. I wouldn't want a criminal living with my mom, even if I didn't like her very much. If his mom condoned and/or assisted, she is party to the crime as well. If these people are criminals, they should be confronted before they rip off someone else. It's people like that who you see on TV in handcuffs for fraud or writing bad checks or kiddie porn. I know I'm making a generaliztion and a stretch, but maybe being taken to court over this is the wake-up call his stepdad and mom need to straighten up. Maybe it won't work...probably won't...but it's worth a shot. :mad: :tard: :mad:

Having the lawyer write the letter probably won't cost near $1000, it might even be $50. Calling the local authorites will cost nothing except a long distance phone call. I'm thinking those two options get you your money and/or stuff back. If your parents want to go to court over it, they're idiots because they are almost sure to lose and may be exposing themselves criminally. I don't know about Florida law, but in most States $1500 exceeds the small claims limitations. :cheers:

[WARPED1]

Sue. It seems to be the only way to solve your problem. It may cost much more than the $1500 the guns are worth.

[staticdecay]

Just go get your belongings. It would be cheeper to get them your self than to sue and make for less NMEs also your mom might just be lazy and slack off doing it even though she wants to. If they don't let you in the house you should try to contact local police to accompany you to get your stuff so no one gets hurt or in trouble case the police can officiate the ordeal.

An easier way to get your way, would be to lay the heavy guilt trip on your mom in a letter or by phone mentioning that she loves your step dad more than you and that she is giving you up over something so simple and that he should have that kind of control over her life and make her not even be able to communicate with her own flesh and blood her own son. Women are emo this should work best.

[MoneyShot]

Just go get your belongings. It would be cheeper to get them your self than to sue and make for less NMEs also your mom might just be lazy and slack off doing it even though she wants to. If they don't let you in the house you should try to contact local police to accompany you to get your stuff so no one gets hurt or in trouble case the police can officiate the ordeal.

An easier way to get your way, would be to lay the heavy guilt trip on your mom in a letter or by phone mentioning that she loves your step dad more than you and that she is giving you up over something so simple and that he should have that kind of control over her life and make her not even be able to communicate with her own flesh and blood her own son. Women are emo this should work best.

Thats good stuff staticdecay, i like that. :cheers:

[Lenny]

Just go get your belongings. It would be cheeper to get them your self than to sue and make for less NMEs also your mom might just be lazy and slack off doing it even though she wants to. If they don't let you in the house you should try to contact local police to accompany you to get your stuff so no one gets hurt or in trouble case the police can officiate the ordeal.

An easier way to get your way, would be to lay the heavy guilt trip on your mom in a letter or by phone mentioning that she loves your step dad more than you and that she is giving you up over something so simple and that he should have that kind of control over her life and make her not even be able to communicate with her own flesh and blood her own son. Women are emo this should work best.

Kudos, man. As sneaky as I can be, I never thought of that; and the best part is, it'd probably work (that is, if she really loved her son, like most moms do, mean or not). Kudos once again.

[mobsterboy]

Just go get your belongings. It would be cheeper to get them your self than to sue and make for less NMEs also your mom might just be lazy and slack off doing it even though she wants to. If they don't let you in the house you should try to contact local police to accompany you to get your stuff so no one gets hurt or in trouble case the police can officiate the ordeal.

An easier way to get your way, would be to lay the heavy guilt trip on your mom in a letter or by phone mentioning that she loves your step dad more than you and that she is giving you up over something so simple and that he should have that kind of control over her life and make her not even be able to communicate with her own flesh and blood her own son. Women are emo this should work best.

Truly magnificent work

I actually would have done that first, being that I am a little bit of a sneaky devil(I get it from my mag :ninja: )

Really, what you could do is take the cops with you and say that your step dad threatened to abuse you and you just want your stuff back so you can go.

[southside_mag]

I guess you guys are right, although I really don't have the 3-4 days it will take(I will have to drive), i'm gonna have to go down there, to take care of this the right way.Btw she didn't call today so I just ended up sitting around and waiting all afternoon.It will most likely be a month or so before I can even think about taking time off,but i will definetly post again when i get back to let you guys know how it turned out. Thanks again for the help!